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Official Mitsubishi hc4000 ONLY Thread - Page 62

post #1831 of 2810
11/5/11 at 9:11pm
Thread Starter 
I found out the Viewsonic 8200 I picked up actually has Dark Chip 3, and supposedly the color wheel produces less RBE than a 6-segment 4x, but I think it should be the same about. It is a 7-seg, 4x. That was a real shocker at that price I got it for, of course it is a refurb and the VS might have some serious firmware issues or a fan problem if they didn't fix it in the refurbs, but we shall see. It will be a noisy sucker too I am guessing.

I know it will be no match for the hc4000's picture quality, but for general TV watching and bright HD content and as a portable spare projector, it may work out, we'll see...
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post #1832 of 2810
11/6/11 at 10:44am
I am having an issue with my HC4000 locking on to a HDMI signal. If i turn unit on for my xbox everything turns on but it takes up to 15 minutes for it to display picture!!! Im so tired of this crap my old Optoma HD20 was instant lock on to HDMI. I have tried every setting and I believe this is some kind of FW issue. Should I call Mits? Is anyone else experiencing this?

Thanks
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post #1833 of 2810
11/6/11 at 1:14pm
Mine seems to have to usual delay for all HDMI inputs which are fed from my Denon. My son hooked up his PS3 and it was a delay, but not 15 minutes.

Are you going through a receiver or straight into the Mits
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post #1834 of 2810
11/6/11 at 6:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

Once i figure out how to stretch using no lens I'll compare to the lens i have......

I did some extensive testing with a CIH lens I had for sony. With this projector I opted NOT to use the CIH lens. It is that good in my opinion. I have used a anamorphic lens for 4 years and decided with this projector I did not need it. This is just my opinion and everyone will have their own opinion on this of course!
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post #1835 of 2810
11/6/11 at 7:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlynch34 View Post

I did some extensive testing with a CIH lens I had for sony. With this projector I opted NOT to use the CIH lens. It is that good in my opinion. I have used a anamorphic lens for 4 years and decided with this projector I did not need it. This is just my opinion and everyone will have their own opinion on this of course!

As Vincent Vega would say, " Thats a bold statement ". Time will tell
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post #1836 of 2810
11/6/11 at 7:51pm
I just saw that a couple of posters have asked about CIH using the Mits HC4000. I would request them to see my previous 4-5 posts where I have posted some pretty detailed information on how to do CIH and how it works. I'm sorry that I cannot post the exact link as I am typing this from my iPhone. But a simple search should give you the info you need.

EDIT: Ok, here is link 1 and link 2. I hope this helps!
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post #1837 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by deez View Post

I am having an issue with my HC4000 locking on to a HDMI signal. If i turn unit on for my xbox everything turns on but it takes up to 15 minutes for it to display picture!!! Im so tired of this crap my old Optoma HD20 was instant lock on to HDMI. I have tried every setting and I believe this is some kind of FW issue. Should I call Mits? Is anyone else experiencing this?

Thanks

The mits is slow to lock on sources, but not anywhere near that bad, how long is the cable that runs to the projector? I would try changing the cable length setting, look on the first page of the thread, post 2 will show you the steps to change that...by changing that might solve your problem...its either the cable or the unit sending the signal is weak etc...I would start with that setting and let us know if that helped, mits tech support is good, just ask to speak to a level 2 guy, they tend to know more, but I would try the length setting and see if if helps or not...
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post #1838 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:26am
Thread Starter 
@ContentedBloke
Good information, hopefully I will have my Viewsonic vs. Mits review up by this weekend and will let people know if the pro8200 is a viable CIH alternative for larger screens (Viewsonic is 1400 lumens in best mode, 2x brighter than the Mits).
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post #1839 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post


The mits is slow to lock on sources, but not anywhere near that bad, how long is the cable that runs to the projector? I would try changing the cable length setting, look on the first page of the thread, post 2 will show you the steps to change that...by changing that might solve your problem...its either the cable or the unit sending the signal is weak etc...I would start with that setting and let us know if that helped, mits tech support is good, just ask to speak to a level 2 guy, they tend to know more, but I would try the length setting and see if if helps or not...

I don't think that cable length option works for hdmi. The option is always greyed out for me and it can't be changed. Has anyone else been successful at changing this setting for a hdmi connection?
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post #1840 of 2810
11/7/11 at 6:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by contentedbloke View Post

I don't think that cable length option works for hdmi. The option is always greyed out for me and it can't be changed. Has anyone else been successful at changing this setting for a hdmi connection?

That doesnt sound right, I thought for sure that fleaman and curtard and some others have changed that...

You do have to do the secret dance

HDMI Cable Length setting:
Accessed through the normal user menu - Settings - Language - leave the cursor on your language - press Auto Position, Enter, Auto PositionA
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post #1841 of 2810
11/7/11 at 6:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post


That doesnt sound right, I thought for sure that fleaman and curtard and some others have changed that...

You do have to do the secret dance

HDMI Cable Length setting:
Accessed through the normal user menu - Settings - Language - leave the cursor on your language - press Auto Position, Enter, Auto PositionA

Wow! This actually worked! Thanks bishopt. Do you know what the other options are for?
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post #1842 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:06am
Dear friends
If all goes well I will be getting this as my first projector after a long hiatus - my last venture into the PJ world was the Infocus 4805, which made me the most popular person in the apartment block, especially on my movie nights - we had half the apartment block in my place

Anyway, I am going to sit 2.8m from a screen donated by a buddy - a Da Lite 2.2m high by 2m wide screen hanging from a 3m ceiling. I will be using a coffee table placement.

By my calculations this screen be about 80cm off my floor.

So I will get an ikea coffee table which is 45 cm high. The image should be 33 cm higher plus 10cm for the unit which will give me an image which is 90cm off the floor. The table will be sited about 2.2 to 2.4m away from the screen.

My eye level is 100cm on my chair which is about 2.8m away, it's a bit lower than the suggested eye level to the centre of the screen, but that should be ok from 2.8m?

Do these numbers sound right?

Also I have been trying to figure out where to get some settings for this unit, can someone please post a link?

Any "run-in" for projectors or settings for running in?

Thanks
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post #1843 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by petetherock View Post

Dear friends
If all goes well I will be getting this as my first projector after a long hiatus - my last venture into the PJ world was the Infocus 4805, which made me the most popular person in the apartment block, especially on my movie nights - we had half the apartment block in my place

Anyway, I am going to sit 2.8m from a screen donated by a buddy - a Da Lite 2.2m high by 2m wide screen hanging from a 3m ceiling. I will be using a coffee table placement.

By my calculations this screen be about 80cm off my floor.

So I will get an ikea coffee table which is 45 cm high. The image should be 33 cm higher plus 10cm for the unit which will give me an image which is 90cm off the floor. The table will be sited about 2.2 to 2.4m away from the screen.


The mits calc can be found on the first page of the thread, post#2 that contains all of the specs etc...coder's calc can be found in his signature of any post....
My eye level is 100cm on my chair which is about 2.8m away, it's a bit lower than the suggested eye level to the centre of the screen, but that should be ok from 2.8m?

Do these numbers sound right?

Also I have been trying to figure out where to get some settings for this unit, can someone please post a link?

Any "run-in" for projectors or settings for running in?

Thanks

I would say go use the mits calc and/or try coder's calculators, they should be able to provide all of the numbers for you....if you have issues with either calculator or have questions post back and someone should be able to help...
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post #1844 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

I would say go use the mits calc and/or try coder's calculators, they should be able to provide all of the numbers for you....if you have issues with either calculator or have questions post back and someone should be able to help...

Yes, I did do my homework... ran my screen size etc through the calculator, what I want to know is if such a setup sounds practical?

I am not keen to spoil the look in my living hall with a ceiling mount, so my only other choice is a coffee table. I can buy one which is 40 / 45 / 50 cm high.

I can also vary the coffee table position slightly but not by much. So if the numbers are not suitable, I may have to skip this and buy a 2nd hand AE 4000 or a new Epson 8350.

However I have been told that the DLP look is great and I do remember my days with the 4805.

Cheers.
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post #1845 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:44am
Thread Starter 
Just set it to Cinema Mode and Medium Color Temp, and then you are almost at D65 already. Hard for a US guy like myself to think in meters and cm in a projector scenario unless I convert them to feet/inches first, but someone else can help you there.
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post #1846 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

Just set it to Cinema Mode and Medium Color Temp, and then you are almost at D65 already. Hard for a US guy like myself to think in meters and cm in a projector scenario unless I convert them to feet/inches first, but someone else can help you there.

right, thats what I was thinking and why I sent him directly to the calculators....going through metrics with my kid right now..lol, oh the fun..
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post #1847 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by contentedbloke View Post

Wow! This actually worked! Thanks bishopt. Do you know what the other options are for?

No problem, lots of tips on the first page...list the options that you are referring to...I'm sure someone knows what they are and what they do...
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post #1848 of 2810
11/7/11 at 2:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by darrellh44 View Post

I'm confused about the how the CIH feature in the HC4000 works. I haven't read the entire thread, but what I gather is switching between 16:9 and 21:9(2.35:1) modes uses no optical zooming and simply re-scales the image digitally and then blacks out any horizontal/vertical pixels that can't be used. Is this correct?

Wouldn't it be far better to use the manual zoom (I'm talking about the projector's built-in non-anamorphic zoom) to help resize the image? This way you should be able to use all 1920x1080 pixels in 16:9 mode, and 1920x822 pixels in 21:9 mode. I know it would be somewhat of a pain to manually adjust the zoom every time the aspect ratio is changed, but isn't this the best performance option short of using a true anamorphic zoom.

Thanks,
Darrell

You are right, zooming gives better quality (and 16:9 content will also be sharper and brighter than they would be using the digital scaling method).

Unfortunately the Mits has no lens shift. So when you zoom out to make your 2.35 movies bigger, the image gets lower and lower. The only way to compensate for this is to do what I've done and actually have two shelves for the projector, and use the higher one for 2.35 movies and the lower for 16:9 movies.
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post #1849 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by curttard View Post

You are right, zooming gives better quality (and 16:9 content will also be sharper and brighter than they would be using the digital scaling method).

To be clear, zooming only positively affects 16:9 as you're using the same number of non-scaled pixels in 2.35 regardless, 1920x822. And while it's theoretically better to optically zoom to 16:9 in a 2.35 CIH setup, since the 16:9 image is smaller (at least width wise), it would in theory matter less.

Maybe curttard can elaborate more as I guess he might of tested this theory? Also curttard, do you find you have to refocus every time you optically zoom?

Though as curttard mentioned, with no lens shift you would have to reposition the PJ if you optically zoom, as he has done with 2 different shelf mount heights.
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post #1850 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:14pm
While watching Mega Mind, i played around with lens in place, and lens removed, PJ set to stretch 2.35:1.....

I prefer my lens in place. Why ? wish i could identify what it was. I also reduced contrast to -10. Doing that really made it easier on the eyes....

So, contrast -10/ medium color temp/-1 Sharpness ......

I'm really liking what i see so far. Is there a bulb burn in time ?
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post #1851 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:19pm
wow, -1 on sharpness huh? I'm at +2 as are most people. I ignore the sharpness test screens on calibration discs and just do it by eye on real video content. Usually 0 or 1 is what I come up with with the calibration test screen and +2 for real video content.
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post #1852 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

I'm really liking what i see so far. Is there a bulb burn in time ?

For the first 100 hrs there will be a red-push that will fade away. Or, if you don't have red push now, it will be red-lite after a 100 hrs. Also, your blacks will slowly get better after a 100-300hrs as the bulb loses some of its lumens, most of which happens in the first 100hrs or so.
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post #1853 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:23pm
Thread Starter 
I preferred sharpness +2 as well. It just depends how sensitive the ringing test patterns you use are. I used a more mild one (forgot which one as I have 3 test discs), and it actually didn't show any real ringing until +3, but at +2 there was a tiny tiny ringing difference but hardly anything to get worried about.
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post #1854 of 2810
11/7/11 at 5:52pm
Yeah, most all done by eye. Your thoughts on the -10 Contrast.....

I think, ringing is what bothers my eyes....
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post #1855 of 2810
11/7/11 at 6:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

Yeah, most all done by eye. Your thoughts on the -10 Contrast.....

I think, ringing is what bothers my eyes....

What size and gain screen?

Was the -10 set by calibration disc or just by taste?

I run a small negative gain gray screen, so my contrast setting probably won't translate, yet it's around 0 or 1 I think? Might fire up the PJ tonight, will check if so.
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post #1856 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fleaman View Post

What size and gain screen?

Was the -10 set by calibration disc or just by taste?

I run a small negative gain gray screen, so my contrast setting probably won't translate, yet it's around 0 or 1 I think? Might fire up the PJ tonight, will check if so.

100"X42"... Gain is about 1.2... I sit about 10' away. All done by eye. Ive been throwing around the idea of getting a meter and software but it was very overwhelming. Meters range from $100-$500.00 in my budget range.... I wanted the $100.00 one but most said not to waste money on cheap meter, hence the overload in my head
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post #1857 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:48pm
Thread Starter 
You don't need a meter to set brightness and contrast correctly, all you need is a test pattern. There is a free AVS test disc you can get from this forum and burn it on a regular DVD drive and it will work in your bluray player in order to set contrast/brightness.

The meter is mainly for gamma, grayscale, and CMS (color table) adjustments.

My hc4000 had a perfectly flat gamma curve at 2.2 IRE after 150 hours on the lamp, I mean flat as a pancake perfect. Some people's were not as flat as mine was OTB, but most everyone's have been close OTB. The gray scale is pretty amazingly close as well. I had a slight red tint that eventually started turning to more of a green tint after 400 hours, but it was so slight. The color space on this projector is very very accurate OTB. The thing about the color space on some projectors (like Sanyo's) is they are so far off that even if you get the projector's grayscale correct, all the colors are wrong themselves.

That is why the Mits hc4000 is the ultimate newb projector, really doesn't need calibrated that much, as very mild improvements are obtained from a calibration. This projector has the most accurate OTB settings on every one I've ever tried, it was even very slightly more accuate than a Sony vw70 which is calibrated by ISF people before shipping.
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post #1858 of 2810
11/7/11 at 7:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

The mits is slow to lock on sources, but not anywhere near that bad, how long is the cable that runs to the projector? I would try changing the cable length setting, look on the first page of the thread, post 2 will show you the steps to change that...by changing that might solve your problem...its either the cable or the unit sending the signal is weak etc...I would start with that setting and let us know if that helped, mits tech support is good, just ask to speak to a level 2 guy, they tend to know more, but I would try the length setting and see if if helps or not...

Sp what length should i set it too?
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post #1859 of 2810
11/8/11 at 12:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by fleaman View Post

To be clear, zooming only positively affects 16:9 as you're using the same number of non-scaled pixels in 2.35 regardless, 1920x822. And while it's theoretically better to optically zoom to 16:9 in a 2.35 CIH setup, since the 16:9 image is smaller (at least width wise), it would in theory matter less.

Maybe curttard can elaborate more as I guess he might of tested this theory? Also curttard, do you find you have to refocus every time you optically zoom?

I don't have to refocus 99% of the time. I suspect the times I do, I have just bumped the focus ring (it only takes a very minor adjustment to get it back).

Not sure what you mean with your first question, can you clarify?
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post #1860 of 2810
11/8/11 at 1:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CT_Wiebe View Post

PRLJAMR -- FYI for you and others who are new to the 2.35:1 CinemaScope scene, I posted the details on the Mitsubishi (undocumented) technique for using a "Scope" screen without an external anamorphic lens. The post is on the "other HC4000" thread, here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=341.

What StevenC56 is referring to (his post # 685, above), is the ability (with a 2.35:1 screen) to electronically move the image up and down when in the 2.35:1 CinemaScope mode (using the Vertical Position control).

PS -- All of the Menu options are shown in a table on page 25 of the HC4000 manual. Also, you can use the 2.35:1 mode even with a 16:9 screen, to try it all out. That's exactly what I did to verify exactly what this "undocumented Mitsubishi" operating mode actually does.

Comment ==> IMHO there is no PJ, under $2000 MSRP, that can beat the HC4000 for overall picture quality. Even many of the PJs under $4000 have a difficult time when all aspects of a PJ are considered. Also, I believe that the comment about Mitsubishi getting out of the PJ business is FUD. They did mention that they would be concentrating on DLP rear projection TV sets and getting out of the other flat panel HDTVs wars.

I thought this post deserved a bump
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