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Samsung D7000 & D8000 Settings/Calibration Thread - Page 102

post #3031 of 3298
Hello Avid and anyone else willing to offer suggestions would me much appreciated!
My latest calibration, and I took yr advice AVID by adjusting the bgain upwards (without a meter) in SVM to compensate for the WB difference in UM. Incidentally I think my wp was off in the UM after SVM calibration because of the difference in contrast??. I dont know what the default contrast is in SVM in dynamic mode but i noticed i was checking after i lowered my contrast in UM which affected my rgain very slightly and lowered my bgain... It only needed 2 clicks upward to compensate.
Anyway the SVM manual adjustment really helped because as you will notice i didnt need to calibrate 2pt wb. So picture looks pretty good but I need direction with 2 issues:

1) I have some occasional pinking. I did not have any pinking or clipping when I set contrast. I even checked the color clipping pattern which was fine. Maybe my eyes missed it?
2) At 40 ire I needed about 2 more clicks of blue. 50 ire was fine.

SVM settings:

ADC L/H = 130/68
WB all set at 128 except Sub-contrast at 132 by default, R-Gain 127, and B-Gain at 78

UM settings

Mode MOVIE
gamma 2.2
Peak White 33ftL (I set this to 33 when adjusting contrast/brightness but did not check after completion of calibration)
Cell light 20
contrast 90
brightness 54
sharpness 0
color 50
tint 50/50
black tone off
dynamic off
gamma -1
flesh tone 0
edge enhance off
motion lighting off
xvYcc off
color tone Cool
digital noise off
mpeg noise off

color space
Red 56,6,5
Green 18,64,0
Blue 1,3,67
Yellow 56,53,4
Cyan 18,54,57
Magenta 49,8,59

White Balance
r-off 25
g-off 25
b-off 25
r-gain 25
g-gain 25
b-gain 25

10-pt WB
1 1,1,4
2 4,4,6
3 5,5,8
4 7,8,10 (needed more blue)
5 7,7,10
6 2,3,9
7 3,6,9
8 -2,-2,5
9 0,-2, 2
10 0,1,6

Can I change my adc values to fix my pinking?

Thx in advance! D
post #3032 of 3298
Quick question for anyone using DirecTV.... I have a 64D8000, have been using it with a DirecTV HD DVR for the past year. My picture settings were obviously off from a standard calibration with this device due to the black level issues that exist with Samsung and that receiver.

I moved last week and upgraded to DirecTV's new Home Media Center... pretty much an HD DVR that records 5 things at once. Using the same settings that I had for the HD DVR, it now looks completely off.

Has anyone else upgraded to the HMC? Perhaps this new receiver has corrected the black level issue associated with the HD DVR?
post #3033 of 3298
Hello, I forget if ADC effects grey scale . I have a PN51D6500 and have my ADC at factory default. I wrote everything down before I changed anything. I think if I remember correctly it's 134 /49. I did do the ADC calibration of the 16-255 pattern but my ADC value didn't change stayed the same numbers. Under HDMI it did show success afterwards, so it took the pattern.
post #3034 of 3298
Hey dan,

Any reason why you left sub-contrast at 132? I would set it to 128 unless you find a reason to change it (of course that means recalibrating, so you can leave it for now).

Anyway, I don't think sub-contrast or L/H values will fix your "pinking". But you say you see NO pinking on the test patterns? That is strange - the typical pinking as a result of clipping should definitely be visible in the test patterns. Could be you have another problem - what sort of content makes it visible?

It would appear that something is still amiss with your calibration given the LARGE adjustments you've made in the mid-range 10pt. Such extreme settings can't be good for your final picture quality, and may even be causing problems between intervals which could maybe cast a pink hue. One way to address it might be to reduce R-gain further in the ADC/WB settings (before I had Janos' help, that worked for my clipping pink). Besides that, I'm not sure what to suggest.
I'm still troubled by the fact that the SM calibration never worked for your set. Sorry to say, but my feeling is there could be something else wrong that's beyond correctable using these techniques. Hopefully someone else might have more insight...
post #3035 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by ndaa75 View Post

Seems these settings are quite common for the larger D7000 displays which to be fair is pretty unusual when compared to other high end Samsungs! The only other thing I'll add to this thread is an i1pro profile I made and used a couple of weeks back to calibrate my D8000 with excellent results.
i1pro profiled i1D3/pro
0.96560332 0.02705702 -0.00738746
-0.01597897 0.98275336 0.00738746
0.00824905 -0.0065119 0.93131973



Ndaa75, can you tell me What exactly these settings do? I have the i1d3pro and I dont know if it is accurate out of the box...Are you saying here that you used an I1 pro to set the i1d3pro?
if so, Can I use them also or would yours be different them mine because they may run different from meter to meter?
Thx Danny
post #3036 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvidHiker View Post

Hey dan,
Any reason why you left sub-contrast at 132? I would set it to 128 unless you find a reason to change it (of course that means recalibrating, so you can leave it for now).
Anyway, I don't think sub-contrast or L/H values will fix your "pinking". But you say you see NO pinking on the test patterns? That is strange - the typical pinking as a result of clipping should definitely be visible in the test patterns. Could be you have another problem - what sort of content makes it visible?
It would appear that something is still amiss with your calibration given the LARGE adjustments you've made in the mid-range 10pt. Such extreme settings can't be good for your final picture quality, and may even be causing problems between intervals which could maybe cast a pink hue. One way to address it might be to reduce R-gain further in the ADC/WB settings (before I had Janos' help, that worked for my clipping pink). Besides that, I'm not sure what to suggest.
I'm still troubled by the fact that the SM calibration never worked for your set. Sorry to say, but my feeling is there could be something else wrong that's beyond correctable using these techniques. Hopefully someone else might have more insight...

Hey Avid thanx for the help!
Yes, remember i too had to replace my panel so i am having a hard time with this...I thought Zoyd said on a prior post that if I was pinking before 95 contrast i could lower the "H" value in SVM to get rid of it. Maybe worth a try, but i dont know how much to lower it. How would you know if the ADC values are correct? "success may be false positive"
You dont think the SM calibration not working for me is a contrast thing?..What else would do this? My old movie mode settings dont matter now, right? I remember reading on some post that someone (maybe Janos?) would zero out the movie mode settings using TDM...Why would someone need to do that if you are going to use "cool" Pic setting ?
Would it be helpful to try calibration using Cal Day/Night ? I never had them enabled....maybe open up new set of defaults???
How much did u lower your rgain in svm? And wouldnt that make things worse in 10p?
post #3037 of 3298
Sure, I understand you replaced the panel (in my case, it was only the main board) and nothing here is straightforward, so I can sympathize. But your situation is still unusual, even for a panel replacement it seems.

Once again, if you do not see pinking in the test patterns (especially the white clipping, but it should be clearly visible in any flashing white bar), then you do not have pinking in the strictest sense of the word, IMO. Pinking is a result of clipping, so anything zoyd would suggest would be specifically to deal with clipping. Sounds to me like you DO NOT have a clipping problem, so using any method to address that problem specifically would be just as likely to cause you MORE problems. You could have some other grayscale issue that is generating pink hues, but I don't know. In a full white screen, do you see any pink hue?

The "correct" ADC values depend on which pattern you use. I suggest you PM zoyd if you want a sanity check; he has a D8000 and has tried several patterns.

Yes, Janos would zero out the movie mode settings so that he could continue to use Warm 2 (the default) instead of cool because they are EXACTLY THE SAME when zeroed. However, he also specifically stated that this was unnecessary because you can just use Cool mode and get the same result. So, don't worry about it.

Cal day/night are pretty much the same as movie mode (I think they calibrate slightly differently). That being said, I am in fact using cal night pretty much exclusively (so it doesn't hurt to try), but this should make no difference.

My biggest problem was red gain through the roof after my main board replacement. Following Janos' procedure, my ADC/WB changes are: R-GAIN = 101, B-GAIN=79, everything else is set to 128. BUT, I still needed to use the 2pt adjustments to further reduce red gain (it's set to 17). All my other white balance adjustments are very minimal, and my 10pt adjustments are no more than +/- 2. Maybe I was just lucky and have no clue what I'm talking about - at least partly possible wink.gif
post #3038 of 3298
Hiker and dannoooo,

I too am using the cal settings on my 64D7000. I found that the sub-contrast has much more effect in the cal-d/n modes than in the movie movie mode. Since I view at a lower peak output than most, I needed to move the effective 10 point regions up and I achieved that by lowering the sub-cont down significantly.

Coincidentally, I did a touch up calibration Tuesday. Here are all the values:

10/02/12012 with i1 LT profiled to i1 Pro
Normal windows 20.1 ftL; Gamma = 2.31
With SM ADC/WB sub-cont = 100, r-gain = 106, & b-gain = 120 and ADC L/H = 132/50

CAL-NIGHT

cell = 20
cont = 88
bright = 57
sharp = 10
color = 46
tint = 50/50

roff = 26
goff = 24
boff = 25
rgain = 23
ggain = 25
bgain = 27

gamma = +1

color space
R G B
r: 45, 75, 60
g: 100, 50, 0
b: 0, 15, 50
y: 40, 50, 0
c: 100, 50, 50
m: 24, 95, 15


10 point

1: 4, 4, 5
2: 1, 0, 2
3: -1, 0, 0
4: 0, 1, 0
5: -2, 1, 0
6: -1, 0, 1
7: 0, 0, 0
8: -1, 0, 0
9: 4, 0, 1
10: -2, 0, 2

Any item not listed is off.

And here are the results:






Larry
post #3039 of 3298
Thanks, Larry. Useful info.
post #3040 of 3298
Hiker and Larry
Thx for the responses
I enabled cal day/night and this time I used a 90% window for calibrating wp. Then I did a quick 2 point calibration which wasn't that far off this time ( my wife started giving me grief over spending too much time with the tv again) so I finished up with the cms and the results look pretty good
First thing I changed is I lowered the contrast 5 points thinking that may solve my pink issue... I think it may have
Another thing I noticed this time that I didn't before is that the menu items that are needed to adjust settings are changing the calibration while I do it... For example let's say I'm adjusting ire 80 in 2 point adjust. The rgb settings for that color show up below the 80% window so I can level off the colors. If I exit from the menu, green goes up slightly and red goes down slighty. Is this behavior normal? Maybe the pros dont see this when adjusting via tdm???
Makes it much harder to achieve targets

Anyway avid I put up a 100 % white and I did have a pinkish hue on the prior settings


Thx for all the help guys!
post #3041 of 3298
Sounds like you're in pretty good shape, Danny. Good to hear. Not sure if you're saying you changed contrast in the UM or SM, but a sub-contrast setting of 132 may have been part of your problem with the SM calibration. I think it's much safer to leave it at 128.

So I think you're saying that the OSD is affecting your white balance measurements in the UM. This is probably normal - I have seen some small effect as well, maybe not quite as much as you describe though. This is why it can be helpful to run through all the grayscale patterns again (without making adjustments) after calibrating to make sure everything is aligned. Based on those measurements, I usually make one more pass though the 10pt controls to fine tune. BTW, your typical "pro" calibrator would never consider touching the TDM. It's dangerous territory, reserved for only the bravest tweakers. I believe even zoyd damaged his set once or twice in there.
post #3042 of 3298
Thanx for all your help Avid...Yes I am getting close now...though i will probably continue to tweak until my wife throws me out or my tv breaks because it is in my nature to do so...Also, i am enjoying the learning experience
I would like to change the contrast when I calibrate SVM because Dynamic mode contrast is pretty high maybe even 100??? I think that may be why my Um calibration starts off un-balanced though it should be. Were you able to change contrast in SVM? How?
If I wanted to hit the TDM is there a more detailed instruction on this somewhere??? Its probably best I dont but I am curious. Also, I starting to notice Image Retention from all the calibrations. I have a faint HDMI1?DVI image in the upper right hand corner of my screen....very hard to see but its there. Samsung displays this every time you are in the UM. There is no need for it really...We all know what input we are changing. Samsung should remove it after 1 minute or altogether...I had to run slides to get rid of it.
Also, how do you know if your meter is accurate? Having a hard time with this question?
post #3043 of 3298
Is there a calibration or setting fix for this issue? My 59D8000 has issues with dark scenes. Where there's light in the picture, I see halos of shades of gray emanating in varying layers. Is that crushed blacks? Is there anything I can do?
post #3044 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

Thanx for all your help Avid...Yes I am getting close now...though i will probably continue to tweak until my wife throws me out or my tv breaks because it is in my nature to do so...Also, i am enjoying the learning experience

You're welcome. I have a lot of folks here to thank for what I know, so I'm just happy to spread the info.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

I would like to change the contrast when I calibrate SVM because Dynamic mode contrast is pretty high maybe even 100??? I think that may be why my Um calibration starts off un-balanced though it should be. Were you able to change contrast in SVM? How?

IIRC, the sub-contrast setting sort of acts like a contrast control in the SM. But by reducing it, you are reducing the upper end of the contrast range in the UM. A setting of 100 or so of sub-cont will make 95 contrast more like a setting of 70-80 (guestimates). I wouldn't drop it below 128 unless you are calibrating with a contrast setting of less than 90-95, but you can try smaler drops if you like. Honestly, if you are happy with where it is now, I would just stop there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

If I wanted to hit the TDM is there a more detailed instruction on this somewhere??? Its probably best I dont but I am curious.

No, there is no clear procedure available. I believe you also need special software and a special cable to access it. Further, there is nothing in there that you really have any need for. You would just be risking damage to the TV for no good reason. If you do find instructions (I've seen some, but will not post them - they are not as detailed as I would want), make ABSOLUTELY sure you know EXACTLY what you are doing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

Also, how do you know if your meter is accurate? Having a hard time with this question?

You don't. Some meters hold their calibration better than others, but they will all drift to some extent over time. You can probably have the manufacturer recertify it, or get it profiled against a verified accurate meter. Post in the calibration forum and see what they suggest.
post #3045 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

Ndaa75, can you tell me What exactly these settings do? I have the i1d3pro and I dont know if it is accurate out of the box...Are you saying here that you used an I1 pro to set the i1d3pro?
if so, Can I use them also or would yours be different them mine because they may run different from meter to meter?
Thx Danny

Hi dannoooo,

yes this is my correction matrix for profiling my i1DPro from my i1Pro.
using it should get you closer to a more accurate grayscale than the out of the box meter.
post #3046 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

I got around that by setting movie sub-contrast in the SM such that cell light 20, contrast 98 = 35 ftL.

Zoyd how did you do that ? samsung factory remote ?
post #3047 of 3298
Sub-contrast is available in the ADC/WB section of the normal service menu, no factory remote needed (all you do is reduce the setting until you get the desired peak white at a contrast of 98). At least I don't think setting sub-contrast in movie mode (with service remote) would do anything different than in dynamic (with normal remote).
post #3048 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvidHiker View Post

Sub-contrast is available in the ADC/WB section of the normal service menu, no factory remote needed (all you do is reduce the setting until you get the desired peak white at a contrast of 98). At least I don't think setting sub-contrast in movie mode (with service remote) would do anything different than in dynamic (with normal remote).

Hi Avid

yeah i know its available in the adc section of the sm, however movie w/b inc. movie subcontrast is in advanced-2D. wondering if zoyd managed to obtain access to this section using the samsung factory remote.
post #3049 of 3298
Are you sure movie sub-contrast is locked into the movie-specific WB? I thought it was just gains and offsets, but it's been a while since I used the service remote. Anyway, there is no way to change those settings with the service remote. To do that, you need access to the TDM which has to be done via serial cable and computer. Zoyd has done this.

I still think the regular sub-contrast setting is global (just like ADC L/H values), so it won't matter what mode you change it in because all picture modes will be affected.
post #3050 of 3298
Avid this is the question I was trying to ask you
How would I be able to set cell 20 and contrast 98 so that I can adjust sub contrast to where I need it once in the service menu ?
Once I'm in dynamic mode in svm I can't change those default values... If I use the samsung communicator and go into movie mode it's the same thing.... No way to change contrast
post #3051 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

Avid this is the question I was trying to ask you
How would I be able to set cell 20 and contrast 98 so that I can adjust sub contrast to where I need it once in the service menu ?
Once I'm in dynamic mode in svm I can't change those default values... If I use the samsung communicator and go into movie mode it's the same thing.... No way to change contrast

As I said before, the sub-contrast has more effect on the cal-d/n modes than the movie mode.

You have to do it by trial and error. That is, reduce the sub-cont in the service menu, turn off the TV, turn on the TV, and measure the results in the user movie cal mode. Do this until you achieve your goal.


EDIT: Whoops. Meant to say cal not movie.

Larry
Edited by LarryInRI - 10/9/12 at 6:40pm
post #3052 of 3298
Quote:

Zoyd how did you do that ? samsung factory remote ?

2d menu using the TDM. Movie mode sub-contrast can only be adjusted from this menu
post #3053 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by ndaa75 View Post

Hi dannoooo,
yes this is my correction matrix for profiling my i1DPro from my i1Pro.
using it should get you closer to a more accurate grayscale than the out of the box meter.

Thanx Ndaa75! I will try it out...
post #3054 of 3298
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

2d menu using the TDM. Movie mode sub-contrast can only be adjusted from this menu

zoyd, out of curiosity have you tried a factory remote and if so what menus are available with it ?
post #3055 of 3298
I've used the factory remote emulator and it enables extended versions of menus Control and SVC. I haven't found any of the extended options useful. The Advanced menu option is also shown but trying to enter it with the usual unlock key '0000' does not work, it is this menu that you can access using the TDM to adjust movie mode and turn off LCE. There is a neat method of building your own IR factory remote here, I don't know if the advanced menu is accessible with that method.
post #3056 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

Avid this is the question I was trying to ask you
How would I be able to set cell 20 and contrast 98 so that I can adjust sub contrast to where I need it once in the service menu ?
Once I'm in dynamic mode in svm I can't change those default values... If I use the samsung communicator and go into movie mode it's the same thing.... No way to change contrast

Yep, just do as Larry suggests - try it with a cal mode and use trial and error. Forget about adjusting locked settings! You already have a sub-sontrast control available to you, and that is the one in the ADC/WB menu. That's all you need.
post #3057 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

I've used the factory remote emulator and it enables extended versions of menus Control and SVC. I haven't found any of the extended options useful. The Advanced menu option is also shown but trying to enter it with the usual unlock key '0000' does not work, it is this menu that you can access using the TDM to adjust movie mode and turn off LCE. There is a neat method of building your own IR factory remote here, I don't know if the advanced menu is accessible with that method.
Zoyd

How do you enter the code even if you had it?
post #3058 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvidHiker View Post

Yep, just do as Larry suggests - try it with a cal mode and use trial and error. Forget about adjusting locked settings! You already have a sub-sontrast control available to you, and that is the one in the ADC/WB menu. That's all you need.
Thx Avid and Larry , will do
Should i shoot for 35ftl as suggested in hopes that I will achieve peak at 30-33 ftl with contrast set to my liking?
post #3059 of 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannoooo View Post

Zoyd
How do you enter the code even if you had it?

It used to be the key sequence 0+0+0+0+Enter to unlock the advanced menu but all it does now is bring you back to the SM.
post #3060 of 3298
Hey Guys, any idea where i can find 98, 99, 107, and 108% white window slides? I have a Dynamic range function on Calman that shows me where the clipping is occurring but i need these extra slides.....
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