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First Sub build - what measurement tools do I need?

post #1 of 19
4/8/11 at 2:07pm
Thread Starter 
Hello everyone,

I've spent the last couple of years doing DIY speaker projects and now I am thinking about tackling a subwoofer project. I have the Rythmik 15" in mind and I am in the process of building the enclosure based on their plans. I have all the power tools I need - router, table saw, etc but I was wondering if I should be purchasing anything else besides the woofer and the amp. I have heard some people recommend the Behringer BFD but are there any other products that I should be looking at for testing and measuring?

If it matters, my room is approx. 14'x25' and I have bass traps in the four corners of the room.
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post #2 of 19
4/8/11 at 3:34pm
i be interested in this discussion.
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post #3 of 19
4/8/11 at 4:34pm
Download the R.E.W. software and get yourself a compliant sound decibel meter such as the digital/analog ones from Radioshack. You'll need to have this equipment and whatever cables necessary (you'll learn what you need when you read up on REW) so you can actually know what your subwoofer and room is doing.

If you're building a sealed sub then you may want something to EQ it and also provide a high pass filter. This can be done all in one plate amp or by getting seperate plate amp and eq/filter.

You also might want to buy something to stuff the enclosure with although you didn't give enough detail so I'm just throwing random thoughts out here.
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post #4 of 19
4/8/11 at 6:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danielson99 View Post

If you're building a sealed sub then you may want something to EQ it and also provide a high pass filter. This can be done all in one plate amp or by getting seperate plate amp and eq/filter.

Could you provide some suggestions on eq/filters?
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post #5 of 19
4/8/11 at 6:39pm
DCX2496 or minidsp
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post #6 of 19
4/8/11 at 7:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

DCX2496 or minidsp

Thanks. I was also looking at the SMS-1 from Velodyne. Is there any consensus on which one is more user friendly between the 2496 or the SMS-1? I know the SMS costs more but I'm thinking that the my laptop will need an external sound card and mic if I went with the 2496 which may negate the lower price for the SMS.
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post #7 of 19
4/8/11 at 8:01pm
The SMS-1 will be easier to setup because it is essentially automatic. The DSPeaker Anti-Mode 8033 is another "automatic" choice.

The BFD and 2496 are more flexible, but you have to measure your response and set them up manually.

-Max
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post #8 of 19
4/8/11 at 8:49pm
Can't you use REW to program a 2496?
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post #9 of 19
4/8/11 at 9:19pm
I'd go MiniDSP. What it doesn't have, you don't need. But if you really want to find out how good the Rythmik subs are, you need bass traps!

BFD adds nasty thumps, DCX is better behaved.
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post #10 of 19
4/8/11 at 10:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

Can't you use REW to program a 2496?

Maybe. You can use REW to program the BFD via MIDI, and it is pretty easy to copy the numbers from REW into the BFD manually even if you don't use a MIDI cable.

However, keep in mind that setup with an SMS-1 or 8033 is still waaaaaay easier if you are starting from scratch. I don't think the OP is very interested in getting a measurement rig set up, so I recommend one of the "automatic" alternatives like the SMS-1 or 8033.

-Max
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post #11 of 19
4/9/11 at 3:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulspencer View Post

I'd go MiniDSP. What it doesn't have, you don't need. But if you really want to find out how good the Rythmik subs are, you need bass traps!

BFD adds nasty thumps, DCX is better behaved.

Op stated he's got bass traps already in his 4 corners.
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post #12 of 19
4/9/11 at 3:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by royceb View Post

Hello everyone,

I've spent the last couple of years doing DIY speaker projects and now I am thinking about tackling a subwoofer project. I have the Rythmik 15" in mind and I am in the process of building the enclosure based on their plans. I have all the power tools I need - router, table saw, etc but I was wondering if I should be purchasing anything else besides the woofer and the amp. I have heard some people recommend the Behringer BFD but are there any other products that I should be looking at for testing and measuring?

If it matters, my room is approx. 14'x25' and I have bass traps in the four corners of the room.

Since you have bass traps what kind of sub are you currently running?
Have you done any measurements to see your in room response of current sub in it's location?
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post #13 of 19
4/9/11 at 4:26am
If you want to use a pro audio MIC, like the ECM8000... and have the need for an external sound card, I recommend the E-MU 0404 USB as the MIC inputs are XLR and has built in 48V power for the mic. I also use it as a DAC for my PC so it worked out well.

I wanted a SMS-1, but the flexability of the DCX2496 is pretty nice. It takes more brain power to get it done, but you do learn a lot in the process if you like that stuff. I am still learning myself, but its fun.

If you dont want a DCX, the DEQ2496 is also a good option as programming from the front pannel is a lot cleaner than the DCX. I use the DCX because I run more than 1 sub, along with bass shakers with its own crossover curves.
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post #14 of 19
4/9/11 at 5:34pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

Since you have bass traps what kind of sub are you currently running?
Have you done any measurements to see your in room response of current sub in it's location?

I have a HSU STF-2. I have done measurements and have played around with placement. I have a slightly bigger room and a much bigger budget since I bought the HSU back in 2003. I haven't done a DIY speaker project in a while thanks to the economy and the arrival of my 4th child but now I have the time and money so I want to see if I can get a little more bang for the buck.
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post #15 of 19
4/9/11 at 5:38pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxcooper View Post

Maybe. You can use REW to program the BFD via MIDI, and it is pretty easy to copy the numbers from REW into the BFD manually even if you don't use a MIDI cable.

However, keep in mind that setup with an SMS-1 or 8033 is still waaaaaay easier if you are starting from scratch. I don't think the OP is very interested in getting a measurement rig set up, so I recommend one of the "automatic" alternatives like the SMS-1 or 8033.

-Max

To be honest, I wouldn't mind getting a measurement rig setup if the learning curve is not too steep and the cost of the rig isn't $1,000. If the DCX2496 is intuitive, then I would go for it. I heard from some people here and on other places that the BFD was not very intuitive.
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post #16 of 19
4/10/11 at 6:50pm
Thread Starter 
If I were to get the DCX2496 and use it to EQ my subwoofer and my two front speakers, would I need to connect the DCX to my Onkyo's pre-outs or do I hook them to the Crown amp powering my front speakers?
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post #17 of 19
4/10/11 at 7:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by royceb View Post

If I were to get the DCX2496 and use it to EQ my subwoofer and my two front speakers, would I need to connect the DCX to my Onkyo's pre-outs or do I hook them to the Crown amp powering my front speakers?


Input A & B = Onkyo Pre-out for L&R Speakers
Input C = sub out from Onkyo

Outputs 1 & 2 L&R to Crown Amp
Output 3 to sub

Just make sure all of ur signal routing is setup the way it needs to be. You can set up any way you like.

I havent tested the sonic quality of the 2496 products for highs and mids. I only use it for subwoofer. Maybe someone could comment on if its even worth doing that.
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post #18 of 19
4/11/11 at 7:12am
Thread Starter 
Another question after doing more research - would I be better off using the Rythmik plate amp or an external amp like the Behringer EP2500? I haven't found a thread which that much consensus. My room is not that large - 16 X 23 so I am not sure if the extra power of an external amp is needed.

EDIT : I should say the EP4000 as the 2500 has been discontinued.
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post #19 of 19
4/11/11 at 9:41am
I love my proaudio gear so personally I'd take a pro audio amp. They pair nice with stuff like the dcx as u can run XLR cables.

More power the better. I have way more amplification than I need, nice to know ur amps arnt the limmiting factor.
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