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The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX12 Model Owner's Thread - Page 567

post #16981 of 18955
^^
As I already indicated in the other thread you started and asked the same question, the master volume can go to +18db. If you purchased a used/demo unit more than likely the "Volume Limit" setting (p. 94 OM) is set to -20db; however, your best bet is to simply reset the microprocessor (p. 129 OM) to return all settings to their mfr defaults.
post #16982 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikelleen View Post

Just biught a new in box 3312ci . On close out for $600.00 ar RC Whilley! Definately NIB, never opened. They had it in their computer in located at their wharehouse, and I asked to see any Denon stock they had available. Luckily I was talking to a senior manager who saw this last one and said he'd give me a deal because a salesman there had made a mistake sending me on a wild goose chase to a remote store to get a 2312 they had shown as in stock at that location.

Long story short, I got a great deal!

:-)

Yes, these XX12 models have been selling on clearance now for quite some time and are good buys as long as still available.
post #16983 of 18955
Bou
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
As I already indicated in the other thread you started and asked the same question, the master volume can go to +18db. If you purchased a used/demo unit more than likely the "Volume Limit" setting (p. 94 OM) is set to -20db; however, your best bet is to simply reset the microprocessor (p. 129 OM) to return all settings to their mfr defaults.

Bought it new and max is -20. So I have to reset it and start over to adjust that?
post #16984 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrlz View Post

Bought it new and max is -20. So I have to reset it and start over to adjust that?

There is a setting for that... choices are -20, 0, no limit (or something like that). Look around and you'll find it.
post #16985 of 18955
While I'm in here there is a strange issue with both my 3312 and 2112 regarding attenuated mute. I setup both these AVR's to match how I had used my 1910, that is, with mute level set to -20db, so I can hear what's going on during commercials when watching TV or answer the phone and talk to ppl when listening to anything else. Always worked well with th1 1910 and our Yammie in the other room.

But on the 3312 (and I think also the 2112 in the BR) when there is a change in the signal the mute level goes to full silent. This happens when a TV or cable station goes to commercial break, or if I change tracks on a DVD or skip tracks on a CD. Pressing mute twice returns the mute level to -20. It's not a major issue, just annoying. Any idea what's going on? Do I need to reset the processor? Or is this not a bug but a "feature"?
post #16986 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrlz View Post

Bou
Bought it new and max is -20. So I have to reset it and start over to adjust that?

Where did you buy it? Did it appear new? Check the Volume Limit setting as I noted and if it's set to -20db, and you didn't set it there, then you likely don't have a "new" model which is why I would reset the microprocessor just to be sure all settings are restored to factory level.
post #16987 of 18955
I'm hoping one of you smart guys can help me out since my comprehension skills are not working this week.

I got an AVR-2312 refurb this week to replace an AVR-988 I bought four years ago. Nothing wrong with the 988, except there aren't enough HDMI inputs on it (there really wasn't back then either, but I got a deal on it).

Anyway, I've torn apart my whole set-up and replaced cables that were too long, upgraded a few components, and finally figured how to properly configure a couple of things I had wrong for four years. I haven't run the Audissey yet since I still have a few connection problems and questions:

1. I still have a LaserDisc player in my set-up. I am using the PVR input using analog composite video, analog L/R, and Optical digital inputs. I'm gold when I'm playing a disc with digital audio, but there is no sound on discs with analog only audio. I've played with the settings on the LD, but it seems I can have digital or analog audio on an input, but not both. The LD has two video and audio outputs, so I guess as a work-around I could have an LD Digital and an LD Analog setup, but I don't want to burn up two inputs for one device. Worked fine on the old receiver. Any thoughts?

2. I have an HTPC with an HDMI output. The AVR recognizes it during the boot process, but loses the signal once Windows starts. Worked fine on the old receiver. Any thoughts?

3. Am I right to assume "sparklies " on an HDMI input indicates that the cable is bad? The signal on the BluRay when the movie is stopped shows faint sparkles in the background with an intermittent flash, like the cable is loose. However once the movie starts, everything is OK. Replace the cable or bad HDMI jack?

4. Is is me or is the black level on the menus more like charcoal gray than black? Even the boot screen background on the HTPC is charcoal, not black like on a computer monitor.

Thanks to anyone who can point me in the right direction, otherwise it might take me years to figure it out on my own (like a problem I had with my digital turntable).

Bob
post #16988 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

There was a firmware update last May to resolve a similar issue on the 1912 and 2112CI as noted in post #6 of this thread. Check Denon's website to see if there is a repair facility in your local area that is able to update the firmware on the 1712 (as not all can).
When referencing a post, it's going to generally always be better to use the actual post # rather than the page number as there is an account setting that can set the number of posts/page anywhere from 10-100 posts/page (eg. this is only page 170 based on the setting of 100 posts/page that I'm using and both posts are on the same page).

When using the optical input on the AVR, you'll note that from the label on the jack (see image below) it defaults to TV, so either select the TV input on your remote ....





or "assign" the optical input to another source name (p. 70).



jdsmoothie, thanks for all the info and the tip about using the post # rather than the page. I almost included it.

I found a repair facility very close by. It's an electronics store. Is it a fast process to have the firmware updated? Would I most likely have to leave the AVR there for the day(s) or could they do it really quick while I waited?
post #16989 of 18955
It all depends on the workload of that particular repair shop. Most likely want you to drop it off and pick it up a few days later while others will let you drop it off and pick it up a short time later that same day.
post #16990 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by moorerobt View Post

I'm hoping one of you smart guys can help me out since my comprehension skills are not working this week.

I got an AVR-2312 refurb this week to replace an AVR-988 I bought four years ago. Nothing wrong with the 988, except there aren't enough HDMI inputs on it (there really wasn't back then either, but I got a deal on it).

Anyway, I've torn apart my whole set-up and replaced cables that were too long, upgraded a few components, and finally figured how to properly configure a couple of things I had wrong for four years. I haven't run the Audissey yet since I still have a few connection problems and questions:

1. I still have a LaserDisc player in my set-up. I am using the PVR input using analog composite video, analog L/R, and Optical digital inputs. I'm gold when I'm playing a disc with digital audio, but there is no sound on discs with analog only audio. I've played with the settings on the LD, but it seems I can have digital or analog audio on an input, but not both. The LD has two video and audio outputs, so I guess as a work-around I could have an LD Digital and an LD Analog setup, but I don't want to burn up two inputs for one device. Worked fine on the old receiver. Any thoughts?

2. I have an HTPC with an HDMI output. The AVR recognizes it during the boot process, but loses the signal once Windows starts. Worked fine on the old receiver. Any thoughts?

3. Am I right to assume "sparklies " on an HDMI input indicates that the cable is bad? The signal on the BluRay when the movie is stopped shows faint sparkles in the background with an intermittent flash, like the cable is loose. However once the movie starts, everything is OK. Replace the cable or bad HDMI jack?

4. Is is me or is the black level on the menus more like charcoal gray than black? Even the boot screen background on the HTPC is charcoal, not black like on a computer monitor.

Thanks to anyone who can point me in the right direction, otherwise it might take me years to figure it out on my own (like a problem I had with my digital turntable).

Bob

1. Although the audio should default to the analog input when there is no digital input and when the INPUT MODE is set to "Auto", you may have to change the INPUT MODE to "Analog" to get it work correctly. Another option as you suggest is to set each up under a different source name.

2. http://www.avsforum.com/t/1334369/the-official-denon-avr-xx12-model-owners-thread/0_100#user_L122.

3. Sometimes, yes. Although on a BDP first try setting the "Deep Color Output" setting to OFF.
post #16991 of 18955
Is it possible for the 2112 to turn on a connected HDMI device? My ST30 doesn't appear to have a network standby mode so my Roomie Remote for iOS cannot turn it on. The only other solution I could think of would be for the 2112 to be able to turn it on via CEC. But all I can find is the ability to turn off devices, not turn them on. Any other work arounds possible?

I feel like this question might have been asked before but for the life of me, I can't find the respective post.
post #16992 of 18955
Although using HDMI-CEC will generally work turning devices in the chain OFF, it doesn't always work to turn them back on again. You may want to consider a smart power strip.

http://www.amazon.com/Smart-Strip-Protector-Autoswitching-Technology/dp/B0006PUDQK
post #16993 of 18955
Thank you. I think that's what I will try rather than invest in a whole lot of IR add ons.
post #16994 of 18955
Am I right in saying that after doing the Audyssey setup you can't change the level of a particular channel and still be able to use Audyssey MultEQ XT / Dynamic EQ? The reason I ask is that my sub is quite boomy and I'd like to reduce the level of that channel but the manual says if you change any speaker settings after running Audyssey setup you have to do the setup again and can't then use the Audyssey EQ. Also something I'm a bit confused about, I set my speaker levels to 75db using a sound meter before I ran the Audyssey setup, that calibration was done with the receiver volume control at 0db as you'd expect. To me that suggests that you shouldn't then get a volume > 75db on the sound level meter unless you turn the receiver volume up > 0db. Why is it then when watching a movie the sound level regularly exceeds 80db even with the receiver volume at between -15 and -20db? It doesn't make sense to me because shouldn't 0db = reference level = 75db so why is -15db on the receiver producing sound levels far greater than 75db? I have the UK 1912 model by the way which I believe is the equivalent of the US 2112 model as mine has Audyssey MultEQ XT smile.gif

Thanks
post #16995 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by zAndy12 View Post

Am I right in saying that after doing the Audyssey setup you can't change the level of a particular channel and still be able to use Audyssey MultEQ XT / Dynamic EQ? The reason I ask is that my sub is quite boomy and I'd like to reduce the level of that channel but the manual says if you change any speaker settings after running Audyssey setup you have to do the setup again and can't then use the Audyssey EQ. Also something I'm a bit confused about, I set my speaker levels to 75db using a sound meter before I ran the Audyssey setup, that calibration was done with the receiver volume control at 0db as you'd expect. To me that suggests that you shouldn't then get a volume > 75db on the sound level meter unless you turn the receiver volume up > 0db. Why is it then when watching a movie the sound level regularly exceeds 80db even with the receiver volume at between -15 and -20db? It doesn't make sense to me because shouldn't 0db = reference level = 75db so why is -15db on the receiver producing sound levels far greater than 75db? I have the UK 1912 model by the way which I believe is the equivalent of the US 2112 model as mine has Audyssey MultEQ XT smile.gif

Thanks

nope. Audyssey works just fine with level changes. On my receiver a little box around the word Audyssey goes away to indicate I've departed from the autosetup values, but everything works just fine. I had my sub about 2.5 dB below autosetup for quite awhile until room rearrangement (I assume) eliminated whatever anomaliy was bothering me, and now I can run it like the setup routine sets it. But either way I always had full Audyssey acccess including DEQ and DVol, plus the ability to experiment with Audyssey flat and bypass front left and right modes, each of which was audibly different.

The 75 dB at 0 on the master volume is set using a test tone at a level that is way below "just as loud as freaking possible." If 75 dB is the proper calibration level, then the test tone muct be at -30 dBFS, and at 0 dBFS (as loud as freaking possible) the sound will be 39 dB louder than the test tone. Theaters and mixing stages calibrate to the same result but using a test tone at -20 dBFS, so they set all speaker sat 85 dB (surrounds are a bit different because theyh ave multiples.)
Edited by JHAz - 1/27/13 at 10:16am
post #16996 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by zAndy12 View Post

Am I right in saying that after doing the Audyssey setup you can't change the level of a particular channel and still be able to use Audyssey MultEQ XT / Dynamic EQ? The reason I ask is that my sub is quite boomy and I'd like to reduce the level of that channel but the manual says if you change any speaker settings after running Audyssey setup you have to do the setup again and can't then use the Audyssey EQ. Also something I'm a bit confused about, I set my speaker levels to 75db using a sound meter before I ran the Audyssey setup, that calibration was done with the receiver volume control at 0db as you'd expect. To me that suggests that you shouldn't then get a volume > 75db on the sound level meter unless you turn the receiver volume up > 0db. Why is it then when watching a movie the sound level regularly exceeds 80db even with the receiver volume at between -15 and -20db? It doesn't make sense to me because shouldn't 0db = reference level = 75db so why is -15db on the receiver producing sound levels far greater than 75db? I have the UK 1912 model by the way which I believe is the equivalent of the US 2112 model as mine has Audyssey MultEQ XT smile.gif

Thanks

1. The manual is referring to changing the physical position of the speaker/sub itself or increasing the number of speakers as far as when you should run Audyssey again. The AVR actually sets the LARGE/SMALL, speaker distance, speaker crossover, and speaker/sub volume levels, so changing these has no impact on the Audyssey EQ.

2. Average reference volume at Master Volume of 0db is 85db with peaks to 105db (speaker)/115db (LFE); however, a 75db test tone is used as an 85db test tone would be too LOUD. eek.gif
post #16997 of 18955
Ok, so i have a quick quesiton regarding the 3312. I found an open box item at a best buy near me. Here is the scope. Apparently i was purchased from a customer, it was returned or somehow sent in for repair. So this store has it, at one point it needed to be repaired but they were going to run through some tests for me before I went in there to check it out. My question is, they are selling it for $402, which is a smoking deal! Should I get it? I believe it would be or should be covered under Denon and the 3yr warranty, so I should be safe, right? Is there anything else I should be considering or asking when they call me back? I will see if I can get a little more history on it but it sounds like it was sent in, I am just not sure how they got it as an open box item. Any feedback/comments are welcome. This just seems like too good of a deal to pass up on

Edit: I also forgot to mention that he said they didn’t have the remote or speaker (for audyssey) but had both of those things from a 3313 I could have. Does the audyssey speaker work the same for both? Also, I am assuming the remote is slightly different, but does that matter if I get a harmony anyway? I just don’t want to buy or do something stupid. Would it still be covered under a 3yr warranty? Do I get them to guarantee that?
Edited by MNaudioguy - 1/27/13 at 2:22pm
post #16998 of 18955
Quick question: what does the "Dedicated "2CH DIRECT/STEREO" menu for configuring 2-channel audio differently than multichannel audio" allow you to tweak?
post #16999 of 18955
^^
So for instance after running Audyssey you'll set your FL/FR speakers to SMALL/80Hz if there is also a dedicated sub in your setup. So then when you select the STEREO surround mode, the above would still apply. However, with the dedicated 2CH Direct/Stereo settings you "could" set the FL/FR speakers to LARGE and turn OFF the sub if you just wanted to listen to music without the subwoofer. This setting would then apply whenever you selected STEREO mode rather than having to manually make these changes if that feature was not available on the unit.
post #17000 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MNaudioguy View Post

Ok, so i have a quick quesiton regarding the 3312. I found an open box item at a best buy near me. Here is the scope. Apparently i was purchased from a customer, it was returned or somehow sent in for repair. So this store has it, at one point it needed to be repaired but they were going to run through some tests for me before I went in there to check it out. My question is, they are selling it for $402, which is a smoking deal! Should I get it? I believe it would be or should be covered under Denon and the 3yr warranty, so I should be safe, right? Is there anything else I should be considering or asking when they call me back? I will see if I can get a little more history on it but it sounds like it was sent in, I am just not sure how they got it as an open box item. Any feedback/comments are welcome. This just seems like too good of a deal to pass up on

Edit: I also forgot to mention that he said they didn’t have the remote or speaker (for audyssey) but had both of those things from a 3313 I could have. Does the audyssey speaker work the same for both? Also, I am assuming the remote is slightly different, but does that matter if I get a harmony anyway? I just don’t want to buy or do something stupid. Would it still be covered under a 3yr warranty? Do I get them to guarantee that?

Both Best Buy's 30 day return policy as well as Denon's 3 year warranty would apply on that unit, although confirm with Best Buy on the 30 days. The Audyssey "mic" that comes with the XX13 models (to include the 3313CI) can also be used with the XX12 models (to include the 3312CI). The remote codes can be downloaded to your Harmony from Logitech. As with any demo/used unit, reset the microprocessor (see post #5 of this thread) first before doing any setup.
post #17001 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Both Best Buy's 30 day return policy as well as Denon's 3 year warranty would apply on that unit, although confirm with Best Buy on the 30 days. The Audyssey "mic" that comes with the XX13 models (to include the 3313CI) can also be used with the XX12 models (to include the 3312CI). The remote codes can be downloaded to your Harmony from Logitech. As with any demo/used unit, reset the microprocessor (see post #5 of this thread) first before doing any setup.

Thank you!! SO you are recommending i go forth and prosper and enjoy the unit? smile.gif I am so excited to get this thing! I just dont want it to be too go to be true. Thanks for your help
post #17002 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
So for instance after running Audyssey you'll set your FL/FR speakers to SMALL/80Hz if there is also a dedicated sub in your setup. So then when you select the STEREO surround mode, the above would still apply. However, with the dedicated 2CH Direct/Stereo settings you "could" set the FL/FR speakers to LARGE and turn OFF the sub if you just wanted to listen to music without the subwoofer. This setting would then apply whenever you selected STEREO mode rather than having to manually make these changes if that feature was not available on the unit.

Thanks! Is that it or does it provide other options? Can I boost/cut subwoofer level or change eq curves?
post #17003 of 18955
The speaker volume levels can also be adjusted, but no sub volume adjustment or changing EQ curves. Refer to p. 90 in the 2112CI Owner's manual for more details (can be downloaded from Denon's Downloads website).
post #17004 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobLee View Post

... with mute level set to -20db, so I can hear what's going on during commercials ...

But on the 3312 when there is a change in the signal the mute level goes to full silent. This happens when a TV or cable station goes to commercial break, or if I change tracks on a DVD...

Does anyone not have any idea what might be the problem here?

Does no one here ever use the -20db mute setting? If so, does it work flawlessly?
post #17005 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobLee View Post

Does anyone not have any idea what might be the problem here?

Does no one here ever use the -20db mute setting? If so, does it work flawlessly?

Just tried -20 on my 3312. Works properly.
post #17006 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by doctorwizz View Post

Just tried -20 on my 3312. Works properly.

Well it works properly in analog mode.

In digital mode, you are correct. The sound muted to silence when I pause/play the DVR.
Edited by doctorwizz - 1/28/13 at 6:27am
post #17007 of 18955
Thanks. Yes, I've noticed it occurs only with digital, which I use 99% of the time.

I wonder if Denon is aware of the problem, or as I said, is it instead a "feature".
post #17008 of 18955
Thread Starter 
I'm wondering if it's some HDMI handshake issue where it drops the signal when muted when there is a break (e.g. skipping forward, pausing).

You mentioned "digital" but is that only HDMI? A good test would be an optical/coax connection as opposed to HDMI, to see if you can pin the issue to HDMI only.
post #17009 of 18955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by woody777 View Post

Thanks! Is that it or does it provide other options? Can I boost/cut subwoofer level or change eq curves?

As JD noted you can't actually change the sub levels, but you CAN change the speakers levels. So if you want to adjust the sub volume for 2ch music playback what you should do is offset the FR/FL speaker levels in the opposite direction to make the sub relatively louder/softer. For example, if you like to run the sub 3dB hot during music playback, you can CUT the FR/FL speaker levels by 3dB which will effectively make the the sub 3dB louder.

The settings you can adjust independently for 2ch mode are:

- bass management (small vs. large)
- crossover frequency
- subwoofer = yes/no
- sw mode = LFE / LFE+MAIN
- FR/FL speaker level
- FR/FL speaker distance
post #17010 of 18955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MNaudioguy View Post

Ok, so i have a quick quesiton regarding the 3312. I found an open box item at a best buy near me. Here is the scope. Apparently i was purchased from a customer, it was returned or somehow sent in for repair. So this store has it, at one point it needed to be repaired but they were going to run through some tests for me before I went in there to check it out. My question is, they are selling it for $402, which is a smoking deal! Should I get it? I believe it would be or should be covered under Denon and the 3yr warranty, so I should be safe, right? Is there anything else I should be considering or asking when they call me back? I will see if I can get a little more history on it but it sounds like it was sent in, I am just not sure how they got it as an open box item. Any feedback/comments are welcome. This just seems like too good of a deal to pass up on

Edit: I also forgot to mention that he said they didn’t have the remote or speaker (for audyssey) but had both of those things from a 3313 I could have. Does the audyssey speaker work the same for both? Also, I am assuming the remote is slightly different, but does that matter if I get a harmony anyway? I just don’t want to buy or do something stupid. Would it still be covered under a 3yr warranty? Do I get them to guarantee that?

Alright, I don’t mean to bump this, but I was going to head over to Best Buy after work and I thought I would do one final check to see if I am not thinking of something. Does anyone see any reason why I should not grab this AVR? My only concern is it has already been in the shop for something and I don’t want a lemon. I looked and the mic they are giving me from the 3313 is backward compatible. The remote is not, but I might just get a Harmony. Also, is the ipad or android app fully functional and can it do everything from details tweaks, run audyssey and perform basic functions?

Thanks all and hopefully by this evening I will be a new proud owner of a 3312!! Now I just need to get some speakers to run this bad boy, haha
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