Official LG xxLK520 xxLK450 - Page 9

I'm considering the 55LK520 however we just moved and in the apartment we rented they decided to put the thermostat on the only wall I can mount a tv. The thermostat happens to be right in the middle of of that wall too. So if I were to mount my tv the thermostat would be behind the tv(articulating mount) so I could still get to the thermostat but I am seriously concerned with the heat the tv emits affecting my A/C ie: always running due to the heat from the tv.

Anyone have any advice/input on wether or not this would be a major problem? I'm not sure how much heat this tv puts out behind it? Would LED be much better? Any advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Hi Otto Pylott and All

I can confirm that after some negotiations (price match) I have been able to purchase the LG 32LK450-TA.AAUYLJD and complete the loupe test. It is indeed an S-IPS panel. Over the week end I will play see what we can achieve using it primarily as a monitor.

- Phil

Congratulations! Calibrate and enjoy your set

Hey guys...

1st post ever on here and just bought the 42LK450 from Costco yesterday and I want to hook up my Western Digital WDTV to it. So after reading some posts, I know that my model doesn't have ARC (which sucks!!)...since I don't have a an AV Receiver in my living room...how do I run audio to my new LCD TV if I want to use the HDMI port??

Thanks in advance!

ARC (Audio Return Channel) is for running audio from your tv back to a receiver if you want 5.1 etc. I use an optical cable to run the audio back from my 47LD520 to the receiver. Otherwise, you can still run audio to your LG thru HMDI and just play the audio thru the LGs speakers.

Right now I have my WDTV hooked up to my HD projector via 50ft hdmi and running audio to a receiver via 3 foot optical.......so what you're saying that I can just run my WDTV with just an hdmi 1.4 cable and get both video and audio to my 42LK450?!?

Can anyone confirm running audio via hdmi cable to their LK450?

Thanks again...this forum is awesome!

That's what HDMI does, audio and video one way. HDMI with ARC goes back and forth provided the devices (tv, receiver, etc) can. I ran audio and video from my Apple TV2 and my Blu-ray player to the LG before I setup my HT. The only downside is that I had to use the speakers in the LG.

BTW, the HDMI version numbers don't really mean that much anymore. All you need is a High Speed HDMI cable that is Category 2 certified from a reputable manufacturer. That will cover all the current and near future HDMI capabilities. My cables can do ARC as well as my HT receiver but the LG can't, so I have to use an optical cable from the LG back to the receiver. The cables can also do ethernet but none of my devices can. Doesn't affect the a/v at all.

My 55LK520 doesn't really throw much heat.

I don't think I'd be too concerned about the thermostat.

There's no way to have it on the stand sitting on furniture instead?

So I started to do the basic calibration and then realized I don't have the blue filter.

So tomorrow I'll see if my local Ritz has anything.

From the playing around I did tho it's starting to lead me to believe that it's going to need an ISF cal. There's that red push that I couldn't get rid of without screwing up everything else.

And the CMS controls are useless without the hardware to measure it.

The other thing I don't know what to do about is the backlight.

Unless I'm completely crazy, which is of course possible, I couldn't find any sections from the AVS disc that deals with that. So it's like where to set it?

Still liking the set tho.

The TV has built-in red, green and blue filters in the advanced menu of the isf expert picture modes.

The link I posted recently has instructions for making CMS adjustments using avs disc pattern B1 (using the built-in RGB filters)

Thanks djams.

I can't believe I never saw that.

You're welcome.

So what's the bezel like on your TV? Is it super shiny and reflective? I ask because this is the only thing I don't care for on my LD set. My tv faces a wall of windows, and while the screen doesn't reflect, the bezel does. If the LK series have a "matte" or satin non-reflective finish, I may look into selling my LD and picking up an LK. Provided of course that I can get a reasonable price for the LD.

Backlight just adjusts the overall brightness -- it has essentially no affect on calibration. Set it however you like, depending on light conditions.
What I usually do, though, is I set brightness and contrast first.

djams,

The bezel is shiny.

I don't know why they think that is a good thing.

Functionally it's stupid.

Thanks rahzel.

However, one should still start at some setting of the backlight I would think before calibrating.

I spent about 2 hours last nite digging into the settings.

I'm feeling frustrated and like I'm somewhat chasing my tail trying to get this dialed in.

At the factory settings(but with all the auto-settings off), it has a good overall balance. But there's that red push where everyone is sunburned to one degree or another.

This also throws every other color off as well, just enough to see that it's not quite correct.

Maybe the set is still breaking in.

I have to say I've been spoiled for the last 7 years with my last panel.

The colors were just so correct on that thing.

Every source was just right. Everyone that every saw it said the same thing as well.

I'm gonna play again tonite.

Any suggestions from the other seasoned pros here?

Let your set warm up for about 10 minutes before making any changes. With my 47LD520 I found that it took about 10 minutes or so before the colors etc seemed to "settle in". Subjective I know but that seemed to give me the best results. If you haven't done so already, get the AVS HD709 disk, with the docs, and start calibrating. I would start your calibrations with whatever room lighting you have when you most often watch tv/movies. I'd also suggest using an ambient light behind your set. You will be amazed at the difference it can make.

Set the basics first before you move onto colors because you can't adequately calibrate your colors if you don't have the proper gray levels. Set the contrast, brightness, sharpness, and overscan (aspect) first. There is a little movie on the AVS disk that explains this which you should check out before you do anything. Use one of the Expert settings to set your calibration with. Turn off all enhancements before you calibrate because you don't want any artificial processing going on. It's also best to have your Blu-ray or DVD player at its defaults as well. Again, for the same reason. Once you are finished, just let it be for a week or so and see if you like it. It will take your eyes awhile to adjust to the new settings. Keep in mind that when you calibrate, your calibrating that particular input only. So if your DVD player for example is using the HDMI1 input, all setting you make will be for that input only. If you check HDMI2 you won't see the setting you made, only the default ones. It took me awhile to get that straight. The same holds true for the Pre-sets. It will take awhile, and the learning curves can be a bit stiff if you've never done this before but stick with it, the results will be well worth it. As far as backlight goes, start with 30 -40 and see how that works for you.

they compared the black levels to an LG 32LV2500 2011 model but the 32LV2500 was using a VA panel, the LV2500 conclusion was poor viewing angles but deep blacks

i own a cheap dynex 26" tv using an AUO VA panel, awesome black levels but awful viewing angles

after owning an LG S-IPS LCD TV for a year now i'd have to say deep blacks are more important and IPS doesn't hold up in this area, the viewing angles are great for IPS but i'm hardly ever straying from the center of the tv and the colours and detail always shine through better with deeper blacks

I read a post in this thread which mentioned a better black level on the LK450 with the backlight down. I have a very good idea of what the default blacks are like. I watch movies on my monitor, which measures at .31 (at the default settings).

The consensus of the smart people here overwhelmingly favors IPS, and based on the performance of my Dell 2209WA monitor I can see why. For games, photos, internet use and viewing angle consistency you can't beat them. But for movies they are a real problem. Sure, you can turn down brightness and boost contrast, and on TVs you can turn down the backlight.

But it's not the same as a panel with good blacks. With good blacks you can adjust for best color and detail, with bad blacks you have to compensate for that, which throws off other things. One day maybe they'll make an IPS panel with a real contrast of >2000:1, not great but good enough to forget about, and then we can all sit back and watch movies and play games and wait for OLED.

The lack of real deep blacks for the S-IPS panels is well documented. However, a carefully calibrated set can more than make up for that to a certain degree, but then again it all depends on how critical you want to be. Environmental viewing conditions also play a major factor. Dark Night looks great on my set as does Seabiscuit (two excellent movies to check your calibration with). Friends who have watched both are just amazed at how well they look. Plasmas have much better blacks than LCDs but they too have issues. But there are other features that the S-IPS panels have that others don't so it's a give and take. For me, at the price point that I paid for my 47LD520, I'm extremely happy with it especially with all the other features that came with it (extensive calibration option, etc.)

I'm leaning in your direction, and for the reasons you give. Still, I wonder if I might be more satisfied overall with a Sony for movie viewing. There are still a few EX500s out there.

Otto, thanks for the advice.

I have done what you suggest and I'm still where I am with this.

Now I've been casually watching HD broadcast/cable, good quality, well shot programs (I'm blessed with a nice signal/box from RCN) this afternoon while working on my computer and what I'm noticing more and more is that the color quality changes from scene to scene. Noiticed this with blueray as well. So this is now leading me to believe/conclude that my grayscale must be off. But I don't know how to set that without the hardware and an ISF guy.

I really want this LG to work out.

If I can't resolve this over the next few days or so I'm probably going to return this. As an example of things, I do video editing for a living. My setup at work consists of 2 HP 24" monitors and a cheap Samsung 40" LCD as a client monitor(connected with HDMI).

The flesh tones are always correct. They match what I shot and what's on my monitors. They don't shift toward any color or tint.

You're the only person who can determine that so I'd suggest going to you local B&M and "interviewing" a few sets to see what you like, keeping in mind that the sets are probably in torch mode to attract your attention.

You can get really close to a proper gray levels with the AVS disk and set the CMS as well. Very good calibrations can be achieved with just the disk and some time. Keep in mind that your source will affect the pq even with a properly calibrated set.

Thanks for confirming the shiny bezel. I definitely agree with your "stupid" comment - in fact, I believe I used exactly that term when I mentioned it in the the LD thread. A Samsung set that I had briefly before the LG also had a reflective bezel surrounding a semi-matte screen, so it's not just LG that practices this lunacy

Do you also see the red tint in the grayscale patterns on the AVS HD709 disc?

When using calibration equipment, adjusting the backlight only changes the light output of the TV. It has essentially no affect on color points, gamma and grayscale etc.

If you don't have any equipment, all I can suggest to you is be patient and you will eventually find a happy medium. It's important that you get the grayscale as neutral as possible and have no tint in any shade of gray. Also only make adjustments when you're in the environment you plan on viewing the TV (ie: daytime/nighttime, lamp on etc.); ambient light greatly affects the picture in several different ways.
Also, as others have mentioned, definitely let the set warm up as it does take several minutes and the picture noticeably changes.

You're welcome djams.

And yes, the red tint is there.

Otto, rahzel.

Been giving it a go last nite and tonite and it's driving me crazy.

First of all, there's nothing I could find that even says what the 3 color temp settings are set at. Is any one of them anywhere near d6500k?

So we don't even have a base starting point.

Then for instance, there's - red, then red brightness, then red tint, then red contrast.

WTF?

Do I use BT709 for blueray and HD broadcast?

Do I use RGB or SMPTE for SD material?

Do I ignore all the other colors like yellow, cyan, majenta, etc?

Would it kill them to set the grayscale flat at the factory?

Obviously I'm not going to pay for an ISF calibration just to see if this set can track flat and keep a consistent color balance.

Sorry for the rant.

You know, after my plasma died, I decided I didn't want to deal with the heat and buzz and weight, etc of another plasma. But after what I've been going through with this LG, I'm starting to think that that's the place to be. At least with plasmas, they have to get the phosphers right and so on.

I don't know.

I love the 55" screen but I'm willing to trade off size for everything else.

I'll base this off of my experience with my 47LD520 which should be close to yours.

We used the AVS HD709 disk with the documentation that is available as well. Watch the movie clip that is part of the disk it will help get you started in the right direction.

Try to setup an ambient light behind your tv (15W CFL light as close to 6500K as possible). It is amazing how well it improves evening viewing. Calibrate your set in the environment where you watch it most (night time with only the ambient light or indirect room lighting etc.) and calibrate your set when it is in its final location. Let your tv warm up for at least 10 minutes before starting.

I used my Blu-ray player with the AVS HD709 disk and used its default settings. You don't want any settings that the Blu-ray player may have to affect your calibration. Let the tv do the work. For me, my Blu-ray player is set to use the HDMI1 input so that's the input that is going to be calibrated.

Pick Expert 1 and reset it to the default settings if you haven't done so already. I would set the Backlight to somewhere between 30 and 45 to start with. Turn off all processing on the tv (TruMotion, Dynamic Contrast, DNR, etc).

Follow the instructions that accompany the disk, calibrate the basics under Picture Mode first which are Contrast, Brightness, Sharpness, Aspect Ratio (I use Just Scan for 1:1 pixel matching). Color is set to 50 and Tint 0. I like a warm picture so I set Color Temperature to Warm. I don't worry what the K equivalent is.

Go to Expert Control and turn everything Off that you can. Color Gamut is BT709, Color Temperature is Warm, Gamma is 2.2, Method is 10Point IRE, Pattern is Outer, IRE is 100 and Luminence is 110.

CMS is next and this will take you some time to learn. I would print out, in color, the B1 pattern from the documentation. This is the Flashing Primary Colors pattern. The pattern flashes and is very difficult, at least for me, to watch. So what I did is label the color printout as to which bars are which colors, and then when the pattern appears, pause the picture, go to Color Filter on your LG, set the filter and then start adjusting your primary colors using the appropriate bars with the appropriate color filter. Then adjust the secondary colors (cyan, magenta, and yellow) in the same manner. Djams put together a really nice "how to" for the CMS adjustment. Maybe if he reads this he'll post the link because I don't remember where it is and I can't find my copy right now.

The CMS will probably take you a couple of times to get it to where you like it because when you adjust one color another will probably "go out" so you'll need to make a few passes back and forth to get it right.

Once you are done with the CMS you've gone about as far as you can without instrumentation so just leave the IREs at 0.

When done, you will have calibrated only 1 input and 1 Expert setting for DVDs. What I had to do is calibrate the only setting that I could which was the HDMI1 input for my Blu-ray player and then use those settings for my other inputs because I have no way of calibrating those. My tv is OTA only and I also have an ATV2 but the settings that I use work well for my other sources so I'm lucky. The IRE settings that I use were sent to me by someone who has the exact same model as I do and they worked very well for me, so my set is completely calibrated, Basics, CMS with IREs. It's probably not perfect and some purists would point out why but the pq is exceptional day or night, tv or DVD (Blu-ray or regular).

I try to keep it simple because of the WAF so we just turn on the tv and watch whatever input we want without any adjustments. However, once you calibrate your set, don't make any changes for awhile to let your eyes adjust. For awhile, I would switch between the Expert 1 settings and a modified Cinema (User) setting I had for OTA tv watching. After awhile, I preferred the full Expert 1 calibration and that's what we use for everything now.

Long post I know. If you start slowly and hit a wall, post your question and someone will answer that specific question as opposed to asking a bunch of questions at once. It took me about a month to satisfactorily calibrate my set and I had lots of help in doing so (djams, Phase, VBB, etc) so hang in there

What is of most interest seems to be missing in this chart. At what back light level are these "black levels" being measured for these TVs? And if the measurements were made by someone who likes sky high brightness rather than natural and accurate levels for brightness, contrast and color; then the charts are meaningless. The black levels obtained on most of the LG CCFL TVs have been much better than 0.31. Several of us with colorimeters have measured black levels of 0.09 as a low and highs of 0.18 to 0.21 depending on back light setting.

Precisely why I still love my 4 year old Mitusbishi LT46231. It has a matte S-IPS LCD panel with a matte bezel. When it is off the beauty looks all black. And after 4 years it still looks superb. I love my LG 42LD550 also, for it's accurate colors and picture balance, but the shiny bezel can distract if viewed from certain angels in a highly lit room.

The LG TVs have one of the best picture calibration menus available with 10 point IRE settings. First, yes use the Warm setting as a base starring point and turn off all video enhancements in the Advanced settings of the ISF Expert menu. Set backlight in the 30 to 40 range depending on room lighting. If you are using the AVS HD 709 disc, watch the short tutorial video and take your time. This isn't that difficult on these TVs, but you need to take a systematic approach and take your time. Too much tweaking without understanding what a setting is doing will throw things off.

These TVs as well as other brands have more in the way of adjustments then your plasma had. So regardless what you may buy today, you will be on a learning curve for adjusting. Otto is giving good advice. He had went through the learning curve and found the results worth it.

I stumbled upon this recently in a LD service manual - Warm is targeted to 6500K at the factory. Cool is 13,000K - Medium was somewhere in the middle.


You will notice that these controls are "grouped" in 2 separate areas of the menu. RGB contrast and RGB brightness are for 2-point grayscale adjustment. Contrast is for high end adjustment (near white), and brightness is for low end adjustment (near-ish black). They appear in the "section" of the menu that deals with all things grayscale. (Color Temp, Gamma, etc.)

The "color" and "tint" controls appear in the "Color Management System" section of the menu. These are for adjusting color.

Since you see the red tint in the grayscale patterns on the calibration disc, and do not have a meter, I'm going to give you slightly different advice than Otto gave so you can try to adjust your grayscale.

1) Set Method to "2 points"
2) Set Pattern to "Inner" (TV displays a near white field)
3) Use Red Contrast, Green Contrast and Blue Contrast controls to make the field look as neutral as possible
4) Note that as soon as you arrow down to the Red Brightness in the menu, the TV switches automatically to a darker field ().
5) Use Red Brightness, Green Brightness and Blue Brightness to make the low end field as neutral as possible.
6) When you're done, set the Pattern back to "Outer" or just push "Exit" to get your picture back.

Your #1 objective here would be to remove any hint of color from the displayed fields.



Yes. (I do anyways)


I don't, but quite honestly I virtually never watch SD material.


No.

Yes, I commented on this as well. It was informed that TelevisionInfo.com does these measurements with backlight at 100% for all sets (so at least the playing field is level). Personally, I think this is pretty misleading since very few would ever watch the TV with backlight at 100%. Just my humble opinion.