'Game of Thrones' on HBO HD - NO SPOILERS or Book Discussion - Page 53

Ok, the finale is going to be busy. I would think we'll have to at least visit each major character's arc even though I can't see any possible resolution with only a few minutes devoted to each.

Jon's deep in it with the Wildings...he'll have time to say hello and then on to next season.

Dany's still looking for her dragons...do they have time to get them back satisfactorily? I doubt it.

Arya's on the road with her friends...who knows where she's going. Maybe they'll tell us.

Robb's army is doing what now? Standing around or looking for Jaime. Kat still locked in her tent?

Jaime is on the road with Brienne. Will they get back to King's Landing without mishap?

Stansa and the Hound on the road too...

All the threads at Kings Landing...Tywyn's back with the support of Loras Tyrell, an interesting alliance, the Imp's status in question, Cersei and Joffrey...what happened to Stannis? Davos? What's going to happen to Shae? Ros?

Greyjoy and the Stark boys in Winterfell???

There's alot to cover in order to achieve a satisfactory season ender. I can't see how they pull it off.

Those are all interesting questions, and I'm looking forward to seeing how it plays out, but fortunately they don't have to resolve everything, just set the table for season three. Good thing next week is not a series ender!

See above.

She definitely has bitter down pat...with a bit of Sarah Connor crazy on top.

You don't s'pose it was Cersei that painted the target on the Imp's face? She and her little brother don't share many warm feelings ya know.

I don't think he's dead. And the wounds were not very realistic. Lacerations to the forehead and scalp tend to bleed a lot and look worse than they really are. His wounds barely bled. He should have had blood all over his face. I liked the job his squire did to the big fella.

larry

I was out of town for Memorial Day and just got a chance to watch Blackwater. Awesome episode, for sure.

The non-movie budget definitely showed through at times (shows like Band of Brothers, The Pacific, and BSG do a much better job hiding their TV budgets during the big battles) but it didn't really bother me as I was too into things to care. I loved the way they had the scales tip back and forth as to which side appeared to be at an advantage throughout the episode.

The music was particularly awesome in this episode, and combined with the always awesome acting it kept the intensity at a high level throughout the whole episode. I also love the way GoT continues to create major characters out of previously minor characters rather than just introducing new major characters out of the blue like most stories do.

My only concern with the episode was another example of magic being used as a sort of Deus Ex Machina way out to any pickle. It almost seems like, so far, that's the only reason it's there. We spend half of season with Renly being the most powerful of all those vying for the throne only to have it undone in 5 seconds thanks to a smoke monster that was invented out of the air, and now we have the largest fleet in Westeros being instantly wiped out by magic nuclear fire. It makes it difficult to take the show at its word knowing that, no matter what human deeds are done or how much conversations build up the strength of a force or leader, it can all be undone in an instant with something that popped into GRR Martin's head in a dream.

I hope they apply some rules to the limits of magic soon. I think that's why it worked for me in something like Harry Potter. You got to a certain point in the series where the boundaries of magic were defined and you knew someone couldn't just conjure up a "kill everyone on the other side instantly" spell out of thin air. In GoT right now, partly because of the mythos of magic in the show itself, it would be within the limits of the show for someone to snap their fingers and instantly turn everyone else in the world into zombies that follow them as king without question.

On the bright side, at least the magic fire bomb didn't win the battle in and of itself, and the major "surprise" that won it for the Lannister's (Tywin and Loras forming an alliance) actually did happen within the bounds of human control. I can't wait to see how that all works out.

that wasn't magic, it was chemistry. It wasn't from out of nowhere either. They already established several episodes back that the tunnels have been filled with it over a long period of time with the alchemists working around the clock. All Tyrion did was pile all the bombs onto one ship.

If the Greeks can make a form of napalm and the Chinese can invent gunpowder in the BC of our world history, a fictional medieval world combining the two seems one of the lesser implausibilities.

As VisionOn said, wildfire is NOT magic.

Also most of the ships were not destroyed. I think the biggest thing the wildfire did was force the army to land farther away which opened them up to be hit harder as they went toward the gates.

Put me in the camp of those who think Sansa didn't leave with the Hound. Another dumb move on her part. Especially in light of the new Lannister/Loras alliance. If I recall correctly, when asked, Loras' sister stated that she didn't want to be "a" queen, she wanted to be "The" Queen. Could that be the price of Loras' loyalty? If so, that's bad news for Sansa.

The wildfire is made by pyromancers and I do believe that the pyromancers when asked by Tyrion about making wildfire that it had been easier as of late and they asked whether there were any dragons around. I do believe that wildfire is part science and part magic (like Keebler cookies?). The definition of a "pyromancer" is "someone who claims to discover hidden knowledge with the aid of supernatural powers." http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pyromancer

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

The alchemists can say it was made with magic because they don't fully understand the chemistry of it or they could just be hyperbolic to sound more mysterious and powerful so that the nobles don't realize that any moron can mix two ingredients together.

In any case, it wasn't a Deus Ex device. It was set up previously and indicated multiple times that it would be used in some capacity for defense. Tyrion requests even more to be made beyond Cersei's orders. I was expecting catapults of wildfire bombs.

Yeah, as soon as the ships showed up, I kept thinking "Ok, when's Tyrion going to use the wildfire"?

Lately, the character has been showing more complexity.
IMO, that is a good thing.

IMO, the best thing about GoT comes to the surface in a battle like this one. There aren't any Uruk-Hai here, no clear lines drawn. "Well, I hate Joffrey, but I like Tyrion, and though Stannis is an uptight jerk with a freaky religion, he'd probably be a better king then Joffrey (he could hardly be worse)... though I don't want to see Sansa raped and murdered..."

It's all shades of grey.

Oh hey! my 1001st post!

I gotta wonder if she doesn't eventually come unraveled.
WAY too intense....

I think she did leave with him. She asked if he would hurt her, and he said that he wouldn't. Plus, he is the only reason she is still alive at this point. When he saved her the last time he claimed he did it for the King, but I don't believe that at all. He despises Joffrey which was clearly shown in this episode.

BTW, I'm in the camp who was highly satisfied with the battle scenes. The LFE during the fire was intense! Rome never had anything close to that in any episode. Huge, live action, battle sequences aren't possible on shows like this. The expense, and logistics, to outfit hundreds or thousands of men with gear, etc., is enormous.

She has hitting the wine pretty hard lately too.

I did. but I was even more excited by the director. The Descent is one of my favorite films of all time, one I can watch over and over. As far as The hound goes, he's brutally honest, even with himself. Always one of my favorite characters in the books, its one of the triumphs of the show how well he's been brought to life.

I didn't suggest that it was a Deus Ex Machina device. That angle was clearly set up numerous times. Tyrion was just struggling with the delivery system and Bronn acted as the commentary of why catapults of wildfire bombs was way too dangerous.

What I am suggesting, and there have been many hints throughout the series, is that the rebirth of the dragons is either the cause or part of the effect of a rebirth of magic. Numerous things: the return of the White Walkers, the red comet, the ease of making wildfire, the magicians around and the warlock, Pyat Pree, who was dismissed by the other members of the council as an illusionist (charlatans performing parlor tricks) but who obviously now has great abilities, all show that magic is significantly stronger than it has been for centuries.

Thats the starting point of the series, in fact. You have the killings in the north and the reappearance of direwolves, both showing things have changed.

I also believe she leaves with him, her loosening the grip on her doll a pretty strong sign.

And the Hound generally does care for Sansa, going back to the moment after Joffrey has Ned killed when he slaps her for speaking too boldly to him. IIRC, the Hound hands her a handkerchief telling her, for her own good, to "Keep it, you'll probably need it later" (or words to that effect).

Ruthless with a hint of compassion, a great combo.

I noticed. I was surprised it wasn't mentioned in this thread as most of us are hyper vigilant about writers and directors.

**high five**

I didn't notice that Marshall directed this episode, but The Descent is one of my all-time favorite horror movies as well.

But... but... why would anyone in this thread care about that unless they had, you know, read his books? In which case, shhhhh.