Microsoft fires the first shot in the "NEXT" generation.... - Page 97  

The only way I see this whole dual GPU thing having even a shred of truth, is if the second GPU is essentially the 360 GPU. Would make backwards compatibility a snap (assuming the CPU is powerPC), and I'm sure programmers could find a way to put some of that excess capacity to use in nextbox games.

This is the same source that "broke" that Microsoft would be making a big next-gen announcement at CES. Everybody remembers that announcement, right?

I thought I'd never say this but...The real NexGen game-changer is going to be full Kinect integration IMO. I have viewed Kinect, Wii and Move with skepticism and disdain as a gimmick in the past. But after reading several very interesting comments in this section and articles elsewhere I have completely changed my mind about Kinect. In fact I am going to go ahead and take the plunge and buy one this week...to get familiar with it before Halo 4 launches and I start ME3.

The reason for my optimism about Kinect is simple. It appears that game devs like it more and will pursue full integration of this technology from more of an "in-game controller" perspective. Meaning...putting more in screen control in our hands through executions like advanced HUD interface...subtle tactile interactions with characters which one can do from a couch...and etc. I never liked the idea of jumping around and flailing away like a wannabe geek in my game room. Kinect has a unique potential in NexGen to make the HDTV itself a vital part of the controller...in-game interaction & experience like no other motion controller IMO. Because it doesn't require me to hold a new device in my hands. But it can allow me to interact with any type of on-screen device Devs can imagine. In many ways...MS already launched NexGen with Kinect. It was the real successor to Wii. Now it just needs to bolt Kinect onto a more powerful console to make it really soar.

i agree the nextbox will have kinect, but i am not sold... (i have played the kinect, FYI), but similar to wii, it just doesn't work the way you want it to, much less for the games i like to play...

Isn't the next version supposed to have the built in processing so it doesn't take any processing from the Xbox? They had planned for the current version to be that way but the cost was too high at the time to achieve it so the current one uses the 360 for processing.

The next version should be able to have more resolution and more processing power since the cost should be lower while the processing power should be able to be much higher. Which should translate to being more accurate and quicker when used.

you are correct, basically i still think we might be another generation removed (meaning kinect 3) before it will really be something that will be used "mainstream" meaning in games like BF3, etc.. i just finished ME3 and didn't feel like i missed anything not playing with kinect... don't get me wrong, i am excited about the technology, just still a little skeptical on it being implemented in the games i play... my nephew on the other hand, he loves it and it works great for him...

Kinect + controller would be cool for RPGs as a keyboard replacement for selecting gear and potions. Would at least get people like me who don't care either way into it. I don't ever use our Wii but some integrated voice/gesture options could be used to expand games on a level we haven't seen yet.

This is exactly what I was alluding too. A verbal/oral keyboard replacement that is completely interactive with the game and XBox controller via voice commands or/and hand gestures. ME 3 is a peek into that exciting future/approach. It could be number, alphabet or character based as part of an on screen display. It sure would make weapons use faster/easier...for example...by allowing one to simply say "Y" or "1" to switch weapons...P to pickup...I to investigate...G to throw a grenade...and G1-G5 to designate type of granade. And so on and so forth.

Kinect could literally become a voice actuated, multi-level, on screen keyboard/HUD for complex commands versus just repeatedly slamming on X, Y, A, B keys with the current XBox Controller. The current controller would be freed to focus on core usage tasks such as shooting, flying, moving, walking maneuvering, aiming and etc. More complex commands from that structure would be handled by simple commands like run/walk faster...after control key activation. Kinect has the potential to give Hard core gamers an unprecedented level of options and control. But only if the Devs fully exploit it in NexGen

I like the potential in this idea much better than the big display controller approach in WiiU. And it appears game developers do too. IMO...if MS wins the NexGen War...it will be because their game control interface with Kinect, in XBox World and Windows PC World...is superior to anything out there. All other tech will be roughly equal I suspect. It will be fun to see it actually unfold.

BTW...as follow up to the above thought on Kinect as an audio/visual keyboard and mouse...I think MS and the game devs need to go all the way with it in NexGen. Make all of the games for NEXtyBox utilize the technology that way...period. And not worry about compatibility with the XBox 360 command structure. Instead make it more competitive with PC/Windows gaming. And start converging the XBox Live and Windows Live command and competition functionality. After all...MS is releasing a Windows Live version of Kinect anyway. So they might as well go all out with the controller aspects of it.

You mean like Bethesda is doing with Skyrim

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3C9P-H1UPgs

Sent from my IPad

I'm guessing, just saw an article about it but haven't read too much yet. Depending on how the reviews for it are, it may prompt me to pick a Kinect up whenever Gamefly sends me Skyrim.

I take that back, negatory ghost rider. I mean gesture support too not just voice don't really feel like shouting at my TV...well any more than I already do!

Horrible idea, for an absurd number of reasons:

First, you've shut down a great number of gaming purists that love controllers. Sorry, but the Kinect in its current state is fine for kiddie-games and silly dance moves for tweens, but I can't see myself ever preferring it to a controller.

Someone also mentioned having voice commands for buttons. Worst. Idea. EVER. Let's take this simple, one line sentence used in a conversation between a buddy and myself over Live or the phone (I multitask) while playing multiplayer versus BF3 and see what happens:

"Why (game thinks I said "Y") is your ex (game reads "X") wife going to be(game initiates "B" button) in a (game performs "A" manuever) dress?"

With this one simple sentence, this "marvel of technology" has performed four things (changed weapons, attempted to reload, attempted to arm an M-COM, and jumped) that I didn't intend for it to do at all. Now, I can't communicate with my party/team anymore? This is good? This is the future? Um, thanks but no thanks.

Sure, you could get around this by implementing someone say, "B BUTTON" instead of just "B" but now you're taking infinitely longer to say it than just hit the damn button. Weak sauce.

Additionallly, there are lots of people out there that game at odd hours. ALOT of guys will put on headphones and play after the wifey and little ones have went to bed. If you're forced to be yelling at the screen, this option is dead. Again, no thanks.

Maybe I reach for my drink, the game interprets this as me attempting to pick up some lame-ass weapon kit on the ground. Now, I've got some noob's pea-shooter rather than my WMDs. Lame.

While the Kinect might be somewhat effective in single-player games for the controller-impaired, making it a mandatory way to play would be a console killer for me and a great number of others. It's a fairly effective gimmick that impresses toddlers and pre-teens for a few moments, but I've seen that even they see the gimmickery and get bored with it over time. I don't see it "controlling" the game world as some would hope.

This does pose some interesting challenges for motion gaming. Not many people want to play a FPS by mimicking all your on screen movements. Voice commands are great until you have to spew out a few things all at once. It's nice to have it as adders but until we get mind control over games I think we're bound to a controller.

This is my gaming life in a nutshell. Ergo, Kinect is not something I'm down with.

[quote=spyder696969;21898839]Horrible idea, for an absurd number of reasons:

A bit overstated don't you think? Well everything you listed is fixable. And I certainly hope so for NexGen gaming. I actually agree with you about the yelling, jumping, hopping stuff. But again...easy fixes on the yelling...noise and voice interruptions. Plus all of that can all be bypassed by just programming NexGen games to play 2-3 different ways (Controller w A/V Kinect & without). Or just using the controller synched with on-screen HUD/keyboard visual only commands. Bottom line is Kinect can be linked in a lot of ways. I'm most certainly not advocating replacing the controller...as you implied. Only enhancing its functionality in ways we haven't done yet. That's the unique potential of NexGen Kinect IMO. I love the XBox 360 controller better than any other out there. But it is limited in so many ways compared to PC gaming. Kinect can bridge that gap...if not totally eliminate it.

I hate repetitive button mashing in all of the games. And if Kinect can eliminate the need to do it. I'm all for it. MS is smart enough to figure out a quiet mode gaming protocol if the controller linkage has potential for them. JMHO.

[quote=barrelbelly;21899016]
Sorry, thought you were saying you wanted games to be Kinect ONLY.

If they make games that can use one, or the other, or even both, at the choice of the user, then I have no problem with it. Just so long as I get to decide what I want to use, not have developers dictate to me that I am forced to use the Kinect as some of the games do already. Perhaps as time passes, we'll see this become less of an issue, once they're done pimping their latest product so much.

"Better with Kinect." A matter of opinion, but fine.

"Kinect only." Terrible idea, imo.

The mere fact of having to accommodate kinect controls will compromise the design of any game.

You're kidding right? I'm sure there were a ton of folks who told Nintendo, Sony and MS the same thing when they were considering motion and voice control devices. Heck...I was even one of the naysayers and skeptics early on. And 10's of million of units sold later, they're all glad they served this unique potential up to the marketplace. There are a lot of smart people out there who can figure this stuff out. And create successes with it. I am optimistic they will. Only poorly thought out games will be compromised with any of this technology. If a studio can't handle it...just use the limited application/potential of the current controller. Or to keep it even more simple...just keep designing games for the XBox 360 if the hurdle is too big for them to comprehend it.

No. Going off track.

You seemingly wanted all games to support kinect in some way. That's insane.

That is correct. And it's not insane just because you can't imagine how it would be done...or can't figure out how to do it. Kinect is a big part of MS' NexGen future. MS has invested a lot of money and prestige into that technology. Game devs are not as myopic as you are suggesting here. They are not stuck in neutral on otherwise. They can multi-task any game and make it compatible with whatever Controller tech is available to them. All I am suggesting is that there is a lot more potential in Kinect than just hopping around a room and yelling into a TV. For example...the hands and fingers can be accessorized & used more creatively to interact with on screen images in lieu of a keyboard. Kinect has the potential to create a whole new controller language in NexGen. And do it without obsoleting the basic XBox 360 controller. MS and devs are limited only by their imaginations.

What is insane is to launch technology like Kinect and not improve or optimize it in the format it was created for (playing games)...or figure out how to use it to differentiate your version of all games for your console. Of course you allow user choice in a game for those who aren't comfortable using it. That;s no different than how I play games on a PC. Sometimes I use a controller. Sometimes I use a keyboard and mouse.

Kinect has unique controller aplication potential, that this very sane person would like to see fully explored in its NexGen version. I think what we are seeing now, in XBox 360 is only a tiny piece of the iceberg with Kinect. I highly doubt MS and game devs will just burp out the same old crap and call it NexGen. Whether its Console tech, Games or current Motion Control interaction? I honestly don't get your point on this...since you appear to be so passionate about an immediate launch of NexBox. NexBox is not NexGen IMO without full Kinect integration. It would just be ThisGen with more powerful specs. Heck I already got that with my new PC.

If devs think they can find an interesting use for kinect in a more traditional game, I'm fine with it. If they come up with something so compelling I need to run out and buy one, great. I draw the line at arbitrarily forcing it.

I'm impressed on every new kinect hack that comes out. Those things are creative and signs of the future.

Nothing of the kinect on xbox makes me want to buy one. When it can make playing a game BETTER, that's when I'm in. Until then, I won't own one.

Yeah, I mean theres a lot of potential there. Feels a few generations away from being something I'd really want to use though. It needs to be way more accurate, and waaaaaaaaay more reliable. It needs to do *precisely* what I expect 100% of the time, like a standard controller does. This goes for motion and voice. It needs to just work.

I'm good to go with that scenario. I'll just add two points:

1. I suspect that in NexGen...the games market will be so good for higher end console games, that you will perceive your first 2 points as fact...or natural state of being in Next Generation. This is already occurring in PC gameworld with the advancements that are too numerous to dialog here. And I am enjoying them immensely with my keyboard...mouse...Saitek controllers, joysticks and flying/driving peripherals. I believe the PC gameworld will actually lead the way on innovative ways to link "Windows Live Kinect" with those devices (on screen).

2. I want them to force it, so it will get better and better. But...like you, I don't want them to eliminate our decision to use it or not. By that I mean one should always have the option of enabling or disabling Kinect controls in the option menu within games. Just like keyboard, mouse, joystick, controller options preside in PC game menus.

That'd be fine if the kinect was some sort of reasonable substitute for a physical input device...but it just isn't.

What will end up happening is something like the monstrosity that is windows 8. They let the needs of tablets corrupt the interface for keyboard/mouse users, and the result is something that is a terrible compromise and not particularly well suited to anyone.

Imagine if wii sports needed to accommodate a traditional controller. It would fundamentally change the game, because they couldn't do anything unique with a wiimote that a controller couldn't emulate well, and vice versa.

You need new hardware to enjoy gaming? O_o

If the world blew up and I only had an Atari 2600, I'd still have a lot of fun...