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Pioneer Blu-ray players 2011 - BDP-140/BDP-440/BDP-LX55/BDP-53FD - Page 38

post #1111 of 1810
Just recieved the 53fd this morning...
replacing the 23fd
and taking a quick look at the manual..
pg.20
to achieve higher quality video and sound
I should connect the BD using 2 separate
HDMI cables one to the TV and another to the AVR.
Connecting to Elite SC-57 AV.
i don't really want to buy another cable...
post #1112 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by rc-zombies View Post

Just recieved the 53fd this morning...
replacing the 23fd
and taking a quick look at the manual..
pg.20
to achieve higher quality video and sound
I should connect the BD using 2 separate
HDMI cables one to the TV and another to the AVR.
Connecting to Elite SC-57 AV.
i don't really want to buy another cable...

If you are connecting to a TV using an AVR, that is the only way to connect any blu-ray player not just Pioneer. HDMI out form the Blu-ray player to the HDMI IN on the AVR then Monitor out from AVR to HDMI In on your display.
post #1113 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex solomon View Post

If you are connecting to a TV using an AVR, that is the only way to connect any blu-ray player not just Pioneer.

No!
If you have a player with two HDMI ports, like the BDP-LX55/BDP-53FD, you can connect one HDMI port to your display and the second HDMI port to the AVR.
This may be necessary when you want to watch 3D and your older AVR can't transport 3D to the display.
Quote:


HDMI out form the Blu-ray player to the HDMI IN on the AVR then Monitor out from AVR to HDMI In on your display.

Yes, this is the normal way, but not the only one if you have a player with 2 HDMI outs.

You are right, either way you'll go, you need always 2 HDMI cables.
post #1114 of 1810
I understand at least for some receivers you need a HDMI connection between receiver and TV to see the onscreen overlay for info and set-up purpose.

I've not read any proof that separating audio and video outputs (the audio ouput on HDMI sub contains blank video) gives 'higher quality' audio and video.
post #1115 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilian.ca View Post

I've not read any proof that separating audio and video outputs (the audio ouput on HDMI sub contains blank video) gives 'higher quality' audio and video.

Kilian,

Your posting may spark some spirited debate. Some see a difference and some do not. I've tried both ways with my Oppo BDP-95 and I noticed no improvement regardless of how I made the connection. My display is a Pioneer Elite Pro-150FD. Personally I think it is just marketing, but I will not debate what one may see.
post #1116 of 1810
Hehe...there was a debate already in this thread whether the separate audio output could be 176.4 kHz.

For video, the new HDMI benchmark measurement would be interesting to compare.
post #1117 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilian.ca View Post

...there was a debate already in this thread whether the separate audio output could be 176.4 kHz.

???
Each HDMI audio output can be up to 192 kHz.

Quote:


For video, the new HDMI benchmark measurement ...

Which "HDMI benchmark"?
post #1118 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by drSeehas View Post

???

DSD-PCM decimation

Quote:
Originally Posted by drSeehas View Post

Which "HDMI benchmark"?

this
post #1119 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilian.ca View Post

... this

Thank you.
post #1120 of 1810
Hi,

I want to buy a new blu-ray player. I have a vsx-lx 55 and therefore I think it is usefull to take a pioneer blu-ray player. I am thinging about bdp-440 or bdp-lx 55. I think the bdp-440 is good enough, but is there any important reason to take the bdp-lx 55? E.g. the picture is much more better or the sound is much more better?

The-Doc
post #1121 of 1810
nobody?
post #1122 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by The-Doc View Post

Hi,

I want to buy a new blu-ray player. I have a vsx-lx 55 and therefore I think it is usefull to take a pioneer blu-ray player. I am thinging about bdp-440 or bdp-lx 55. I think the bdp-440 is good enough, but is there any important reason to take the bdp-lx 55? E.g. the picture is much more better or the sound is much more better?

The-Doc

No need for BDP-LX55 in my humble opinion...
As long as you have the Qdeo scaler in VSX-LX55 which will take over the video duties, you'll be fine with BDP-440...
I have this player and except for the bugs you can read about in earlier posts, PQ and SQ is outstanding...
also, there is no proof of better video or audio transfer by separating the HDMI outs on the BDP-LX55...
post #1123 of 1810
Over the last few days I tested the BDP-LX55 with my hi-fi equipment (Marantz PM8004). Analog stereo sound quality is better than the OPPO BDP-93EU.
CD, DVD and Blu-ray music on the stereo LPCM track plays well, more dynamic and open than the OPPO. AKM 32 bit DAC is doing a good job. I am very pleasantly surprised ...

Still waiting for firmware updates! No display of track number is very frustrating!
post #1124 of 1810
I read the 38 pages of comments to this thread. Wow! You guys are a font of knowledge (and frustration). I'll be delaying my purchase of a Pioneer Blu ray until the issue with the LAN (causing the AVR to power cycle) is resolved.

I've learned a lot from your comments and now I have a basic question about which Pioneer Blu ray I should buy (BDP-140 or the 53FD) considering my other equipment.

I have a Pioneer PDP-6010FD plasma and Pioneer VSX-1021-K. I understand that both the TV and the VSX have chipsets that "process" image and audio and can even upconvert SD movies to HD. Blu ray players can do the same thing.

I realize that not all processor chipsets are created equal. Here's my question: considering the capabilities of the 6010FD plasma and the VSX-1021-K (which has the Anchor Bay 1080p scaler), do I need the power of the 53FD's Marvell QDEO scaler?

I'd guess that one should do the "processing" with the best, most powerful chipset and "turn off" processing in the other two units. That would seem to dictate that I get the 53FD and let things pass through the VSX.

Music listening is done on other equipment in a different part of the house, so playback of music via the Blu ray is not a factor; just movies.

Is the BDP-140 good enough to handle upconverting and other processing or should I let the VSX's Anchor Bay chipset do it? Is the 140 or 53FD (with its problems resolved) and it's Marvell QDEO the right equipment to "process" DVD and Blu Ray movies?

I can get the 140 for $200 USD and the 53FD for $430 (free shipping).
post #1125 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by S-jerry View Post

... Is the BDP-140 good enough to handle upconverting and other processing or should I let the VSX's Anchor Bay chipset do it? ...

I know neither your TV nor your receiver, but I have a similar configuration from Denon: DBP-1611UD player and AVR-4310 with ABT chip. The processing in the AVR is good enough for me.

Why don't you consider the BDP-52FD player?
post #1126 of 1810
RE: BDP-52FD... I did consider the 52FD ($400), but the 53FD is only $29 more (and free shipping) than the 52FD at the "big A." If I'm thinking of buying a Blu ray player at these prices, why not go for the latest for only a little extra?

The advise I seek is whether to buy the 53FD for it's Marvell QDEO "processing" chipset or go with the cheaper BDP-140 and let my VSX-1021-K AVR handle the processing knowing that its Archor Bay chipset is not as good as the Marvell QDEO.
post #1127 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by S-jerry View Post

... I did consider the 52FD ($400), but the 53FD is only $29 more (and free shipping) than the 52FD at the "big A."...right

What is the "big A."?
In Europe the 52FD is offered as BDP-440 und the price is right between the BDP-140 and the BDP-LX55/53FD (at least $150 difference).
post #1128 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by S-jerry View Post

RE: BDP-52FD... I did consider the 52FD ($400), but the 53FD is only $29 more (and free shipping) than the 52FD at the "big A." If I'm thinking of buying a Blu ray player at these prices, why not go for the latest for only a little extra?

The advise I seek is whether to buy the 53FD for it's Marvell QDEO "processing" chipset or go with the cheaper BDP-140 and let my VSX-1021-K AVR handle the processing knowing that its Archor Bay chipset is not as good as the Marvell QDEO.

Happy to see another Pio enthusiast
I wish you could see the bugs already fixed...that´s what we all here desperately wait for, too...
sadly, I`m starting to think it just won`t happen in a desired fashion...
as Dr. Seehas said, the Anchor chip should be good enough in terms of video performance you look after...however, the superior Qdeo machinery has been repeatedly awarded with the best results as far as upscaling is put on a table...you´d probably need to bring both players home and compare it yourself, that´s my only advice...
I have VSX-1121 with Marvell chip and BDP-440 at the moment. AVR takes over the video duties...
If the BDP´s bugs were properly fixed, I would dare to say it´s one of best affordable home cinema applications at under $ 1000 market
post #1129 of 1810
What is the "Big A"? It's that online dealer who sells everything and is named after the big river that runs from Peru thru Brazil to the Atlantic.

Clue: Amazon.com.
post #1130 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by S-jerry View Post

What is the "Big A"? It's that online dealer who sells everything and is named after the big river that runs from Peru thru Brazil to the Atlantic.

Clue: Amazon.com.

Ah, thank you.
https://www.amazon.de/dp/B0053HHNB4
BDP-440 EUR 302,98
https://www.amazon.de/dp/B0066XZ6C2
BDP-LX 55 EUR 488,00
post #1131 of 1810
a can be a seller rating..

though if A is on the back of the player will denote region A bd's...
post #1132 of 1810
A - the big one... Amazon dot com... they keep prices low at other dealers.
A - A DVD/Blu Ray region of the world
A - Something my report card lacked
A - rating for something/someone who is first rate
A - As in "that guy is a complete A ..."
A - As in "Angry"... what Pioneer fans are experiencing waiting for the firmware update to fix the problem with BDPs and AVRs on a network, e.g., power cycling of AVR (and other fixes, too).
post #1133 of 1810
I posted this in the BDP-53FD thread, I'm hoping I can get some help here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrlnc View Post

No, I'm using it to play SACDs bit streamed as DSD through HDMI.
My receiver can handle that.

I did a lot of testing tonight:
  • I swapped out the HDMI cable
  • I swapped HDMI inputs on the receiver
  • I disconnected ethernet
  • I turned off all HDMI CEC due to problems it causes with remotes
  • I tried it on several multi-channel discs
  • I parallel tested this with my Oppo player

In all cases I used the Oppo with the Elite's cable and HDMI input. It never exhibited the problems of the Pioneer.

An interesting thing to note is that sometimes when I would swap out a cable or input, when I first powered on the Pioneer the sound would be fine. But after putting in a third or fourth disc, the Surr Rt channel would be silent. I also got some strange dropout on a particular disc in the same place that the Oppo would never get. I noticed that at that time mark the HDMI sync light would go out and I'd get about a 2 sec dropout. Always in the same spot in that song.

Anyway, if it weren't for the audio problems, I could live with its other issues until Pioneer gets a firmware fix out.

I wish I could just buy a product that works. I've upgraded my subwoofer and receiver as well. I'm not up to doing all this beta-testing.

This is exactly the same problem I'm having!

Not only that, but Dark Side of the Moon played the first time I tested it, and now it's reading it as an "Unknown Disc". Nine Inch Nails' The Downward Spiral is having the same problem.
post #1134 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post

If the BDP´s bugs were properly fixed, I would dare to say it´s one of best affordable home cinema applications at under $ 1000 market

Really! I would say under $500, but not $1,000.
post #1135 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

Really! I would say under $500, but not $1,000.

I meant the price of both devices altogether...
VSX-1121 is 500 to 700 USD, BDP-440 is 220 EUR...
sorry for misleading
post #1136 of 1810
Hi all,
I have read this long thread but it is hard to get a good overall picture of the features and bugs of this model... perhaps you can help me answering a few questions... First of all I am thinking about buying the BDP-440 because I have a small collection of SACDs and DVD-As and at the moment I can't play SACDs at all (apart from the CD layer of course) and I need to rip DVD-As to FLAC files to play them.
Since the BDP-440 is currently £209 here against the Oppo 93 at £499 I am considering the Pioneer model as an inexpensive way to play those discs more comfortably. The player will be connected to a Sony receiver via HDMI.

I understand that someone a way to switch between Multichannel SACD layer, stereo SACD layer and stereo Redbook layer on SACDs. Can you please confirm it works?
As I said this will be used mainly for SACDs and DVD-As, however should I use it for BluRay playback then I will connect it via Ethernet cable to a router. What is the status with the drop-out issues mentioned in this thread? Is keeping the player disconnected from the network an absolute requirement to avoid those dropouts?
Anything else I should be aware of? Which other bugs mentioned in this thread are going to hit me in this scenario? I am not interested in the debate about SACDs to PCM at 88.2K or 176.4K as I am sure I won't be able to tell the difference anyway.

Thanks for your help!
post #1137 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyrome64 View Post

Hi all,
I have read this long thread but it is hard to get a good overall picture of the features and bugs of this model... perhaps you can help me answering a few questions... First of all I am thinking about buying the BDP-440 because I have a small collection of SACDs and DVD-As and at the moment I can't play SACDs at all (apart from the CD layer of course) and I need to rip DVD-As to FLAC files to play them.
Since the BDP-440 is currently £209 here against the Oppo 93 at £499 I am considering the Pioneer model as an inexpensive way to play those discs more comfortably. The player will be connected to a Sony receiver via HDMI.

I understand that someone a way to switch between Multichannel SACD layer, stereo SACD layer and stereo Redbook layer on SACDs. Can you please confirm it works?
As I said this will be used mainly for SACDs and DVD-As, however should I use it for BluRay playback then I will connect it via Ethernet cable to a router. What is the status with the drop-out issues mentioned in this thread? Is keeping the player disconnected from the network an absolute requirement to avoid those dropouts?
Anything else I should be aware of? Which other bugs mentioned in this thread are going to hit me in this scenario? I am not interested in the debate about SACDs to PCM at 88.2K or 176.4K as I am sure I won't be able to tell the difference anyway.

Thanks for your help!

hi there,
these are the current bugs of BDP-440, not fixed yet as there hasn`t been any firmware update yet...

- no track/chapter visibility on front display
- weak sensor for remote control on the player, you need to hold a straight angle when operating (not likely to be changed by an firmware update, it however can be overrun by iControlAV2 app for Apple/Android products or by IP control over the home network)
- the player doesn`t sport IR control jack on the back so you can`t use AVR`s remote sensor (which is certainly much stronger) instead of the player`s one
- when pressing HDMI button and changing a resolution, you can`t see the actual change neither on front display, nor on TV
- inability to adjust video setting while on play
- poor YouTube interface
- LAN drop-outs (if Pio AVR is connected to the same router as the player, it causes sudden AVR dropouts once in a while...if you disconnect AVR from the network, the problem disappears...but you can`t use Internet radio or DLNA on the AVR...vice versa and you can`t use DLNA or Web services on the player) this was discovered by Pioneer EU right after the sale of BDP-440 has started in Europe, no solution as of today...I`m pretty sure they will come up with some treatment, though...

apart from these, the player performs pretty good in both PQ and SQ, plays pretty extensive bunch of DivX HD formats with subtitles, 1080p MKVs, .m2ts, .m4v, NTFS formatted USBs, SATA...
post #1138 of 1810
I bought the BDP-440 a few weeks ago. There was almost no info about this player to be found anywhere. So I thought I'd post my impressions, as hopefully it might be helpful to others. Bear in mind that I was primarily looking for a high res multichannel audio/music player. Video playback was a secondary concern. I had no interest in the BDP-140 as it doesn't play DVD-A discs, and the Elite is too expensive. If I'm going to pay that much for a Blu-ray player I'd rather get a superior enthusiast player from Oppo/Cambridge.

I have to say I'm both very impressed and somewhat disappointed. Impressed with it's high end audio capabilities at such a low price. Disappointed that actually using many of these audio features is way too much of a hassle: A TV is required to be connected and turned on at all times and files need to be renamed. Turning on my projector when I simply want to listen to music is out of the question, and I have no intention of re-burning dozens of flac DVD's.


Cons:

- No way of playing mp3/flac files without a TV connected and turned on. If I insert a data disc the player automatically enter a GUI mode that is impossible to navigate without a TV. There's no way of switching to the first track in the next/previous folder using the remote without a TV. It doesn't even autoplay the first track when pressing play on the remote (!).

- There's a button on the remote that supposedly lets me toggle between the CD/Stereo/5.1 layers on SACD's. It doesn't work on any of the discs I've tried. (Not much of a problem for me personally though, since it plays the 5.1 track by default and that's usually what I prefer anyway.)

- There's no button on the remote that lets me switch between different "groups" on DVD-A discs. Again a TV is required.

- The BDP-440 was advertised in EU with full flac support, yet flac files will only play if the extension is renamed to mp3 or wma. Hopefully this will be fixed in a firmware update.

- Doesn't play wma lossless audio files or ogg files.

- The remote control has to be pointed *directly* at the player or it won't work. I don't think I've ever owned such an unresponsive remote. This was really annoying when first setting the player up and adjusting various settings. But I find it to be less of a problem in daily use.

- The players display is (currently) absolutely useless, and it makes me wonder why Pioneer included a display at all. It doesn't even display the current track number when playing a CD (!).

- When I disabled the BD Live feature, there was an annoying error message displayed every time I inserted a Blu-ray disc.

- No samba (Windows networking) support.

- DVD upscaling cannot be disabled. The player will automatically scale DVD's to the Blu-ray output resolution set in the menu, but doesn't convert 50Hz to 60Hz. Very annoying for those who intend to use an external scaler for DVD's, or those who own HD TV's that only support HD resolutions at 60Hz.

- No WiFi, no component video or analog multichannel outputs.


Pros:

- DVD-A, SACD, and 24/96 multichannel flac support (extension must currently be renamed to mp3/wma). It even plays homemade SACD-R's, incorrectly authored DVD-A discs, and there's no DVD-A watermark protection

- Plays all video files I've tried so far without a problem, including 1080p mkv's with srt subtitles. (Though I hear it won't currently play mkv's with flac and DTS-HD Master Audio.)

- Terrific at reading low quality DVD/Blu-ray media without any skipping. Tried several very problematic discs that all played flawlessly. The player seems to use a very high quality laser. This is something I've come to expect from Pioneer, but I was still impressed.

- Even though it apparently doesn't have the QDEO Marvell chipset, the quality of the DVD upscaling was surprisingly good, better than my PS3 I think.

- Supports NTFS file system, at least from an USB thumbstick.

- Can be made fully region free (both Blu-ray and DVD) with a hardware mod that's very easy to install (no soldering).


All things considered I think this player is a real steal for the audiophile on a low budget. It offers DVD-A, SACD and (currently limited) flac support for less than half the price of an Oppo 93 (in my country), as well as PQLS. And it's a pretty good above average HD video player as well.

Still, those of you who doesn't care about high res music will likely find equally good video players at much lower prices from other manufacturers. And many audiophiles will be severly turned off by the fact that a TV is required in order to use most of it's high end audio features, not to mention having to rename flac files.

BTW, one thing I didn't test was video_ts/BDMV playback from folders or iso files. I don't have an external drive at hand right now, and as expected I couldn't get DLNA to work. The BDP-440 picked up my Logitech Squeezebox DLNA server, and I could browse folders fine, but there was nothing displayed inside the folders.
post #1139 of 1810
did you contact customer service?let'em know about these bugs
post #1140 of 1810
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderMyWheels View Post

I bought the BDP-440 a few weeks ago. There was almost no info about this player to be found anywhere. So I thought I'd post my impressions, as hopefully it might be helpful to others. Bear in mind that I was primarily looking for a high res multichannel audio/music player. Video playback was a secondary concern. I had no interest in the BDP-140 as it doesn't play DVD-A discs, and the Elite is too expensive. If I'm going to pay that much for a Blu-ray player I'd rather get a superior enthusiast player from Oppo/Cambridge.

I have to say I'm both very impressed and somewhat disappointed. Impressed with it's high end audio capabilities at such a low price. Disappointed that actually using many of these audio features is way too much of a hassle: A TV is required to be connected and turned on at all times and files need to be renamed. Turning on my projector when I simply want to listen to music is out of the question, and I have no intention of re-burning dozens of flac DVD's.


Cons:

- No way of playing mp3/flac files without a TV connected and turned on. If I insert a data disc the player automatically enter a GUI mode that is impossible to navigate without a TV. There's no way of switching to the first track in the next/previous folder using the remote without a TV. It doesn't even autoplay the first track when pressing play on the remote (!).

- There's a button on the remote that supposedly lets me toggle between the CD/Stereo/5.1 layers on SACD's. It doesn't work on any of the discs I've tried. (Not much of a problem for me personally though, since it plays the 5.1 track by default and that's usually what I prefer anyway.)

- There's no button on the remote that lets me switch between different "groups" on DVD-A discs. Again a TV is required.

- The BDP-440 was advertised in EU with full flac support, yet flac files will only play if the extension is renamed to mp3 or wma. Hopefully this will be fixed in a firmware update.

- Doesn't play wma lossless audio files or ogg files.

- The remote control has to be pointed *directly* at the player or it won't work. I don't think I've ever owned such an unresponsive remote. This was really annoying when first setting the player up and adjusting various settings. But I find it to be less of a problem in daily use.

- The players display is (currently) absolutely useless, and it makes me wonder why Pioneer included a display at all. It doesn't even display the current track number when playing a CD (!).

- When I disabled the BD Live feature, there was an annoying error message displayed every time I inserted a Blu-ray disc.

- No samba (Windows networking) support.

- DVD upscaling cannot be disabled. The player will automatically scale DVD's to the Blu-ray output resolution set in the menu, but doesn't convert 50Hz to 60Hz. Very annoying for those who intend to use an external scaler for DVD's, or those who own HD TV's that only support HD resolutions at 60Hz.

- No WiFi, no component video or analog multichannel outputs.


Pros:

- DVD-A, SACD, and 24/96 multichannel flac support (extension must currently be renamed to mp3/wma). It even plays homemade SACD-R's, incorrectly authored DVD-A discs, and there's no DVD-A watermark protection

- Plays all video files I've tried so far without a problem, including 1080p mkv's with srt subtitles. (Though I hear it won't currently play mkv's with flac and DTS-HD Master Audio.)

- Terrific at reading low quality DVD/Blu-ray media without any skipping. Tried several very problematic discs that all played flawlessly. The player seems to use a very high quality laser. This is something I've come to expect from Pioneer, but I was still impressed.

- Even though it apparently doesn't have the QDEO Marvell chipset, the quality of the DVD upscaling was surprisingly good, better than my PS3 I think.

- Supports NTFS file system, at least from an USB thumbstick.

- Can be made fully region free (both Blu-ray and DVD) with a hardware mod that's very easy to install (no soldering).


All things considered I think this player is a real steal for the audiophile on a low budget. It offers DVD-A, SACD and (currently limited) flac support for less than half the price of an Oppo 93 (in my country), as well as PQLS. And it's a pretty good above average HD video player as well.

Still, those of you who doesn't care about high res music will likely find equally good video players at much lower prices from other manufacturers. And many audiophiles will be severly turned off by the fact that a TV is required in order to use most of it's high end audio features, not to mention having to rename flac files.

BTW, one thing I didn't test was video_ts/BDMV playback from folders or iso files. I don't have an external drive at hand right now, and as expected I couldn't get DLNA to work. The BDP-440 picked up my Logitech Squeezebox DLNA server, and I could browse folders fine, but there was nothing displayed inside the folders.

Another great description

just to get it straight:
- the player plays all HD audio formats from compressed media but you need an .m2ts AV file in order to play Dolby True HD and DTS HD MA/HR (try any of these http://www.demo-world.eu/trailers/hi...n-trailers.php)
- the DLNA works flawlessly for me, you probably haven´t set the right media server in your computer, try Mezzmo http://www.conceiva.com/products/mezzmo/default.asp
WMP just sucks..not sure about Logitech
my BDP-440 even finds the files in my old Nokia N95 and plays them
(N95 has its own Home Network app, works pretty much as a DLNA server)
- speaking of multiregion, I know about the hardware mod option though I´m still having a hard time to get a DVD-only MR capability...no hack remotes, no firmwares like with BDP-320/430 out there...any help?
thanks
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