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3D Theatre - VIP Product Thread - Page 29

post #841 of 2071
Does anyone else who has received the RF glasses know if there is a mode (maybe via the PC software?) where they can be put in left eye or right eye only? I know this would be an unusual application, but I read that some (I believe the Viewsonic?) DLP-Link glasses can do this, and here is why I'm interested: split screen gaming. I read in theory if you output a 2D two-player game as split-screen, then set the 3D display (or adapter box, the VIP Theater in this case) to manual side-by-side (or top and bottom, if that is how the game does split screen), and can get the glasses to sync to only left eye (and another pair to only right eye), each player will only see their portion of the screen.

Of course it would likely be stretched unnaturally, and there may be ghosting if one player's image differs tons from the other, but it would be fun to try it out if the glasses can do this. No more screen cheating from my son!
post #842 of 2071
Guys im on my way to pick up the stuff to do the pan4k test !
post #843 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by widerscreen View Post

Guys im on my way to pick up the stuff to do the pan4k test !

Report back soon. If the crew over at VIP can get everything dialed in so that there is no ghosting and flicker I may keep my unit.
post #844 of 2071
Hi another question some doubts.

I read some post before that if you connect the theater or the displayer before your amplifier (as long as is at least 1.3) you will get 3D even if in theory your amplifer is no 3D ready.

In my case I have the Sony HT-DDWG800 and I have conected the PS3 (DVD, Multimedia HD also) thru the Amp with HDMI then a splitter after the HDMI out to split the HDMI to TV and PJ.

Will I get 3D if I connect the Displayer between the PS3 and the AMP?

thanks
post #845 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by rioeire View Post

Hi another question some doubts.

I read some post before that if you connect the theater or the displayer before your amplifier (as long as is at least 1.3) you will get 3D even if in theory your amplifer is no 3D ready.

In my case I have the Sony HT-DDWG800 and I have conected the PS3 (DVD, Multimedia HD also) thru the Amp with HDMI then a splitter after the HDMI out to split the HDMI to TV and PJ.

Will I get 3D if I connect the Displayer between the PS3 and the AMP?

thanks

Yes you will get 3D as what this does is take the signal down to a hdmi 1.3 signal...your reciever should have no problem passing that along..you should be good to go!
post #846 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart628 View Post

Yes you will get 3D as what this does is take the signal down to a hdmi 1.3 signal...your reciever should have no problem passing that along..you should be good to go!

How about the VIP between the amp (1.3) and projector instead? Will we still get 3d that way?
post #847 of 2071
ok I dont want to speak too soon but Im getting ghosting and flicker with the ae4k pj I will wait till I get a call back from Jonathan

I will report I do get a 3-d images but nothing like I get from my plasma TV

ghosting and flicker
tried to dial it out with the joy stick but seem not to have any effect. again I could be doing something wrong so Ill wait to hear back from J.
post #848 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by widerscreen View Post

ok I dont want to speak too soon but Im getting ghosting and flicker with the ae4k pj I will wait till I get a call back from Jonathan

I will report I do get a 3-d images but nothing like I get from my plasma TV

ghosting and flicker
tried to dial it out with the joy stick but seem not to have any effect. again I could be doing something wrong so Ill wait to hear back from J.

I thought you were doing this at VIP with Jonathan. Didn't you take your projector to Jonathan?

My Theater unit arrived today! I will test it tonight on my RS1.
post #849 of 2071
Well I cant seem to control the depth only the middle seems to have any 3-d depth and the rest is like double vision. I cant get rid of the ghosting and flicker the joy stick thing I just dont get it or what its purpose is for??
post #850 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by slvramalgam View Post

How about the VIP between the amp (1.3) and projector instead? Will we still get 3d that way?

no, as you have a non 3d amp....I am even running into issues with putting the theater between my amp and the projector and I have a 3d amp (pioneer vsx 820k) directv works out great...but when I try a bluray from my panasonic bdt 110 it gives me problems.
post #851 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by widerscreen View Post

Well I cant seem to control the depth only the middle seems to have any 3-d depth and the rest is like double vision. I cant get rid of the ghosting and flicker the joy stick thing I just dont get it or what its purpose is for??

I was able to get rid of the flicker, but that severely affected the brightness. I can't get rid of the ghosting though. I've tried with both the joystick on the emitter as well as using the tuning software. I don't want to run a dual projector setup (1080P for 2D & 720P 3D ready) just to get quality 3D, but that seems like the only relatively inexpensive option.
post #852 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by widerscreen View Post

Well I cant seem to control the depth only the middle seems to have any 3-d depth and the rest is like double vision. I cant get rid of the ghosting and flicker the joy stick thing I just dont get it or what its purpose is for??

Did you download the manual? To enable joystick adjustment of the fine tuning, press the joystick IN until two green lights light up. Then, side-to-side controls duty cycle & up-down controls delay.

Forgive me if you tried that already... just trying to cover all the bases! The software utility may be easier for fine tuning.
post #853 of 2071
Well I find the more I play with it the better it gets , Yes the darker the less ghosting im going to play with it more but it does work with the 4k but looks like a lot of tweaking is needed. Boy I have a head ache!


Quote:
Originally Posted by THE DU3C3 View Post

I was able to get rid of the flicker, but that severely affected the brightness. I can't get rid of the ghosting though. I've tried with both the joystick on the emitter as well as using the tuning software. I don't want to run a dual projector setup (1080P for 2D & 720P 3D ready) just to get quality 3D, but that seems like the only relatively inexpensive option.
post #854 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by widerscreen View Post

Well I find the more I play with it the better it gets , Yes the darker the less ghosting im going to play with it more but it does work with the 4k but looks like a lot of tweaking is needed. Boy I have a head ache!

When you get it to the best you can please post it on youtube ...I need to see
the 3d picture quality before I spring for this
post #855 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by widerscreen View Post

Well I find the more I play with it the better it gets , Yes the darker the less ghosting im going to play with it more but it does work with the 4k but looks like a lot of tweaking is needed. Boy I have a head ache!

This might be why so many people have ghosting. They want a bright picture. Can't happen! brightness has to drop to about 20% of what you see with 2D. Maybe even less!

My Directv HR20 DVR doesn't support 3D. So I need to take one of my HD23's from another room and install it in my theater just to test it. This sucks because I had a ton of recorded shows on my external drive and i am not sure if a newer HD DVR model will boot with the external drive plugged in.
post #856 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart628 View Post

no, as you have a non 3d amp....I am even running into issues with putting the theater between my amp and the projector and I have a 3d amp (pioneer vsx 820k) directv works out great...but when I try a bluray from my panasonic bdt 110 it gives me problems.

Since i am using the ps3 as my 3d bluray source, and as it is using hdmi 1.3 cable, I think I should have no problem passing the signal through my 1.3 amp, then to the vip and finally to the projector. i should be getting the unit tomorrow, i will test it out and report back.
post #857 of 2071
I find the more I play with it the better I get the picture. You to have to sacrifice brightness to get no ghosting. This joy stick sucks tying to figure out what each thing is.

Do any of you guys have the manual as I didn't get one as Jonathan was to send me one but hasn't as of yet
post #858 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by slvramalgam View Post

Since i am using the ps3 as my 3d bluray source, and as it is using hdmi 1.3 cable, I think I should have no problem passing the signal through my 1.3 amp, then to the vip and finally to the projector. i should be getting the unit tomorrow, i will test it out and report back.

A HDMI 1.3 amp will not extract the audio from the dual buffer packed 3D video format from 3D Blu-rays using 3D BR plasyer or when playing a 3D BR using the PS3 since the audio is in the middle of the buffer between the left eye and right eye 1080p video frames.
post #859 of 2071
I have a dead emitter for my RF glasses. No LED's light up and even direct to the PC the fine tuning program says no device found.

So much for testing this on an RS1 although the image is displaying on the screen so if I had working glasses it would probably work.

This pisses me off! Wait all this time and what a let down. These things should be tested before sent out. Not Jonathan's fault but Bit Cauldron's fault for sure.
post #860 of 2071
Hi all,

I received my rf emitter & glasses a few days ago, & I've had some time to run them through their paces. I did the majority of my testing on my Optoma HD70 (non-3D) dlp projector at 60hz. I thought I would post my initial impressions:

Packaging: All items received in good working condition. I was hoping that the glasses would come in a nice pouch like the ir version, however!

Setup: A bit confusing at first. Unlike Jazar's experience, my unit wouldn't get power from the sync cable (as the ir emitter did), so I had to plug in via usb adapter. I downloaded the MAX manual from the Monster site, but if if I didn't know the emitter was the same form factor I would have been lost as to the controls; the fine-tuning operations were needed for me, as the picture was not ideal out of the box. Since I received the unit, Jonathan has sent out a more in-depth pdf manual for users, which is very helpful.

Operation: Now this is where this system really shines! The fine-tuning options, once I got the hang of them, allow for a much more rewarding 3d experience than the ir equivalent. Key points:

- Sync: With the ir emitter, I had to press the polarity button probably 50% of the time on startup; while it's too soon to tell for sure, initial sync doesn't seem to be an issue with the rf emitter. So far the polarity with the rf system has been reversed only once or twice, and I have fired up 3d blu-ray & cable dozens of times already... The instances of pseudo-stereo seem to be limited to times I resumed a previously played disc... I have had no problems on a newly loaded disc, or pausing, fast forward, etc. The software control utility for the rf emitter, which hooks up via usb, isn't any more or less convenient than the joystick, but it lets me take note of the settings.
- Signal & range: This aspect alone will probably keep me from going back to ir. I no longer have to deal with the lenses fluttering every time I reach over to pick up my drink, or lift my hand to adjust them... the glasses will keep plugging away, even if I turn my back.
- Delay & duty cycle settings: These are the adjustments which directly effect image quality. With the ir emitter, I had two choices - vga or dvi. Vga was too dark, and dvi had too much flicker at 60hz. The rf emitter gives me a good number of settings along that spectrum. Flicker is not eliminated completely, mind you, but I can choose a setting that minimizes it (by sacrificing some brightness). For adjusting this I used source material that had exhibited lots of flicker for me ("Despicable Me" - plenty of bright scenes). As for ghosting, the worst title on my system was "Monster House" (a good number of scenes with fast animation). "Under the Sea" also lent itself well for adjusting, because it had plenty of slow-moving sea creatures sharply delineated against a smooth blue background, which provided time & crisp imagery for tweaking settings.

Fine-tuning the adjustments will be a matter of preference, and viewing environment. There are seemingly HUNDREDS of steps along the delay/duty cycle spectrum (down to 100th of a millisecond I'm told). As you move down the scale away from flicker, you head first into a slightly dimmer image, and then into some "banding" across the gradients, and finally into a very dark "solarized" image. So you can eliminate flicker on a 60hz system completely, it just depends on what you consider unwatchable as far as image quality. For me, I was able to find settings with more than acceptable viewing. I found that opening up the duty cycle setting, then setting the delay to minimize ghosting, then pulling back on the duty cycle setting again, gave me good results. Using a variety of source material helps, & I made sure to test both bright and dark scenes. A duty cycle setting of 50-70 with a delay in the 20000 range seemed good for my HD70 dlp projecting an 80" screen in a darkened room.

The adjustments give me ZERO ghosting on blu-ray titles; I occasionally see a double-image on some low-end cable content, but I believe these are convergence issues, as they don't "bleed" from eye to eye. The glasses have good range and don't require line of sight, and I would imagine the emitter can probably eliminate the color cast issues some people have reported with dlp-link. So down the line, if I find a 3d-ready projector that meets my needs, this is equipment I can see carrying over to a new system.

So overall, I will have to say that the rf system is a keeper. Is it perfect? No, but no way am I going back to the ir glasses.

I have not thoroughly tested the emitter with my Samsung LCD tv, but preliminary results seemed to indicate that at the very least a completely different settings profile would be needed to address the ghosting & flicker specific to the different display type. This isn't to say that improved results won't be achievable, but with only one emitter I'll probably leave it optimized for the projector, since that's what I'll be using for viewing 99% of the time.

Anyway, in summary, I am happy with the improvement the rf setup offers over the ir. I hope the comments above are in some way helpful to others.
post #861 of 2071
Hey all, let me see if I have this straight. Nothing but problems here so get the new Acer H5360BD 1.4 unit when it comes out. Is that right? Am I missing something because I would really like a full HD PJ that can do 3d but I see nothing but issues here.

So, seems to me, I have DLP link glasses that work great with my Sammy RP DLP TV, it would appear the Acer is my easy solution especially with the 1.4 specs and the fact I have DLP Link glasses already.
post #862 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Hey all, let me see if I have this straight. Nothing but problems here so get the new Acer H5360BD 1.4 unit when it comes out. Is that right? Am I missing something because I would really like a full HD PJ that can do 3d but I see nothing but issues here.

So, seems to me, I have DLP link glasses that work great with my Sammy RP DLP TV, it would appear the Acer is my easy solution especially with the 1.4 specs and the fact I have DLP Link glasses already.

The issues are setup related. I don't think people realize how dim the picture needs to be in 3D so they opt for brighter picture which means ghosting. The converter works and works best with 3D ready projectors at 120Hz. I still think its awesome VIP offered a 60Hz output. It just requires more adjustment for it to look right set to 60Hz and some flicker has to be tolerated. That's why 3D was designed it to be 120Hz.

I just ended up with a bad emitter. Same emitter sold my Monster! Not VIP's fault.

Ron
post #863 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Rain View Post

When you get it to the best you can please post it on youtube ...I need to see
the 3d picture quality before I spring for this

No way to do this. 3D requires two eyes looking through the glasses.
post #864 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart628 View Post

Yes you will get 3D as what this does is take the signal down to a hdmi 1.3 signal...your reciever should have no problem passing that along..you should be good to go!

thank you, will it pass to the amp HD sound?
post #865 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebard View Post

Hi all,

I received my rf emitter & glasses a few days ago, & I've had some time to run them through their paces. I did the majority of my testing on my Optoma HD70 (non-3D) dlp projector at 60hz. I thought I would post my initial impressions:

Packaging: All items received in good working condition. I was hoping that the glasses would come in a nice pouch like the ir version, however!

Setup: A bit confusing at first. Unlike Jazar's experience, my unit wouldn't get power from the sync cable (as the ir emitter did), so I had to plug in via usb adapter. I downloaded the MAX manual from the Monster site, but if if I didn't know the emitter was the same form factor I would have been lost as to the controls; the fine-tuning operations were needed for me, as the picture was not ideal out of the box. Since I received the unit, Jonathan has sent out a more in-depth pdf manual for users, which is very helpful.

Operation: Now this is where this system really shines! The fine-tuning options, once I got the hang of them, allow for a much more rewarding 3d experience than the ir equivalent. Key points:

- Sync: With the ir emitter, I had to press the polarity button probably 50% of the time on startup; while it's too soon to tell for sure, initial sync doesn't seem to be an issue with the rf emitter. So far the polarity with the rf system has been reversed only once or twice, and I have fired up 3d blu-ray & cable dozens of times already... The instances of pseudo-stereo seem to be limited to times I resumed a previously played disc... I have had no problems on a newly loaded disc, or pausing, fast forward, etc. The software control utility for the rf emitter, which hooks up via usb, isn't any more or less convenient than the joystick, but it lets me take note of the settings.
- Signal & range: This aspect alone will probably keep me from going back to ir. I no longer have to deal with the lenses fluttering every time I reach over to pick up my drink, or lift my hand to adjust them... the glasses will keep plugging away, even if I turn my back.
- Delay & duty cycle settings: These are the adjustments which directly effect image quality. With the ir emitter, I had two choices - vga or dvi. Vga was too dark, and dvi had too much flicker at 60hz. The rf emitter gives me a good number of settings along that spectrum. Flicker is not eliminated completely, mind you, but I can choose a setting that minimizes it (by sacrificing some brightness). For adjusting this I used source material that had exhibited lots of flicker for me ("Despicable Me" - plenty of bright scenes). As for ghosting, the worst title on my system was "Monster House" (a good number of scenes with fast animation). "Under the Sea" also lent itself well for adjusting, because it had plenty of slow-moving sea creatures sharply delineated against a smooth blue background, which provided time & crisp imagery for tweaking settings.

Fine-tuning the adjustments will be a matter of preference, and viewing environment. There are seemingly HUNDREDS of steps along the delay/duty cycle spectrum (down to 100th of a millisecond I'm told). As you move down the scale away from flicker, you head first into a slightly dimmer image, and then into some "banding" across the gradients, and finally into a very dark "solarized" image. So you can eliminate flicker on a 60hz system completely, it just depends on what you consider unwatchable as far as image quality. For me, I was able to find settings with more than acceptable viewing. I found that opening up the duty cycle setting, then setting the delay to minimize ghosting, then pulling back on the duty cycle setting again, gave me good results. Using a variety of source material helps, & I made sure to test both bright and dark scenes. A duty cycle setting of 50-70 with a delay in the 20000 range seemed good for my HD70 dlp projecting an 80" screen in a darkened room.

The adjustments give me ZERO ghosting on blu-ray titles; I occasionally see a double-image on some low-end cable content, but I believe these are convergence issues, as they don't "bleed" from eye to eye. The glasses have good range and don't require line of sight, and I would imagine the emitter can probably eliminate the color cast issues some people have reported with dlp-link. So down the line, if I find a 3d-ready projector that meets my needs, this is equipment I can see carrying over to a new system.

So overall, I will have to say that the rf system is a keeper. Is it perfect? No, but no way am I going back to the ir glasses.

I have not thoroughly tested the emitter with my Samsung LCD tv, but preliminary results seemed to indicate that at the very least a completely different settings profile would be needed to address the ghosting & flicker specific to the different display type. This isn't to say that improved results won't be achievable, but with only one emitter I'll probably leave it optimized for the projector, since that's what I'll be using for viewing 99% of the time.

Anyway, in summary, I am happy with the improvement the rf setup offers over the ir. I hope the comments above are in some way helpful to others.

Great info there thebard, thanks.

Have you replaced the bulb in your hD70? You mentioned previously that it was due to be replaced.
Thanks,
Moo
post #866 of 2071
Just a question......Is it possible to use the VIP IR glasses with the RF emmitter? Hate to see my several hundred $ IR's go to waste if I get the better RF glasses... I could keep the IR's for guests[too bad for them].
post #867 of 2071
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Hey all, let me see if I have this straight. Nothing but problems here so get the new Acer H5360BD 1.4 unit when it comes out. Is that right? Am I missing something because I would really like a full HD PJ that can do 3d but I see nothing but issues here.

So, seems to me, I have DLP link glasses that work great with my Sammy RP DLP TV, it would appear the Acer is my easy solution especially with the 1.4 specs and the fact I have DLP Link glasses already.

Did you read this Thread!!! Or just pop in here now and read this page!

By the way, I cant wait to see the ACER at this rumored 800.00 level, don't think thats gonna happen but we will see, 1000, 1100 maybe.

Many poeple have had great success, there have been some issues, but most have been worked thru, or are being worked thru!
post #868 of 2071
My other glasses did not work just the pair that came with the set up

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanab View Post

Just a question......Is it possible to use the VIP IR glasses with the RF emmitter? Hate to see my several hundred $ IR's go to waste if I get the better RF glasses... I could keep the IR's for guests[too bad for them].
post #869 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moolers View Post

Great info there thebard, thanks.

Have you replaced the bulb in your hD70? You mentioned previously that it was due to be replaced.
Thanks,
Moo

No... I ordered, but they sent me the wrong one! Still working at 2300+ hours.

New one should arrive today.
post #870 of 2071
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebard View Post

Setup: A bit confusing at first. Unlike Jazar's experience, my unit wouldn't get power from the sync cable (as the ir emitter did), so I had to plug in via usb adapter.

That's very odd. Are you powering the VIP with a wall outlet or USB? I have my VIP plugged into the wall.
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