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The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX12 Model Owner's Thread - Page 588

post #17611 of 18963
Batpig is right. I've been buying and using recievers and separates for over 40 years, I,m 62 years old. If you have to use 125 watts of constant power you may need to have your hearing checked.
post #17612 of 18963
I hope this hasn't been discussed before. My goal is to use a Denon AVR as a convenient way to switch between two sets of speakers that are in the same room: a 5.1 home theater setup, and a 2.1 music setup connected to the Zone 2 preouts (via external power amp).

I believe the AVR-2112 is the cheapest Denon model with MultEQ XT that accomplishes this. Am I correct here?

Most importantly: If I use the Zone 2 preamp outputs on the AVR-2112, will Audyssey work with these? Will the Audyssey setup measure the Zone 2 speakers separately? Will the Denon conrol the volume of the Zone 2 speakers?
post #17613 of 18963
Audssey only works for zone 1
post #17614 of 18963
Although the 2112CI is indeed the lowest model with Zone 2 pre-outs, Audyssey does not EQ the Zone 2 speakers. Additionally, the external amp would have to be used to control the volume (although upgrading to the 2313CI would allow you to control the Zone 2 volume from the AVR or the external amp). Another option is to use the AVR's Amp Assign speaker posts and set them as "Front B" which is what is the recommended solution for those wanting to use a dedicated set of speakers for music listening only. The 2112CI can accomplish this as well, but so to can the 1712 which also uses MultEQ XT (however, it does not have Zone 2 pre-outs if you also wanted to pass another set of speakers to Zone 2 for patio or deck speakers).
post #17615 of 18963
Does Audyssey work with the pre-outs of the AVR-3312? And how does the switching between speakers and pre-outs work for this model?
post #17616 of 18963
Thread Starter 
Amplification is irrelevant to Audyssey. Like any other digital processing it happens well before the amp stage. It doesn't care where the signal that is output is amplified.

The same signal flows to the pre-outs as goes to the internal amps. There is no switching, the pre-outs are always "hot".
post #17617 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Amplification is irrelevant to Audyssey. Like any other digital processing it happens well before the amp stage. It doesn't care where the signal that is output is amplified.

Thanks batpig. That's what I expected. Do you know the cheapest Denon AVR that has main zone preouts and MultEQ XT and lets me save/load Audyssey settings?
post #17618 of 18963
Thread Starter 
Pre-outs are only available on the 33xx models or above. So either the 3311, 3312, or 3313 (in ascending order of price and chronology).

Another potentially cheaper option if you don't need the fanciest new features (3D support, Pandora and Airplay streaming, etc) is to grab a 3808ci off the used market. The 3808 is beefier than the newer 33xx models, larger and heavier with a more powerful amp section.
post #17619 of 18963
1713 has Zone 2 preouts that can be mapped to two front speakers, right? And it has XT.
post #17620 of 18963
Thread Starter 
Wrong smile.gif The Zone 2 pre-outs are for... wait for it.... Zone 2.
post #17621 of 18963
That's lame.
post #17622 of 18963
Yeah, truly lame.
post #17623 of 18963
^^^ I don't think Batpig was trying to be disrespectful, but instead being humerous. At least that's what I got out of it if you read a lot of his post. He's extremely helpful and knowledgeable on Denon products and does his best to answer questions. He answers a LOT of them so will add humor to his answer once in a while.
post #17624 of 18963
Thread Starter 
I believe he wasn't saying that I was lame, rather that the fact that the preouts can't be used for FR/FL was lame.
post #17625 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

I believe he wasn't saying that I was lame, rather that the fact that the preouts can't be used for FR/FL was lame.

Yes that's right. smile.gif
post #17626 of 18963
Ok-thanks for clearing up. My mistake/misunderstanding...
post #17627 of 18963
Thread Starter 
You're so lame tongue.gif
post #17628 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

You're so lame tongue.gif

biggrin.gif;)
post #17629 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dru the Fu View Post

Thank you for the suggestions to contact Panurgy. It looks like they are in NJ...Are there any repair sites on the West Coast, or perhaps not as far as the East Coast, as I live in California?

So after some consideration, I ended up sending my 3312 to Audio Design and Service Inc. located in North Hollywood, CA. After they received the unit, they were unable to update the firmware, even via their 'Service Center' magical means. What I was told is that it is a bad NIC on the HDMI board, and it will need to be replaced. After they spoke to Denon, a new board is being sent from Japan, as they are out of stock, so I'm looking at least on a 2-3 week wait, not the 2-3 day fix frown.gif . I'm just glad that this is a warranty fix and not something out of pocket to replace the board. Hopefully it comes back as good as new with no new defects and fixes the ability to update firmware.
post #17630 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Rad View Post

Thanks batpig. That's what I expected. Do you know the cheapest Denon AVR that has main zone preouts and MultEQ XT and lets me save/load Audyssey settings?

if you're in so cal, i have a 2809 i haven't been able to unload yet....
post #17631 of 18963
Why would a calibrator Change my LPF from 120 to 80 htz and turn of all EQ'S . NO Audessy OR manuel eq.(.Just off) The only only thing he did was use a laser to set distance and a hand held meter to set tone (db). Oh and change my LFP for LFE to 80????so now I have NO EQ Right???
post #17632 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by bamabrcklyr View Post

Why would a calibrator Change my LPF from 120 to 80 htz and turn of all EQ'S . NO Audessy OR manuel eq.(.Just off) The only only thing he did was use a laser to set distance and a hand held meter to set tone (db). Oh and change my LFP for LFE to 80????so now I have NO EQ Right???
Which AVR do you have? What speakers do you have? Did you ask your calibrator why he set up your system this way? Did he come with references? Does the Geek Squad do audio calibrations?

Manual vs Audyssey equalization can be an audio theory debate. UMR (Jeff Meier) calibrated our 3312 and the equalizer for the sub manually. The results are better than I was able to do with Audyssey for our room. Maybe he thought your room was acoustically perfect. rolleyes.gif
post #17633 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by bamabrcklyr View Post

Why would a calibrator Change my LPF from 120 to 80 htz and turn of all EQ'S . NO Audessy OR manuel eq.(.Just off) The only only thing he did was use a laser to set distance and a hand held meter to set tone (db). Oh and change my LFP for LFE to 80????so now I have NO EQ Right???

Correct. Did he run Audyssey so you could at least compare "his" method vs. Audyssey? If not, then simply jot down the distance and level settings he changed and then run Audyssey yourself and compare the two. Refer to the Audyssey 101/FAQ Guide linked in my sig for more info.
post #17634 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Correct. Did he run Audyssey so you could at least compare "his" method vs. Audyssey? If not, then simply jot down the distance and level settings he changed and then run Audyssey yourself and compare the two. Refer to the Audyssey 101/FAQ Guide linked in my sig for more info


.
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Which AVR do you have? What speakers do you have? Did you ask your calibrator why he set up your system this way? Did he come with references? Does the Geek Squad do audio calibrations?




Manual vs Audyssey equalization can be an audio theory debate. UMR (Jeff Meier) calibrated our 3312 and the equalizer for the sub manually. The results are better than I was able to do with Audyssey for our room. Maybe he thought your room was acoustically perfect. rolleyes.gif

I have a 2312,polk RTi 8 fronts CSi 3 center FXi 3 rears and a Boston Acoustic VPS210 sub.YES i asked why would you change my LPF to to 80 not leave at 120 as specified (on this thread). HE told me All crossovers should be set to 80.YES he came with references!.I will pm you his name.NOT Geek squad .
NO he did not run Audyessy To compare . I don't think it's a manuel equalization when distance and dbs levels are are the only things checked.Am i correct? I have 10 ft ceilings open Kitchen and dining room not acoustically perfect:mad:
I'm going to write down his measurements and rerun Audyssey to see the difference . confused.gif
post #17635 of 18963
Thread Starter 
No, distance and levels is not the same as EQ. Some installers will avoid Audyssey and just do manual tweaking with the built-in graphic EQ, but to NOT use EQ at all is quite unusual. You could have done that yourself for free, just by running Audyssey with one position to set distances and levels and then turning the EQ off if you didn't like it.

The LPF of LFE is NOT a crossover. It's not a huge deal to set it to 80Hz (in fact some folks recommend that) but for him to tell you it's because "crossovers should be set to 80" indicates a lack of understanding of the function of that setting.
post #17636 of 18963
I had an interesting experience with my 3313ci yesterday - the receiver stopped putting out sound from one of the HDMI inputs. From the front panel, it looked like it was stuck on "Stereo" sound and wouldn't recognize any other signal (I tried Dolby Digital, DTS HD, and Multi Ch PCM). I switched cables with another device to verify it was not the device and the same thing happened with the the other device on the same input. Anyway, I ended up doing a microprocessor reset and then everything came back to normal. I was wondering if anyone else has had anything similar happen.

One other thing - I tried saving my settings before doing the reset and then restoring them after, but it didn't work. The save went okay, but when I did the restore it would upload the config file and then say "Loading" for a minute before giving a message that the load failed. I tried a few times with different browsers. It's not a big deal, but I had to re-assign all the inputs and run Audyssey again. Bottom line - don't rely on the Save/Load function.
post #17637 of 18963
Thread Starter 
First things first, this is the xx12 thread not the xx13 wink.gif

But anyway, when doing a network SAVE you always want to check and verify a "good" save by opening the file (with either a text editor like Notepad or a dedicated Hex editor program and verifying that it's not all 0's. The save can look like it worked but the file might not have any data (all 0's) and that's why the LOAD probably failed.
post #17638 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

No, distance and levels is not the same as EQ. Some installers will avoid Audyssey and just do manual tweaking with the built-in graphic EQ, but to NOT use EQ at all is quite unusual. You could have done that yourself for free, just by running Audyssey with one position to set distances and levels and then turning the EQ off if you didn't like it.

The LPF of LFE is NOT a crossover. It's not a huge deal to set it to 80Hz (in fact some folks recommend that) but for him to tell you it's because "crossovers should be set to 80" indicates a lack of understanding of the function of that setting.

I have run audyessy before and had very similar measurements , That he came up with.But I'm confused why He turned my eq off.He also calibrated my VT25 and GT50 ONLY in THX mode ,witch look good BUT wouldn't do a day mode?WTF and didn't do my 3d said some stuff about the cinema mode (THX)being calibrated and being the same in in service menu that THX didn't certify the first generation VT25 SO he jest plugged in 100 contrast and the same color , brightness tint ,etc values in the3D cinema mode and said that was the same..(3d cinema THE same as THX 2d ???? VT25,but that's for another thread.:confused.gif
post #17639 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by sigma957 View Post

I had an interesting experience with my 3313ci yesterday - the receiver stopped putting out sound from one of the HDMI inputs. From the front panel, it looked like it was stuck on "Stereo" sound and wouldn't recognize any other signal (I tried Dolby Digital, DTS HD, and Multi Ch PCM). I switched cables with another device to verify it was not the device and the same thing happened with the the other device on the same input. Anyway, I ended up doing a microprocessor reset and then everything came back to normal. I was wondering if anyone else has had anything similar happen.

One other thing - I tried saving my settings before doing the reset and then restoring them after, but it didn't work. The save went okay, but when I did the restore it would upload the config file and then say "Loading" for a minute before giving a message that the load failed. I tried a few times with different browsers. It's not a big deal, but I had to re-assign all the inputs and run Audyssey again. Bottom line - don't rely on the Save/Load function.

Some times things just get gummed up as your avr has computer parts and usually it comes from Networking/Airplay playing havoc and jamming up and this happens when not totally backing out and or stopping your Net/Usb event.

Not sure if the Networking is your issue but unplugging the avr for a few minutes may resolve an issue before doing an avr reset and having to rerun Audyssey either manually or reloading your settings via the web control feature.
post #17640 of 18963
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

First things first, this is the xx12 thread not the xx13 wink.gif
Oops... I just picked the Denon thread near the top - thought it was xx13...
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