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Onkyo TX-NR609, TX-NR509, TX-SR309 Thread - Page 79

post #2341 of 3823
^^^ If i understand correctly, you cannot apply any sound settings/listening modes to multich.
post #2342 of 3823
I am the happy owner of a 607, so I recommended Onkyo to my brother and helped him buy and install an Onkyo 609.

Overall it works great except for one small problem (and yes, I know this sounds weird) but it seems to be having a problem decoding the bitstreamed sound from certain AC-3 encoded AVI files. All other AVIs, MKVs, VIDEO_TS (DVD) folders all work fine.

The same files work fine at my house with Onkyo 607 and played from either my MediaPortal HTPC, XBMC HTPC, or a WD Live TV SMP. Using either DVI/SPDIF or HDMI.

At his house (with Onkyo 609) but with same mixture of playback devices ... it just can't seem to lock onto the sound. The video is fine, but the audio is either silent or cuts in-out (as the display indicator flashes). The display never shows the Listening Mode because it can't lock onto the sound for any length of time.

Running both of the AVI files in question through MediaInfo, they both say:
Audio Stream: 192 Kbps, 48.0 KHz, 16 bits, 6 channels, AC-3
... so nothing unusual there.

Normally I would just say the files are bad or poorly encoded, but they work fine on my system. Even fine on his system with the old Sony (pre AC3 ... or analog ... no SPDIF or HDMI) amp ... just not with the new Onkyo 609. Just not a good "showing" and kind of has him worried that he made a purchasing mistake.

Am I missing a trouble-shooting step here? Are you guys seeing anything like this?
post #2343 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by tighr View Post

I have my PC set up to output 5.1 audio via HDMI to the NR609. Under "display", it clearly shows that the input to the receiver is Multich PCM 5.1.

When I am watching OTA TV using WMC, most of my local broadcasts are 2.0, and the computer properly sends the audio as stereo left and right to the receiver, but is there no way to simulate surround sound as Pro-Logic II? The only way I can get any audio out of the center channel and surrounds is if I set it to "All-Ch Stereo".

If I play 5.1 movies from my computer using "direct", everything plays correctly.

I've run across this recently also. So far, it always been a fault or mis-configuration in the playback device or input device. In every case, I've been able to correct it (at the HTPC).

I do a lot of stuff with HTPC and the new WD-Live-TV-SMP. When I use to use DVI and Optical SPDIF ... it never seemed to be a problem.

However, when I switched over to running both audio AND video over HDMI, this problem surfaced. The amp shows MultiCh and you can't switch to "simulated surround" listening modes like PLIIx or NEO:6 .

What happens is the playback device is incorrectly sending 2 channels of sound with 4 channels of silence (6 total). When this hits the amp (instead of just 2 channels), that's what it plays. It doesn't know how to drop certain audio tracks that are already present.

I suppose it can also happen with poorly encoded media files, but it's unlikely the creator would enclude extra tracks of silence. So far, it's always been the playback device incorrectly creating those and "inserting" them into the signal sent to the amp.
post #2344 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

I've run across this recently also. So far, it always been a fault or mis-configuration in the playback device or input device. In every case, I've been able to correct it (at the HTPC).

Did you find a solution that corrects this via HDMI, or are you recommending that I switch to optical?
post #2345 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by tighr View Post

Did you find a solution that corrects this via HDMI, or are you recommending that I switch to optical?

I fixed it and still use HDMI.

But I don't use MCE or MC7. Try setting Windows Control Panel sound to "Desktop Speakers". That might limit analog and/or PCM sound to 2 channels but still send the bitstreamed (Dolby Digital 5.1 and DTS) directly to the amp for proper Multi-channel playback.

Also, look for and try changing settings in your sound driver config and/or MC7. For instance, if there is a place where you set the "Audio Device", select a specific one instead of the "System Default" one.

If you do fall back to SPDIF (nothing at all wrong with that) ... try running SPDIF to Amp. Then, install a $3 DVI-to-HDMI converter and use the HDMI cable on the DVI port. Reason ... sometimes HTPC has trouble when using HDMI port, but not using it for both audio and video.
post #2346 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post

Add me to the list of people with this 24p frame skip with a TX-NR809.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=2986


Bought a Denon AVR-3312. Problem solved. Never buying another Onkyo again. Their entire line of receivers is simply broken!

Hey another bonus from the Denon is no waiting for the audio to start playing again when you fast forward/rewind/skip chapter during Blu-ray playback. That 2-3 second delay of silence was annoying.
post #2347 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by tighr View Post

I have my PC set up to output 5.1 audio via HDMI to the NR609. Under "display", it clearly shows that the input to the receiver is Multich PCM 5.1.

When I am watching OTA TV using WMC, most of my local broadcasts are 2.0, and the computer properly sends the audio as stereo left and right to the receiver, but is there no way to simulate surround sound as Pro-Logic II? The only way I can get any audio out of the center channel and surrounds is if I set it to "All-Ch Stereo".

If I play 5.1 movies from my computer using "direct", everything plays correctly.


did you go through the set up on wmc and tell it you have a 5.1 system?
you need to also do it on the digital output settings on whatever sound drivers you are using...
post #2348 of 3823
I posted a few post back that my Blu Ray player will not show on the screen and now I realize I ran the Audessey for the first time and now the Blu Ray player will not show on the screen? I go into source and try to connect on the Blu Ray source and nothing? Could running the Audessey changed anything?

Onkyo TX-NR609
post #2349 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinwoodward View Post

did you go through the set up on wmc and tell it you have a 5.1 system?
you need to also do it on the digital output settings on whatever sound drivers you are using...

Yes, in the HDMI Audio device in the sound panel, it is set as a 5.1 system, and the test tones play in all the correct speakers. I have disabled all other sound devices (since I'm not using any of them), so the HDMI device is the only enabled one.

In 7MC, when telling it I have a 5.1 system, it fails to play the tone in all of the speakers.
post #2350 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post

I posted a few post back that my Blu Ray player will not show on the screen and now I realize I ran the Audessey for the first time and now the Blu Ray player will not show on the screen? I go into source and try to connect on the Blu Ray source and nothing? Could running the Audessey changed anything?

Onkyo TX-NR609

Figured it out!
post #2351 of 3823
^^
Glad to hear you figured it out, however, it would help others to note what it was you did to resolve your issue rather than simply saying that you figured it out. Thanks.
post #2352 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

However, when I switched over to running both audio AND video over HDMI, this problem surfaced. The amp shows MultiCh and you can't switch to "simulated surround" listening modes like PLIIx or NEO:6 .

This answers my question as far as the Onkyo goes, so I'm going to take the question over to the HTPC forums. Now I at least know why I couldn't get Pro-Logic to work. I went into the Playback devices and configured the device as stereo, and I was able to get Pro-Logic on the receiver. Then I configured 7MC to be a 5.1 system. Everything now works in WMC as far as TV content is concerned, and all six channels get a tone in 7MC.

I've done a bit of googling, and it turns out what I need to do is force FFDshow to pass-thru multi-channel audio. This ignores the configurations in the audio device, and merely sends all audio to the receiver for decoding. In either event, this is not a problem with the Onkyo.

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone. Wish me luck.
post #2353 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Also, any cable supports Audio Return Channel so there's nothing special required there. If you have cables labeled HDMI 1.3 they will work just as well as any cables labeled HDMI 1.4.

That is incorrect. ARC only works on HDMI 1.4.
post #2354 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by sublime258 View Post

That is incorrect. ARC only works on HDMI 1.4.

That has also been my experience, because ... at MonoPrice, the only cables marked ARC, were also v1.4.

I tried to use an nice high-bandwidth v1.3 cable, and ARC wouldn't work. As per the manual, you also have to turn on HDMI-CEC on both devices (in this case, an Onkyo 609 and a Panny 2010 plasma).

HDMI v1.4 cables are also rated to handle more bandwidth ... get'em as short as possible with a lower guage (thicker wires).
post #2355 of 3823
is the onkyo TX609 the same as onkyo TX609-B? is it worth upgrading if i have onkyo HT RC 360 to the TX 609? its a 150.00dollar CAD. price gap
post #2356 of 3823
I've read every post of at least the last 30 pages of this thread and saw that a lot of people are having the same issues I'm having with the TX-NR509. I have a Panasonic BDT210 Blu-ray player connected to the TX-NR509 with a 10' Monoprice 28AWG High Speed HDMI cable, and the same cable connecting the TX-NR509 to the Panasonic 55ST30 TV. I am seeing little white dots flashing all over the screen very quickly and randomly when using the receiver’s OSD and also when the screen is black before the movie starts. That issue seems to stop once the movie actually starts playing. The other issue is random audio/video cutouts. Sometimes the audio will drop out a few times in a minute, sometimes every few minutes, and sometimes not at all for long periods of time. It doesn't happen at the same spot in the movie when going back. Sometimes the video will also drop out and the TV will display "no signal" for a couple seconds. I can see the receiver resetting itself when this happens, like it has to reacquire the data stream or something.

Some people think it's a HDMI handshake issue between the BD player and receiver. I saw someone in this thread stated that the Monoprice site says somewhere that the 28AWG High Speed HDMI cables can cause handshake issues when used with AVRs, and that the thicker 24AWG cable shouldn't have that problem. I would like to know where it says that on their site, because I couldn’t find it. I honestly don’t understand why that would make a difference, because they’re both HDMI 1.4. I also saw that someone with this problem upgraded from the Panny BDT210 to the BDT310 because it has two HDMI outputs; so they could connect one directly to the TV for video and one to the receiver for audio, and that resolved the problems.

At this point I don't know whether to fault the BDT210, TX-NR509, or HDMI cable. I have yet to find a solution for this and am about to send back the TX-NR509 and upgrade to the TX-NR609 just because I haven't found the same issues reported with TX-NR609. I would rather not spend more money on unnecessary upgrades if I don't have to because I really do like the TX-NR509 and the BDT210, but this problem is a deal breaker. If anyone else has found a solution to this, I would be very happy to know what it is!
post #2357 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by sublime258 View Post

That is incorrect. ARC only works on HDMI 1.4.

Sorry, but not true ... which is why the HDMI.org now forbids HDMI cable mfr from labeling cables with an HDMI number. Please refer to the link in my previous post for more information on this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

That has also been my experience, because ... at MonoPrice, the only cables marked ARC, were also v1.4.

I tried to use an nice high-bandwidth v1.3 cable, and ARC wouldn't work. As per the manual, you also have to turn on HDMI-CEC on both devices (in this case, an Onkyo 609 and a Panny 2010 plasma).

HDMI v1.4 cables are also rated to handle more bandwidth ... get'em as short as possible with a lower guage (thicker wires).

Again, not the case. More than likely you had a settings issue, as ARC will indeed work with HDMI 1.3 cables with proper settings on both the TV and AVR.

The below quote is from the HDMI.org site ---> http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdm...i_1_4_faq.aspx

============================================================ ===========
Will I need a new cable to support Audio Return Channel functionality?

No. Audio Return Channel -enabled devices can be connected via all the existing categories of HDMI cables.
============================================================ =============
post #2358 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by tighr View Post

This answers my question as far as the Onkyo goes, so I'm going to take the question over to the HTPC forums. Now I at least know why I couldn't get Pro-Logic to work. I went into the Playback devices and configured the device as stereo, and I was able to get Pro-Logic on the receiver. Then I configured 7MC to be a 5.1 system. Everything now works in WMC as far as TV content is concerned, and all six channels get a tone in 7MC.

I've done a bit of googling, and it turns out what I need to do is force FFDshow to pass-thru multi-channel audio. This ignores the configurations in the audio device, and merely sends all audio to the receiver for decoding. In either event, this is not a problem with the Onkyo.

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone. Wish me luck.

i can answer this for you as i had the same issue
the ONLY way to get TV to work is to set the windows configeration to 2ch. this allows the amp to apply PL2
you then need reclock to load with whatever else you use to play discs/files. ie mpc, and set it to output either 5.1 pcm or just bit passthrough. this bypasses the windows configeration and allow the amp to receive the digital/5.1 pcm
post #2359 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by sublime258 View Post

I have a Panasonic BDT210 Blu-ray player connected to the TX-NR509 with a 10' Monoprice 28AWG High Speed HDMI cable, and the same cable connecting the TX-NR509 to the Panasonic 55ST30 TV. I am seeing little white dots flashing all over the screen very quickly and randomly when using the receiver’s OSD and also when the screen is black before the movie starts.

More often then not "white sparkles" are the result of a defective cable, so before replacing any devices, try replacing the cables first. Monoprice is good about taking defective products back. Also, if there is a Deep Color Output setting on the BDT210, try setting it to OFF.
post #2360 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Sorry, but not true ... which is why the HDMI.org now forbids HDMI cable mfr from labeling cables with an HDMI number. Please refer to the link in my previous post for more information on this.



Again, not the case. More than likely you had a settings issue, as ARC will indeed work with HDMI 1.3 cables with proper settings on both the TV and AVR.

The below quote is from the HDMI.org site ---> http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdm...i_1_4_faq.aspx

============================================================ ===========
Will I need a new cable to support Audio Return Channel functionality?

No. Audio Return Channel -enabled devices can be connected via all the existing categories of HDMI cables.
============================================================ =============

While im sure this is true...
I would just add my personal experience here. When first hooking up my 609 to TV, i could not get ARC to work. I switched out the older HDMI cable for a new one i had from Monoprice that was labelled "1.4". ARC then worked.
I dont know what the deal was but switching cables solved the issue.
post #2361 of 3823
I have an onkyo ht-rc 360 its the same as an onkyo nr609. My problem is I get a white snowy picture and then comes and hdmi black picture cycle and sound gets lost. What the heck is the problem this is my second onkyo unit in 3 weeks I'm really sad please help.
post #2362 of 3823
^^
In order to troubleshoot HDMI video/audio issues, start out by ensuring the cable connections are securely fitted between the source and AVR and between the AVR and the TV/display. A loose fitting can cause picture issues. The next step is to connect the HDMI cable from the source directly to the TV/display to see if you still get the same issue to rule out the source as the issue. If no issue, this connection doesn't rule out the cable itself from being defective, so try replacing the HDMI cables which can be purchased from forum sponsors Monoprice or Blue Jeans Cable for relatively inexpensive prices (~$5/cable). The last step would be to reset the micropressor which will return all settings to their factory defaults.

Is the issue happening with all sources or just a particular source?
post #2363 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaty View Post

is the onkyo TX609 the same as onkyo TX609-B? is it worth upgrading if i have onkyo HT RC 360 to the TX 609? its a 150.00dollar CAD. price gap

When they add the B ... that usually just means it's Black in Color. If Onkyo made a Silver one, they would add an S on the end. Panasonic and others do the same thing.

You can compare both in a side-by-side chart at OnkyoUsa.com. The 360 is probably missing THX or something.
post #2364 of 3823
Hey all, I have a TX609. On my old AVR, I could plug in my Iphone via the aux jack and listen to audio while watching video on another input. Purpose is to stream local radio broadcasters for football game, and mute the tv broadcast announcers.

This new AVR has a USB to hook up the iPhone, now. Is there a way to listen to that and switch to video feed on another input concurrently?
post #2365 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob67 View Post

Hey all, I have a TX609. On my old AVR, I could plug in my Iphone via the aux jack and listen to audio while watching video on another input. Purpose is to stream local radio broadcasters for football game, and mute the tv broadcast announcers.

This new AVR has a USB to hook up the iPhone, now. Is there a way to listen to that and switch to video feed on another input concurrently?

I think you can, but you have to use the iPhone analog audio output like before (not USB). That way, the iPhone is still processing the sound. Then, you connect it to an "audio only" input like CD.

Maybe someone else has a better answer.
post #2366 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob67 View Post

Hey all, I have a TX609. On my old AVR, I could plug in my Iphone via the aux jack and listen to audio while watching video on another input. Purpose is to stream local radio broadcasters for football game, and mute the tv broadcast announcers.

This new AVR has a USB to hook up the iPhone, now. Is there a way to listen to that and switch to video feed on another input concurrently?

This was discussed earlier in the thread in this post ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post20330530
post #2367 of 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post


This was discussed earlier in the thread in this post ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post20330530

Thanks! Missed that post in my search. Bad news though...
post #2368 of 3823
I own the 609 and just ordered the Outlaw Lfm1 sub. Are there any others in here with this combo that can share how they setup the sub. Im wondering if i should set the sub in bypass for crossover and just letting audyssey take care of the crossover settings for me.
post #2369 of 3823
^^
Although not an Outlaw LFM1 owner, the general recommendation when using an Audyssey equipped AVR is to bypass all settings and let the AVR handle the bass management. If the sub comes with it's own EQ program and you want to use it, run it first and then run Audyssey afterwards.
post #2370 of 3823
@jdsmoothie
I did read your link and see where you are coming from, the site does say "Will I need a new cable to support Audio Return Channel functionality?
No. Audio Return Channel -enabled devices can be connected via all the existing categories of HDMI cables." However on other pages of the hdmi.org site, I see where it says ARC was only introduced in HDMI 1.4, which is contradicting. If you google "audio return channel" you will find other sources saying it only works on HDMI 1.4 (aka High Speed). Considering people haven't gotten ARC to work with cables less than 1.4, I would assume hdmi.org is incorrect, which would be crazy considering it's the official site for HDMI...
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