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2011 Mitsubishi DLP WD-73640 official thread - Page 61

post #1801 of 1871
I think I found it.... This might be a limitation in the Mitsubishi.... If I change the MXO2 output to 720p/59.94, then I get an output on the Mits...

If anyone has successfully fed 1080i/29.97 to the Mits 73640, please post....

Either RGB or YUV worked....


Thanks...
Edited by Jan J - 2/3/13 at 8:18am
post #1802 of 1871
I have a question. I noticed I am starting to get the occasional flicker on this set now. Like it switches between bright and standard bulb lighting. Is the bulb starting to go or does that sound like the light engine? Bulb hours is at 2312.
post #1803 of 1871
Our 73640 light is set at bright... Occasionally I see flickering... I changed lamp output to low, and it kept flickering, so it isn't that. I switched back to high level lamp, and it eventually went away...

I've seen many lamps fail (I do the replacements at work, where we have 20 or so of them), and usually when it goes it's one of two ways....
Catastrophic failure (you hear glass breaking), and melted lamp assembly and light moves out of the center of the reflector, and it gets dim.
post #1804 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan J View Post

I just encountered an issue....

I'm borrowing a Matrox MXO2 unit from work....and everything seems to work correctly except the HDMI output to the Mits 73640 DLP.... I have 13.06 in the 73640...

Here is the issues....

I have the MXO2 set up for 1080i (1920x1080/29.97).... And the HDMI configuration is set (In the MXO2) as: "Same as Primary Output" (1920x1080/29.97) and YUV colorspace... And the 3D settings are turned off (MXO2 supports 3D).... I get audio out of DLP, but just a Blue Screen..

If I change the settings to: Same as Primary, YUV, and 3D Over/Under, Then I get Video, but it is scaled incorrectly and aspect ratio is also incorrect....

As far as I can tell, this is not a Copy Protection Issue (Home Video Camera footage), as when I have seen CP Kick in, it's a blue or black screen and no audio, and I get audio at all times, just no Video..

I've also tried other options (RGB Colorspace) but nothing other than "Same as Primary Output", YUV and 3D Over/Under is enabled on the Matrox. At No time did I ever select 3D on the Mitsubishi....

I'm going to call the Manufacturer tomorrow, but thought I'd post here to see if anyone has encountered this before.

????

Jan

Why would you not use something like a consumer Nvidia or ATI or an embedded Intel iGPU? They all work fine.I use a i3 Sandy Bridge with the integrated video. I have Ceton 4 tuner cable card tuner and 2 HD Homerun ATS dual tuners. That provides 7 tuners for WMC DVR and the picture quality is great. I run the set with geometry correction OFF!!!. I use no scaling. I let it overscan and only scale to do maintenance. WMC and the Intel grpu do a fine job. Get a consumer type discrete GPU.. something in the $40 dollar range will work fine. I suggest Nvidia because of the stable drivers, but if you any kind of Sandy Bridge or Ivy Bridge CPU with integrated graphics it will work very well and uses very little power.
post #1805 of 1871
I've had someone else attempt to feed 1080i/29.97 to Mitsubishi DLP's... Here's his results:

Mitsubishi 65733 firmware 009.03-
Matrox output pref set to 1080i does not display video or audio at all
Matrox output pref set to 1080p does not display video or audio at all
Matrox output pref set to 720p does display video and audio but with BOTH letterbox and pillarboxing (ie. proper aspect ratio but surrounded by black borders) (TV on standard format setting)

Mitsubishi 65738 firmware 012.08-
Matrox output pref set to 1080i displays both video and audio as expected
Matrox output pref set to 1080p displays both video and audio as expected (showing interlace)
Matrox output pref set to 720p displays video and audio as expected (fullscreen, no borders) (on TV standard format setting)

For fun-
Visio E200VA-
1080i is fine
1080p is fine
720p is green skin and purple background weirdness (this is from the MXO2's HDMI output, simultaneous to the other 720p tests which were from SDI output to AJA Hi-5)

Looks like your TV is the culprit to me. Strange, I really expected my older TV to display the 1080 signal just the same as the newer one...


If anyone has been successful (OR NOT) with getting 1080i/29.97 feed to display on a 73640 via HDMI Connection, would you kindly post what product you used, how you know it is 1080i/29.97 footage, and what firmware in the 73640, Please?

Thank You
post #1806 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan J View Post

I've had someone else attempt to feed 1080i/29.97 to Mitsubishi DLP's... Here's his results:

Mitsubishi 65733 firmware 009.03-
Matrox output pref set to 1080i does not display video or audio at all
Matrox output pref set to 1080p does not display video or audio at all
Matrox output pref set to 720p does display video and audio but with BOTH letterbox and pillarboxing (ie. proper aspect ratio but surrounded by black borders) (TV on standard format setting)

Mitsubishi 65738 firmware 012.08-
Matrox output pref set to 1080i displays both video and audio as expected
Matrox output pref set to 1080p displays both video and audio as expected (showing interlace)
Matrox output pref set to 720p displays video and audio as expected (fullscreen, no borders) (on TV standard format setting)

For fun-
Visio E200VA-
1080i is fine
1080p is fine
720p is green skin and purple background weirdness (this is from the MXO2's HDMI output, simultaneous to the other 720p tests which were from SDI output to AJA Hi-5)

Looks like your TV is the culprit to me. Strange, I really expected my older TV to display the 1080 signal just the same as the newer one...


If anyone has been successful (OR NOT) with getting 1080i/29.97 feed to display on a 73640 via HDMI Connection, would you kindly post what product you used, how you know it is 1080i/29.97 footage, and what firmware in the 73640, Please?

Thank You

There is nothing special about the 73640 works fine on both my 92840 and my 82837... Use a source other than your Matrox.
post #1807 of 1871
can you confirm you can display 1080i/29.97 on the 73640?

I'm trying to determine if it can be done on the 73640. If so, what hardware did you use?

I would prefer to display 1920x1080/29.97 than 720p/59.94, as I'm trying to avoid cross conversion artifacts. The original edit was in 1920x1080/29.97.

(1920x1080/29.97 gives bluescreen and audio. Same playback converted to 1280x720/59.94 plays back flawlessly)
post #1808 of 1871
I just got off the phone with Mitsubishi. 800-332-2219

They say the 65738 and 73640 supports both 1080i/29.97 and 1080i/60

He did a check on the 65733, and he believes that you are correct, the 65733 doesn't support 1080i/29.97

Interesting....

I obviously have some more testing to do....
post #1809 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan J View Post

I just got off the phone with Mitsubishi. 800-332-2219

They say the 65738 and 73640 supports both 1080i/29.97 and 1080i/60

He did a check on the 65733, and he believes that you are correct, the 65733 doesn't support 1080i/29.97

Interesting....

I obviously have some more testing to do....

I don't know how I can make it any clearer. Get rid of the Matrox and use a recent ATI, Nvidia or Intel iGPU. These modern Mits displays all handle the timings you ask about. You are spinning your wheels. There is nothing about your display that should give it any trouble with those timings. Any 1080i broadcast either cable or over the air is 29.97. The internal runer handles that.
post #1810 of 1871
I borrowed a AJA HI-5 from work. Put it on HDSDI output A set for 1080i/29.97...
AJA LED went Red, as it would for an HD signal.
Connected the HDMI Cable to Mitsubishi 73640.
Played the Premiere 1080i/29.97 project. Got a Blue Screen with audio on the Mitsubishi.

OK... One thing I haven't told you. It's a 45' HDMI cable.

So, let's say it's the cable length.... SO.....
I put a 40' coax on the Primary HDSDI output of the Matrox... Put the HI-5 at end of cable, and a 10' HDMI cable into Mits DLP. (It's the same cable that the 1080p scan converter used successfully to this same HDMI Port).
I get Blue Screen with audio on this test....

That confirms it. It's the Mitsubishi... that's not playing 1080i/29.97 properly...

Thanks for listening....

PS to this...gtgray: My GPU is a Quadro fx 4800. The MXO2 is a I/O BOB
post #1811 of 1871
After finishing and posting the above last night, I realized there might be one more thing to try......

I was in Freerun, not genlocked mode. It could be that the freerun frequency is slightly outside what Mits can accept on 1080i/29.97....

So I genlocked it with a Sync Generator using NTSC Black Burst.

Unfortunately that did not help... The Mitsubishi 73640 output blue screen and audio when in freerun or genlocked, with or without the HDMI being generated off the MXO2 or AJA HI-5 off HDSDI.

The Mits 73640 WILL work Genlocked on 720p/59.94, but not 1080i/29.97

I think I have my smoking gun...
Edited by Jan J - 2/8/13 at 7:42am
post #1812 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan J View Post

After finishing and posting the above last night, I realized there might be one more thing to try......

I was in Freerun, not genlocked mode. It could be that the freerun frequency is slightly outside what Mits can accept on 1080i/29.97....

So I genlocked it with a Sync Generator using NTSC Black Burst.

Unfortunately that did not help... The Mitsubishi 73640 output blue screen and audio when in freerun or genlocked, with or without the HDMI being generated off the MXO2 or AJA HI-5 off HDSDI.

The Mits 73640 WILL work Genlocked on 720p/59.94, but not 1080i/29.97

I think I have my smoking gun...

I don't know about your set but these sets do fine with 1080i at 29.97. I have a Tivo HD set to Native it puts out 59.94 at 720P and 29.97 at 1080i.. I won't bother to set my my Radiance to 1080i because I am too lazy to mess with that. Trust me, either your display is broken or this genlock device is doing something weird. Any old cable box will put out 1080l at 29.97 and work just fine. I also have an HP x280n Windows Media Center Extender wihich ouputs 1080i at 29.97 4:2:2 and it work fine direct. I normally don't send anything to direct to my display as I usually have a VP inline. First was an Edge, then a DUO and now a Radiance it is my preference to do all the deinterlacing and scaling in the Video Processor.. but things synch just fine without the VPs.

You have an interesting piece of gear that is not typical consumer stuff, why it misbehaves on your set in your enviroment is anyone's guess..... but believe me 1080l at the standard refresh rate is not a problem. I also have an older HD-DVD player that could only output 1080i it also worked fine. It was a thousand dollar device in is day, Toshiba XA2. Actually I have other 1080i devices laying around that have been plugged directly into both my 2009 82837 and my 2011 92840 all worked without issue.... Two of them are external ATSC tuners.
post #1813 of 1871
I know you believe you are correct, but I'm posting what is true. I've since tried other 29.97 devices. It can't do 29.97
When I was on the phone with Mits, the fellow had to put me on hold twice, to get answers to the questions I was asking.

These questions were:

Does Mitsubishi support 1080i/29.97 via HDMI as well as 1080p? He didn't know and had to ask someone.

Then I asked about the other Mits DLP's that have been tested..... SOME WORKED WITH HDMI at 29.97 and some didn't!!! (and these were not 720p native DLP's) How would you explain that?

I was put on hold and when he returned, he confirmed some models will not work with 1080i/29.97 on HDMI, only OTA Tuner.

I would have been very happy if you were right, but you're not....

I'd strongly suggest you borrow some 29.97 hardware and test it.... I'm afraid you'll find exactly what I found.

The Email support thread from the Mits site has been removed, and that prevents me from reporting this to them.... Not that at this late date they'd do anything about it..... The product is end of life... Though I prefer making colors off of 6 colors plus Luminance...

As posted before, when I change the MXO2 to 720p/59.94 the Mits instantly locks to the image. So I do have a work around. (Albeit with cross conversion interlace to progressive artifacts).

At this point, it is what it is....
Edited by Jan J - 2/11/13 at 6:07am
post #1814 of 1871
when you were on the phone with Mits you had a moron on the line. What are you really trying to achieve anyway. The typical source of 1080i content is terrestrial broadcast either ATSC or QAM from a cable source. Those sources play fine when fed to a properly working Mits DLP rear projector.

Don't expect to get an even reasonably competent answers when you call Mits support.
Edited by gtgray - 2/12/13 at 1:10pm
post #1815 of 1871
I'm going to bring home much more hardware to test this, but the 73640 isn't the only Mits that can't take 1080i/29.97. I took my 10' HDMI cable that works on the 73640 at 1080p on my scan converter, I tried a couple older ones at work....
720p/59.94 works but not all work with 1080i/29.97.

The test signal generator I used is: http://www.lynx-technik.com/index.php?id=439
The HDSDI to HDMI Converter I used is: http://www.aja.com/en/products/mini-converters/hi5/#overview

I then tried the following HD formats, using my 10' HDMI Cable (Known good At 1080p ti my 73640) from the test generator at the shop at work, to "See what would happen" when I through Multiple HD Formats at a consumer TV. (A one year old Samsung TV that just happened to be in the shop).

Here's my results: (I'm expecting PAL HD not to work on a consumer TV)

720p/59.94 good
720p/60 good
720p/50 NG
720p/30 NG
720p/29.97 NG
720p/25 NG
720p/24 NG
720p/23.97 NG

1080i/60 good
1080i/59.94 good
1080i/50 NG
1080p/30 good
1080p/29.97 good
1080p/25 NG
1080p/24 good
1080p/23.97 NG
1080psf/25 NG
1080psf/24 NG
1080psf/23.97 NG

My intention is to get permission to bring the test generator home to test the Matrox system, along with the following test gear, for evaluation of the streams leaving the Matrox MXO2:

http://www.leaderamerica.com/web/products/video_monitor/lv5800.htm

This way, I can verify, without a doubt that the Matrox MXO2 is outputting legal HD Video, and put another nail into the Mitsubishi 73640... Which I'm willing to assume WILL receive 1080i/29.97 OTA through the tuner, but no via HDMI inputs....

As mentioned before, I already know the Mits cannot accept the 1080i/29.97
post #1816 of 1871
Thread is a little aged, but I thought I might get some help on some trouble I'm having with my 73640

Works fine most of the time, once in a while the screen will go black and I get the front green led fast flashing. Needs a power cycle to come back. Seems to be happening more often lately, and another symptom is the sound will just cut out. Nothing to the tv speakers or the coax output on the back. Same thing, needs a power cycle to get it back. Changing inputs or mute/unmute, etc doesnt help. Once in a while I hear a static pop just before the sound cuts out.

Pretty simple setup...directv hr24 to the tv with a decent hdmit cable, coax out to a receiver, but I wasn't ever using it when the pic or sound cut out.

Vents are clear, unit sits on a raised marble pedestal that makes an excellent heat sink.

Anyone have anything I can do or check before I try out Squaretrade for the first time? Glad I bought the +3 year warranty extension from Costco for $50...
post #1817 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoop View Post

Thread is a little aged, but I thought I might get some help on some trouble I'm having with my 73640

Works fine most of the time, once in a while the screen will go black and I get the front green led fast flashing. Needs a power cycle to come back. Seems to be happening more often lately, and another symptom is the sound will just cut out. Nothing to the tv speakers or the coax output on the back. Same thing, needs a power cycle to get it back. Changing inputs or mute/unmute, etc doesnt help. Once in a while I hear a static pop just before the sound cuts out.

Pretty simple setup...directv hr24 to the tv with a decent hdmit cable, coax out to a receiver, but I wasn't ever using it when the pic or sound cut out.

Vents are clear, unit sits on a raised marble pedestal that makes an excellent heat sink.

Anyone have anything I can do or check before I try out Squaretrade for the first time? Glad I bought the +3 year warranty extension from Costco for $50...

Sorry, I don't know anything for sure... but as you hinted at with the 'clear vents/heat sink' comments, it almost seems like an over-heating issue. Or a failing power-board... very possibly just a cheap fuse that might need to be replaced. But the audio problems are odd.
post #1818 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP32 View Post

Sorry, I don't know anything for sure... but as you hinted at with the 'clear vents/heat sink' comments, it almost seems like an over-heating issue. Or a failing power-board... very possibly just a cheap fuse that might need to be replaced. But the audio problems are odd.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP32 View Post

Sorry, I don't know anything for sure... but as you hinted at with the 'clear vents/heat sink' comments, it almost seems like an over-heating issue. Or a failing power-board... very possibly just a cheap fuse that might need to be replaced. But the audio problems are odd.

Its done it a few times when the unit was cold, within a minute of starting it. Gave me fits the other day, dropping its sound within 10 seconds of turning on, then I turned it off, waited for the light to quit blinking and turned it on. Came almost on, then turned off with the fast flashing light. When I turned it on again, it lost the sound within a half minute. Then after pulling the plug after a shutdown, it turned on fine and hasn't been the least troublesome since. Watched it for ~6 hours yesterday,

The intermittency is annoying!

I was wondering if a cable problem or a grounding issue of some kind could be causing it. It seems like a power supply issue, but those usually aren't as intermittent and get worse with heat/use. Maybe I'll pull the coax audio out for a while and see if that improves it. I did have a problem with hdmi port #1 and a particular hdmi cable...it'd work on either of the other two ports but intermittently it wouldn't work on port #1.

I do have it on the latest firmware and it looks like there hasn't been anything new in close to a year.
post #1819 of 1871
I've seen that happen a couple times in the almost 2 years we've had it.... Any time of year, so it most likely isn't a temperature issue. Airflow is good, nothing blocked...but it keeps on working. so maybe it is a random reset built into firmware???

???
post #1820 of 1871
will these glasses work with this tv ?
3D IR Infrared Active Shutter Glasses for Samsung 3D: Description says "These glasses are intended for use with Samsung 3DTVs which use Active Shutter technology and IR (infrared) wireless connections. They feature an internal, rechargeable lithium-ion battery, which can hold a charge for up to 50 hours of use, so you won't need to watch TV with a USB cable plugged into your glasses.Each pair comes with an 18" micro USB cable for charging when not in use. They feature a 1000:1 contrast ratio and allow viewing angles up to 80 degrees from center."

I have this emitter already
http://www.amazon.com/Dimensional-3ACTIVE-Emitter-Compatible-Mitsubishi/dp/B005M3BIMO/ref=pd_sim_vg_2

Or if I ditch the emitter will these work too ? http://www.ebay.com/itm/SainSonic-2013-144Hz-3D-DLP-Link-IR-Active-Shutter-Rechargeable-Glasses-for-BenQ-/261206098514?pt=US_Video_Glasses&hash=item3cd118c252

Thanks in advance.
Edited by ianbotham - 4/30/13 at 3:38pm
post #1821 of 1871
hi all. I figured it's time to show. My ultra demential rig. My itty bitty MAN CAVE. U can click on my items below.
post #1822 of 1871
Greetings All, first time poster.

I have had Mitsubishi WD-73640 for about a year now. Overall..pretty pleased.
Curious however, I have noticed on the mitsu site that a software update is available. Anyone know what it is actually updating? It doesn't appear on their site.
Wanted to give this a try since I have not used the usb hub before but, not if it isnt worth the update.

As well, quick question. Is there any kind of bluetooth device that will allow me to use my IPhone with this tv? Don't think there is but...maybe someone knows something I dont. I am also thinking about a home theater system (speakers and blueray) any suggestions that would be compatible with this TV?

Cheers!
post #1823 of 1871
hi alll. the firm ware update is old, back at 7/5/12. it is a file 13.06. just hit the menu on remote, the firm ware version should be displayed the lower left of of image. IF you do not have it; follow usb install instructions from MITSI. It suppose to fix 3D judder and ghosting..and it worked for me..
post #1824 of 1871
That model has no Bluetooth circuits so there can be no Bluetooth device to directly control the TV. The USB input is for software updates ONLY and does not support any other USB functions so you cannot use that to add an external Bluetooth device either.
post #1825 of 1871
After 6200+ hours on the lamp and the dimming getting on my nerves I broke down and ordered a new lamp. I went with a genuine Mitsubishi replacement lamp. I'm not gonna try an OEM compatible after some of the horror stories I read on here. Hopefully I'll have it next week. Also one of these days I'm gonna order a X-Rite i1Display Pro and trick this bad boy out some more... hehe biggrin.gif
post #1826 of 1871
I finally got around to testing 3D on my tv. I played a 3D sbs file through the pc via HDMI 1.3. I am using this 3d emitter and sony ps3 glasses. I set the tv overscan to zero.
Firstly the size of the image on the screen is restricted to a narrow strip (hitting the format button on the remote tells me pc 1080 3d sbs, but does not do anything ) , secondly the image doesn't pop like in a movie theater . I can see a bit of depth but it's barely anything. Can I do something to improve the quality of this experience ?
Thanks in advance.
post #1827 of 1871
IDK, but I would think a 3d bluray would work best.
Free bump.
post #1828 of 1871
I don't know about the narrow strip issue but you can't set the overscan to 0 for 3D to work. Overscan has to be stock for 3D to work correctly.

I got my replacement lamp today. I put in the TV and WOW it's bright again LOL. 6349 hours on the old lamp. The lamps are smaller than I thought they would be and it was mostly easy to replace. My only difficulties were due to my set up and equipment placement. Anyway now I need to get 100 hours on this lamp cuz I have X-Rite i1Display Pro colorimeter on the way.
Edited by |Tch0rT| - 7/3/13 at 5:49pm
post #1829 of 1871
OK.... After Months of screwing around, I finally got 1080i/29.97 to work on HDMI inputs.... and the Setting in the video editing camera capture system was not the issue....

The issue was the MITS 73640 PC input Specs and naming convention of the inputs, and this is kind of a trap.....

Let me explain.....

I hooked my 1080i/29.97 HDMI feed to HDMI Input 3. This defaults (on my 73640 Set) as a "PC" input. This did come from a PC, so I left it as it was, as I had no reason to edit the name....

1080i/.29.97 would not work... I got audio and blue screen. If I changed the Cross converter in the Camera Capture system to 720P/59.94 then it did work!

And that's what I posted.... And all subsequent tests were done with the naming of HDMI-3 as "PC", as I found it!

Even when I took the HDSDI Signal to an AJA HI-5, and 3' HDMI cable (that worked on 1080P on a different input), it still would only work on 720p, not 1080i/29.97.


The Solution:

The NAMING Convention of the Inputs in the Menu --- Sets LIMITATIONS to the HDMI Input!

HDMI-3 on my set Defaults to "PC". I was discussing this problem with folks on the Matrox Support site, and someone posted the specs of the 73640, and whereas 1080i IS SUPPORTED on HDMI, 1080i ISN'T SUPPORTED in the HDMI-"PC" Mode!

HDMI-"PC" Mode Specs are: 640 x 480, 800 x 600, 1024 x 768, 1280 x 720, 1365 x 768 @ 60Hz

1080i isn't in that list!!!


SO..........

This was fixed by RE-NAMING the HDMI-3 INPUT FROM "PC" --- TO: "HDMI-3"

THIS REMOVED the 1080i "Limitation" from the HDMI-3 input, and the 1080i/29.97 video and audio was instantly recognized!!!


Be aware of the naming issue..... It is an in-inadvertent trap!
Edited by Jan J - 7/8/13 at 7:47am
post #1830 of 1871
Well I got an X-Rite i1 Display Pro (I think it's referenced as a D3 around these parts) earlier this week and have been mostly playing around with it on my PC monitor and Laptop. I did try the included software on my HTPC with my 73640 but that turned out to be a mess. After getting things as back to my normal as I could I decided to just measure it with ColorHCFR (AVS HD 709 source on HTPC. Grayscale, primary, and secondary colors measurement) and here are the results:











So how suspect should I be of the results?
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