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Microsoft fires the first shot in the "NEXT" generation.... - Page 157  

post #4681 of 7006
Not really surprising, but the cloud services Sony showed off were "aspirational". So some of the features will be there day one and some may come sometime later...maybe.


http://www.theverge.com/2013/2/22/4017222/sony-says-ps4-cloud-features-are-aspirational

What I would like to see from Microsoft in their presentation is at least 75% to 25% things that will be available day one to the hopes. So less Velocity Girl and more this cool media function will work when you turn on the Xbox.
post #4682 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post



The PS2 CRUSHED the Xbox in sales in the US. Sony banked on that....didnt work out for them, did it?

This.

The thing people keep forgetting is that every cycle is a new thing. It's own thing. Banking on anything except what you are bringing to the table right now is likely to get you crushed.

Nintendo used to be the big dog. Then came Sony and PS1. PS2 was a monster so naturally PS3 would be as well. Then came The Wii and the 360. Frankly, MS does not have enough of the market with the 360 to bank on anything. They are exactly even with PS3, so pretty much anything could happen and land them in the back seat this time around. They need to bring their a-game.
post #4683 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

There will be some inertia - but if they don't show something impressive, they won't grow, and people will leave eventually. All my local friends and me are tied to XBL, but a few of us have already decided on Sony, based on what we're seeing. People are going to have an unprecedented choice this holiday between two similar systems - without BC, there's nothing tying you to your old ecosystem. If the early adopters choose Sony because it makes a better case to the early adopter mindset....they're going to drag a *lot* of people with them.

The PS2 CRUSHED the Xbox in sales in the US. Sony banked on that....didnt work out for them, did it?
An interesting point was made in that podcast too, they said that a lot of game companies struggle on their third console because they start to rest on what they have done and get a little lazy. I could see MS doing this, feeling confident that all they have to do is come out with something with Xbox on it and people will flock to it. It may work, or they may get their butts kicked and have to go back to the drawing board, a lot like Sony is doing after their third console wasn't a success.
post #4684 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antiochus View Post

This.

The thing people keep forgetting is that every cycle is a new thing. It's own thing. Banking on anything except what you are bringing to the table right now is likely to get you crushed.

Nintendo used to be the big dog. Then came Sony and PS1. PS2 was a monster so naturally PS3 would be as well. Then came The Wii and the 360. Frankly, MS does not have enough of the market with the 360 to bank on anything. They are exactly even with PS3, so pretty much anything could happen and land them in the back seat this time around. They need to bring their a-game.

Except that this generation, people aren't tied to the box, they're tied to the online system. If all of your achievements and friends are on XBL you're not going to want to start over with Sony's system.
post #4685 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbexperience View Post

Except that this generation, people aren't tied to the box, they're tied to the online system. If all of your achievements and friends are on XBL you're not going to want to start over with Sony's system.

Not quite true. With the lack of Digital BC on PS4 and the probable lack of it on 720, why does your account truly matter? Does that number next to your user name really matter?
post #4686 of 7006
I'd personally prefer to keep it all in one place. If you could care less about achievements or trophy's, then it doesn't matter to make the switch in that case, unless all your friends prefer the other console. I'm not a true achievement hunter, my GS is only like 16000 out of 134 possible games, but I'd prefer to keep it all in one place. I also like how MS is developing to cover all devices, PC/Console/Phones.... Of course this really only works if you use their platforms. Also my friends mostly play on Xbox for console gaming...

I'm expecting big things from MS though, and I'm hoping Sony just pushes them to go even further with it!
post #4687 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Not quite true. With the lack of Digital BC on PS4 and the probable lack of it on 720, why does your account truly matter? Does that number next to your user name really matter?

I stopped caring about achievements once every platform spawned their own system, and the number basically became meaningless.
post #4688 of 7006
A huge win for MS would be to have backward compatibility for Games on Demand/Arcade/Indie games. I could really care less if my disc games are not compatible, but I have a decent library of GoD/Arcade games available to me...
post #4689 of 7006
When achievements first came out, I would go out of my way to try and get them. Now, I don't even look at the acheivement lists when I get games. I will just play and be surprised if one pops. I can understand people not wanting to give up on MS because all their friends play it, but I couldn't see not giving great games and a good system a chance just because of that. My play time is a lot smaller then it used to be, so now I am not worried about what my friends are playing or anything like that, I get the games I want and play them and if a friend is online playing, then we will play it together. Also, my closer friends have all turned into COD fans, and will pretty much only play that or the occasional sports game, so I am used to playing the better games by myself.
post #4690 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbexperience View Post

Except that this generation, people aren't tied to the box, they're tied to the online system. If all of your achievements and friends are on XBL you're not going to want to start over with Sony's system.

People are not tied to anything. However, this is one of the areas I was referring to when I said there are some things that can make a system more or less attractive outside of the big 3 factors I listed. If MS announces full backwards compatibility with 360 and that all xbox live content will roll over to xbox 720, that will be a master stroke which will strengthen their position when it comes to keeping live members from switching consoles. Beyond that, a gamerscore is just a number. An achievement is simply a meaningless icon.

I am much more likely to buy a 720 if I know I can use all my 360 software while waiting on the 720 software stream to really start pumping out games.
post #4691 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomNinjaAtk View Post

A huge win for MS would be to have backward compatibility for Games on Demand/Arcade/Indie games. I could really care less if my disc games are not compatible, but I have a decent library of GoD/Arcade games available to me...
I hope this is the case for Arcade titles. I'll miss my Pinball FX2 game if it does not get to come over onto the new system since I doubt I will leave the 360 down with the main equipment since I only have so many inputs. I honestly wouldn't care much if the discs are not compitable, but arcade titles seem like to me they should transfer over to the new system.
post #4692 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antiochus View Post


I am much more likely to buy a 720 if I know I can use all my 360 software while waiting on the 720 software stream to really start pumping out games.

I agree with this comment. With the added caveat, that it would actually help MS workout the retail glut of "New" XBox 360 game inventory at retail. It would encourage early adoption of the new console because of the ample supply of "new XBox 360" games already in the pipeline. And you would be ready for the new blockbusters to come out...without being forced to buy a poorly reviewed...expensive...untradable nextGen "Dud" game.
post #4693 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antiochus View Post

This.
Nintendo used to be the big dog. Then came Sony and PS1. PS2 was a monster so naturally PS3 would be as well. Then came The Wii and the 360. Frankly, MS does not have enough of the market with the 360 to bank on anything. They are exactly even with PS3, so pretty much anything could happen and land them in the back seat this time around. They need to bring their a-game.

If I was a betting man...I would bet that Nintendo will be #1 in NextGen too with the lowest tech console (WiiU). They will actually benefit from all of the Next Console advertising war hype between Sony and MS. Parents will remain very commited to their platform for their children. And WiiU will look & feel nextGen...just fine and dandy on their HDTV displays to them. We often forget that we come at this totally from the perspective of the most avid "Adult" gamers. We buy systems for ourselves. But often completely different ones for our kids. The vast majority of people just buy what their kids want. And use it themselves whenever they can. I suspect Nintendo will chug along with WiiU just like they did with 3DS. They will continue to innovate for it and its roster of handhelds like 3Ds. They may even take a page out of the MS book and begin integration between all of their platforms via that tablet controller. They will just draft off of all of the newness talk...with everyone calling WiiU a launch failure until...oops!...it's the volume winner. In many ways they are innoculated from all of our assumptions and speculation about NextGen on this thread.
post #4694 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by barrelbelly View Post

If I was a betting man...I would bet that Nintendo will be #1 in NextGen too with the lowest tech console (WiiU). They will actually benefit from all of the Next Console advertising war hype between Sony and MS. Parents will remain very commited to their platform for their children. And WiiU will look & feel nextGen...just fine and dandy on their HDTV displays to them. We often forget that we come at this totally from the perspective of the most avid "Adult" gamers. We buy systems for ourselves. But often completely different ones for our kids. The vast majority of people just buy what their kids want. And use it themselves whenever they can. I suspect Nintendo will chug along with WiiU just like they did with 3DS. They will continue to innovate for it and its roster of handhelds like 3Ds. They may even take a page out of the MS book and begin integration between all of their platforms via that tablet controller. They will just draft off of all of the newness talk...with everyone calling WiiU a launch failure until...oops!...it's the volume winner. In many ways they are innoculated from all of our assumptions and speculation about NextGen on this thread.

I will so take that bet.
post #4695 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antiochus View Post

People are not tied to anything. However, this is one of the areas I was referring to when I said there are some things that can make a system more or less attractive outside of the big 3 factors I listed. If MS announces full backwards compatibility with 360 and that all xbox live content will roll over to xbox 720, that will be a master stroke which will strengthen their position when it comes to keeping live members from switching consoles. Beyond that, a gamerscore is just a number. An achievement is simply a meaningless icon.

I am much more likely to buy a 720 if I know I can use all my 360 software while waiting on the 720 software stream to really start pumping out games.

I just flat out disagree that people aren't more engaged with one system or the other. I would imagine there are very few people that spend their time 50/50 with each system. In fact I think most people would probably be something like 80/20 or 90/10 one over the other. The point is that once you get used to a given system you have a tendency to stay within that sphere. Then, if you have an extensive friends list on one versus the other, and you have achievements or trophies on one versus the other, it compounds that tendency to stay.

Also, I would argue that your "big three" are no in line with the most important factors in the general public.
post #4696 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

I will so take that bet.

Me too, all day long. Give me some odds and a place to put my money.
post #4697 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

I will so take that bet.

The operative word was "if" BD.biggrin.gif At my core I am a terrible poker player. I would fold the straight flush if I saw the hawks too (Old Spice commercial). You got me on that one...LMAO.
post #4698 of 7006
I don't see it for Nintendo this time around. The system has been out for a while and there does not even seem to be a public perception that there is actually a new Nintendo machine on the market. By the time people figure out what a Wii U is, it may be too late. Much, however, depends on what MS does with the 720. If they screw this up, Nintendo is still very much in the game.
post #4699 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbexperience View Post

I just flat out disagree that people aren't more engaged with one system or the other. I would imagine there are very few people that spend their time 50/50 with each system. In fact I think most people would probably be something like 80/20 or 90/10 one over the other. The point is that once you get used to a given system you have a tendency to stay within that sphere. Then, if you have an extensive friends list on one versus the other, and you have achievements or trophies on one versus the other, it compounds that tendency to stay.

Also, I would argue that your "big three" are no in line with the most important factors in the general public.

Of course people tend to be engaged more with one system. However, this can and does swing wildly when a new generation starts, so it is worth paying attention to the things that impacted these swings in the past and comparing them to the things that may work against them now.

What I am saying is that the xbox live ecosystem is a potent weapon when all things are equal, but when things are not equal, it's value is diminished.
post #4700 of 7006
Everyone is spelling gloom and doom if the NeXtBox isn't BC. Pretty much the same thing that was said about the 360 and it not being BC. It wouldn't be a surprise if it wasn't. Sure eventually they rolled around some software solutions for BC on the 360 but to be honest I think most people moved on already to the "shiny new" games by then.

EDIT: But to be honest I have to admit I can't wait to see the first vid of a guy standing in line for a PS4, then comes outside, and bashes it to pieces in front of a crowd of PS4 fans. LOL
post #4701 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by totalownership View Post

Everyone is spelling gloom and doom if the NeXtBox isn't BC. Pretty much the same thing that was said about the 360 and it not being BC. It wouldn't be a surprise if it wasn't. Sure eventually they rolled around some software solutions for BC on the 360 but to be honest I think most people moved on already to the "shiny new" games by then.
I actually think the doom and gloom talk has a lot to do with the rumored lesser specs for the next Xbox compared to the PS4. I will take a stronger console over playing last gen games.
post #4702 of 7006
Interesting thoughts. MS reveal in April?

post #4703 of 7006
I think they should do it sooner, because for two months, any developers talking about next gen games will only be mentioning the PS4.
post #4704 of 7006
This console war will diminish before the end of the year. The specs will be comparable and im sure price will be too. But if xbox already beat out the PS3 and it had bluray, when the 720 comes out and has bluray technology it will be everything the PS3 is and more.

Anyone know the cost or projected cost the 720 will launch at?
post #4705 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbexperience View Post

Except that this generation, people aren't tied to the box, they're tied to the online system. If all of your achievements and friends are on XBL you're not going to want to start over with Sony's system.

Ive been on live since the launch of the original xbox and i could give a rats rear about being tied to the service. Live has gone down a bit, not because of the service, but because of the gamer. No one can seem to find the headset that came with the console and you rarely see any teamwork of any kind going on in anything. I can do that on free psn or psn+.

Im basically more tired of microsofts first party snorefests (gears, mass effect, halo,etc, etc that have all been milked dry and repeated a million times. Microsoft basically sat on the throne they were glued to this whole generation. Now they have to win the crowd over again and it sounds like they will force more of the same crap down our throats as they did with the 360.Everytime i fire up my 360, i feel like im on netflix and i have to rummage through the crap to get to the games tucked away in a small corner. The 360 in a nutshell is the jack of all trades and the master of none.

Im sorry, but microsoft will have to take a new direction to get my dollar and it doesent look like thats going to happen.
post #4706 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antiochus View Post

I don't see it for Nintendo this time around. The system has been out for a while and there does not even seem to be a public perception that there is actually a new Nintendo machine on the market. By the time people figure out what a Wii U is, it may be too late. Much, however, depends on what MS does with the 720. If they screw this up, Nintendo is still very much in the game.

Im honestly wondering myself amd not just the WiiU, but current gen support. PC is X86-64 and now both next gen consoles coming this fall are. Both are going to have 8GB+ of RAM. Nintendo is stuck with a power PC architecture and a very small amount of RAM, and 3rd party support is already shakey.

Do devs write of Power PC and thus both Nintendo and current gen quickly? Maybe, but then again between Sony and MS theres 140 million consoles out there... and Sony is up again to keep supporting their legacy console it seems.

Still, makes you wonder. Devs have neen very cost and risk adverse lately, and keeping support for power pc development is going to still be costly.
post #4707 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by americangunner View Post

I think they should do it sooner, because for two months, any developers talking about next gen games will only be mentioning the PS4.

Lmao omg it is not as serious as you make it sound. Some of you act like this is a life or death situation for MS. Regardless how anyone feels MS did more than anyone expected them to do and to think they don't have a plan in place and established te relationships they have with developers now is just simply ignorance. They along with developers know what the game plan is for The new system. Developers have already made plans at least two years to not only provide exclusives but also launch multiplatform games for the system. The same thig was being said about the Wii U. MS has led in te online service and games continue and Live accounts continue to be popular. Developers talking about the PS4 today is not a vital threat to MS if try don't respond a month from now. People know it is coming and the info we found out on Monday still isn't set in stone about the PS4.
post #4708 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Im honestly wondering myself amd not just the WiiU, but current gen support. PC is X86-64 and now both next gen consoles coming this fall are. Both are going to have 8GB+ of RAM. Nintendo is stuck with a power PC architecture and a very small amount of RAM, and 3rd party support is already shakey.

Do devs write of Power PC and thus both Nintendo and current gen quickly? Maybe, but then again between Sony and MS theres 140 million consoles out there... and Sony is up again to keep supporting their legacy console it seems.

Still, makes you wonder. Devs have neen very cost and risk adverse lately, and keeping support for power pc development is going to still be costly.

They supported x86 for PC, so PPC support will stick around as long as there's viable platforms. PS360 have at least 2-3 years of life left, the Wii U maybe that long as well.
post #4709 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by mboojigga View Post

Lmao omg it is not as serious as you make it sound. Some of you act like this is a life or death situation for MS. Regardless how anyone feels MS did more than anyone expected them to do and to think they don't have a plan in place and established te relationships they have with developers now is just simply ignorance. They along with developers know what the game plan is for The new system. Developers have already made plans at least two years to not only provide exclusives but also launch multiplatform games for the system. The same thig was being said about the Wii U. MS has led in te online service and games continue and Live accounts continue to be popular. Developers talking about the PS4 today is not a vital threat to MS if try don't respond a month from now. People know it is coming and the info we found out on Monday still isn't set in stone about the PS4.

Don't worry, it's set in stone. As I showed, the comment was about the physical box, not the specs they threw out everywhere (and had their demos running on).

MS could come out in April with an exclusive Activision DLC partnership for 3 years and blow up any want people might have for Sony. I wouldn't underestimate the draw of COD, and MS's pension for favoring exclusive and timed content over dealing with whole studios for first party titles. It's smarter, and the returns vs cost are greater.
post #4710 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Don't worry, it's set in stone. As I showed, the comment was about the physical box, not the specs they threw out everywhere (and had their demos running on).

MS could come out in April with an exclusive Activision DLC partnership for 3 years and blow up any want people might have for Sony. I wouldn't underestimate the draw of COD, and MS's pension for favoring exclusive and timed content over dealing with whole studios for first party titles. It's smarter, and the returns vs cost are greater.

As someone who's as big a cod fan as anyone....not even that is enough. Online *needs* to be free, or I'll never buy an online game for the nextbox, period. I don't even care about timed exclusives anymore. I'm not paying the XBL gold fee any more. Never again.
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