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Lab Gruppen FP14000 clone amplifiers - Page 57

post #1681 of 4397
Good deal - thanks! For some reason, I thought some amps didn't like to be powered up w/o a speaker load connected to each of the outputs. I suppose I could always put a dummy load on the unused side w/ the gain down if I was that worried about it.

Sounds like I may be taking the plunge on one of these soon then. And yea, adding another LMS is in the back of my mind sometime down the road, and that's why I'm thinking about going this way now vs. an EP4000 or RMX2450/4050/5050.

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #1682 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

+1
Plus it makes upgrading to that second Ultra that much easier when the time comes!

One sub is only a temporary thing. Just sayin'
post #1683 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

One sub is only a temporary thing. Just sayin'

This is true.
post #1684 of 4397
SO my 5 FP10000qs came in, and I was pumped... I loaded them into the equipment rack ( 4 for the rack, one as spare) got them all fired up, and first amp out of the gate was showing VPL lights, with low, distorted output F@#$... went on to test the other 4, and one other amp ch, 4 has VPL issues... If anyone here can assit I'd appreciate it. I've already heard from johnson, and he sent a couple pictures for measurments points that he wants some values from... I'm not very technical, so I'm either going to try it, or take it to someone who can. I've asked for a straight amp exchange even if I have to pay the shipping... we'll see where this goes...
post #1685 of 4397
Awww. That's a bummer. Good luck with the repairs.
post #1686 of 4397
Try running them at idle for a couple of days (no input signal) and see if the VPL circuit resets.
post #1687 of 4397
I have one FP10000 that has the VPL issues and youre not going to get too far with Johnson would be my bet. I would take it to a local music shop and have them fix it.

Mine clips about 30% early compared to the other and he responded to me a couple of times asking simple random questions about how I had it wired and then just slowly stopped responding after he asked me to clip my subs and record it so he could see it. I'm sorry but I'm not going to intentionally push my subs with clipping amps just to show him that what I'm telling him is going on when they are turned up.

From what I've read he will send the parts if you can track down the problem so taking it to someone should be doable but not an exchange!

Think I'm going to sell my 10000s and try the 14000s just because all the problems we are having with the 10000s. Its becoming more and more the norm to have a faulty 10000. And, I would bet he is very aware of this too! I am in no hurry since it doesnt clip until well above reference but it shouldnt be doing it at all.

Oh, and mine is channel 1 if that makes any difference.
post #1688 of 4397
The parts to repair my 10000q turning off and on should be here today. Will keep ya posted.
post #1689 of 4397
I've contacted a guy who recently just left a large sound and lighting house here in town, so he should be more than capable of looks at and repairing this amp. I'm hoping he's willing to take this on like a small challenge, cause I am certinaly not capable. I hope as you say that johnson is willing to support with parts at least, but again having a whole dead amp, I'm hoping I might raise the history bar, and see if they will sent a substitute amp since ALL four channels are exhibiting VPL issue. AS for the other amp, it's actually only ch 4 that has an issue... I have to get johnson the serila numbers, and the voltage values he's requested and see what happens. in the meantime I'll be shopping for deals on the real deal, and I'll be flushing these clones out of my invenotory - so if anyone is interested in even the "working" version - pm me... I thought I'd take the change on some more, and I got burned... there are 3 fully working units that I need to use twice on two shows. Sept 16th my production season is done and they will be available for purchase. I think I have $1000.00 into them landed (after duty, taxes and shipping) in Canada each.
thanks
S Presley
www.bssproductions.com
post #1690 of 4397
Thread Starter 
Have you tried disabling the vpl for that channel? does it make any difference?
post #1691 of 4397
I finally got around to setting up my FP10000 I bought from another member here at AVS. Can anyone point me in the direction of how the switches on the back are configured? I want to run one input (sub out on my receiver of course) and 2 outputs. So far I can get it to work by outputting channel one and channel three, but unless I'm reading something wrong that appears to be bridging outputs 1 and 2 / 3 and 4
post #1692 of 4397
Hi Not, how do I disable the vpl circuit, I haven't looked at the dip switches yet ( today), is there an off, or do I just set it high?
Thanks
Sp
post #1693 of 4397
Wow Heywood, so sorry to hear about the amps...I won't buy another and consider myself lucky that I have one that's working great so far.

Hope Mr, Johnson makes it right for you...you've already bought 7 amps from him.
It's so sad that they have terrible QC with them.

Good luck
post #1694 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heywood1969 View Post

I've contacted a guy who recently just left a large sound and lighting house here in town, so he should be more than capable of looks at and repairing this amp. I'm hoping he's willing to take this on like a small challenge, cause I am certinaly not capable. I hope as you say that johnson is willing to support with parts at least, but again having a whole dead amp, I'm hoping I might raise the history bar, and see if they will sent a substitute amp since ALL four channels are exhibiting VPL issue. AS for the other amp, it's actually only ch 4 that has an issue... I have to get johnson the serila numbers, and the voltage values he's requested and see what happens. in the meantime I'll be shopping for deals on the real deal, and I'll be flushing these clones out of my invenotory - so if anyone is interested in even the "working" version - pm me... I thought I'd take the change on some more, and I got burned... there are 3 fully working units that I need to use twice on two shows. Sept 16th my production season is done and they will be available for purchase. I think I have $1000.00 into them landed (after duty, taxes and shipping) in Canada each.
thanks
S Presley
www.bssproductions.com

I'm purchasing one from ya, done and done.

This would bring me up another 8400 peak watts to 35,400 total peak watts; which I desperately need for the reasons I mentioned on page 56.
Not only that, I'm curious to see what these clones can actually do...
post #1695 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heywood1969 View Post

I hope as you say that johnson is willing to support with parts at least, but again having a whole dead amp, I'm hoping I might raise the history bar, and see if they will sent a substitute amp since ALL four channels are exhibiting VPL issue.

I hope so too buddy. It always puts a smile on my face to see guys put their money where their mouth is, but it pains me to see when issues like these arise. I wish someone would step up to be a stateside POC/Distributor that could stock a few hundred of these at a time, deal with all of the QA issues at once and send all of the defective units back to Sanway for exchange/correction. It obviously would be a significant logical/money investment, but seems like a more economical approach vs. dealing with units and people on an individual basis. Guess their would also be the potential of pissing off LG and potentially running into some patent issues (maybe?) as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BassThatHz View Post

I'm purchasing one from ya, done and done.

This would bring me up another 8400 peak watts to 35,400 total peak watts; which I desperately need for the reasons I mentioned on page 56.
Not only that, I'm curious to see what these clones can actually do...

Awwwww….yeah. BTHz stepping it up! Man, mad respect for your bass addition, but there is no way I could have a setup like yours. What do you have, like 8 different types of subs or something like that? The OCD in me would drive me absolutely insane…everything has to be uniform and symmetrical, or it would bug me…

Also, how the he!! do you implement everything you have at once? I think I saw a DCX2496 in one of your video’s, does that help integrate all of those subs to play nicely with each other?
post #1696 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgse3 View Post

I finally got around to setting up my FP10000 I bought from another member here at AVS. Can anyone point me in the direction of how the switches on the back are configured? I want to run one input (sub out on my receiver of course) and 2 outputs. So far I can get it to work by outputting channel one and channel three, but unless I'm reading something wrong that appears to be bridging outputs 1 and 2 / 3 and 4

Man, I wish I could help you out, but I'm still trying to figure out the rear switches on my Clone as well. I pretty much have them all in the down position from when I was originally dealing with a hummm issue upon inital receipt of the unit. Now, that I've gotten rid of the hummm, I might as well ask you guys what the optimal settings for the rear switches on the FP14K are?

I know when I had my inital hummm issue when I adjusted a few switches in the rear and the hummm would intensify or decrease depending which switch I toggled. The only switch I specifically knew the operation/function of was the "birdge mode" switch. I'm pretty much a pro amp virgin, so go easy on me...
post #1697 of 4397
Heywood what is the VPL settings set to on the amps? Just asking..
Matter of fact if you could just take a picture it would be easier..
post #1698 of 4397
^^^ Those switches on the back need to be aligned properly or you will most certainly have issues. They aint there to look pretty...
post #1699 of 4397
Heywood, I'll likely take one of the working ones as well. Drop me a pm when you are ready to sell. I just another fp14000 and so far it's working properly as well as the one I got from you.
post #1700 of 4397
Hey Guys, thanks I appreciate you "stepping up".. like I say the 100% working one's (when they come available sept 16th) will have two shows on them on monitors only, so you'll know that they have been working. So far the count is 3 fully working, let's hope it stays that way for the next 2 weeks. I'll contact you when my show run is done - I've kept all the boxes. I'm hoping to find a local tech to support me and maybe get these other two sorted out, and I'm still hoping for johnson to step up and replace that completely dead one. VPL light on all 4 channels... BTW - I left the "dead one" on for about 8 hours last night in my garage hoping to reset the vpl circuit like bossa suggested, I'll try it tonight to see what's up... VPL settings are at 121V, and sensitivity db is set to 32 db. I was driving them with the dbx drive rack 480 ch 1 ( and I switched it to channel two and three to remove the doubt that ch 1 had an output issue) It was powering EV xw15 floor monitors, the output sounded distorted and low as opposed to the other amps which showed plenty of green led activity and output.... The vpl light lights up, with no green led activity on the "hurt" amp... I have a youtube video, I'll post it, and post the link here...
Edited by Heywood1969 - 8/23/12 at 9:34am
post #1701 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heywood1969 View Post

I've contacted a guy who recently just left a large sound and lighting house here in town, so he should be more than capable of looks at and repairing this amp. I'm hoping he's willing to take this on like a small challenge, cause I am certinaly not capable. I hope as you say that johnson is willing to support with parts at least, but again having a whole dead amp, I'm hoping I might raise the history bar, and see if they will sent a substitute amp since ALL four channels are exhibiting VPL issue. AS for the other amp, it's actually only ch 4 that has an issue... I have to get johnson the serila numbers, and the voltage values he's requested and see what happens. in the meantime I'll be shopping for deals on the real deal, and I'll be flushing these clones out of my invenotory - so if anyone is interested in even the "working" version - pm me... I thought I'd take the change on some more, and I got burned... there are 3 fully working units that I need to use twice on two shows. Sept 16th my production season is done and they will be available for purchase. I think I have $1000.00 into them landed (after duty, taxes and shipping) in Canada each.
thanks
S Presley
www.bssproductions.com

How much for the working 10000Q?
post #1702 of 4397
A working 10K is going to be 1K... that's what it cost me to ship here (Ottawa, Canada), and pay the shipping and 6.5% duty and taxes... it was actually 1107.68 but I'll eat the 100.00 for the 2 weeks of use smile.gif
BTW - I drew a representation of the dip switch settings...



youtube video should be up in a few minutes...

http://youtu.be/fSejk4xFPOY
Edited by Heywood1969 - 8/23/12 at 10:46am
post #1703 of 4397
So Johnson had me measure some values on the boards, and there are issues a foot... Getting negative dc values where there should be plus values, and getting no values where there should be values.... Stay tuned as to what hoops I'll be asked to do shortly... I put a spreadsheet together for Johnson , hope he can sort this out and I can get this turd firing on all four cylinders smile.gif
post #1704 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

I hope so too buddy. It always puts a smile on my face to see guys put their money where their mouth is, but it pains me to see when issues like these arise. I wish someone would step up to be a stateside POC/Distributor that could stock a few hundred of these at a time, deal with all of the QA issues at once and send all of the defective units back to Sanway for exchange/correction. It obviously would be a significant logical/money investment, but seems like a more economical approach vs. dealing with units and people on an individual basis. Guess their would also be the potential of pissing off LG and potentially running into some patent issues (maybe?) as well.

Awwwww….yeah. BTHz stepping it up! Man, mad respect for your bass addition, but there is no way I could have a setup like yours. What do you have, like 8 different types of subs or something like that? The OCD in me would drive me absolutely insane…everything has to be uniform and symmetrical, or it would bug me…
Also, how the he!! do you implement everything you have at once? I think I saw a DCX2496 in one of your video’s, does that help integrate all of those subs to play nicely with each other?


Only a few people can follow my system diagram, it is pretty eccentric. WAY beyond your atypical home configuration. It goes something like this...

My source is a PC via a Xonar HDAV, analog RCA-outs to the multi-pre-in's on the UMC-1.
The UMC-1 is my pre-amp for now... which I then split both LR stereo outputs, one stereo pair to my Rotel monoblocks with FMOD-150 HP's and then directly on to the B&W HF in's,
the 2nd stereo pair goes to all the woofers/subs, this is connected to my BFD for RCA to XLR conversion.
[I'm planning on buying an XSP-1 soon, which will do that instead and at much higher fidelity too I might add; thus no longer needing the BFD for that task.]
The BFD also chops off the high bits above 5khz (high-bass). That then goes into two bridged XTI 4K's which have their own XO's and EQ's which feed the LR B&W LF's in dual mono (2+2ohm),
each of those XTI's are daisy-chained in dual-mono/stereo to the DEQ, (this is where the DCX would come in, more on that later), I have an ECM mic connected to the DEQ for RTA monitoring as well,
so after the dynamic EQ'ing and further choping of high bits(sub-bass), this then goes into the iTech 8k, which has it's own XO/DSP/dynamics processors, that powers the LMS (1ohm) and the SDX's (1ohm), this is then stereo daisy-chained to two EP4K's,
one feeds the Daytons in dual-parellel stereo 4ohm, the other EP4K feeds the Mal-21's (which for now is in input-parellel mode at dual 4ohm out).
The other 5 channel outs on the UMC-1 go to my other rotel amps, for the center channel and surrounds for a 7.9+ config in movie-mode (HDMI digital) and 2.9+ config in music-mode (analog hard-wire).
The XSP-1 would be an extension to the UMC-1, I'd hook both of them up together, the UMC-1 becoming my movie-DAC, the XONAR remaining the music-DAC.
So then... purchasing the FP10KQ would allow all 10 subs to finally be on descrete/independent/balanced channels for proper EQing/XO'ing/Delay etc etc, the DCX achieving that and LFE-mixing and would also allow me to preserve the stereo-bass signal to all 10 subs (5L + 5R) , and additionally implement real XO's for the non-crown amps that need it.
[Damn, I'm going to need a zillion more cables to make that all happen.]


It probably goes without saying that I did it this way specifically TO achieve WAY beyond your atypical, Best-Buy / Average-Joe's receiver-type setup. Because if it didn't sound better this way... why would we do it? wink.gif

For the most part, my system is 100% symmetrically-balanced in placement and stereo imaging BTW, with one exception, that being that I only have one LMS up front right now.
I have 5 different styles of subs, 4 styles of which are currently in-use; so I supose you could say that from that perspective it is not "purely" homogeneous biggrin.gif
Edited by BassThatHz - 8/23/12 at 9:41pm
post #1705 of 4397
H cool.gif L Y C R A P B A T M A N That's one hell of a signal chain. Absolutely no beer allowed when troubleshooting. biggrin.gif
post #1706 of 4397
Here's a pic of how my dip switches are setup on both my 14k's. smile.gif

234376de.jpg
post #1707 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by edoggrc51 View Post

Here's a pic of how my dip switches are setup on both my 14k's. smile.gif
234376de.jpg

edoggrc51,

You're running at MAX...does that not worry you?
Just asking.

thanks
post #1708 of 4397
shouldnt, his subs are capable of taking it all, and the amp is designed to operate at full potential anyways...
post #1709 of 4397
I just ordered 2x FTW21's and have a 10000Q...could I run those at full tilt too?
thanks
post #1710 of 4397
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

shouldnt, his subs are capable of taking it all, and the amp is designed to operate at full potential anyways...
+1
They've been running like that for months now without any problems. smile.gif
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