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Ripping Blu-Rays II - Page 133

post #3961 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Hi guys ...like many of you, i have many(hundreds) DVD's and Blurays on disk that i want to transfer to my Synology NAS(DS1812+). But the thought of doing this 1-disk at a time from my laptop (which only has a DVD player and not a BD player) is just too painful to the point of being silly. So ....


1. Is there a service that can do this for you(for a nominal fee)?

2. Can i buy or better rent a machine to do this for me? if so, suggestions welcome...

3. What is the best format to transcode these movies to? Is MKV the best as i like perfect bit-for-bit lossless transfers?


Thanks,
David
For #3 I think you meant you want a 1:1 copy as going lossless would increase your file size tremendously and gain you nothing. As far as wrapper is concerned, that depends on what device you will be using to play the file.
post #3962 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Hi guys ...like many of you, i have many(hundreds) DVD's and Blurays on disk that i want to transfer to my Synology NAS(DS1812+). But the thought of doing this 1-disk at a time from my laptop (which only has a DVD player and not a BD player) is just too painful to the point of being silly. So ....


1. Is there a service that can do this for you(for a nominal fee)?

2. Can i buy or better rent a machine to do this for me? if so, suggestions welcome...

3. What is the best format to transcode these movies to? Is MKV the best as i like perfect bit-for-bit lossless transfers?


Thanks,
David

You mention the effort involved but nothing about storage constraints so here you go -

AnyDVD HD -> Rip to Hard Disk = done
post #3963 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Hi guys ...like many of you, i have many(hundreds) DVD's and Blurays on disk that i want to transfer to my Synology NAS(DS1812+). But the thought of doing this 1-disk at a time from my laptop (which only has a DVD player and not a BD player) is just too painful to the point of being silly. So ...
Are you going to watch them all at once? Probably not, so why think you have to rip them all at once? When I started down the path of putting content on servers for streaming, like you I had hundreds of disks that I thought were begging to be ripped. I put a stake in the ground and said that from this point forward no new disks would be played and all new content would first be put on the server to be streamed for its first viewing. The older stuff would be ripped to the servers as time permitted, selecting first the disks most likely to be played again.

Well, in my case it has been several years since then and 95% of the older disks still have not been ripped because there is little to no desire to watch them again. With each month, more new content is added so that we have a backlog of new stuff to watch -- this further reduces the probability that the old content will ever be watched again. This has left me with a lot of extra time to watch new content, a lot of extra space on my servers to store new content and the nagging question of, "why do I buy all these disks in the first place". And even for the new stuff -- we've all acquired disks that were a disappointment and after viewing we knew immediately, "I'll never watch that again". I'm not shy about kicking them off the server when faced with the need to buy another HDD.

Your end goal may be completely different but what I would suggest is that you not overly sweat the process and just dive in with a dozen or so of your top disks, while putting all new content on line for first viewing. This will get you set up, running and moving forward.
post #3964 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Hi guys ...like many of you, i have many(hundreds) DVD's and Blurays on disk that i want to transfer to my Synology NAS(DS1812+). But the thought of doing this 1-disk at a time from my laptop (which only has a DVD player and not a BD player) is just too painful to the point of being silly. So ....


1. Is there a service that can do this for you(for a nominal fee)?

2. Can i buy or better rent a machine to do this for me? if so, suggestions welcome...

3. What is the best format to transcode these movies to? Is MKV the best as i like perfect bit-for-bit lossless transfers?

1. Not that I have ever heard of. There would be intellectual property/copyright issues. An individual ripping their own (and "own" is key here) titles is in a sort of grey area, but someone charging money to rip the titles of others would surely come to the attention of the IP owners ... and quickly be in the headlines.

2. Can you buy or rent a PC? Well, yeah. Would it have the (mostly) free software needed? Likely not if gotten from a chain store or name-brand online vendor. If put together for you by a small custom shop, then I'd bet that it is possible. BTW, depending on what your goal format is, ripping is one to three tools. One of them will be licensed (cost $$), but maybe on "beta" and free (for now).

3. There may be no reason to "transcode" movies. Find a Wiki or something. MKV is a container, not transcoding. You need to look at your system storage capacity and what formats the player can read. That will tell you what you need for software.
Edited by pepar - 9/12/13 at 6:08am
post #3965 of 5693
#1 No

#2 Of course you can build a computer for this purpose but it won't be automated. The best you'll get is setting up batch jobs to complete a bunch of steps while you're away.

#3 If you want a lossless transfer that would be referred to as remuxing. Transcoding is when a video is converted on the fly for a specific playback device. Encoding is when a video is converted on-demand with dedicated software.

MKV is the most capable container available that is widely used and compatible.
post #3966 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Well, in my case it has been several years since then and 95% of the older disks still have not been ripped because there is little to no desire to watch them again. With each month, more new content is added so that we have a backlog of new stuff to watch -- this further reduces the probability that the old content will ever be watched again. This has left me with a lot of extra time to watch new content, a lot of extra space on my servers to store new content and the nagging question of, "why do I buy all these disks in the first place". And even for the new stuff -- we've all acquired disks that were a disappointment and after viewing we knew immediately, "I'll never watch that again". I'm not shy about kicking them off the server when faced with the need to buy another HDD.
Ha. I just "kicked" off about 600GB of movies that the wife and I will never watch again and if we do, I'll dust off the disc and fire up the BD Player. Now I can wait until BF to pick up another 3TB drive. cool.gif
post #3967 of 5693

First of all, I would like to thank ALL of you for your comments and helpful advice to my dilemma. As many of you have surely surmised, I'm not well versed in the world and terminology of ripping shiny disks. Thank you for being patient and understanding with my noobiness.

 

It seems that I have to bite the bullet and do it on my own as no service out they does it and will not be able to do so without being legally liable. I like the idea of ripping newer(and enjoyable) disks first. My Synology NAS has 6TB of usable space with three 3TB WD RED drives. I plan to fill the remaining 5 bays with the newer 4TB drives soon so disk space is there to use.

 

 

Now, my next question is what kind of file or directory structure would you all recommend that is readily easy to use and efficient? I have CDs, SACDs, DVDA's and BR as well.

 

 

Thanks again for your understanding ...

 

 

David

post #3968 of 5693
Hi David

I may have missed it but you didn't say how you are playing these back. Are you using a computer to your TV or just on the computer or...?

There are a couple of things you may consider - are you only wanting to play back just the movie or did you want all the other items including menus and extras.

If it is just the former (movie only) then I suggest you consider working on only the movie itself via stream stripping. Normally, (talking Blu Ray here) has multiple streams that are video, audio and subtitles.
Depending on your playback, you can take out unused streams. As example you may not need any subtitles or just need to use the English subtitle. If you have a system that can play back HD audio such as DTS-Master then you may want to only save that file (within it is the core DTS stream so that will always be there for later). As for video, more often than not there is really only one video for the main movie but some discs might also have a lower resolution version as well. - Often the latter is a separate entity.

Video - save only the main movie 1080p stream
Audio - save only the best audio
Subtitle - save only the English sub if needed

By doing the above, you save some space that does add up after a few movies. The same space in your case might be enough for another CD or more.

MakeMKV can save just the main movie and the selected "streams" as described above.
If you do a full backup locally (Windows only) you can use other free tools such as TSmuxer or ClownBD to just get the files needed to generate the main movie and the select streams that you want.

The three most used "back up" tools are AnyDVD HD (Windows), DVDFab (WIndows and a bit quirky Mac port) and MakeMKV (Windows, Linux and Mac).

The entire process is not that difficult. The only time there may be challenges is if you have forced subs which means the film automatically brings up subtitles such as in Avatar when they speak the alien language. MakeMKV can also find those too as can ClownBD.

Directories -

I tend to have separate directors/folders for different types of media as well as sub directories.

Made up example

Movies/
HD Movies (1080p movies)
SD Movies (anything less than 1080)

Music/
CD Music
SACD Music
iTunes purchases
FLAC purchases (HDtracks downloaded 96/24 and 192/24 files)


There is in Synology DLNA software and such and you can set it up so it sees all your music and same for movies.

Last - if you really want all the blu ray items but want to store on your Synology you might do this instead

MakeMKV tool used

Folder NAME - TITLE OF MOVIE
inside the folder might be -
TITLE OF MOVIE (Date)
TITLE OF MOVIE EXTRAS (subfolder with all the files within named the way you like such as "deleted scene 1, 2 3 etc.)


I hope this is somewhat clear. Feel free to PM if you have questions.

Last - I see absolutely no reason to compress any Blu Ray or for that matter standard definition files unless they are to be played on an item like a tablet/iPad or similar. I rarely use Handbrake and my tools are
MakeMKV, AnyDVD HD, EAS3to, ClownBD, TSmuxer, VLC, VideoSpec, BDinfo, and odds and ends MKV tools that I almost never touch. I have 2 QNAP NAS and have emptied my media shelves quite a bit and boxed up my original discs for safe keeping.
post #3969 of 5693

Awesome help Phrehdd...

 

I have an Oppo 105 that will be used for streaming from my Synology NAS and have MakeMKV as well. Your idea of stripping out lossy audio streams and non-English subtitles is helpful indeed.

 

Thanks for the directory structure help. It seem logical and easy for me to follow, especially for music:). ..

post #3970 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Awesome help Phrehdd...

I have an Oppo 105 that will be used for streaming from my Synology NAS and have MakeMKV as well. Your idea of stripping out lossy audio streams and non-English subtitles is helpful indeed.

Thanks for the directory structure help. It seem logical and easy for me to follow, especially for music:) . ..

Blu-ray subtitles are an issue with MKV on the OPPO.

Native subtitles on DVD are VOBSUB (which OPPO supports in MKV), but on Blu-ray are PGS/SUP (which OPPO does not support in MKV).

Solutions:

(1) You can convert PGS/SUP to hidef VOBSUB with free tools.

  • extract the PGS/SUP subtitles from the Blu-ray structure with tsMuxeR (open a BDMV/.PLAYLIST/*.mpls file)
  • convert it to VOBSUB with BDSup2Sub
  • merge the VOBSUB into an new copy of the MKV with mkmerge


Drawbacks: extra work.

(2) Use M2TS containers instead of MKV.

Drawbacks: no chapters in M2TS. It is the native Blu-ray container type, but the chapter definitions are kept in other files in the directory structure.

We've requested PGS/SUP support in MKV, but this would come from Mediatak and there is no telling what they will provide.

-Bill
post #3971 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Native subtitles on DVD are VOBSUB (which OPPO supports in MKV), but on Blu-ray are PGS/SUP (which OPPO does not support in MKV).

Solutions:

(1) You can convert PGS/SUP to hidef VOBSUB with free tools.
  • extract the PGS/SUP subtitles from the Blu-ray structure with tsMuxeR (open a BDMV/.PLAYLIST/*.mpls file)
  • convert it to VOBSUB with BDSup2Sub
  • merge the VOBSUB into an new copy of the MKV with mkmerge

-Bill

My process for handling PGS/SUP subtitles is almost identical. The only difference is that I first rip to MKV and then use MKVExtract to obtain the .sup file.

However, I have one caveat on this procedure. The resulting VOBSUB conversions do indeed get displayed by the Oppo but they appear in green text with green edges and can be quite difficult to read (each character tends to merge into adjacent characters). I reported this problem to Oppo a month ago, providing a sample MKV file, and have just chased them for the status of their investigation.

David
post #3972 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

My process for handling PGS/SUP subtitles is almost identical. The only difference is that I first rip to MKV and then use MKVExtract to obtain the .sup file.

However, I have one caveat on this procedure. The resulting VOBSUB conversions do indeed get displayed by the Oppo but they appear in green text with green edges and can be quite difficult to read (each character tends to merge into adjacent characters). I reported this problem to Oppo a month ago, providing a sample MKV file, and have just chased them for the status of their investigation.

David

That doesn't happen with the process I showed.

-Bill
post #3973 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

That doesn't happen with the process I showed.

-Bill

Hi Bill,
When we discussed this topic back in June I was having problems getting tsMuxeR to work on my PC but you could see no reason why my alternative process should not also work on the Oppo (my VOBSUB conversions work fine on every software player I have tried on my PC). You speculated that there might be a bug in the Oppo firmware, which is why I have reported it to Oppo tech support.

However, I will now have another go at trying to get tsMuxeR to work. To be honest, I had forgotten about that option, so thanks for the reminder smile.gif

David
post #3974 of 5693
tsMuxeR is still not working for me though the errors may not be the same as I saw in June. However, back then I had a trial installation of AnyDVD on my PC, which has now expired. Is AnyDVD a vital prerequisite for extracting the subtitles from a Blu-ray? I don't need it to rip a Blu-ray disk when I use MakeMKV.

Incidentally, when I look at the BDMV/PLAYLIST folder on my BD version of LA Confidential I can see no less than 40 .mpls files, none of which are bigger than 2kb. Do I have to process all of these individually using tsMuxeR?

David
post #3975 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

tsMuxeR is still not working for me though the errors may not be the same as I saw in June. However, back then I had a trial installation of AnyDVD on my PC, which has now expired. Is AnyDVD a vital prerequisite for extracting the subtitles from a Blu-ray? I don't need it to rip a Blu-ray disk when I use MakeMKV.

Incidentally, when I look at the BDMV/PLAYLIST folder on my BD version of LA Confidential I can see no less than 40 .mpls files, none of which are bigger than 2kb. Do I have to process all of these individually using tsMuxeR?

David

AnyDVD is only needed if you are trying to work with a protected disc. If the disc has already had the protection removed then you do not need.
post #3976 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

tsMuxeR is still not working for me though the errors may not be the same as I saw in June. However, back then I had a trial installation of AnyDVD on my PC, which has now expired. Is AnyDVD a vital prerequisite for extracting the subtitles from a Blu-ray? I don't need it to rip a Blu-ray disk when I use MakeMKV.

Incidentally, when I look at the BDMV/PLAYLIST folder on my BD version of LA Confidential I can see no less than 40 .mpls files, none of which are bigger than 2kb. Do I have to process all of these individually using tsMuxeR?

David

It's easiest to have an unencrypted copy of the the Blu-ray itself available. This would be a BDMV/ directory structure. AnyDVD and DVDFab will do that. I recall MakeMKV has a "mirror" (?) function; does that do the same thing?

Each .mpls file is a playlist. You want just one. I use DVDFab which picks out the correct one; I know people have described how they do this with AnyDVD and other tools.

The free tools like tsMuxeR, BDSup2Sub, and mkvmerge do NOT work on encrypted Blu-rays. You need an unencrypted copy or software that mounts the disc and decrypts it on demand.

-Bill
post #3977 of 5693
I'm not sure that I can recognise an encrypted Blu-ray disk when I see one. All the BDs I've looked at so far have let me copy the disk contents (including the BDMV folder) to my PC. Does that indicate a lack of encryption?

David
post #3978 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

I'm not sure that I can recognise an encrypted Blu-ray disk when I see one. All the BDs I've looked at so far have let me copy the disk contents (including the BDMV folder) to my PC. Does that indicate a lack of encryption?

David

Assuming you had the encryption removed when you copied (which I would assume you did as pretty much this is standard) you are fine.
post #3979 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

I'm not sure that I can recognise an encrypted Blu-ray disk when I see one. All the BDs I've looked at so far have let me copy the disk contents (including the BDMV folder) to my PC. Does that indicate a lack of encryption?

David

All commercial Blu-rays are encrypted.

How did you copy them? If you had AnyDVD running then it did the decryption at that time. If not, then I don't think the other tools will work on them, perhaps explaining the errors you've seen.

Do you have a software player like vlc? If it plays the copy then you are ok.

-Bill
post #3980 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbone1026 View Post

Assuming you had the encryption removed when you copied (which I would assume you did as pretty much this is standard) you are fine.

All I have done is to use Windows Explorer under Win 7 to copy the contents of a commercial Blu-ray disk to my hard drive. This process has never generated any messages about encryption. Does that mean these disks are unencrypted or does it mean that I might have some software running in the background that might have done the decryption without my knowledge?

David

EDIT: I made this post before I saw Bill's reply above.
post #3981 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

All I have done is to use Windows Explorer under Win 7 to copy the contents of a commercial Blu-ray disk to my hard drive. This process has never generated any messages about encryption. Does that mean these disks are unencrypted or does it mean that I might have some software running in the background that might have done the decryption without my knowledge?

David

You can copy the files but they remain encrypted. Windows is not going to report that.

Have you done anything with the results? You use MakeMKV on the copied results? That will work because MakeMKV is doing the decryption. The original files remain encrypted, though.

-Bill
post #3982 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post



(2) Use M2TS containers instead of MKV.

Drawbacks: no chapters in M2TS. It is the native Blu-ray container type, but the chapter definitions are kept in other files in the directory structure.

We've requested PGS/SUP support in MKV, but this would come from Mediatak and there is no telling what they will provide.

-Bill


Hi Bill,

So since the extra work for subtitles wasnt mentioned in the M2TS section, does that mean that subtitles, especially forced subs, are handled "more easily" by the Oppo and other media players? Or are we still left with figuring out all the intricacies of getting forced subs into our rips. I REALLY want to take all of my full ISOs and rip them down to a single M2TS or MKV file, but not fully understanding how to reliably and easily rip the forced subs has kept me from going down that path.
I have looked at MakeMKV and ClownBD but still don't really get how I can know which subtitle boxes to check, etc.

So does ripping to M2TS help somehow in this regard, or is the subtitle work basically the same?
Edited by hifiaudio2 - 9/13/13 at 8:22am
post #3983 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

Hi Bill,

So since the extra work for subtitles wasnt mentioned in teh M2TS section, does that mean that subtitles, especially forced subs, and handled "more easily" by the Oppo and other media players? Or are we still left with figuring out all the intricacies of getting forced subs into our rips. I REALLY want to take all of my full ISOs and rip them down to a single M2TS or MKV file, but not fully understanding how to reliably and easily rip the forced subs has kept me from going down that path.
I have looked at MakeMKV and ClownBD but still don't really get how I can know which subtitle boxes to check, etc.

So does ripping to M2TS help somehow in this regard, or is the subtitle work basically the same?

I'm going to let someone else handle that because I haven't followed the "forced" discussions.

-Bill
post #3984 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

You can copy the files but they remain encrypted. Windows is not going to report that.

Have you done anything with the results? You use MakeMKV on the copied results? That will work because MakeMKV is doing the decryption. The original files remain encrypted, though.

-Bill

I normally run MakeMKV on the original disk, without copying it to my hard drive. I copied some of my BDs to the computer before I started using MakeMKV but only one of these is still in place. VLC can play the primary m2ts file so I guess it was copied while I still had AnyDVD active. I will now try to identify which of the 19 available mpls files is the one I should open in tsMuxeR. Perhaps some of my errors have been due to opening the wrong mpls file.

Is there any chance that MakeMKV can take the place of AnyDVD for the purpose of decrypting mpls files?

David
post #3985 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

I normally run MakeMKV on the original disk, without copying it to my hard drive.

What did you do when you "ran" it on the original disc ... if you didn't copy?
Quote:
Is there any chance that MakeMKV can take the place of AnyDVD for the purpose of decrypting mpls files?

David

MakeMKV, AnyDVD HD and a few DVDFab products all decrypt.

Jeff
post #3986 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

What did you do when you "ran" it on the original disc ... if you didn't copy?
MakeMKV, AnyDVD HD and a few DVDFab products all decrypt.

Jeff

Hi Jeff,
I used MakeMKV to create an MKV version of the original Blu-ray. This process does, of course, copy and decrypt information from the BD but I don't end up with a clone of the BDMV folder on my hard drive - unlike a simple copy via Windows Explorer.

I am aware that MakeMKV decrypts a BD while creating an MKV but I was specifically wondering whether it also has the ability to extract the mpls files and save them on my hard disk in decrypted form. I have not had time yet to check this for myself.

David
post #3987 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

Hi Jeff,
I used MakeMKV to create an MKV version of the original Blu-ray. This process does, of course, copy and decrypt information from the BD but I don't end up with a clone of the BDMV folder on my hard drive - unlike a simple copy via Windows Explorer.

I am aware that MakeMKV decrypts a BD while creating an MKV but I was specifically wondering whether it also has the ability to extract the mpls files and save them on my hard disk in decrypted form. I have not had time yet to check this for myself.

David

David, I am not a MakeMKV user, so I don't know if it works like that. Why would you want the .mpls files on your hard drive? They are the playlists that tell the players what .m2ts files to play and in what order.
post #3988 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

David, I am not a MakeMKV user, so I don't know if it works like that. Why would you want the .mpls files on your hard drive? They are the playlists that tell the players what .m2ts files to play and in what order.

If you check back a few posts in this thread you will see that I am trying to emulate a process used by Bill McClain for converting PGS/SUP subtitles to VOBSUB as my current process has bugs.

David
post #3989 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

If you check back a few posts in this thread you will see that I am trying to emulate a process used by Bill McClain for converting PGS/SUP subtitles to VOBSUB as my current process has bugs.

David

Ok, but you need a decrypted BDMV folder structure for that. The .mpls files are playlists. They are no good without the other files. They don't contain the subtitles.

Since you already have experience with it, the easiest thing would be to renew your license to AnyDVD. You can either copy the BR disc to your hard drive or work on it directly when it is mounted by AnyDVD.

-Bill
post #3990 of 5693
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Since you already have experience with it, the easiest thing would be to renew your license to AnyDVD. You can either copy the BR disc to your hard drive or work on it directly when it is mounted by AnyDVD.

-Bill
+1
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