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The Official "I dont have dish or cable" anymore thread - Page 43

post #1261 of 1629
7/30/12 at 7:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

3 - More and more, retransmission money paid to stations by cable and satellite companies is paying the programming bills. So, campaigning to get people to drop cable service may potentially hurt your ability to find good programming on these channels down the road. So, encourage those (especially those being rated) to watch those local channels that you can get for free, but encourage those who are willing to pay for TV to continue doing so.
If someone else wishes to feed the beast, you may as well let them.

The impact of that retransmission money is...complicated.

We can certainly expect that broadcast stations that are seeing 50 cents/month per subscriber will probably not be interested in encouraging viewers to cut the cord. After all, that's a large, steady income stream. In a market the size of the one that I'm in (DFW), that's over $10 million/year. But I'll note that even at that amount, it will still be dwarfed by advertisng revenue -- this same market was generating some $700 million in annual broadcast TV advertising revenue before the big recession hit. That amount is likely lower today, but I'd be willing to guess that the "big four" affiliates are probably looking at upwards of $50 million each in advertising revenue.

So take that retransmission money away and programming quality will surely suffer, right? Maybe not...because what's driving a lot of the programming cost inflation is that broadcasters need to compete against cable networks that get even larger amounts of retransmission money (that means, in particular, ESPN). When you cut the cord, you cut the money going to those competitors. And for every 50 cents that your local big four affiliate loses, ESPN is losing ten times as much when you cut the cord.

So major cord cutting would almost certainly be deflationary when it comes to the fees that get paid for rights to programming and sports events. The impact on programming quality is open for debate.
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post #1262 of 1629
7/30/12 at 8:04pm
Nothing on Earth will get me to return to Pay-TV. There's nothing out there that interests me anymore, and I have enough DVDs (and VHS Tapes as well) to last me the remainder of my life. As for sporting events, there's a pub that's within walking distance from my house, and a Glass of Beer is but 1/22 of what it would cost me each month to watch it on Pay-TV. If a Major News Event occurs (The kind they'd interrupt programming in order to report), All I need to do is tune in to an over-the-air Station, that's if I don't hear about it on the web first. IMO Prices will only continue to rise, and quality will continue to head south. That's a deadly combo for any business, and it only leads to one thing, OBLIVION!
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post #1263 of 1629
7/31/12 at 2:08am
I have a nice VHS collection to go with my DVD collection. Thanks to MeTV being on a free subchannel my VHS collection is getting bigger. This year I've filled up nine six hour VHS tapes of the Beverly Hillbillies and five six hour VHS tapes of the 60s Batman. Neither show has an official release of all seasons on DVD. I also use my VCR to time shift other shows on MeTV. They are all in SD so no HD is needed for that channel.

PBS showed Rocky II in HD uncut and commercial free Sunday night. It looked great in HD. My DVD player has been getting little use as of late. With football season fixing to start up that probably won't change. Thank goodness for free over the air TV.
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post #1264 of 1629
7/31/12 at 4:38am
I won't be watching any sporting Events on TV until after the first week in November. There's a little event happening then, and the antics of those who are participating in this even make watching TV something only a MASOCHIST can enjoy. mad.gif If I want to watch Football there are two High Schools within five miles of my house, and I can watch their games for only a buck or two, from seats that would cost two weeks wages or more if they were College or Professional Games. eek.gif Most of the Players in these games will NEVER see action in the NFL, they will graduate and join the rest of us in making contributions to society. cool.gif
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post #1265 of 1629
7/31/12 at 6:28am
Well, that's just you. Most of the rest of us feel differently about watching sports, and are willing to pay for it. It is sad that the non-sports watching public gets to pay extra for stuff they don't care about.
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post #1266 of 1629
7/31/12 at 7:15am
That's the biggest argument in favor of an "A-La-Carte" System, where viewers would pick (and pay for) ONLY the channels thy watch. I do like sports, I just refuse to pay the high prices (and view the Advertising) in order to see them. High School Football is just as much fun to watch, its a heluvalot cheaper than TV, and IT'S COMMERCIAL FREE! biggrin.gif
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post #1267 of 1629
7/31/12 at 9:22am
I went almost 4 years with no pay TV and never missed it. Recently got TW Cable as a promotion when I put in a phone line, and I am so ready to get rid of it. Nothing really worthwhile to watch. The HD channels are full of artifacts and A/B comparison of OTA to cable shows the flaws immediately--especially with motion.
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post #1268 of 1629
7/31/12 at 11:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

If I want to watch Football there are two High Schools within five miles of my house, and I can watch their games for only a buck or two, from seats that would cost two weeks wages or more if they were College or Professional Games.
While I enjoy going to High School games (I also have two within five miles of my house, and I'm not even originally from this city), you can't honestly compare the experience of going to a College/NFL game to that of a High School game. Not even close.
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post #1269 of 1629
7/31/12 at 11:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi Master View Post

I have a nice VHS collection to go with my DVD collection. Thanks to MeTV being on a free subchannel my VHS collection is getting bigger. This year I've filled up nine six hour VHS tapes of the Beverly Hillbillies and five six hour VHS tapes of the 60s Batman. Neither show has an official release of all seasons on DVD. I also use my VCR to time shift other shows on MeTV. They are all in SD so no HD is needed for that channel.
PBS showed Rocky II in HD uncut and commercial free Sunday night. It looked great in HD. My DVD player has been getting little use as of late. With football season fixing to start up that probably won't change. Thank goodness for free over the air TV.

Dude, why are you still using vhs units when you can buy a Tivo or pc tv tuner so you can record those hd channels in real hd? eek.gif I've been thinking about going back to ota, but there is no way I can go back to a non-dvr lifestyle. biggrin.gif

I currently have a usb tuner stick that I use to record CW and PBS shows with (Dish doesn't offer CW or PBS in hd here in Detroit). But if I do cut the cord again, I'll be picking up a couple of the HD Homerun dual boxes to connect to my Win7 pc along with a 2TB hdd and another Xbox 360. wink.gif
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post #1270 of 1629
7/31/12 at 12:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas Desmond View Post

The impact of that retransmission money is...complicated.
We can certainly expect that broadcast stations that are seeing 50 cents/month per subscriber will probably not be interested in encouraging viewers to cut the cord. After all, that's a large, steady income stream. In a market the size of the one that I'm in (DFW), that's over $10 million/year. But I'll note that even at that amount, it will still be dwarfed by advertisng revenue -- this same market was generating some $700 million in annual broadcast TV advertising revenue before the big recession hit. That amount is likely lower today, but I'd be willing to guess that the "big four" affiliates are probably looking at upwards of $50 million each in advertising revenue.
So take that retransmission money away and programming quality will surely suffer, right? Maybe not...because what's driving a lot of the programming cost inflation is that broadcasters need to compete against cable networks that get even larger amounts of retransmission money (that means, in particular, ESPN). When you cut the cord, you cut the money going to those competitors. And for every 50 cents that your local big four affiliate loses, ESPN is losing ten times as much when you cut the cord.
So major cord cutting would almost certainly be deflationary when it comes to the fees that get paid for rights to programming and sports events. The impact on programming quality is open for debate.
Good point, but you live in a top 5 TV market. There's a lot of money to be had in TV there.

The problem is, there are over 200 markets and they get pretty small above around market 100. At those levels, most of the real money you see in ads is for the network commercials, not those the local station airs.

I guarantee that $.50 a subscriber in Wichita Falls goes a lot further than in Dallas/Fort Worth. I once worked in a market where you could buy a primetime commercial spot in the local avail time for less than $500. Ad time during the local news could be had for less than $100. Keep in mind that the primtime programming would be the same as in your market, which is where the viewer eyeballs really are.

When faced with numbers like that, $.50 a subscriber really starts to boost the bottom line.
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post #1271 of 1629
7/31/12 at 1:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tighr View Post

While I enjoy going to High School games (I also have two within five miles of my house, and I'm not even originally from this city), you can't honestly compare the experience of going to a College/NFL game to that of a High School game. Not even close.

Lets See. There's Driving to the Game: 90 Miles each way (Daytona Beach to Jacksonville) vs 1 1/2 Miles (My house to Atlantic High School) That would be $50.00 for Gas vs a few pennies (I use a Motor Scooter to get around town) biggrin.gif

Ticket Prices: $35.00 (End Zone Nosebleed) Jacksonville Jaguars vs $2.00 50 yard line (Atlantic High School)

Food $15.00 for a Hot Dog, Fries and a Soda vs $4.00 for a Bag of Doritos and a Soda (You purchase at Wally's before the game).

Leaving after the game is over. 80,000 people jamming the roads around Jacksonville's Stadium vs a hundred or so around the High School's Field

You're right, there is not much of a difference! wink.gif
Edited by borntocoast - 7/31/12 at 2:00pm
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post #1272 of 1629
7/31/12 at 3:26pm
That's not what I meant, and you know it.
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post #1273 of 1629
7/31/12 at 4:39pm
I forgot something! At a High School Game, you don't see the players standing around on the field doing nothing for five minutes between plays! biggrin.gif
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post #1274 of 1629
7/31/12 at 4:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

I forgot something! At a High School Game, you don't see the players standing around on the field doing nothing for five minutes between plays! biggrin.gif

Yes, yes you do.

I played high school football for four years, I would know. Every year, two or three of our games would be televised, and we had to endure the TV timeouts as well.
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post #1275 of 1629
7/31/12 at 7:59pm
Not at any of the games I've been too! However, if I do see a TV Crew when I approach the Field, I'llturn tail and go to my backup game.

TV Timeouts suck, I know of someone who took his kids to see at Buc's game in Tampa, they left after the Halftime Show because the kids got bored. They played in a "PeeWee League" and they could not understand why the players would stand there doing nothing for five minutes between plays (because of the TV Timeouts). They had spent over $500 for Tickets, Gas, Food and Souveneers, and it proved to be a dud for the kids. Their Parents said "They should have gone to Disney World Instead".
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post #1276 of 1629
8/1/12 at 7:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tighr View Post

While I enjoy going to High School games (I also have two within five miles of my house, and I'm not even originally from this city), you can't honestly compare the experience of going to a College/NFL game to that of a High School game. Not even close.
Yep, really not much point comparing HS sports to anything else on TV, just let it go.
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post #1277 of 1629
8/2/12 at 1:21pm
Advertising Age reported today that Direct TV LOST 52,000 Customers during the last three months, the first time they've seen a decline in customer numbers.
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post #1278 of 1629
8/3/12 at 5:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

Advertising Age reported today that Direct TV LOST 52,000 Customers during the last three months, the first time they've seen a decline in customer numbers.

Did it say (or speculate) as to why? Cord cutting, dissatisfaction with Direct, or other reason?

The reason I ask - I have become less than happy with Direct.
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post #1279 of 1629
8/3/12 at 10:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhufnagel View Post

Dude, why are you still using vhs units when you can buy a Tivo or pc tv tuner so you can record those hd channels in real hd? eek.gif I've been thinking about going back to ota, but there is no way I can go back to a non-dvr lifestyle. biggrin.gif
I currently have a usb tuner stick that I use to record CW and PBS shows with (Dish doesn't offer CW or PBS in hd here in Detroit). But if I do cut the cord again, I'll be picking up a couple of the HD Homerun dual boxes to connect to my Win7 pc along with a 2TB hdd and another Xbox 360. wink.gif

The MeTV subchannel I do all my copying off of is a SD channel so no HD is needed. With VHS tapes I get to add them to my VHS library that I've had for the last 30 years. I don't have to worry about full harddrives or hard drives going out and losing everthing. Since I have over 100 VHS tapes hard drives are not an option.

With HD stuff I press the mute button or change the channel when a commercial comes on. I wish the DVR Pal was still available for $249 but its been discontinued. The new Channelmaster DVR is full of bugs and it cost $400. I don't want to pay a subscription fee for Tivo and my PC is in a different room from my big TV and surround sound system.
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post #1280 of 1629
8/3/12 at 10:35pm
I'm against pay TV with the high prices and all the reality shows and crap but I have to say I still love football. I've been a football fan for 35 years and I love it. Every July around the middle of the month I get that football itch and start counting down the days until NFL training camps and fall practice for college teams to open. I also start looking at the NFL preaseason schedule. Thanks to the OTA channels I still get to watch 12 hours of college football in HD on Saturday and 12 hours of the NFL in HD on Sunday. I know the Hall of Fame game is on Sunday night on the NFL Network but the first game on the local OTA channels in my area is Thursday Aug. 9th between the Raven and the Falcons. I'll be watching it. The next week is there will be several preseason games on the OTA networks.

The big game I've been looking forward to for months now is Saturday Sept. 1st at 8:00pm Alabama vs Michigan on ABC. I can't wait.

So I still get to watch plenty of football in HD without having to pay for it. I have ESPN 3 on the computer but its only in SD. I also listen to ESPN radio and Fox Sports radio for football talk. Also clips on NFL.com and ESPN.com.
Edited by Jedi Master - 8/3/12 at 10:42pm
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post #1281 of 1629
8/3/12 at 11:14pm
DirecTV loses subscribers for first time in 2Q
Quote:
NEW YORK — DirecTV, the country's largest provider of satellite TV services, is losing subscribers for the first time, as the company tightened credit policies and consumer appetite for pay-TV services appears to have plateaued.

DirecTV Inc. said Thursday that it lost 52,000 U.S. subscribers in the April-to-June period. Last year, it added 26,000 in the same period, which is seasonally the weakest of the year.
Other pay-TV companies have reported worsening subscriber trends in the quarter, except for Comcast Corp. and Dish Network Corp., which have reported reduced losses. Time Warner Cable Inc., the second-largest cable company, said Thursday that it lost 169,000 subscribers in the second quarter, a record for the company.

The biggest U.S. TV distributor, Comcast Corp., lost 176,000 video subscribers, which was considered an improvement as the rate of loss was better than in recent quarters. Of the big four distributors, satellite provider Dish Network Corp. said it lost just 10,000 subscribers, also considered an improvement.


Read more here: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2012/08/02/2238387/directv-loses-subscribers-for.html#storylink=cpy
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post #1282 of 1629
8/3/12 at 11:30pm
Discontinued our cable/sat services about 4 years ago. Went to OTA HD and cannot be happier. I like sports but do not watch it anymore: players only care about money, they bounce around with no loyalty to fans and teams anymore. I am not missing it and do not plan on going back.
Edited by ddgtr - 8/4/12 at 12:09am
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post #1283 of 1629
8/4/12 at 4:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi Master View Post

The MeTV subchannel I do all my copying off of is a SD channel so no HD is needed. With VHS tapes I get to add them to my VHS library that I've had for the last 30 years. I don't have to worry about full harddrives or hard drives going out and losing everthing. Since I have over 100 VHS tapes hard drives are not an option.
With HD stuff I press the mute button or change the channel when a commercial comes on. I wish the DVR Pal was still available for $249 but its been discontinued. The new Channelmaster DVR is full of bugs and it cost $400. I don't want to pay a subscription fee for Tivo and my PC is in a different room from my big TV and surround sound system.

I was able to get a great deal on the 1 TB TiVo premiere with lifetime service back in February. Since it was a one time payment, I don't have any monthly fees. Of course there is always the possibility that the company will go out of business, but I will cross that bridge when I come to it. Unfortunately, I'm a bit of a snob when it comes to video quality. If I record something, I want it in HD. I really love my TiVo. It's been great for recording the Olympics. I can pick and choose what events I want to watch that have been televised on NBC.

On a different note, I tried the indoor antenna from Mohu called the "leaf". I live less than a mile from the transmission towers and have a lot of multipath issues. The leaf works better than all of the antennas I have tried over the years which were quite a few.

Cheers.
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post #1284 of 1629
8/4/12 at 10:26am
The article doesn't mention anything about disgruntled customers, other than to say "Appetite for Pat-TV services appeared to have plateaued". But ask anyone who has Pay-TV if they are happy with it and five will get you ten they will say "NO". The biggest complaint is "It costs too much money". In the last two years 2,500,000 customers have decided "Enough is Enough" and have discontinued their Pay-TV Subscriptions to seek their Entertainment and Informational needs elsewhere.
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post #1285 of 1629
8/4/12 at 10:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

The article doesn't mention anything about disgruntled customers, other than to say "Appetite for Pat-TV services appeared to have plateaued". But ask anyone who has Pay-TV if they are happy with it and five will get you ten they will say "NO". The biggest complaint is "It costs too much money". In the last two years 2,500,000 customers have decided "Enough is Enough" and have discontinued their Pay-TV Subscriptions to seek their Entertainment and Informational needs elsewhere.
I think a lot of those numbers are reflected in the "it costs too much" camp who suddenly find themselves having to cut back on expenses due to un(or under)employment due to the economy. It's easy to say "it's not worth it" when the money isn't there.

However, I predict the trend will either stabilze or reverse itself once unemployment drops a few more percent. We tend to spend more money on things we might not normally want to when we have money to spare.

It's the same way that people jump all over fuel-efficient vehicles when gas hit $4 a gallon, but go right back to large SUVs when it drops back down.

Never underestimate the power of conspicuous consumption. We love to be seen with stuff. It doesn't take much to add that one feature we can't live without to get people back into the fold.
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post #1286 of 1629
8/5/12 at 4:42am
Except there isn't one person I've talked to who hasn't said anything good about Pay-TV. There are a lot of people, and I mean A LOT, who have said when their commitments are up they will drop their subscriptions. After spending more than a decade raising prices and lowering the quality of what they are offering the Pay-TV companies are reaping what they have sowed. People are seeking their Entertainment and Information Needs Elsewhere. The Over-The-Air Antenna Business is booming, along with rental businesses such as Netflix.
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post #1287 of 1629
8/5/12 at 4:55am

And there are a lot who will go back to pay tv once they can better afford it again. Maybe not all, but A LOT. You may not think much of the programming these days, but many people actually like it.

 

Also, how many people actually do everything they say they're going to do? With someone pushing an agenda as hard as you are, people will often "go along" with what they're saying, just in order to be left alone.

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post #1288 of 1629
8/5/12 at 6:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

Except there isn't one person I've talked to who hasn't said anything good about Pay-TV.
There are a lot of things people don't have anything good to say about, but in the end, they do what get's them what they want.

Plenty of people have nothing good to say about Walmart, but at some point an item they want is priced just low enough to make them buy it there.

People have gotten all militant about causes for animal cruelity, the environment and and individual rights, but at some point, they decide veal tastes good, they want a V8 engine and air conditioning and they figure that giving up a few individual rights is fine as long as they're someone else's. It's easy to give up extra expenses when there's no money to pay for them, but when there's plenty of change jingling in our pockets, we love to spend it.

Let's face it, we love to gripe about something with everything in life - and the internet is the most awesome forum ever created to do so (that , and view porn). The problem is, we also suck at following through if it inconveniences us.

'I swear, I'm going to go down to the courthouse and protest!"
(Looks outside)
"Well, it looks like it might rain today...maybe tomorrow..."
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post #1289 of 1629
8/5/12 at 7:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

There are a lot of things people don't have anything good to say about, but in the end, they do what get's them what they want.
Plenty of people have nothing good to say about Walmart, but at some point an item they want is priced just low enough to make them buy it there.
People have gotten all militant about causes for animal cruelity, the environment and and individual rights, but at some point, they decide veal tastes good, they want a V8 engine and air conditioning and they figure that giving up a few individual rights is fine as long as they're someone else's. It's easy to give up extra expenses when there's no money to pay for them, but when there's plenty of change jingling in our pockets, we love to spend it.
Let's face it, we love to gripe about something with everything in life - and the internet is the most awesome forum ever created to do so (that , and view porn). The problem is, we also suck at following through if it inconveniences us.
'I swear, I'm going to go down to the courthouse and protest!"
(Looks outside)
"Well, it looks like it might rain today...maybe tomorrow..."

Isn't that the truth? Very well said.
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post #1290 of 1629
8/5/12 at 11:52am
Well find out even more in November when the third quarter results are published. If the trend reverses I'll eat my words.
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