Lab Gruppen FP14000 clone amplifiers - Page 4

I know that not believes that Sanway builds the amps he's buying. I do not.

There are lots of companies that will sell the same amplifier. They do not build them either. They're all in the same neighborhood in Guangzhou. Here are some of them...

Guangzhou Gisen

http://gisen.en.alibaba.com/

Sanway

http://sanway.en.alibaba.com/

Guangzhou Ho Young

http://hyaudio.en.alibaba.com/

La8 Green (ya gotta love this name, eh?)

http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j0...er-FP1000-.jpg

Hy Pro Audio

http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j0...FP-10000Q-.jpg

Guangzhou Hao Yang Pro Audio Manufactory (they sell BOSE as well)

http://www.topfreebiz.com/company/23...anufactory.htm

Or, you can go to China Department Store and buy an actual Lab Gruppen tagged FP+ series amp, complete with on board Nomadlink, for $1600 + frt

http://www.chinesedepartmentstore.co...oducts_id/8541

Same goes for Crown, QSC and many other brands.

So, asking about any other 'Sanway amp' is an impossible question. Like myself and not, you just have to ask your questions of them and, in the final analysis, order one, tear into it and test it. It could be virtually any amplifier with a different face plate on it.

Bosso

Being pegged and having a 1 to 1 ratio are not one and the same.

Explain.

Bosso

I was going by Hawkins post and Sanway's website. It provides some info, but to be honest, and I'm not familiar enough with electronics to clearly identify what is the basis of "their" design for the P1800. Thus my question.

Understood. It's just not possible to answer because Sanway does not always tell you what you're getting accurately, and sometimes, quite frankly, they don't know themselves.

Bosso

Bosso, I have been meaning to PM you on this matter but since you showed up again I figured I would ask it here.


I have got two arrays of gen 1 maelx's, I can either get the cabs to 2 ohms or 8ohms based on my VC config(which are 8ohms per VC). I've got the two cabs wired in series to 4 ohms with a ma5050 bridged. I have been looking at these amps but I really don't want to risk frying my drivers and playing around with winisd and 9000 watts it looks like I over run the xmax pretty early(20hz) and then hit xlim just below 5hz.

Basically what I am wondering and I think other people are wondering is aren't we running the likelihood of killing our drivers in sealed configs or does the air suspension basically save the drivers?

Nvm

1 Chinese yuan does not equal 1 American dollar. According to XE.com the Yuan is worth 0.153877 USD. But because the Yuan is pegged, the ratio between the the USD and the Yuan remains the same as the USD goes up and down. I.e the value of the Yuan (i.e. the ratio) does not change, but the ratio is not 1 to 1.

It's a good question, but not one that pertains to me.

I have ALWAYS built sealed subs with boxes sized to limit excursion, so the only way to 'fry' them is to apply way more continuous power than the drivers can handle for a long period of time.

For those who've chosen to use much bigger boxes, less power should be required, but it's much harder to find just the right power plant that will give you the most system performance, but not tear the drivers apart on unexpected transients.

I wish I could be more specific, but I have no experience with large box/power balancing and in the end, if you have 'amp headroom', it can certainly be abused with the wrong person at the remote.

Bosso

Thanks Hawkins, I was not aware about that aspect of the culture, very interesting. Also, thanks for looking into the P1800...it seems too good to be true (or should I say good?)...at least from this side of the pond.

Don't tell you pay for your porn too?

nvm

Notnyt, you 'should' be able to get customized fans if you ask for them. If working with a factory, it shouldn't be a problem, just be specific about how and what is the best way to customize and achieve similar airflow.

BTW, I could be wrong, but most factories don't answer the phone 24/7 and have a home phone connection with the office....

So what freq do you aim for then in order to limit excursion, knowing you probably 3hz or 0hz. I don't have the winisd parameters for the tumult so I can't play around with it now.


That kinda leads me into my next question, looking at chaz's ratings for some of the amps he has tested, what do you believe these 14000's are capable of delivering in watts? Nots running a 120x30amp line so the most watts he can put out is 3600 correct even switching over to 240 gets us to 7200. So where does the extra 7k of watts come in, is it banked in the capacitors?

How about just the original spec'd fans, oh wait this is a rip-off so you get the cheapest sourced screamers.

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=u...urce=undefined

Make sure you click MAX on that chart to get long term view. Note that the peg is no longer fixed. The Chinese allow a slow stepped change in yuan value. It should be worth far more, and sadly, our dollar worth far less.

Limit excursion @ 0hz ? lol

About the 14kw rating, it's a magic trick called false advertising afaik

Lab-gruppen also advertise them as 14kw with a 16a @ 240v current draw limit. Despite the false advertising these amps are some of the strongest money can buy, even as clones.

has the weight been measured yet?

I spoke to him at length.
I think its a factory. I called some competitors and they confirmed this.

Not---You can get the fans customized. Just tell him what you think is best.
For a group buy, we can get any of his product line at wholesale price(even better price). Also, for the prices I listed earlier for bulk buys, the bottom wholesale price can still be negotiated, probably about 20$ more max. Also, it doesn't have to be the same product, it can be different products mixed together to achieve large quantities.

For AB, they can't get the watts that high, which is why the p1800 is class H, but the p1200 is class AB.

I spoke to him about the amp not muting under high temps. Thats what happened in the 2 ohm, 2 channel test, right? Well, he said that the amp should mute itself when it gets hot, but he wasn't associating that with the vpl having a problem.
He then said, it can do 2 ohms, but don't do it for long and heavy periods. Best to run it not at 2 ohms.

i bought my projector from a kid in japan who ran across the street and bought it at a shopping mall and then dhl'd it over here...but some of these chinese guys are hilarious.

from the hyaudio.com website. i'm not kidding, it is actually on their homepage.



his apartment is on the right. his bad photoshop "distribution center" is on the left complete with a purple delivery truck!

http://www.hyaudio.com/en/index.asp

What 2 maybe 3wks.. Based on Bosso's comments I think it would be advisable to hold off on a GB just yet as many may not have the disposable income to "buy spares" when their units bake. I commend you offering to back this but I think it may be in haste to jump right into another order.

Now that is seriously F*ing hilarious. What are they shipping Teletubbies in that purp box.

It doesn't work that way. As your box size decreases, the driver reaches a max excursion point, which means the curve flattens out. So, from a certain frequency down, the excursion is flat.

As far as the amps and what they'll pull from a 120V-30A home run, I don't get into all that amplifier testing stuff. I think the methodology results in largely useless information as far as how an amp will perform with dynamic program source... especially with very large transients to 3 Hz.

I will say that they'll kick the snot outta any amp I've tried under $1k... period. They are also 2RU, 1/3 the weight, 3" less depth and twice as efficient as a Marathon or RMX 5050 or similar big iron amp.

I like the green aspect. Not because it's currently a popular catch phrase for climate change imbeciles. I've been energy conscious all of my adult life and I like that less materials and energy are used to build one, ship one and use one. It's just smart.

I have 2 FP9k clones in my rack for 9 or 10 months and have pounded them. I tried one in a 20A home run and one in a 30A home run. Part of max performance is to use a proper power cord with a 30A twist lock plug. If you aren't going to do that, don't waste time and $$ putting in a 30A home run for these amps.

I just don't like that they are a blatant rip off of the Lab stuff. Morality has nothing to do with it. It's a legal issue. I don't want to be hassled by anyone for the amplifiers I use to power my subwoofer system.

Bosso

Not so in my case, although the Lab clones I've tried are from a year ago. All of mine used 60 cfm Sunon fans. I'm not aware that it gets any better than that as far as amp cooling fans goes.

As my Chinese friends love to say "Is top quality, so you not worry!". But, as not will attest to, the Chinese also love to change parts specs and manufacturers with no notice, including a recent switcharoo done on thousands of Harman products to black market components (according to a reliable source), so I don't know what Sanway is selling these days as far as what fans are being used.

Bosso

When I spoke to him about the fans, he said something about having to import fans from taiwan to get something better.

Can you elaborate on what happened with the Harman products?

Exactly the problem. I know a few people and have read enough stories of prototypes and 1st runs being to spec., and then the old switch-a-roo. A penny saved is a penny earned. We all know how that turned out for the MFW amps, and the latest being the new Peavey amps with a years worth of delays and finally shipping re-worked and re-boxed from the factory. It's sad when you hear about large companies that don't even bother to employ a couple people to monitor the production of their product.

Anyhow back to these amps, do you think the Sanway's are the LG factory side-selling or are the internals different? Have to say it is a hell of a lot of wattage for the money.