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Official Mitsubishi hc4000 ONLY Thread - Page 77

post #2281 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by fleaman View Post

Yeah, that's usually a 'goosed' mode. It won't be accurate for movies or quiet (high lamp), but would be ok for sports, etc.

When calibrated, low lamp, and measured, it comes in around 500-550 lumens with a new lamp.

Made me laugh - goosed mode ROFL....good one fleaman.
post #2282 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3IFM Cine View Post

Thanks for the warm welcome. I would love to run 2.35 aspect! I've been evaluating my available space and I'm having a small placement flexibility issue with the HC4000. If the pictures show up, you'll see that my space is (first and foremost) a living room. I have gone to a great deal of effort to have a nice HT setup without leaving a big footprint on the normal living space. As a result of this, I worked way too hard to build a dedicated (and mostly hidden) projector room.

The lens on that old Optoma (great little 480p BTW) is sitting at exactly an 18'10" throw. If it were the mits, (according to the throw calculator at 1.00 zoom) it will project an image that is a minimum 109" wide at 1:1. Unfortunately, that screen is only 104.61" wide viewable (The black margin is right around 1.5"). So, it looks like an inch of overhang on both sides. The BenQ would eliminate this with greater flexibility but I really think I'll have some reflected light issues in this room with light levels above 15fl. The next motorized screen in this design category is 150". I don't have the room for it and definitely don't want to spend the money on it. I want to spend the money replacing that old RCA 5.1 DD with a new Onkyo 7.1 DTS. This will be the same cost as the 150" screen and would max out the budget anyway. I'm not quite sure what to do with this any ideas.

BTW: You guys have already been wonderful in helping me out here and I can't even tell you how much I appreciate your time!

No worries, so all I'm saying is that 120" is large, the mits can do it but is/will not be as bright as say a w6000. Mine is also in a multipurpose room in my basement, their are always trade offs with all of this stuff, YOU have to pick the ones that you are willing to trade...oh and btw, I love my onk, last year when I upgraded all of my stuff I went with the 708 model, I've had denon, Pioneer and yamaha and just installed a setup over thanksgiving a Denon avr991, I like both of them but like how the Onk is setup and they way the menus work....I'm only pushing PSB Image speakers so not that much of a load...I love my mits though, I like watching movies and sports and for the price its the one to beat...good luck and let us know how it goes...
post #2283 of 2855
Thread Starter 
Do you notice much difference in sound between the different receivers?

I know receivers are all supposed to sound the same, but they come with different EQ's I think, the Pioneers always sounded a bit flat to me, like it needed an EQ to fix the sound. I had a JVC receiver, but it smoked badly as a capacitor inside it caught on fire after 1.5 years of use.
post #2284 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

Do you notice much difference in sound between the different receivers?

I know receivers are all supposed to sound the same, but they come with different EQ's I think, the Pioneers always sounded a bit flat to me, like it needed an EQ to fix the sound. I had a JVC receiver, but it smoked badly as a capacitor inside it caught on fire after 1.5 years of use.

Ya know, thats hard to say since I don't listen to much music critically anymore and I have never done any A/B tests. All of the ones that I have owned have been very nice to listen to for watching movies etc. They all excel in one area over another one, like the yamaha for instance has a great 2 zone setup and controls speakers all threw out my house, It has like a second amp section and you don't even have to turn on the main amp to run the second zone. It's powering my upstairs unit with warfedales towers and sounds really good, and my new onk powering my PSB image towers sounds good to me also. I like the audessey calibration in the onkyo which does multi eq including the sub, the Denon uses that also. If I could have my way I'd move my warfs downstairs and the PSB upstairs but I have been told that is a no go...

Hopting to one day upgrade my PSB with new warfedales, since I really like the ones I have upstairs, but don't get me wrong I really like the PSB's also.


With receivers I have always tried to go middle to high end stuff and buy when they are coming out with new models, seem to get more for your money.
post #2285 of 2855
The Onkyo HT-S5400 seems well priced for the way it's equipped. There's been some talk about HDMI input problems but I suspect this is due to heavy and continuous use with lots of devices connected. I'll be cooling it with a fan and running it for only a couple of hours at a time. I'm excited to hear the loss-less DTS decoding as I have never enjoyed it as a part of my home experience before. I'm thinking it'll compliment the HC4000 and my favorite blu-ray nicely!
post #2286 of 2855
HC4000 Grayscale and Gamma calibration:

I did the first time calibration at about 100~300 hours.

The second time calibration was at 1,212 Hours.



Before:








After:









The 3rd time calibration was at 1,710 hours.



Before:














after:







post #2287 of 2855
After calibration, HC4000 with japanese HDTV:





























post #2288 of 2855
Very Nice thanks for posting, I'm approaching 1000Hrs, looks like I need to break out my calibration stuff and re-calibrate..although I am thinking of getting a new screen, I might just wait for that..
post #2289 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

Very Nice thanks for posting, I'm approaching 1000Hrs, looks like I need to break out my calibration stuff and re-calibrate..although I am thinking of getting a new screen, I might just wait for that..

do you know which one you will get?
post #2290 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Hath View Post

do you know which one you will get?

I'm looking at the multi format ones from monoprice http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2 They only come in 106 and 120 size, just works since I am running a 106" jamestown grey screen right now...But I think I am going to go with white...
post #2291 of 2855
Hey all. I just sold my 59" Samsung plasma, and I'm ready to make the jump to my first projector! I'm mainly concerned with 2D picture quality, and low input lag. Use will break down something like 30% games, 30% TV, 30% sports, and 10% movies. I'm in a "mancave" that does have 4 windows with blinds and I will be adding blackout curtains shortly so light isn't an issue though I want the picture to pop and have the ability to watch with some ambient lighting. The walls are a fairly dark grey, with a smooth white ceiling. I'm thinking of going with a 98" Thrifty Whiteboard DIY screen and painting it with some version of the MaxxMudd v2.1 (thinking LL, thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1319717). Throw distance will be between 10 and 12 feet.

Two questions:
1. I'm leaning towards the HC4000 as it seems to meet all my requirements but I've also considered the Optoma HD33 and the Acer H9500BD. I don't really care about 3D but I'm more concerned with buying a projector that has been out for several years (HC4000) and being behind the technology curve. Will Mits be updating the HC4000 soon? Am I making the right choice here?

2. Version of MaxxMudd or Silver Screen to go with? I want to balance pop with maintaining decent black levels. Coming from a high-end plasma which had inky blacks I won't be able to handle high black levels. I posted this question on the MaxxMudd boards also.

thanks!
post #2292 of 2855
Thread Starter 
The hd33 and Acer 9500bd don't have any extra technology over the Mits hc4000, other than 3d and the Acer has an IRIS.

These two projectors are actually using a lower version of the contrast chip than the Mits hc4000 is (they use DC 2, Mits uses DC 3).

The Acer is missing calibration controls, so it's not possible to get a purely color-accurate picture unless you buy a $500+ (generally $1000+) Video Processor to calibrate with the Acer.

The hc4000 has higher Native On/Off contrast and better calibration, better OOTB settings. Those two projectors have 3D however (since Mits has no 3D), and the Acer has slightly darker blacks with the IRIS so may win for movies. Some may prefer the ACER, but it is probably slightly edgier and more color inaccurate.
post #2293 of 2855
Thanks for the response coderguy. You pretty much reaffirmed what I was thinking, sometimes it just helps to hear it.
I posted asking specifically about screens over on the DIY painted screen section and MississippiMan thinks that I won't get enough brightness out of the HC4000 to get "pop" when running higher zoom. I was planning to ceiling mount on 8' ceilings so I'm a little limited with placement and have to run near the max zoom to keep the picture of the floor. He recommends I get an HD20 for its higher lumen rating of 1700. The HD20 is $829 over at the jungle which is quite tempting. But I understand it will have a less contrast and a worse overall picture. Decisions.......
post #2294 of 2855
Thread Starter 
The difference is only 50 to 100 lumens between the 2 projectors in best mode, this is not even visible by the naked eye and whichever one comes out brighter in the end will be related to how perfectly you calibrate. The Mits looks better OOTB than the Optoma hd20, it doesn't need a calibration nearly as bad, and the brightness difference is not enough to even be a factor in this decision.

The hd20 only has 1,200:1 On/Off compared to the Mits hc4000 which has 3,800:1. The production version of the HD20 may be a bit brighter than the reviews show, not sure as you'd have to go into the hd20 thread to find that out, but I have seen no immediate evidence of it.

The two projectors are too close in brightness for this to even be a deciding factor. Anyhow, I'd buy the Viewsonic Pro8200 before the Optoma hd20 if you want brightness, even the Viewsonic has around 1,500 to 2,000:1 On/off (depending on calibration and placement) and Dark Chip 3, better color wheel, and brighter than the HD20 for a lower cost.

From Projector Reviews (Projector Central also found the same Lumens)
http://www.projectorreviews.com/opto...erformance.php

The dissapointment comes from the Optoma claim of 1700 lumens. Now, most companies tend to overstate their brightness, and often significantly. That said, let's say that Optoma may have gotten a bit carried away, since it measured almost 40% less than their claim. (15% - 25% isn't that unusual, and it's rather uncommon to find a projector that beats its marketing claim).
post #2295 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

The difference is only 50 to 100 lumens between the 2 projectors in best mode, this is not even visible by the naked eye and whichever one comes out brighter in the end will be related to how perfectly you calibrate. The Mits looks better OOTB than the Optoma hd20, it doesn't need a calibration nearly as bad, and the brightness difference is not enough to even be a factor in this decision.

The hd20 only has 1,200:1 On/Off compared to the Mits hc4000 which has 3,800:1. The production version of the HD20 may be a bit brighter than the reviews show, not sure as you'd have to go into the hd20 thread to find that out, but I have seen no immediate evidence of it.

The two projectors are too close in brightness for this to even be a deciding factor. Anyhow, I'd buy the Viewsonic Pro8200 before the Optoma hd20 if you want brightness, even the Viewsonic has around 1,500 to 2,000:1 On/off (depending on calibration and placement) and Dark Chip 3, better color wheel, and brighter than the HD20 for a lower cost.

From Projector Reviews (Projector Central also found the same Lumens)
http://www.projectorreviews.com/opto...erformance.php

The dissapointment comes from the Optoma claim of 1700 lumens. Now, most companies tend to overstate their brightness, and often significantly. That said, let's say that Optoma may have gotten a bit carried away, since it measured almost 40% less than their claim. (15% - 25% isn't that unusual, and it's rather uncommon to find a projector that beats its marketing claim).

Thanks for the info. The Viewsonic looks decent, but I'm going to stick with my gut and go with the HC4000. Placing the order now! Now I need to decide on a screen.... Going 96" on the Thrifty Whiteboard, thinking MaxxMudd v2.1 LL. Will my blacks really suffer with this combo? I want enough brightness to be able to run with low amounts of ambient light and normally run in ECO mode. MississippiMan recommended S-I-L-V-E-R paint combo. Its all a little overwhelming and hard to make decisions for a first time projector owner.
post #2296 of 2855
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDKruger4 View Post

Thanks for the info. The Viewsonic looks decent, but I'm going to stick with my gut and go with the HC4000. Placing the order now! Now I need to decide on a screen.... Going 96" on the Thrifty Whiteboard, thinking MaxxMudd v2.1 LL. Will my blacks really suffer with this combo? I want enough brightness to be able to run with low amounts of ambient light and normally run in ECO mode. MississippiMan recommended S-I-L-V-E-R paint combo. Its all a little overwhelming and hard to make decisions for a first time projector owner.

I would also always recommend the Mitsubishi over the Viewsonic as it is a better projector, the only advantage the Viewsonic has is brightness and less rainbow-effect (but most don't see RBE on the Mits either).

You can buy an ND-FILTER and get the black levels back into place at the cost of some intrascene and ANSI contrast, although I've heard buying a higher quality ND filter and tilting it a bit helps (not sure about this myself). I am not familiar with that paint, I guess it's like retro-reflective paint?

2.1 gain?
Yah with 2.1 gain you'll need the ND-FILTER, give AVS a call or visit B&H Audio/Video's site as they have some ND filters. Someone here might be able to offer some advice on the ND filter as well.

The black levels are a product of how dark you room is (as far as how dark they can go), as well as any reflections onto the screen will also hurt black levels and intrascene contrast.
post #2297 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

2.1 gain?
Yah with 2.1 gain you'll need the ND-FILTER, give AVS a call or visit B&H Audio/Video's site as they have some ND filters. Someone here might be able to offer some advice on the ND filter as well.

The paint (discussed in this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1319717) has somewhere around a 1.4-1.5 gain from what I've read. Thought with the lower lumen output from the HC4000 I would want modest gain? Or is this getting to the level where a filter is needed? I would just go with a lower gain screen before buying a filter.
post #2298 of 2855
Has anybody here attempted to motorize the zoom adjustment on their HC4000?
post #2299 of 2855
Looking for some tips/hints on installing the HC4000 with a ceiling mount.

This is the first time I have ever done this and on the surface, it seems that my measurements and screen placement have to be extremely precise to ensure the image being thrown hits all edges of the screen. But it also seems there is some trial and error because you can't know exactly where the screen and projector need to be placed until you actually get them set up to see what it looks like.

Am I thinking about this correctly? Or can you get the projector in approximately the right position and then make some micro-adjustments from there (my concern with this is a reduction in PQ)?
post #2300 of 2855
Would this machine make a good 'TV' projector? I have an RS45 in place right now, but I have racked up quite a few hours on it already, and the supposed JVC bulb problems make me paranoid about possible bulb failure.

So I thought about getting a second projector for general TV viewing and gaming, and using the RS45 for mainly Blu-Ray content.

Has anyone else done something like that?
post #2301 of 2855
Thread Starter 
Yes, the Mits is the best 'TV Projector', other than it could be brighter, but still for handling TV and going by PQ, it has unusually clean processing for a cable signal and great motion, the cleanest processing I've seen so far.
post #2302 of 2855
Brightness shouldn't be too much of a concern. I have a highpower screen.
My main concern however is if the image can fill the screen. The Mits would sit about 11 feet from a 119-inch screen, sitting on a table-top. Would that be a problem?
post #2303 of 2855
Thread Starter 
Yah it's a problem, can't do it.
post #2304 of 2855
What is the slimmest ceiling mount that will work with the HC4000?

I have 8' ceilings, and I'll be putting up a 96" image (smaller than I wanted) and want to keep the image as high as possible. Keystoning is out, keeping 1:1 pixel mapping is very important as it will be hooked up to a HTPC and lots of text. The 96" seems to be as large as I can go with the desire to keep the distance from top of the screen to ceiling noticeably less than from bottom of screen to floor. It also fits well with the cheap Thrifty WB DIY screen option, larger and I'd go sintra which is 10x more $$. I searched and didn't see any specific recommendations.
Thanks
post #2305 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDKruger4 View Post

Thanks for the info. The Viewsonic looks decent, but I'm going to stick with my gut and go with the HC4000. Placing the order now! Now I need to decide on a screen.... Going 96" on the Thrifty Whiteboard, thinking MaxxMudd v2.1 LL. Will my blacks really suffer with this combo? I want enough brightness to be able to run with low amounts of ambient light and normally run in ECO mode. MississippiMan recommended S-I-L-V-E-R paint combo. Its all a little overwhelming and hard to make decisions for a first time projector owner.


I have a Wilsonart Designer White screen (92") with my HC4000 and loving it. If I had a bigger room I would get a larger screen!
post #2306 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by FremontRich View Post

I have a Wilsonart Designer White screen (92") with my HC4000 and loving it. If I had a bigger room I would get a larger screen!

Do you have it painted? My room is large, 21' long with seating at 17' which is why I got rid of my 60" plasma. Unfortunately my ceilings are 8' so I'm pretty limited with the offset of the HC4000. Really wish it was a few degrees less!
post #2307 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDKruger4 View Post

Do you have it painted? My room is large, 21' long with seating at 17' which is why I got rid of my 60" plasma. Unfortunately my ceilings are 8' so I'm pretty limited with the offset of the HC4000. Really wish it was a few degrees less!

You can always tilt and apply keystone, thats what I did since I was limited to ceiling height, a couple of clicks and I cannot tell at all and trust me I have looked, at least with video sources. You can read through and others are doing the same, the goal is always one to one pixel mapping but if you want a bigger screen it is always an option...just something to keep in mind. The mits throws up a great image, best bang for your buck for sure
post #2308 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDKruger4 View Post

Do you have it painted? My room is large, 21' long with seating at 17' which is why I got rid of my 60" plasma. Unfortunately my ceilings are 8' so I'm pretty limited with the offset of the HC4000. Really wish it was a few degrees less!

No, it's not painted. The material is a close match for Stewart Filmscreen's StudioTek 100. Check out this DIY screen blog for laminate screens:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=708240
post #2309 of 2855
If this is the Official Thread then we need to do the normal Spec thingy:
post #2310 of 2855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy586 View Post

If this is the Official Thread then we need to do the normal Spec thingy:

Which is located on the first page of the thread
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