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Microsoft fires the first shot in the "NEXT" generation.... - Page 173  

post #5161 of 7006
Sorry for the random question. Has there been anything said about downloadable content from the 360 Live account, like games on demand or movies/tv shows etc, being transferable to the Nextbox?

I haven't really accumulated that much, a few games on demand and arcade games. But I imagine some people payed for the right to download a lot of stuff.

Will your Live account basically just transfer to the new system, or be stuck on 360?
post #5162 of 7006
Nothing set in stone right now. There are rumors on both sides of the table when it comes to 360 content on the next xbox. I have a ton of downloadable content, but if the next systen doesn't allow you to use it, then I will just move on to the next system and move my 360 into my room.
post #5163 of 7006
Thread Starter 
If Microsoft went to the trouble of putting a 360 SoC inside each of their next-gen machines, then they are doing that for a very specific reason. They are doing it so that people will be able to transfer over all their crap without having to jump through all kinds of crazy hoops. It's a huge selling feature to know that you can buy a Xbox Infinity and know that you can put your Gamertag on the new system and download all your previous stuff.

Honestly, I think it would actually win them this console war. (assuming they don't do something crazy like not allow used games while Sony does allow used games). I know for some people, backwards compatibility is totally overrated, and wouldn't affect their buying decisions, but I know that for many others, it's EXTREMELY important and would be a make or break feature. Obviously, 3 years from now, nobody is going to care about BC, but 3 years from now, a lead platform will have presented itself. MS basically won last gen in the USA because it became the lead platform for 90 percent of the major developers.

Remember back to the early days of the PS3/360 war. Remember how crappy the sports games were on the PS3 ? Remember how games like Oblivion and such ran so crappy on PS3? That had a huge effect, that I think ultimately ended up making the 360 the defacto standard for most US gamers. Now part of that, was the PS3 being difficult to develop for, and that isn't going to be the case this time (at least it appears that way), but still, if the games are designed with the Durango in mind (because of it's sales lead, which is because of the BC and the fact that it's so easy to transfer over your digital library), it's going to show up in the reviews. The average gamer is going to hear about how the games "run" better on Durango, and any decent sales lead is going to be pretty huge early on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkcusD View Post

The PS3 had full backwards compatibility and it didn't bury anyone



Edited by Anthony1 - 4/18/13 at 11:20pm
post #5164 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post

If Microsoft went to the trouble of putting a 360 SoC inside each of their next-gen machines, then they are doing that for a very specific reason. They are doing it so that people will be able to transfer over all their crap without having to jump through all kinds of crazy hoops. It's a huge selling feature to know that you can buy a Xbox Infinity and know that you can put your Gamertag on the new system and download all your previous stuff.

Honestly, I think it would actually win them this console war. (assuming they don't do something crazy like not allow used games while Sony does allow used games). I know for some people, backwards compatibility is totally overrated, and wouldn't affect their buying decisions, but I know that for many others, it's EXTREMELY important and would be a make or break feature.

the console war in the hardware sense is feature for feature. i dont believe backwards compatability is a nail in the coffin for any console maker. its simply a gesture of gratitude and should be offered in every console, whether it be at launch or sometime shortly after via patch. the xbox did this after launch with no issues.

More importantly, this generation is not as much of a leap in technical aspects as the last transition. so alot of people wont be adopting the new console at lanch as much as there were in the last round of consoles. So i dont see why its such a big issue if its not present at launch. No one is requiring you to trade in your 360 for a 720 or your ps3 for the ps4, so its not like your up a river without a paddle. If BC is the main focus on the minds of console makers, they would simply make an addon for your current console so you can play more up to date games tech wise and still keep your current library in tact. was that the jaguar add on for the sega that was so many years ago?

fact is, people need to adapt or get left behind. we've been waiting for 7 years for something new and were already complaining about the possible transition. this generation is probably the worst ive seen with exception of a few bright spots. the last year and a half of console gaming has been abysmal and leaves me wanting a new experience even more. seems all we get is rehash after rehash of the same old series with the same characters, year in, year out. new consoles usually bring new series and enlightened creativity. console gaming is pretty much black and white and we desperately need some color added to the situation.

what we should be complaining about is the fact that microsoft is planning on winning the dollar war but not captivating the consumer market in the games sense of things. they want to issue a product of value, with games in the background. It should be pretty obvious between the rumors and the current state of the dashboard that microsoft had the industry by the neck with cretivity and stellar game franchises and an awesome online service. but guess what, that land has been conquered and microsoft has basically hit it and quit it. they are merely the name you look to first and they will be trying to captivate your wallet instead of your imagination with the all in one media center that just happens to play games.

the sore thing about this is, the nextbox will come in shy of what the ps4 can handle and all the third party titles will be similar between the two consoles. basically, the nextbox slightly inferior technical aspects will not allow the ps4 to shine and high higher fidelity. all microsoft has to do is get within range of the slightest degree of the ps4 hardware to be considered in the same market and basically put the ball and chain on ps4 third party titles from a graphical standpoint. lets face it, standardization is a crappy part of life and we cant have 6 different ports for each platform. publishers have to cut corners somewhere. if these two are even considered competing for the same dollar, the ports will be identical for both consoles.

Sadly, the almighty dollar will reign supreme over creativity and fun, which are what games are supposed to be about. And this should come as no suprise to anyone as the transition of focus off the customer and on the profit has hit the peak a long time ago. The efforts of the PS4 will be all for not, excluding first part exclusives, due to microft rolling into town on fumes while the ps4 is blazing with a full tank and trying to put the core gamer first again.

Microsoft fully expects to reign supreme again off its past efforts, and the likelihood of them taking the crown again is pretty high no matter what turd they roll out at E3. when you've all but monopolized the console market, your in an invincible strategic position to do no wrong. Your current customers just want to see what you will be offering so you can take their money again and again. I for one have been an xbox gamer since its induction on to today and am disgusted by the lack of creativity that just completely dropped off somewhere down the road. There is literally nothing good to play, were seeing 4th and 5th installments on series that should have died after the 2nd one. No one has done much of anything in the past year and a half worth noting and now everyone is holding off for the new consoles. So what does that mean for us? two friggin years of absolute steaming, fruit fly attracting dung POS games that arent worth 5 minutes of my time. Ive literally all but completely given up on games in general its so bad. Im ready for a new shooter thats worth playing and believe it or not, bf4 and cod 17 announcements do nothing for me. You polish that turd, because in the end its still the same old turd.

I just hope if the nextbox does just enough to share front page ad space for black friday, that they get the same ports as WIIU and the ps4 gets direct or damn near perfect PC ports. someone needs to stick it up microsofts you know what, because we all know whats coming. If it was up to me, I'd tell both sony and microsoft to stick it for letting these consoles go on for so long. I'v never seen a drought like this. One more year with no consoles would have completely killed the industry. :vomit:
post #5165 of 7006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by whityfrd View Post



Microsoft fully expects to reign supreme again off its past efforts, and the likelihood of them taking the crown again is pretty high no matter what turd they roll out at E3. when you've all but monopolized the console market, your in an invincible strategic position to do no wrong. Your current customers just want to see what you will be offering so you can take their money again and again. I for one have been an xbox gamer since its induction on to today and am disgusted by the lack of creativity that just completely dropped off somewhere down the road. There is literally nothing good to play, were seeing 4th and 5th installments on series that should have died after the 2nd one. No one has done much of anything in the past year and a half worth noting and now everyone is holding off for the new consoles. So what does that mean for us? two friggin years of absolute steaming, fruit fly attracting dung POS games that arent worth 5 minutes of my time. Ive literally all but completely given up on games in general its so bad. Im ready for a new shooter thats worth playing and believe it or not, bf4 and cod 17 announcements do nothing for me. You polish that turd, because in the end its still the same old turd.
:

Wow... based on those comments, I'm not sure anything is going to impress you.

Sure, these last couple of years haven't been the most exciting, but there are still some damn good games here and there. To just say that it's all utter rubbish, is throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If you think these two new consoles are going to work miracles, unfortunately, I think you're going to be in for a rude awakening. Just look at Crysis 3 on a super high end PC. Most people playing that game will tell you that it looks as good, or better than anything the PS4 or nextbox are going to be running any time soon, yet the game is considered very lackluster overall. So, just having great graphics doesn't make a great game. These new consoles won't automatically translate into better overall experiences. Sure, they will look pretty, but will they really be that much better ?

What I'm trying to say, is that you should probably lower your expectations quite a bit, otherwise you might be so disappointed that you quit gaming altogether.
post #5166 of 7006
What nobody said to Nomad was that there really can't be word on the transfer of downloadable content until there's word about backwards compatibility.

There's no reason why some files like downloadable movies can't transfer over without backwards compatibility, but for things like XBLA and Games on Demand releases, the 720 will have to be able to run 360 software.

So when we get word on the status of BC, you will get your answer. If it's backwards compatible there's no way that your compatible 360 purchases will be null and void on your new Xbox 720. That would be a PR nightmare if they did that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by whityfrd View Post

the console war in the hardware sense is feature for feature. i dont believe backwards compatability is a nail in the coffin for any console maker. its simply a gesture of gratitude and should be offered in every console, whether it be at launch or sometime shortly after via patch.

Backwards compatibility never happened out of the kindness of anyone's hearts. There are sound business decisions behind its consideration which sometimes leads to its inclusion, leads to the feature being dismissed, and sometimes even leads to its elimination during the course of production as the Playstation 3 so famously showed.

If it's financially worthwhile for them where the benefits gained outweigh the increased cost it will cause for each console sold, they're going to do it. During the first several years of life for a new console or handheld it encourages people to adapt the new system. Their existing library of software will still work and future releases will remain an option for them (Which can be important with Halo 2 the last time around being some anecdotal evidence of that with many copies surely sold to 360 owners, many original Xbox owners that upgraded earlier than they otherwise would've since that game was compatible, and I'm sure it eased the wait for many until Halo 3). Plus they have an economical pool of software to continue to purchase from in-between expensive next generation games since it always takes a long time for budget deals to finally appear. And outside of a place like AVS, that's an important consideration for many.

And those that never bought a Xbox 360 will have that much more of a reason to finally make that jump since they already will have a generation's worth of exclusives at their fingertips to experience during the early lulls that always happen between compelling next generation console releases. It also benefits the console manufacturer since it helps disguise early lags in some genres like always happens with every new console. And it benefits publishers that have new customers to sell their new 360 projects to while keeping all current customers as an option even if the 360 went to finance the new purchase.

All this helps increase your install base faster than it otherwise would've since people that would've stayed with their current console a while longer will be willing to upgrade earlier. And that means you have more people buying your next gen games earlier. And it creates the minimum of penalty to the health of your previous console which if successful will usually have a healthy extended life after replacement as existing owners slowly upgrade and a new wave of budget conscious consumers pick up the system. All the while still being able to sell 360 games to every 720 owner.

If it doesn't cost too much or place too many limitations on their next generation focus, it's going to happen and not just for goodwill (Which also has an indirect positive effect on the bank account of a corporation). It can have a direct positive impact on their bottom line if the added cost isn't too severe. But of course it's not the focus here. The future is solidly what they're aiming their sights at.

But that doesn't mean that they're not taking a long and hard look at backwards compatibility even if it's not a game changer. Most aspects of a console aren't but it's the culmination of all those features and decisions they're making now that will be what counts. So don't underestimate the importance of one of the many facets of the system since it's the system as a whole that matters.

Also keep in mind that the voice of someone like yourself and other technologically cutting edge consumers at AVS that will not be looking back for even a moment when Fall arrives are hardly representative potential Xbox 720 customers over the next several years before 360 compatibility becomes irrelevant due to the progress of time. We have a lot of people here that have upgraded their console a half dozen times over the past 7.5 years as power supply wattage dropped, chipsets were shrunk, etc.

People like that are outliers even among the early adapters of the console over the course of the next couple of years during the transition period where backwards compatibility matters to many.
Edited by Leo_Ames - 4/19/13 at 5:54pm
post #5167 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad817 View Post

Sorry for the random question. Has there been anything said about downloadable content from the 360 Live account, like games on demand or movies/tv shows etc, being transferable to the Nextbox?

I haven't really accumulated that much, a few games on demand and arcade games. But I imagine some people payed for the right to download a lot of stuff.

Will your Live account basically just transfer to the new system, or be stuck on 360?

I would guess the movies, music, and tv shows would transfer over just fine. I have access to the tv shows I have picked up for free on my Windows 8 machine. I believe all of that material is tied to your account and not just the console it is downloaded onto.
post #5168 of 7006
whityfrd, can you help explain to me what a monopoly is? i thought i knew what it was but i guess i am mistaken??
post #5169 of 7006
Yes, I felt he greatly understated the role of Sony and Nintendo on the console market too.
post #5170 of 7006
I had no idea MS had a monopoly going on.
post #5171 of 7006
He probably means Oligopoly.

What I find more amusing is that this thread two years, 173 pages, and 5,1270 posts long and there is still no new xbox.
post #5172 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by weekendtoy View Post

He probably means Oligopoly.

What I find more amusing is that this thread two years, 173 pages, and 5,1270 posts long and there is still no new xbox.

I do find the thread title ironic since Microsoft is the "last to shot in the Next"generation".
post #5173 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by spid View Post

I do find the thread title ironic since Microsoft is the "last to shot in the Next"generation".

well, Microsoft was on its schedule. they didn't create this thread or any other rumor thread... smile.gif
post #5174 of 7006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by onlysublime View Post

well, Microsoft was on its schedule. they didn't create this thread or any other rumor thread... smile.gif

Do you guys remember a number of years back when about 3 really big Xbox 360 guys left Microsoft in a dispute about the future direction of the company ? The rumor back then was that they wanted to go with a new console much earlier, but they lost out to the Kinect people, because the Kinect was a huge surprise sales wise, and MS wanted to milk it for all it's worth. They decided that the next-generation would be delayed several years, and the 3 bigwigs left the company. We would have had the Next-Gen much earlier, but the Kinect delayed everything.
post #5175 of 7006
Knowing what we know now if that was the case I am personally glad Kinect won out and that the system is coming now rather than 3 years ago. Seriously MS came out with their system 3 years ago and Sony and Nintendo stayed on the course they are on, I don't think things would have bold well for MS
post #5176 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post

Do you guys remember a number of years back when about 3 really big Xbox 360 guys left Microsoft in a dispute about the future direction of the company ? The rumor back then was that they wanted to go with a new console much earlier, but they lost out to the Kinect people, because the Kinect was a huge surprise sales wise, and MS wanted to milk it for all it's worth. They decided that the next-generation would be delayed several years, and the 3 bigwigs left the company. We would have had the Next-Gen much earlier, but the Kinect delayed everything.

that's kind of revisionist history. if anything caused Allard to leave, it was the debacle with the Kin, the Zune devices, and the cancellation of the Courier project. same thing with Bach. it could also be argued that Microsoft was concerned with too many black projects and divisions (Microsoft does pretty much outspend everybody in R&D and doesn't have a lot of real-world product to show for it) and wanted to simplify which they did by eliminating Bach's position and having the others report to Sinofsky and Ballmer.

nothing to do with a next-gen console.
post #5177 of 7006
OMG, I need NextXBOX now, my 360 starting freezing yesterday! I sure don't want to buy another current gen box at this point. This is really going to be a long wait! What's the date, sometime in Nov?
post #5178 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmalbers View Post

OMG, I need NextXBOX now, my 360 starting freezing yesterday! I sure don't want to buy another current gen box at this point. This is really going to be a long wait! What's the date, sometime in Nov?

MS loves Mid November. My guess is a Tuesday around the 15th-22nd range. Looking at a calendar, I say the release date will either be Nov 12th or Nov 19th.
post #5179 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Myrtledog View Post

MS loves Mid November. My guess is a Tuesday around the 15th-22nd range. Looking at a calendar, I say the release date will either be Nov 12th or Nov 19th.

Personally, I feel they will launch the 720 alongside the next Call of Duty, maybe even offer it in a launch bundle with a few months of free Live. CoD is almost single handedly selling Live and the 360, so it makes sense to partner with Activision at launch.
post #5180 of 7006
Unless Sony has beat them to it. Not saying they did, but it is possible.
post #5181 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post

Wow... based on those comments, I'm not sure anything is going to impress you.

Sure, these last couple of years haven't been the most exciting, but there are still some damn good games here and there. To just say that it's all utter rubbish, is throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If you think these two new consoles are going to work miracles, unfortunately, I think you're going to be in for a rude awakening. Just look at Crysis 3 on a super high end PC. Most people playing that game will tell you that it looks as good, or better than anything the PS4 or nextbox are going to be running any time soon, yet the game is considered very lackluster overall. So, just having great graphics doesn't make a great game. These new consoles won't automatically translate into better overall experiences. Sure, they will look pretty, but will they really be that much better ?

What I'm trying to say, is that you should probably lower your expectations quite a bit, otherwise you might be so disappointed that you quit gaming altogether.

I think the question is, HD aside, is/were there any games that game companies wanted to make, but current hardware wasn't powerful enough to make. And I'm not talking about strictly graphics I mean actual gameplay.

I think Skyrim is an excellent example of a game that wouldn't have been possibly on Xbox ONE that was possibly on 360.

So are there any hidden games out there in development that the 360 just wasn't powerful enough to handle but 720 will?
post #5182 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ripeer View Post

I think the question is, HD aside, is/were there any games that game companies wanted to make, but current hardware wasn't powerful enough to make. And I'm not talking about strictly graphics I mean actual gameplay.

I think Skyrim is an excellent example of a game that wouldn't have been possibly on Xbox ONE that was possibly on 360.

So are there any hidden games out there in development that the 360 just wasn't powerful enough to handle but 720 will?

I take it you never played morrowwind then? tongue.gif
post #5183 of 7006
I am pretty sure that theu next gen will bring more than prettier graphics. The amount of memory that these machines will be working with will allow them to do a lot more with gameplay stuff. We're (hopefully) just under one month away from the xbox reveal. I am looking forward to the announcement.
post #5184 of 7006
I completely forget about morrowwind. How could I forget short draw distances, and the ever present fog eek.gif
http://www.listal.com/viewimage/225808h
post #5185 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ripeer View Post

I completely forget about morrowwind. How could I forget short draw distances, and the ever present fog eek.gif
http://www.listal.com/viewimage/225808h

Yeah, looks a little shabby in this day and age....but I guess the point I was trying to make is that you could technically port the "game" part of skyrim to older platforms. But you'd lose so much of what makes skyrim great - you're not transported to another world if you're just staring at bare polygons. Graphics aren't just window dressing, they completely change the experience. So I'm kind of agreeing with you - the total package experience of skyrim just wasnt possible on the Xbox 1. Even if they could degrade the look in order to squeeze out a longer draw distance, no designer at the time would have made that choice.

I'm sure the same will hold true next gen - being freed from tech constraints always produces new gameplay ideas....even if looking back, those were possible all along.

Another good example would be dead rising - that first time seeing a screen full of 50 zombies blew me away. Xbox 1 could have done that with untextured and low geometry zombies to replicate the actual gameplay - but that game would never have even been considered at the time.
post #5186 of 7006
It refuses to die. Eurogamer Interview with Tomasz Gop

Quote:
It sounds like the next Xbox will be always-online?

"What do I think? Very brave, so to speak, decision from Microsoft. Still, the question is whether or not somebody had to do it sooner or later. I'm not personally worried about it myself because as a player it's doable at my home. Even looking at countries like Poland ... there are people who do not have internet, but probably most of them know that it wouldn't even make sense in their case to own a current-gen console, because without the internet you have like half of it [the experience].

"I don't expect it to be that big of a deal, personally. Still, I'm not [an] advisor on that - if it was up to me I probably wouldn't do it so early."
Quote:
Next Xbox possibly blocking pre-owned?

If this is a thing, Gop "seriously" hasn't heard of it, but does have an opinion about it. "Personally I understand people who buy pre-owned games, who sell them. I never will disrespect anybody and I will never encourage anybody, and I will never stand on the side of anybody banning that, personally.

"But then again I'm not a businessman, I'm a developer. If somebody feels like he can't make ends [meet] without it, it's gonna be his decision, and he's going to take it on his chest with all the storm that comes with it. It's his choice. Personally, I'm not in favour of this feature. Players don't want it, and a bigger part of me is a player."
Quote:
"I can't talk too much about the next-gen Xbox," he added, "but I don't think a lot of people [are] going to be surprised. I don't think it's going to be huge news what's inside, no - seriously."
Quote:
Increased raw power aside, it's the new features like video sharing that Gop thinks Sony and Microsoft will use to excite the public. "I really believe the breakthrough here is in the ability to record and share. If you've done something and you want to make a sort of guide out of it, you don't have to go to a forum, you can just record it and show it," he said, alluding to its potential for a "challenging" game like Lords of the Fallen.

"And this is just one tiny detail out of many of these [new features]," he added. "This is probably the thing that defines this new generation of consoles more than the hardware itself."
post #5187 of 7006
Where in there did he actually say that it has always online? I am not seeing that at all, just his opinion on if it will work.
Edited by americangunner - 4/22/13 at 10:18am
post #5188 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Personally, I feel they will launch the 720 alongside the next Call of Duty, maybe even offer it in a launch bundle with a few months of free Live. CoD is almost single handedly selling Live and the 360, so it makes sense to partner with Activision at launch.

Agreed.

Especially considering COD2 was also the best looking release day title on the Xbox360.

After playing the COD2 demo in EB/Gamestop in October 2005.. I immediately put down a deposit. It was hands down the best looking game I'd ever seen on a console!
post #5189 of 7006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daekwan View Post

Agreed.

Especially considering COD2 was also the best looking release day title on the Xbox360.

After playing the COD2 demo in EB/Gamestop in October 2005.. I immediately put down a deposit. It was hands down the best looking game I'd ever seen on a console!

The CoD 2 bundle released in late 2006 is what convinced me to buy a 360. It didn't scream "Next Gen" to me, but it was an amazing game that I just could not pass on playing. Oblivion and Gears were the others that got me to buy it. (even if I did get a PS3 and Oblivion again just 6 months later)
post #5190 of 7006
New to the thread...is there anything concrete about a release date for the new Xbox console?
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