Anybody using 2 center channel speakers in a side-byside configuration?

not good.

If you are interested in stretching out the center channel dialogue, in a manner not intended by the director and which doesn't sound as "real", then by all means use center channel speakers side by side!!

This has been discussed quite often on this and other AV forums, and there are technical reasons why it's not a good idea. Depending upon room configuration (large screen with multiple row seating on risers) two center channels positioned high and low has been reported to be favorable over one center center channel, but it's still hotly debated as to it's necessity. There's absolutely no good reason or room configuration that side by side center channels would be considered favorable.

For more information on the technical reasons and the science of it, do a Google search.

Lol i couldn't fit another CC-390 next to the one I have If I tried!

+1. I've read very little positive about a second center channel. Time alignment issues and seating positioning would be a problem. I'd simply do a stereo system (w/o a center) as an alternative.

Negative sacarsm may be skillfully used to say - NO, NO, NO!!!@@@

No, because objectively this had been researched and discussed time and time again and its something that shouldn't be done.

Listen for yourself. Play pink noise through your front L/R speakers simultaneously and walk across your seating area; notice all the timbral changes. That's what happens to vocals/dialogue when played back as dual-mono, either through two centre speakers or through your front L/R speakers.

i had a two center system some years ago.
one center was over the screen the other under.

there is only a very small sweet spot to hear it perfect.
may 2-4 cm only.
same for a system without any center just 2 left and right speaker.
after you go out of it its worse than one center.

i remove the secound center some months later.

as i lost 2 years ago my right ear any surround sounds like one speaker.
i cant detect with one ear anymore any direction.

there's no way that I know of for two centers to coexist and integrate nondestructively for more than one sweet spot.

in other words the center channel would
be played at same time by two different
speakers arriving at different times based on distance to the receiver(you). So you would have a generally muddy center channel with very poor imaging. Not to mention comb filtering effects and cancellation etc........ They could and mist likely would work against each other by canceling each other out by destructive interaction......

Anyways, try it and post back what
YOU think........ I try to learn something
every day.......

People experience dual-mono playback routinely when listening to music on a 2-speaker set-up. The most important content (lead vocals, instrument solos) is mixed equally in both channels to image in the centre of the soundstage. It doesn't sound as bad as you describe it. Home theatre is a different story, since you typically have to deal with multiple listeners, and the effects of comb filtering become more of an issue.

two channel sound stage and home theater are COMPLETELY different. As you hinted at. However the center channel of home theater in no way can
be adequately compared to the right and/or left of a two channel setup.

For example, take the R or L of a two channel setup and listen to it exclusively and you can follow the song(although excruciating.).

Now take the R or L of a home theater setup and listen to it exclusively, and try to follow the movie....... Not the same, there is "overlap" in the R and L of two channel mixing which creates soundstage. The center channel is a discrete channel all its own and completely different.

I can imagine no other destructive feature of home heater than a muddy and jagged center channel with dips and peaks........

like I said try it and see.....

This thread is about dual centre speakers, not a single centre. 2-channel music has plenty of dual-mono content (everything that images at the centre of the soundstage). Same effect as two centre speakers.

If dual-mono signals "work against each other by canceling each other out by destructive interaction" as you describe, then 2-channel music would have been unlistenable all these years. Sounds that were supposed to image at the centre of the soundstage would have cancelled each other out.

But that doesn't happen. Nor will it happen with dual centre speakers.

ground has already been plowed boys....,,,


Way smarter folks than me have weighed in on this.......

Because stereo is not dual-mono. Try comparing dual-mono on a stereo pair with the same mono on a single centered speaker and the difference is apparent, especially with a solo voice. I did this with my 3 identical L/C/R speakers.

Which is why I was specifically referred to the dual-mono content of a stereo signal. If the same sounds from two speakers were "canceling each other out by destructive interaction" you'd never hear a phantom centre image when listening to stereo music. My point being that while two centre speakers are not a good idea, it certainly isn't the horror described.
I have. In fact I've been using a centre speaker for listening to music (2-channel or otherwise) for the last 20 years.

I don't see why it would be worse than for music.

IMO the main reason for using two (high/low) centers is to anchor the dialog at the proper height.

I think this could work pretty well if done properly.

First, use a limited bandwidth second speaker, say 150 - 2000 Hz, to allow greater distance discrepancy before onset of noticeable comb filtering.

And the second speaker should be equidistant from the MLP, or driven by its own amp with time delay to effect same.

Depending on how far the seats are from the front wall, this could give a pretty wide listening area.

It seems that the folks at Trinnov agree with you on this one, they state the following:

Center Channels - While perforated screens permit the positioning of the center channel (and perhaps right & left channels) directly behind the screen surface for optimal localization of vocals, non-perforated screens and flat panel displays make this impossible. By using two center channel speakers, one below the screen and one above the screen (two channels on the TEQ in addition to your other speakers), the TEQ will image the center channel directly in the middle of the viewing surface. Alternately, if the right and left speakers are at an elevation so that the top of these speakers is close to the top of the viewing surface while the center channel is below the screen, the TEQ can pull the center channel image up into the viewing surface using the right and left speakers. Rest of description is here: http://www.ada.net/products/ht/teq_trinnov.php

Not sure if that's just another schill to sell their product, but I'm curious if the Trinnov really makes 2 center channels really sound better than one.

I'm an ADA fan but I would imagine sitting off axis would create an time alignment issue as the top center speaker would be a farther distance from the bottom center speaker. Sitting in the middle of the room (the center speakers would be ideal and I can see the logic)

The discussion so far has been about side by side centre speakers (see thread topic), not high & low. So all my comments are about two centre speakers configured horizontally.

I separated music vs movies because the former is typically done solo while the latter is usually a group activity. You'll notice in the part of my post you quoted I point out the problem is multiple listeners, not content (it's not like the gear knows whether it is playing back music or movies).

That's the reason I suggested David try moving across the listening area while playing pink noise from 2 speakers, so he could hear for himself the tonal changes in various seats. This isn't a problem with music, because folks typically don't spend the evening listening to a CD with a row of people, like they do with movies.

Why would the two speakers be time alignmented differently for off axis listeners? If you're sitting in the sweet spot and the high/low centre speakers are both the same distance away, then moving horizontally won't change that. They'll be further away, but both will still be equidistant to the listener. You'd have to move vertically (like sit on a riser) for the two centre speakers to be at unequal distances.

If your ears are ear level with the lower speaker, there will be an issues. I should've been more clear. I was assuming a typical recommended viewing angle of eyes at lower 1/3 of screen.

It's a second-order effect, but the change in distance will not be quite the same unless the high and low speakers are at the same vertical angle from listening height.

I guess I did veer OT, but I guess I don't see any reason whatsoever to use two centers side by side, at least in this forum.

I don't even know what side by side stereo centers means.

sipester, thanks for the link; I didn't know Trinnov offered that.

I don't see how you can align two speakers for more than one very small sweet spot. Everywhere else should be muddied from time delay issues, not to mention reflected sound......

Some of us go to great lengths to get rid of reflected sound from 1st reflection points for the very reason...... A second speaker would be even worse than an unwanted reflection, and then add in it's reflections......

That is because there is little dual-mono content that isn't somewhat phase-shifted between the channels. That is what distinguishes a dual-mono from a true stereo recording of a single centered voice. The differences are, to me, quite striking with the latter greatly more stable, fuller and preferable.


Well, I would agree that it depends on how picky (read: discerning) you are.


Not quite the same thing, is it? More like the inverse proposition.

Well, I thought about trying two center channel speakers side by side since I have one row of seating 16 feet wide, and it seemed to me that dialog might be improved for folks sitting on the sides ( my center channel is mounted above the screen ). But I just increased the volumne of the existing center channel.