Help! Sub choice for under $900: Rythmik vs Hsu vs Epik (yet again) - Page 3

Originally Posted by benclement11

uhhhhh....how do you figure that isn't a truck bed liner finish? It looks exactly like truck bed lining. My point is...if you want a nice finish...the sub costs just as much as the competitors. I'm a little tired of the bang for buck argument. It isn't any cheaper unless you get that ugly matte finish. Yes Purevils subs look nice. They cost just as much as the competitors sub.
I'm not saying that it isn't a good sub. Let's stop pretending they are this huge bargain and you're saving sooooo much money. Lots of manufactures give you price breaks when you buy multiples. You two make me feel like I've taken crazy pills.

Originally Posted by tesseract67

Where did this figure come from? Seems like you've added at least 35 lbs. Info I get says 140lbs. shipped.

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

So show me a better deal on an 18" sealed sub........

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

This recently posted picture of a stock A7S-450 looks pretty nice to me! http://i611.photobucket.com/albums/t...o/IMG_9573.jpg

No truck bedliner there, just a nicely finished sub, recessed driver, powerful amp, and sweet price!

If you need two, they are even less!

Originally Posted by benclement11

why does it have to be an 18" sub? You don't think a 15" sub in the same price category can outperform it?

The F15SE costs $1099 plus shipping
An ED in gloss black costs $1020 plus shipping.

Is the ED that much better? How do you know? I'm not saying it is. I'm not saying it isn't. BUT, I bet there isn't that big of a difference. I'd be willing to bet that the Rythmik sounds cleaner. I also like the look of the Rythmik more than the ED. I'd be happy with either sub...but come on dude. If it was such a killer deal, everyone would buy an ED.

Originally Posted by benclement11

Yeah, that shows to his credibility right? Shipping weight is 140lbs. I'd imagine that that it probably weighs closer to 130. Which still makes it a heft sub. But, 165 pounds? Come on dude? Next he'll be trying to convince us that it grabs him beers from the fridge.

Originally Posted by tesseract67

You should get a couple of them, they would blow your little 12" subs away!

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

"Little 12" subs"?

Sound And Vision said:

..is a true rock and roll subwoofer
..it plays loud and it goes fairly deep
..with enough power to rattle the room
..was our dollars-to dB champ

An independent third party reviewer had this to say about a pair of LFM-1EX subs:

..the Outlaws are rocking the house totally
..these guys can SHAKE a room
..these are one excellent product

It was based on the pro review and the independent third party glowing review that I decided to purchase my Outlaw subs. Oh yeah, care to guess who the third party reviewer was?..........wait for it..........he went by the forum name of Craigsub!

Originally Posted by tesseract67

I am sure your little 12's are fine, they just can't run with the big dogs we are discussing here.



The irony here is just too much! If you like the Outlaws, imagine what the same third party reviewer's (craigsub) dual 18's sound like. Imagine is all you can do until you actually get a pair and listen to them.

It would be interesting to see which subs you preferred in a blind shootout, FPB.

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

Dude, I just crushed you! Your boss LOVED my subs!! Unfortunately I won't be buying any of his, there are just too many better deals out there, IMO. Sorry!

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

"Little 12" subs"?

Sound And Vision said:

..is a true rock and roll subwoofer
..it plays loud and it goes fairly deep
..with enough power to rattle the room
..was our dollars-to dB champ

An independent third party reviewer had this to say about a pair of LFM-1EX subs:

..the Outlaws are rocking the house totally
..these guys can SHAKE a room
..these are one excellent product


It was based on the pro review and the independent third party glowing review that I decided to purchase my Outlaw subs. Oh yeah, care to guess who the third party reviewer was?..........wait for it..........he went by the forum name of Craigsub!

Originally Posted by yadfgp

So wait a minute... you're so obsessed with 3rd party reviews, that you bought a sub based off of a 3rd party review from a guy whose sub you will not buy? You trust his opinion so much that you'll buy a sub based off of his review of it, but you won't buy a sub from this same guy who's opinion you value so much?

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

Dude, I just crushed you! Your boss LOVED my subs!! Unfortunately I won't be buying any of his, there are just too many better deals out there, IMO. Sorry!

Originally Posted by MasonS

The funny thing about that is the CHT 18.1 is at the same price point and I have read in a few reviews, shootouts and GTGs that its a better overall sub than the A7s. It goes as loud, a bit deeper and is more musical as well. Its uglier than the A7s imo but that aside, if I only had $875 to spend on a single sub I would choose the 18.1 over the A7s after reading the many reviews here and on other audio forums.

Originally Posted by yadfgp

Same here. If anyone can recall over the last year or so, how much I've obsessed over whether I should buy a CHT sub or the A7S-450. In the end though, I've settled on CHT subs. There was some minor hiccups at first when the company got started up, but that happens with pretty much everybody. The latest versions of his subs look great in my opinion. And the overwhelmingly positive reviews they keep getting are what sold me over. All I'm waiting for now is for the new CHT VS ported subs to come out. Which should be within the next couple of weeks or so. Once they do I'll finally be able to kick my MFW's to the curb.

Originally Posted by benclement11

I didn't know he was making a ported sub. I'm looking forward to seeing what it looks like. Someone on this forum needs to win the lottery, buy all the subs we fight over and spend months testing and retesting them. I know below90hz and his bro did a great test. But still, people were not satisfied. If someone had the time and equipment to run every test imaginable, we could put this all to bed. It would be sweet to be a multi millionaire and buy every single sub in all the major ID companies line-ups. Dream a little dream with me.

Originally Posted by MasonS

Oh I have also had this dream, it would have made my choice sooooo much easier had I had a list like that. Plus how awesome would it be to hear all these subs in action :drool:

Originally Posted by benclement11


We know Michael Duxter, you have heard every sub. ED is the best for the money. But, that doesn't mean it is the best. I'd put a F15 or F15HP up against your ED and maybe to some people the difference in performance(whatever that difference is) is worth the extra money. "For the money" is only key if you are trying to make "bang for buck" which has nothing to do with "A" is better than "B".
When did you hear a CHT 18.2? I'm surprised you traded a Submersive in for an ED...unless you heard someone else's sub.

Lets not forget that if you want anything other than a truck bed liner finish... you have to pay more, which puts you right in line with the brands that compete with it on performance and price. That knocks a little hold in your "bang for buck" argument. I don't doubt that it may be the best sub you have heard at its price point. BUT, there are a lot of good subs missing from that list of yours.

Originally Posted by MasonS

The funny thing about that is the CHT 18.1 is at the same price point and I have read in a few reviews, shootouts and GTGs that its a better overall sub than the A7s. It goes as loud, a bit deeper and is more musical as well. Its uglier than the A7s imo but that aside, if I only had $875 to spend on a single sub I would choose the 18.1 over the A7s after reading the many reviews here and on other audio forums.

Originally Posted by dominguez1

Since they did not FR match the subs, their SQ comparisons were largely influenced by the different FR responses each sub exhibited. So when the claim is made that one sub has a better SQ over the other, it's primarily because of the reviewers preference for the FR of that particular sub in that particular room, not necessarily it's SQ.

Here's an example that may make more sense: Blind fold the listener. Tell him that you're testing 5 different subs. Take 1 sub and hook it up to a 12 band sub EQ. Play the same song/movie 5 different times. Each time, adjust the FR bands slightly. At the end of the comparison, the listener will claim that the first time perhaps it sounded tighter, the second time perhaps it had great extension, the third time perhaps a lot of mid bass slam, etc. etc. At the end of it, the listener will pick a 'perceived sub' that had the best sound quality. They are really just picking the FR he preferred as set by the EQ.

Now, for the shootouts, there were a lot more variables they considered like output, transient response, etc. so the above example is not exactly the same. However, you can see how the different FRs could largely influence their preference for SQ. This is why it is important to FR match the subs to really make it an apples to apples comparison.

Originally Posted by runnin'

Uh, the thread starter posted his selection and left this thread a few days ago.

Originally Posted by tesseract67

1. Can you back this up with some in room measurements? It would be nice to put some numbers to your subjective impressions.

Look here http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/con...e-subwoofers-6

Now add 3db for duals, or 6db if co-located, not bad for $1098 delivered!

2. Craig is not my boss. I am a volunteer on his site, I do it for love of the hobby and respect for what he is doing for the audio community.

Good for you, no comment on Craig!

3. As far as "deals" I would say that is relative. Many hobbyists would take exception to your ideal of a bargain sub. We wouldn't be having this discussion if you could just state your view as opinion, rather than emphatically insist your view is fact... in thread after thread.

Did you not see the disclaimer IMO in my post? I feel there are many better deals out there at the moment, which is why I'll be looking elsewhere.

4. You left out (intentionally?) the most important part of my quote: "It would be interesting to see which subs you preferred in a blind shootout, FPB. I bet the CraigSub, eD, or Rythmik would pound the cr*p out of your subs, sorry."

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

It would be nice to see you state that this comment is YOUR OPINION, nothing more. Twin LFM-1EX subs have 12 inch drivers, which is more area than a single 15 inch sub, and is roughly comparable to an 18 inch one. Twin 350 watt amps are more powerful when combined than the amp in a single CS or Rythmik sub, but not the eD, which is why it is on my short list. I prefer to upgrade to a pair of subs, and I need them to be so much better than what I have now to be what I consider a worthwhile upgrade (twin MBM subs, twin LFE subs, SMS-1).

Originally Posted by MKtheater

FBP, there is more to a sub than it wattage you know. The subs sensitivity will help determine how much power it needs. The eD sub needs 1200 watts to reach it's limits and the CHT subs need 500 watts to reach theirs. Just because one has more watts does not mean it is more powerful. Besides, I have owned many subs and once you have enough headroom(spl's) and FR's that are the same it is more about extension, WAF, and price. The subs start to sound more similar than different once you match the frequencies.

Originally Posted by floridapoolboy

Yes, I am aware of that, thanks. I'm also aware that subs tend to sound more alike than most would think, as long as they are not being overdriven. That is the root of my issue, I'm not overdriving mine, which makes an upgrade path more difficult. There are many subs out now sporting huge drivers and boasting of huge numbers, I'll take a wait and see approach until the smoke clears and the reviews are in. It's easy to forget that just a few short years ago 12" ported subs were all the rage, with Hsu, SVS, etc. selling them as their flagship models.