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Samsung PNxxD450/PNxxD490 Owners Thread - Page 23

post #661 of 1859
Changedsoul: OK. You should try chaninging the name of the input (DVI-PC or bluray) and see the changes!
post #662 of 1859
WD HD tv (Gen.2) works wonders with mkvs at 1080p with this plasma

"Warm 2" option destroys Color Delta , try Movie mode with "Standard"
post #663 of 1859
Hey just to let you all know. I should be getting a ColorMunki spectro in directly from Spectracal (confident it will be accurate), that I will profile my i1D2 against. Will report calibration results over the weekend.
post #664 of 1859
I got my replacement TV and the Juddering effect is still present on the new TV and the one i have had with over 100 hours on it. So I got a Panasonic 42S30 to see if its Samsung with the problem but it present on the Panasonic as well and the Panasonic has some big time ghosting on the Xbox dashboard > My Xbox when side scrolling them. Don't know if the Panasonic is a bad one but i find it hard to believe. I think ill just stay with Samsung and have less problems then the Panasonic.

Heres the panasonic 42S30s ghosting problem and its more pronounced in person.
http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/2...led1copycs.jpg
post #665 of 1859
is there any difference in 2d picture quality between the 450 and the 490?
post #666 of 1859
Alright. Done calibrating my PN51D450 (US Model). Grayscale is great, color gamut eh. But that is pretty common for cheap/er Plasma's (over saturation of green).


Mode Movie
Cell 10
Constrast 86
Brightness 59
Sharpness 0
Color 52
Tint 50/50
Gamma 0
Color Temp Warm 2
W/B
R-Off 23
G-Off 25
B-Off 22
R-Gain 15
G-Gain 27
B-Gain 25

Whatever settings are not listed. Should be turned off/set to 0/etc....
LL
LL
post #667 of 1859
Settings look similar to the ones done by TelevisionInfo. Great work, I can't wait to try them out when I get my TV on Wednesday.

BTW, are the W/B settings readily available or do they have to be tweaked in the service menu?
post #668 of 1859
The W/B settings are readily available, no need to get into the service menu!
post #669 of 1859
Nutdotnet: What patterns did you use (SD or HD patterns) for color calibration, because I got a lot better Delta E on on all colors (especially green) with auto colorspace. However, that was with 709-hd that has a wider gamut than NTSC. I also wonder about your choice of using so much adjustment of tint. I found that when I did so (EU model however), while it did improve the secondaries somewhat, it seriously messed up the primaries, weirdly enough...

Anyway, with a HTPC and color correction (in media player classic) you can get all delta e at less than 3 (both greyscale and color).
post #670 of 1859
grimmy, i liked your settings but having call light at highest point was a bit uncomfortable for me, i think mainly due to electricity cost. can anything similar be done with cell light at 10?

nutdotnet, as you have the usa version, is 10 the highest cell light setting or does it go upto 20?
post #671 of 1859
I am fairly confident that the EU and US model are quite a bit different.

For example, your max Cell is 20, ours is 10. You mentioned you have a "Blue/Green/Red " only mode. We have NONE of those.

Correct me if I am wrong. But using a HTPC /w MPC /w "color correction", would only apply to the HTPC correct? (ok not really a question sorry lol).

I mean that is awesome for finding a "work around" on a HTPC (I read the thread). But what about for other sources? Have you tried taking a reading from another source? I would be very curious on what your findings are.

And I used the "Tom Huffman" way for setting tint. i.e. getting Cyan as close to the CIE target as possible. Unless it adversely effects the other secondaries, which as always, on TV's with lack of CMS and full grayscale controls you compromise.
post #672 of 1859
hi nutdotnet, i tried your settings but it didn't work for me. the grass had a neon glow. i dropped the colour to 38 and temperature to standard and grass looked more natural but i'm still testing different settings.

problem is, i'm trying to get the popping contrast that i saw on the samsung LE40C580 and C650 and i think it's probably impossible on this set!
post #673 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimmy84 View Post

These are the settings for 1080p24 (should be the same for 720p) based on standard with game mode turned on:

Cell at max
Contrast at 85
Brightness 42
Color 46
tint 50/50 (untouched)
colorspace AUTO (important!) and all fancy options turned off
Warm 2
Gamma 0 for around 2.2-2.3 gamma. You might want to use -1 for dark room and possibly +1 for a really bright room.

in white balance r-offest increased to 26
b-offest reduced to 17
r-gain reduced to 6
b-offest increased to 26
green-offest and g-gain left alone

As in the other mode, what is important is to reduced red until the purle tone is removed. Changing the blues are not as important as they are trade offs anyway because the blue gamme tracking is far from flat. It will be quite good anyway you deal with it.

hi, you've got b-offset at 17 and 26. does 26 for b-gain?
post #674 of 1859
i'm using these settings from Grimmy84. only thing i changed is having cell at 10 (on an eu tv where max =20) and i'm not using it in conjunction with anything that's 1080p24 or game mode, just bbc hd from sky hd box.

These are the settings for 1080p24 (should be the same for 720p) based on standard with game mode turned on:

Cell at max
Contrast at 85
Brightness 42
Color 46
tint 50/50 (untouched)
colorspace AUTO (important!) and all fancy options turned off
Warm 2
Gamma 0 for around 2.2-2.3 gamma. You might want to use -1 for dark room and possibly +1 for a really bright room.

in white balance r-offest increased to 26
b-offest reduced to 17
r-gain reduced to 6
b-offest increased to 26
green-offest and g-gain left alone


and here's a pic. i love it. red is glowing in some scenes so i need to turn it down, but it has some great depth and really vivid colours. what do you think?
post #675 of 1859
KPM you may want to verify your brightness setting.... You have a Blu-Ray player that you can use the AVS disc with?
post #676 of 1859
Just updated my settings/chart (well the color ones). Grayscale still verified great. This is normally why I don't post settings till the next day after my mind clears
post #677 of 1859
kpm197:Yes, b-gain at 26 (it was a typo)

Nutdotnet: Yeah, the color correction is only for a htpc and it does the same as an expensive video processor would do. In principle, all sets that have a to wide gamut can be adjusted (it can only be shrunk) but you can only adjust the primaries and pray that the tv do not get the secondaries wrong.

I have also calibrated from an htpc without color correction and from my xbox 360. These are the settings I have posted. I do not use any other sources.
What I found there is that with colorspace auto the delta E of the primaries will not be as off as you have it and I think they might have been to much off because you have adjusted tint as much. At first I also tried getting cyan correct by adjustning tint. However, the error in cyan is not so much due to the inaccurate mix of colors, but rather that the primaries are a little bit off to begin with.In the end, I got the best result by leaving tint as is. Then again, this might be diffrent on the EU and US version.
post #678 of 1859
Yeah man it has to be a difference between EU and US models. OR your meter is off (please do not think I am trying to point a finger or ANYTHING), but if you are using a i1D2, I would not be surprised. Shoot my i1D2 less than a year old, and I was surprised how much correction it needed when profiled against a known good spectro.

I did re-do my color settings. My math was off the first time. So after doing Color again, the tint didn't need adjustment (well it could have gone a tick to the left, but eh).

With just Color/Tint controls, there is no one can get this much error corrected (well expect for using an external proc. of course).

Now if Red was overly saturated along with green, we could make green error much smaller. But due to the fact that red is actually under saturated at stock, and green is over saturated, we (well at least US Models) are kind of stuck.

But for the price, it is great.

Which patterns are you using BTW (on the AVS disc that is). I assume the window patterns?
post #679 of 1859
Nutdotnet, tried a variation on your settings for my PN43D450 and it got the image to much better match with my Epson 8350 projector. So thanks for your setup post! I'm still not liking the red levels on this Samsung unit (just can't get them right no matter what) but at least they are somewhat more natural now - no more heat stroke victim flesh tones...
post #680 of 1859
Got myself the new SAMMY 43D490, Picture quality is much better than my LED 40 Inch
3D functionality is tops
Also like the 2D - 3D conversion

Played Crysis 2 in 3D
Watched TRON in 3D,

i will post more pictures later on
post #681 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpm197 View Post

i'm using these settings from Grimmy84. only thing i changed is having cell at 10 (on an eu tv where max =20) and i'm not using it in conjunction with anything that's 1080p24 or game mode, just bbc hd from sky hd box.

These are the settings for 1080p24 (should be the same for 720p) based on standard with game mode turned on:

Cell at max
Contrast at 85
Brightness 42
Color 46
tint 50/50 (untouched)
colorspace AUTO (important!) and all fancy options turned off
Warm 2
Gamma 0 for around 2.2-2.3 gamma. You might want to use -1 for dark room and possibly +1 for a really bright room.

in white balance r-offest increased to 26
b-offest reduced to 17
r-gain reduced to 6
b-offest increased to 26
green-offest and g-gain left alone


and here's a pic. i love it. red is glowing in some scenes so i need to turn it down, but it has some great depth and really vivid colours. what do you think?

b-offest reduced to 17 ........... b-offest increased to 26

any other thing to do with the same offset at the same time ?

Nutdotnet ; Sharpness : 0 ...wtf ?

There is no Game Mode in EU models !

Dont know PQ differences between EU and US models but
Cell at max is not good for the Black levels in the EU model
and Warm 2 option instead "Standard" destroys natural skin tones


As for the picture....Blue looks well calibrated (left logo).
Image is too much bright for me
post #682 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by ertoil View Post

b-offest reduced to 17 ........... b-offest increased to 26

any other thing to do with the same offset at the same time ?

Nutdotnet ; Sharpness : 0 ...wtf ?

There is no Game Mode in EU models !

Dont know PQ differences between EU and US models but
Cell at max is not good for the Black levels in the EU model
and Warm 2 option instead "Standard" destroys natural skin tones


As for the picture....Blue looks well calibrated (left logo).
Image is too much bright for me

settings are direct from grimmy84s post. confirmed that 26 is for b-gain.

i think i've got my sharpness at around 20, the photo makes it look alot sharper than the actual tv image.

game mode is under general settings not picture settings, have you checked in there?

i think i've actually gone with warm 1 now as warm 2 just looks too reddish.

regarding my previous comments about these settings having too much red glow, i found the game mode and turned it on and that turned the red down just enough.
post #683 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutdotnet View Post

KPM you may want to verify your brightness setting.... You have a Blu-Ray player that you can use the AVS disc with?

hi, yeah i've been using the avs disc on the ps3 but only the basic folder as i don't have any physical tools to calibrate beyond that. brightness i think might actually be set at 46 or 48. i've spent so much time trying different settings i'm starting to forget what i set it to! i hate bright images but this doesn't seem too bright to me. i was round a friends house on the weekend and he had his tv on dynamic mode and as it was a samsung i recognised most of the picture settings so changed it up a bit. it looked much better after but he preferred dynamic mode!
post #684 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpm197 View Post

hi, yeah i've been using the avs disc on the ps3 but only the basic folder as i don't have any physical tools to calibrate beyond that. brightness i think might actually be set at 46 or 48. i've spent so much time trying different settings i'm starting to forget what i set it to! i hate bright images but this doesn't seem too bright to me. i was round a friends house on the weekend and he had his tv on dynamic mode and as it was a samsung i recognised most of the picture settings so changed it up a bit. it looked much better after but he preferred dynamic mode!

When watching the AVS brightness/contrast pattern on the PS3 do you see all the bars?

Been awhile since I have owned a PS3. It is great because it has so many different options, but also can be a pain for that same reason.

There should be an option to output YCbCr which "should" force 16-235. But I have also read that is only for Video/Blu-ray play back and all games on the PS3 are forced to 0-255.

Also for some reason I remember you actually need to have Super White turned on to display WTW and BTB. But again I could be wrong. I am sure some quick searching on here would result in a proper answer.

ALMOST sounds like you may be getting brightness and contrast confused (i.e. saying you don't bright images). Remember brightness is black level (first pattern in the AVS Basic Settings), and contrast is white level (3rd pattern). And don't forget about the 2nd pattern either It is the Dynamic Brightness/Contrast pattern.
post #685 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by ertoil View Post

b-offest reduced to 17 ........... b-offest increased to 26

any other thing to do with the same offset at the same time ?

Nutdotnet ; Sharpness : 0 ...wtf ?

There is no Game Mode in EU models !

Dont know PQ differences between EU and US models but
Cell at max is not good for the Black levels in the EU model
and Warm 2 option instead "Standard" destroys natural skin tones


As for the picture....Blue looks well calibrated (left logo).
Image is too much bright for me

Yes Sharpness at 0. If I could reduce it more I would.... Samsung's plasma have been very "edgy" (i.e. love the sharpness) even when set to 0. And this one is no different.

And Cell light has VERY little (if any) to do with black level. If it did, it would actually effect brightness when viewing a pattern, which it doesn't.

I calibrated to appx. 35ftL at max white.
post #686 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutdotnet View Post

When watching the AVS brightness/contrast pattern on the PS3 do you see all the bars?

Been awhile since I have owned a PS3. It is great because it has so many different options, but also can be a pain for that same reason.

There should be an option to output YCbCr which "should" force 16-235. But I have also read that is only for Video/Blu-ray play back and all games on the PS3 are forced to 0-255.

Also for some reason I remember you actually need to have Super White turned on to display WTW and BTB. But again I could be wrong. I am sure some quick searching on here would result in a proper answer.

ALMOST sounds like you may be getting brightness and contrast confused (i.e. saying you don't bright images). Remember brightness is black level (first pattern in the AVS Basic Settings), and contrast is white level (3rd pattern). And don't forget about the 2nd pattern either It is the Dynamic Brightness/Contrast pattern.

please take this politely; perhaps i've misunderstood but i'm not sure why you think i'm confused i really like the picture on my tv
post #687 of 1859
I have already returned this model once after it developed a large pale pink tint over half the screen that was not there originally. Now the replacement has developed the same problem only not quite as severe. It is mainly noticeable on a light background. Has anyone else noticed this issue and is there anyway to make it less noticeable? Otherwise I really like this television.
post #688 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpm197 View Post

please take this politely; perhaps i've misunderstood but i'm not sure why you think i'm confused i really like the picture on my tv

And that my friend is all that matters

I was just trying to help you verify that your brightness setting is set correctly. (Remember brightness only raises black level, it won't make it "Brighter"). But having it set to low won't make your blacks "blacker" either. It will just crush the black detail.
post #689 of 1859
I'm thinking about buying this set and I was wondering if anyone thinks I should be concerned with burn in, if most things I watch are SD and have black bars on the left and right.

I normally leave an old episode of the simpsons on in the background and the episodes all have black bars. As well, I don't have cable so very little of the media I watch is HD, except for when I put a BD in the PS3.

I know people recommend breaking in the tv, but is it really necessary to do it for 100 hours with this set?

Thanks!
post #690 of 1859
Quote:
Originally Posted by aapl View Post

I'm thinking about buying this set and I was wondering if anyone thinks I should be concerned with burn in, if most things I watch are SD and have black bars on the left and right.

I normally leave an old episode of the simpsons on in the background and the episodes all have black bars. As well, I don't have cable so very little of the media I watch is HD, except for when I put a BD in the PS3.

I know people recommend breaking in the tv, but is it really necessary to do it for 100 hours with this set?

Thanks!

Break in is a debated topic in your situation I would do it. Also remember that an important step in avoiding burn in is to switch sources so that the image doesn't burn in. Even without cable most stations have OTA HD which you should be able to get.
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