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The New Master List of BASS in Movies with Frequency Charts - Page 187

post #5581 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by raistline View Post

Can't we all just get along and stop this pointless bickering and these venomous comments. Really now, what is the point in this comment here other than to insight a quarrelsome response. I think everyone would be best served if you and others stopped with these kind of arguments.
I am sure that I am not the only one who is sick of this 20+ page argument of back and forth riddled with nothing but ridicule and piousness.
Please, I beg of you, everyone. Let's just get back on the primary subject matter of this forum and agree to disagree about what each individual person finds to be most pertinent.
The point of the comment is that this is an open forum to the public and opinions will be discussed and nobody will ever agree and that is part of putting your opinion out on and open forum. The part that bothers me is when it gets pompous and some belittle others just because they have this and that. Argue the science of it, but please don't think you are any better because you have a 2K sub and the other guy does not. Now with that, I don't understand why others care about what others post? Read what you want to read and ignore what does not pertain to you. Everything is just serious anymore. rolleyes.gif
Edited by Reefdvr27 - 10/3/12 at 10:59am
post #5582 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post


Since the frequency ranges are different, it's not easy to tell. Is the unknown movie Super 8 or something?

Max


Niagara 1952. Broadband signal with no filtering.

Does that ULF content move Niagara into the 5 star category?wink.gif




Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post



If the white lines both represent THX Reference, the mystery movie has far less content below 70Hz and MUCH less below 10Hz. It appears to have more content at 1kHz (and possibly above? Though the Star Trek graph doesn't go above 1kHz).


Max

Star Trek goes up to 2200 Hz as indicated in the top right corner scale.

I don't recall mentioning THX reference playback level (or any particular playback level at all). You can't get SPL levels from this program.

Yes, energy levels are different in different movies. The master volume control will take care of that.

Note that hearing is octave based and not frequency bin based. The octave from 10 to 20 Hz has about 10 frequency bins, and the octave from 1000 Hz to 2000 Hz has about 1000 frequency bins. The spectrogram does not represent what you hear very well at all, but it does show how energy levels are distributed on an audio track.



Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post



Like I said, if the graphs have a common frame of Reference for FR and levels then you can compare movies you're familiar with to new movies you may not have yet seen. Folks who have systems capable of playing down to single digits and have watched the bass reference scenes from TIH, WOTW and the like as well as scenes from S8 and Battleship etc. have a frame of reference as to which types of graphs sound a certain way, i.e. if you see the graph for a new movie and it falls off a cliff below 30Hz, you know it won't sound anywhere near as impressive to folks with single digit Hz capable systems. For folks whose systems fall off a cliff below 25-30Hz though, the 30Hz wonders may quite likely sound as impressive if not more so than the movies that plunge to single digit Hz, simply because they're systems can't reproduce that, and they've never heard/felt what those scenes can do.


Max


Movies are not all recorded at the same volume levels, so it is hard to compare one movie with another. There is no common frame of reference. Anyone can use any input volume level that they want to, and they can shift spectrogram colors / contrast / brightness / offset at will.

You can use any old RTA program to see where the FR drops off on an audio track. Perhaps an RTA is "better" than a Spectrumlab spectrogram in that it is octave based and not frequency bin based. In other words, an RTA is more representative of the way that hearing is based. However, try to find an RTA program that has a waterfall function to record the time based data.
Edited by J_Palmer_Cass - 10/3/12 at 11:05am
post #5583 of 16121
Ok. New settings for SpecLabs.
Here is the peak max (green) and long time average (red) plot of PROMETHEUS.

I will post the same for TIH so you can see if my settings are good.
143201275758P1a5d.jpg
post #5584 of 16121
TIH for reference :
4a3201282326P537e.jpg

Avengers for reference.
543201284100P53c7.jpg

So, whats the verdict? Are these plots incorrect or should I keep doing them for future releases?
Edited by Steveo1234 - 10/3/12 at 11:41am
post #5585 of 16121
For starters, increase your signal level so you have peaks near the 50% mark (right hand plot). You probably have to get into your PC sound mixer and increase the record level.
post #5586 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post

For starters, increase your signal level so you have peaks near the 50% mark (right hand plot). You probably have to get into your PC sound mixer and increase the record level.

Signal level appears fine to me. I plotted a 25hz sine recorded at -12db. After setting my offset to 0 it was shown as -12db. I believe it is correct?

Signalchain is bluray disk to tsmuxer to audacity to spectrum labs.
post #5587 of 16121
And just for the fun of it:
À l'intérieur DTS 1.5Mbps, french.

073201291604P82ec.jpg
post #5588 of 16121
Prometheus....is starting - with a smile smile.gif
(Avenger is filed in #13)

Prometheus - Chapter #1
Prometheus_ch1.jpg
Edited by Flageborg - 10/4/12 at 12:24am
post #5589 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by bossobass View Post


Unfortunately, after wading through all of the childish barbs, false accusations, misinterpreted comments and data, negative spew and JPC's badgering about my settings, results and other pseudo-technical irrelevant trivia, I've come to agree with Max. It's not worth the effort.

I hope the thread thrives because I've enjoyed it more than most of the info this sub forum offers, but I predict that without the objective data it will fade away, as the old thread did after those first slew of SL graph posters moved on.
Don't go. Some of us actually appreciate the information and actual data as opposed to the useless/pointless conjecture of, "I think it sounded AWESOME".

Simply do what maxmercy has decided is the best approach and use the 'Block users posts' function to block the posts by the folks who have nothing of value to add. I find it greatly enhances the SNR of the thread.


Max
post #5590 of 16121
Have to agree with bosso here.

This thread is, unfortunately, more than long gone. Don't believe me? Read the first 30 pages or so, and see for yourself what the difference is. It used to be much more data, and some subjective comments, but with comments on the data primarily. I remember getting some films from Netflix based on the data. Then it turned into some data, more commentary, and now it is one graph, and a sh*tstorm follows.

There may be a new thread started, but if it just turns into what this thread has turned into: 95% 'rocks' vs 'sucks' and only 5% data, it may have to die as well. I do not mind a thread that doesn't get updated often; as long as it gets updated with good data, and not just the same old parties arguing over whether or not '20Hz extension is enough/not enough', etc, and the 'data is worthless if you thought it rocked' folks...

It may not even be on this forum. PM me if you are interested in having a primarily data-based thread with a bare minimum of subjective comments.

JSS
post #5591 of 16121
The main problem here is that the ratings system used by certain posters is primarily based on the amount of Infrasonic content that is recorded on a movie soundtrack. I note that the Avengers is still listed as a 4.5 star movie on page 1 of this thread. Maybe you guys should replace the owner of this thread with a more compliant owner.

Another problem is lack of new content. With 5 years of postings here, the older horses have been beaten to death already. Some have waterfalls, many do not have waterfalls. I wonder how those "objective" ratings were determined? The Avengers shows up with a good soundtrack albeit with no Infrasonic content, and some of the natives have meltdowns because the movie was not mixed the way that they wanted it to be mixed. Too bad, so sad!

I guess that I will have to wait for the December release of Batman for my next "current movie" evaluation / purchase.
post #5592 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post

Have to agree with bosso here.

This thread is, unfortunately, more than long gone. Don't believe me? Read the first 30 pages or so, and see for yourself what the difference is. It used to be much more data, and some subjective comments, but with comments on the data primarily. I remember getting some films from Netflix based on the data. Then it turned into some data, more commentary, and now it is one graph, and a sh*tstorm follows.

There may be a new thread started, but if it just turns into what this thread has turned into: 95% 'rocks' vs 'sucks' and only 5% data, it may have to die as well. I do not mind a thread that doesn't get updated often; as long as it gets updated with good data, and not just the same old parties arguing over whether or not '20Hz extension is enough/not enough', etc, and the 'data is worthless if you thought it rocked' folks...

It may not even be on this forum. PM me if you are interested in having a primarily data-based thread with a bare minimum of subjective comments.

JSS



Name the thread "Movies with Infrasonic content that rocks".

Three tiers of rating of infrasonic movies, 10 star for over the top full range bass, and 5 star for average bass filtered, and honorable mention for the rest. Then that thread will really "rock"!
post #5593 of 16121
Prometheus looks awesome smile.gif
post #5594 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post

Have to agree with bosso here.
This thread is, unfortunately, more than long gone. Don't believe me? Read the first 30 pages or so, and see for yourself what the difference is. It used to be much more data, and some subjective comments, but with comments on the data primarily. I remember getting some films from Netflix based on the data. Then it turned into some data, more commentary, and now it is one graph, and a sh*tstorm follows.
There may be a new thread started, but if it just turns into what this thread has turned into: 95% 'rocks' vs 'sucks' and only 5% data, it may have to die as well. I do not mind a thread that doesn't get updated often; as long as it gets updated with good data, and not just the same old parties arguing over whether or not '20Hz extension is enough/not enough', etc, and the 'data is worthless if you thought it rocked' folks...
It may not even be on this forum. PM me if you are interested in having a primarily data-based thread with a bare minimum of subjective comments.
JSS

 

+1

 

Perhaps the ground rules of the new thread specify only members that can prove <[x] hz reference output with graphs can weigh in. 

 

x=18? Maybe less?

 

That way the folks that can't produce it are forced to read from the sidelines until they make the Olympic trials...biggrin.gif

 

No offense to those that can't, but without having owned a capable sub system below [x] hz (not just experienced a few demos), your opinion doesn't hold a lot of weight when speaking of movies capable of less than [x] hz.

post #5595 of 16121
I just watched cabin in the woods, did anyone else think it was odd? It was Friday the 13th meets 13 ghosts! Any links to the charts? I may miss them in the mayhem.
post #5596 of 16121
Prometheus - Chapter #7

Prometheus_ch7.jpg
post #5597 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

I just watched cabin in the woods, did anyone else think it was odd? It was Friday the 13th meets 13 ghosts! Any links to the charts? I may miss them in the mayhem.

Cabin in the woods - Its on todays to-do-list...
post #5598 of 16121
Prometheus - Chapter #32

Prometheus_ch32.jpg
post #5599 of 16121
@ Flageborg

Thanks for the chart!!

I don't have my copy of Prometheus yet, so what scene is that one?
post #5600 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominguez1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post

Have to agree with bosso here.

This thread is, unfortunately, more than long gone. Don't believe me? Read the first 30 pages or so, and see for yourself what the difference is. It used to be much more data, and some subjective comments, but with comments on the data primarily. I remember getting some films from Netflix based on the data. Then it turned into some data, more commentary, and now it is one graph, and a sh*tstorm follows.

There may be a new thread started, but if it just turns into what this thread has turned into: 95% 'rocks' vs 'sucks' and only 5% data, it may have to die as well. I do not mind a thread that doesn't get updated often; as long as it gets updated with good data, and not just the same old parties arguing over whether or not '20Hz extension is enough/not enough', etc, and the 'data is worthless if you thought it rocked' folks...

It may not even be on this forum. PM me if you are interested in having a primarily data-based thread with a bare minimum of subjective comments.

JSS

+1

Perhaps the ground rules of the new thread specify only members that can prove <[x] hz reference output with graphs can weigh in. 

x=18? Maybe less?

That way the folks that can't produce it are forced to read from the sidelines until they make the Olympic trials...biggrin.gif

No offense to those that can't, but without having owned a capable sub system below [x] hz (not just experienced a few demos), your opinion doesn't hold a lot of weight when speaking of movies capable of less than [x] hz.



Obviously you don't know the players here very well. Your suggested x=18 Hz cutoff is not even in the ballpark. That cutoff frequency would even allow me to be a poster on that thread.

I also note that you did not mention SPL levels that would go along with your cutoff frequency. We need headroom, and can you prove that you have enough of it?

How about compression? We can't have any of that. Can you prove it?

How flat is your system? Can you prove it?

How "hot" do you run your subwoofer relative to 1000 Hz? Can you prove it?

How about distortion? How much is too much? Can you prove it?

Is your system "green"? Not sure we even want to get into that!

After you meet those requirements, there must be a requirement that you can contribute to the thread with use of the SpectrumLab program. No waterfalls means no posting!
post #5601 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flageborg View Post

Prometheus - Chapter #32

Prometheus_ch32.jpg


What does that yellow line in the upper spectrogram represent? I assume that Red is the long term average and Green is PEAK level.
post #5602 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post

What does that yellow line in the upper spectrogram represent?

Yellow Line represents.....in the graph...nothing.
While recording - the yellow line represents the "live" signal wink.gif

How did I get it on this chart? I "paused" SL while the movie was still playing...
Normally I start SL before I start the "soundtrack" and stop the ""soundtrack" before i "pause" SL...to avoid the Yellow line.
Edited by Flageborg - 10/4/12 at 6:38am
post #5603 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by cr136124 View Post

@ Flageborg
Thanks for the chart!!
I don't have my copy of Prometheus yet, so what scene is that one?

Thank you - stay tuned - more to come smile.gif

Chapter #32 is the scene where they all .......... and then suddenly .............

Sorry, can't tell you more in public, BUT those low frequencies might be shocking your body - and give you a lot of fun wink.gif
post #5604 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

I just watched cabin in the woods, did anyone else think it was odd? It was Friday the 13th meets 13 ghosts! Any links to the charts? I may miss them in the mayhem.

Here are mine: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1333462/the-new-master-list-of-bass-in-movies-with-frequency-charts/5430#post_22448433
post #5605 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flageborg View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post

What does that yellow line in the upper spectrogram represent?

Yellow Line represents.....in the graph...nothing.
While recording - the yellow line represents the "live" signal wink.gif

How did I get it on this chart? I "paused" SL while the movie was still playing...
Normally I start SL before I start the "soundtrack" and stop the ""soundtrack" before i "pause" SL...to avoid the Yellow line.



Brain lock. I should have know that. I have my "yellow line" set as a bar graph so I am not used to seeing a third line.

You can use that "yellow line" function to evaluate the spectrum at any time period on your waterfall. Sometimes I will save my waterfall / spectrogram with a specific sound effect time period in mind, and it will show up in the upper spectrogram.
post #5606 of 16121

Thank you! Now I know what you mean by The Hand! I told my friend while watching it that I wished the Avengers to have bass like this. I am always curious to see what frequencies some scenes are, or how deep they reach. The bass was not louder but the effects were so much better, I am starting to get used to what unfiltered movies feel like with this new system, not just 5 star super loud movies. There are wobbles(shutters) and waves that I did not feel before so once I feel that I know the soundtrack digs deeper than usual.
post #5607 of 16121
You're welcome biggrin.gif

Yeah, I sat up and paid attention as soon as the fifty minute mark came around. That wide bandwidth rumble accompanied by that loud 30-35Hz sweep was a lot of fun in here. Really effective LFE track in that movie.
post #5608 of 16121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklahoma Wolf View Post

You're welcome biggrin.gif
Yeah, I sat up and paid attention as soon as the fifty minute mark came around. That wide bandwidth rumble accompanied by that loud 30-35Hz sweep was a lot of fun in here. Really effective LFE track in that movie.

I had no idea which direction this movie was going. The bass was very good indeed! The nice part about this movie is there is bass without very loud action sequences. Of course they exist as well but that eerie bass is always great. Chalk another one up to a horror flick. BTW, I rented the bluray and while the disc said DTS-hd only dolby digital was an audio choice. It seems like they are releasing cheaper copies for rent nowadays. Either way, the audio was very good.
post #5609 of 16121
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post

Watched Sherlock Holmes 2 last night. Did anyone post waterfalls for that yet? I'd like to see those if anyone has. I'd give it probably 3.5-4 stars. Lots of action and a good amount of bass but nothing that stuck out to me as particularly deep reaching or powerful. Great surround mix. I thought some of the bass mix was a little weird though. For example the loudest most active bass scenes appeared to be some of the score and background music, while the bombs and cannon blasts seemed to be mixed a little lean on the bass at least compared to the large amount of energy present in the mids and high freqs during these short events. I am still trying to get used to a new space so maybe it is just me.

No, it's not you. The mix have way too loud music in mains, was actually too much even -15 from reference and the bass is in weak level. First sherlock did have way better mix and bass.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/sherlock2forestscene_zpse3cab519.png



Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklahoma Wolf View Post

Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow - just barely a five star. Could have used a couple more scenes with the really good stuff, but it was fun. I was at four and a half until the underwater battle stuff.
It's no cinematic masterpiece, but better than some of the other five star movies. Way better than the Transformers movies, anyway.

Barely? These charts are taken only from vlc player playing scenes, so only left+right channels from dts fullbitrate dvd.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain12_zpsa476391e.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain6_zps88926336.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain_zpscc82e568.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain2_zpsd7071c51.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain3_zpsb0893431.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain5_zpscad6c2f5.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain5_zpscad6c2f5.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain6_zps8b86ad95.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain7_zpsfc4f8957.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain8_zps842a5b55.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain9_zps01d64f82.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain10_zpsdc6773c4.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/skycaptain11_zpsa7569f69.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolcat4843 View Post

Yes.
Flight of the Phoenix on blu-ray disc, has lossless 5.1 DTS-HD Master Audio.
The DVD doesn't have lossless audio.
Get the blu-ray disc and forget about the DVD.
That whole plane crash landing sequence is my favorite demo scene.
Sound quality is just jaw dropping incredible!

Was the blu-ray actually filtered around 40hz, i something remember that flage did show chart comparison from it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklahoma Wolf View Post

Finally got around to Battleship. Thoroughly disappointing, terrible movie. Three star vote from me. Lots of loud LFE, but it was all up high.

I actually liked it more when thinkin that the aliens were actually good guys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

I might of missed it but I don't see the inclusion of the final bridge scene in "The Long Kiss Good Night."

Anyone have this? I hate geena davis, so im not so interested to check this movie again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradymartin View Post

with all you guys talking about that super 8 harshness or screeching sound (i havent seen the movie, yet, but plan to)
did you also notice it on the plane crash scene in Knowing? when the plane wing first touches the ground? a huge long screeching sound that hurt my ears, i hope im not getting old but yeah metal hitting the ground should sound that way. just wondering if its just me, my speakers, or if thats what the sound engineers wanted it to sound like. btw i love that scene

It's normal. Nothing wrong in your speakers in that scene. Sadly dvd have stronger bass levels than bluray. Even dvd dolby track is louder than blu-ray dolby track. Wtf. Comparison below from sunflare scene.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/knowingblu-ray-dvdsunflarecomparison_zpsf6de6c2a.png
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm111/lfeman/knowingdvd-bluraysunflarescene_zpsb39ff308.png

Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Avengers is 7.1 DTS-HD. So far half way thru the bass is 4 stars. The overall audio is awesome. I remember the Dark Night having better bass which I ranked 4.5.

Better bass, i dont know maybe, but i think avengers did have a lot more on it in 25-50hz area. Would be cool to see peak/average chart from dark knight. Hmm did leto do it, i cant remember.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post


And to all of you who gave 4.5+ stars, I question your system's frequency response.
JSS

I have no idea what is my frequency response to listening position, i quess its 18hz at least or even lover(when watchin that scene from wotw when that tripod hits ground). What are some good mic's/program to check this, gos im interested now how it will change when im moving to different place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post

LFE Man, take away the star ratings. Why have 5 stars when NO films even get less than 4-stars? Just have two ratings: whether the bass rocks, or sucks. Then people can puke out all the wonderful, yet meaningless audiophile words like 'palpability' and 'articulation'......who needs charts? Did the bass rock, or suck?
See you guys, this thread was fun for a long time.
JSS

No, star ratings will stay. Though there is some work to do on some titles and maybe new category, i dont know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklahoma Wolf View Post

Looks like a three star, the way I rate them these days. Hoping to find out otherwise once I can get my hands on a rental copy, but so far it's looking like the second coming of Battleship.

Not even close how crap the bass is in battleship.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post


WOTW DD and WOTW DTS (identical mix on same DVD) would not display the same waterfalls unless you equalize the volume levels of the two audio tracks.

I dont have dvd anymore, but i remember there was differences in those tracks, something like where dolby mix did have stronger lower bass, where dts did have stronger higher bass in that scene where tripod is startin to move underground.

Quote:
Originally Posted by T( )( )L View Post

Flageborg,i appreciate your charts god work : ) hope you can give the movie "Inside" à shot,its à french horror flick With insane bass into singel digits,check it out ; ) even Bosso cant complain on this one : )

Heh, many would bottom/kill his system with this movie especially with that dts track.biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklahoma Wolf View Post

Tonight's movie was Cabin in the Woods. Now this is the kind of LFE I want to hear. It really put the smackdown on Battleship, anyway. Going to try for some waterfalls tomorrow, but before then I think I need to put my internal organs back into alignment.
Starting at about 1 hour 20 minutes, the tapped horns just went nuts. Been a while since they've done that biggrin.gif

Was it that scene where that snake did take that woman through roof. Sadly this movie wasnt that good anymore in second time. Though first time with double bill with raid redemtion it was riot/blast with 500+ people.biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Why are folks in a BASS in movies thread bothering about everything else about a movie besides the BASS?
You want to comment about how great a movie is? Go to the 'Subjective opinions of the AWESOMENESS of the latest thing I watched' thread.
This is a thread for bassheads. Non-basshead-subjective-opinion-wannabe-movie-reviewers, please reserve opinions about BASS discussion in a thread about BASS, or go elsewhere.
Max

Did i hire you to be my moderator on my thread?rolleyes.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Avengers ranked the same as XMFC? Who was smoking what when they put Avengers there?
Max

Yes, i was smokin it in hot bass levels it was awesome and i was so high.tongue.gif The ratings are not only given by extension. There is quantity, quality and amplitude that matters too and avengers have quantity and quality in spades.

Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Battleship is a 3? I didn't think S8 really had anything better than Battleship. There's no way XMFC and A belong in the same classification though.
Max

Super 8 have a way better bass than that battleship, just look some footstomp from that monster and compare to them to any scene from battleship. My experience from XMFC is from dvd and what i remember it did have quite weak amplitudeon those bass scenes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post

OK folks,

LFE Man, it is high f'in time we really took a look at all the ratings we have thrown about in cavalier fashion in this thread, basing them on actual LF content. WTF WERE WE THINKING? I'm so glad the patience of the subjective sages of this thread have finally led us to the beacon of light of that is 'awesome' vs 'suck'. I decree that all films should only receive 4, 4.5, or 5 star ratings (if not higher!) from now on, and that the first page of this thread is a sacrilegious mess that should either be torn down piece by piece or razed to the ground, and all charts deleted, or even better, BURNED. The charts have misled us so.........how can we ever repent in the face of a simple choice? Awesome = 5 star, Suck = 4 star, can't make up your mind? 4.5. Easy. Just watch Idiocracy. Good film (4-star bass by the current rating scheme that prevails here), and the parallels to this thread as it has evolved are peculiar.
JSS

What is your problem anyway? You cant take others opinions, if yes... well too bad then, but thanks anyway for your work here.smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

I am working on Spec lab now since my room is done. Should I run the graphs like Maxmercy or Bosso? PM me the settings and I will start to learn. Once I get the graphs dialed in I will plaster this thread with graphs! Oh, and my opinions too.

First page have some settings how to do it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wth718 View Post

All this Avengers controversy just brings to the fore what is clearly evident and has been the case for much longer than these past couple of weeks--much of the list has a certain level of subjectivity to it. There are certainly some ratings that I disagree with, some being too high (Avengers, Superman Returns) and some too low (30 Days of Night, Elektra). I can say this with a certain level of confidence since installing a Buttkicker and having my eyes opened to what some of these movies can REALLY do.
But the fact is, a lot of movies on the list don't have graphs, and some subjectivity has to be used. I think Bosso rated Hunger Games a 5, but it's on the list as a 3.5. He provided graphs, but the scenes with such content were very few and far between. Do 2-3 short scenes equal a 5 star movie? Subjective. Immortals has some scenes with obvious clipping, but has a TON of LFE used in different ways on the track. Tron also has clipping, and doesn't go as low as Immortals. Yet one is a 4.5 and the other an unquestioned 5. Subjective. Inception, Super 8, Avatar, and 30 Days of Night are all 4 stars. Super 8 shouldn't be that high, period, IMO. Avatar shouldn't be there either unless you're talking about it as an overall track, which is what many are saying re: Avengers. To me, I think the difference in quality of Inception vs 30 Days is pretty vast. To my ears, 30 Days is reference quality, although not on the level of the really heavy hitters. The LFE effects are immersive, layered, and varied, all contributing to the overall excellence of the track. Inception? Not so much. There's just something off about the sound of the bass. Does a graph show that or does some subjectivity come into play there, too?
This thread is like democracy--messy and frustrating, but ultimately the best we've got. I wouldn't change a thing. People who find utility in graphs will continue to do so. Same with the subjective comments. I suspect it will be a mix of both for most people. The list, to me, is not the end all, be all, but a guide. I've looked up and down the list to find movies whose bass I might enjoy. Where they are on the list might affect my decisions somewhat, but not totally.
I will say this, though. I have seen way too many movies recently being given 4-5 stars almost by default. If it doesn't suck, give it a 4.Luckily, LFE Man mostly sifts through this recent noise.
IMO, fwiw, yada yada yada.

Elektra dont have that special bass, atleast theatrical cut. Also 30 days of night sucked in bass, or i remember it did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bossobass View Post

Honestly, people need to read more and skim less.
I said I was rating HG a 5 for the sole reason that it proved beyond a doubt that sound designers know exactly what content they're dealing with and that it in no way could be "unintended artifact" because someone had to spin the generator knob from 'x' Hx to 'x' Hz below 20 Hz.
It has nothing whatever to do with content or the standard star rating. It is just that it can be used heretofore as a reference to refute the incredibly errant "They can't monitor the content so everything below 20 Hz is unintended artifact", a ridiculous statement that resurfaces in some form every year since I've been a member here. That makes it a 5 score. IMO.

I have thinked something funny, would it be actually those low level sweeps in that opening scene are some leaked stuff from other mixin rooms when they recorded that dialogue from those actors in that scene. Probably not, but funny anyway to think.biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post

Below is a waterfall / peak-average spectrogram of a random DVD.
What does this movie sound like? Peak/Average spectrogram plus waterfall.

Probably full of crap bass, like your charts look like.biggrin.gif:rolleyes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post

Look, everyone has their own opinion on what bass they enjoy. I mean this is an opinion thread on Bass and people give opinions. Some of the folks like deep pounding bass and others like softer bass and then there are those that enjoy nice tight bass and I am very happy with my dual PSA XV-15's. It is really interesting to get a perspective from all the angles. I myself like a nice deep punch. It's nice that you have your system tuned to 11hz and don't have the same opinion of the movie that others did, but everyone has an opinion.
Don't take this the wrong way, but some people around seem to think that this is THIER thread only just because they have more bass than others and the others opinions don't count. This is a public forum and others enjoy talking bass whether they have a $99 sub or a 10K system. Not everyone has the cash to go out and buy what it takes to duplicate bass under 20hz. The goal is to get your system to what sound good to "YOU" and it is nice to have this thread to get opinions from all the guys. Just my two pennies.

+1 Could'nt say it better.smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steveo1234 View Post

Well, then Id have to disagree with you. The graphs show intensity (level) and frequency, and a few other things. It does not show how the LFE works with the rest of the soundtrack, either in timing or level. Or anything else that can be detected when using your ears. Does that mean that the graphs are useless? Ofcourse not. I believe I was the first to post an Avengers graph and I still believe that graphs are a (the most?) important part. But, to me its not the only input for the ratings system.
Regarding the spectrographs of inception: IIRC theres a few scenes with excellent sub content, for instance the beach scene in the beginning. Im sure those look good on a speclab plot. Im also sure that I would rate the bass of inception low. Not because there isnt both level and frequency to give it a good review but because the LFE sounds horrible. Subjetivly. To me.
Im sure others would like it..

It's well known fact that bass in overall sucks in quality on inception.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFC View Post

I've read this thread for a long time. Opinions about bass quantity and quality for many movies are varied, influenced by such factors as system setup, listening position affected by room nulls/peaks, playback volume, etc. While enjoyment of the subjective experience is the end result of audio/home theater, I believe it's essential to have an objective archive of what information is actually encoded on the disc. Otherwise, my quadruple tapped horn system will disappoint me when I wonder why The Secret Garden isn't pressurizing my room with single-digit bass!
Emotion and involvement in an experience makes it difficult to state truly what occurred. Watching a fun movie, hearing a live symphony, or seeing "Stomp" live all affect our judgement of certain aspects of that experience. How many folks here just eyeball how far their speakers are from the listening position? Or do they measure the distance to get them equal? Objective measurements are an important part of the entire studio-to-theater chain.
This thread would benefit from the following:
1. Please continue the graphs and objective analysis of soundtracks.
2. Instead of saying that a movie (with no bass below 30 Hz) has "crappy bass", simply state that there is no content below 30 Hz. This way of stating it will not aggravate those whose systems play that 30Hz bass and provide a fun experience. I hope you understand how placing subjective judgements on objective measurements is what has caused the many pages of turmoil. We all know by now that many folks will absolutely enjoy The Avengers regardless of what content lies below a chosen point. In the context of this thread, those subjective experiences are another aspect of "value" of a disc. Very few folks would replay a disc that had good ULF content, but was totally garbage otherwise (the "audiophile recording" effect). So, refrain from making subjective comments about a given movie; more harm than good. Some here may choose to buy/pass on a disc by virtue of content, but leave that decision to the reader.
3. Thank you for all the hard work and time in assembling this list and continuing this thread.
Lee

Another thread hijacker/wannabe moderator, but you have some good points.smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by raistline View Post

Can't we all just get along and stop this pointless bickering and these venomous comments. Really now, what is the point in this comment here other than to insight a quarrelsome response. I think everyone would be best served if you and others stopped with these kind of arguments.
I am sure that I am not the only one who is sick of this 20+ page argument of back and forth riddled with nothing but ridicule and piousness.
Please, I beg of you, everyone. Let's just get back on the primary subject matter of this forum and agree to disagree about what each individual person finds to be most pertinent.

Thumbs up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Lol. The Avengers order thread!! biggrin.gif

Sigh. Sometimes i wish that i wouldnt resurected this thread.frown.gif

http://i49.tinypic.com/rwm2bn.gif
Edited by lfe man - 10/4/12 at 4:53pm
post #5610 of 16121
Cabin in the woods - It was on todays to-do-list...

Now its DONE - eek.gifeek.gifsmile.gif

PURE ULF MADNESS !!!
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