Panasonic TC - P50GT25 - Image Retention / Burn-In

Hello,

I purchased a Panasonic P50GT25 plasma this past February. I made sure to run it though its 'burn-in' period for over 100 hours and, overall, have been having great luck with it.

I recently built a new PC to hook up to it and played FALLOUT 3 on it this past week. I probably played for about 4 or 5 hours straight one night and noticed image retention from the in-game HUD. I ran the wipes many, many times and it didn't work. Then today I ran 'static noise' and that didn't do anything either. I ran this for at least 6 hours.

At this point, I think its burned in - which is ridiculous considering how little I played. Basically, I'm looking for advice on:

1. How to fix it, if that's possible.

2. What to tell Panasonic to make them fix it or replace it. I noticed in their 'warranty' it doesn't cover image retention.

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards

I've been running a static noise loop, but it doesn't seem to help. Do you think it would be better to run the red, green, blue, white, and gray color slides instead?

Hello,

To update: the image retention is still present, even after running constant snow and/or white bar wipes for 12+ hours per day. It does not appear to have diminished.

I've been in contact with Panasonic technical support in regard to this matter and have sent them a detailed email in hopes of finding a resolution to the issue. A portion of this email, along with images, is included below for reference. Hopefully, if someone else has this same issue, it will help.

I'll update this thread with any information and/or fix information I receive from Panasonic.

Thanks again for all your responses and suggestions.

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Images & Descriptions

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/5264/ironwhite01sm.jpg

http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/7...nwhite02sm.jpg

These two images show the image retention the most clearly. You can easily see the letters CND and AP, in addition to some lines. They appear almost pink on the white background.

Despite running the white bar sweep and black and white static for over two weeks, the image retention remains unaffected. I've been running the static and/or swipes for up to 12 hours per day.

http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/7048/irimageonsm.jpg

As requested, this shows the image retention on top of an active image. Its less visible, due to the object obstruction, however AP can still clearly be discerned. I've noticed that the retention seems most visible on green, white, and blue imagery.

http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/1...ionnoise01.jpg

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/919...ionnoise02.jpg

Additionally, I noticed that solid white shapes, in general, appear distorted and slightly offset. This is most noticeable in the white sweep bar. Please refer to image 02 on the inside, right-side of the bar. You can see it looks like a wavy, squiggly linear distortion. In image 01 you can see how the white line doesn't 'register' properly on the left side and appears gray.

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/5...rnoise01sm.jpg

http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/480...rnoise02sm.jpg

http://img546.imageshack.us/img546/7...rnoise03sm.jpg

These images all show the excessive amount of noise in solid colors. A friend of mine who has the 42" model of this TV took note of this and said this was very excessive. His TV doesn't have this amount of noise or the other issues detailed above.

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I have an update. Panasonic has reviewed the images I posted and notified me that the excessive noise and image retention are a result of a bad component.

They are sending a representative from Advisory TV and Radio Labs to repair the television on Monday. I'll be sure to update again then.

In the interim, I've been continuing to run white bar swipes and static noise. Unfortunately, the image retention has not diminished at all.

Has anyone else had similar issues with this model Panasonic plasma?

Hi Randy,

I think that particular image you post is slightly out of focus. Here is a clearer one - noise still very apparent:



The tech I spoke to on the phone said the 'bad component' causing the noise likely also caused the image retention/burn-in.

My concern at this point is that they could still say that image retention is not covered in the warranty, even though the panel is obviously defective and the IR was caused by defective parts. He assured me that "I would be taken care of," but I'm a bit leery.

If you have any other suggestions on how I should deal with this, please let me know.

Thanks

I have another update. Today, an authorized Panasonic technician was sent to evaluate my problem. Panasonic had not sent him any of the case history and I had to go through each point of my problem from the beginning. He thought he was there to check out "buzzing" emitted from the TV.

1. Noise - He didn't seem concerned with this and even said that my friends 42" model may not show it as much because its smaller. I tend to disagree and still feel its big a performance issue. I looked at other plasmas in the store this weekend and none had this problem - even the Panasonic models.

2. Image Retention - Again, I had to explain to him that I did in fact run the color slides for over 100 hours, played the game on a low brightness settings (the panel's 'Game' mode) for only 3 - 5 hours, and ran the TV static and white bar wipe repeatedly in Vivid mode for weeks without any positive results.

I have to say, it gets really annoying that every person you speak to automatically assumes you screwed up and the problem with the TV is your fault.

Basically, he said he is going to order a board (which is on back order, of course) that helps the screen refresh when changing images or channels. He didn't say what the exact part was. If I can find out, I'll post it here.

When I asked if this would fix the noise and image retention, he was evasive. He did say if it works, it would be apparent 24 hours after the part was replaced. He also took this opportunity to remind me that Panasonic's warranty does not cover image retention and that Panasonic will do everything in its power to avoid actually having to replace a bad panel. I pointed out to him that it was told to me by a Panasonic tech that it was likely that the image retention (and noise) was caused by a bad component and, as such, should be covered. He just shrugged.

If anyone has any suggestions on how I should proceed, please let me know. I feel like this is going to be a whole summer of back-and-forth between myself and Panasonic - ending with them weaseling out of any responsibility.

Oh ya, did I mention that I had to take a half day off of work because the techs don't do weekends?

I should have kept my Sony KD-34XBR960. . . .

Hello,

I have another update. There has been a lot of back-and-forth in the past week, so I'll do my best to summarize.

6/20/2011 - Panasonic telephone technical support told me that the excessive noise was caused by a faulty A-BOARD and that Advisory TV would replace this board on-site within two weeks. In addition to the noise, it was also thought that this would help fix the image retention - this was told to me by the on-site service tech during his visit.

6/24/2011 - I received an email from Advisory TV stating the following:

"I sent your pix to Panasonic for review and I was told to make arrangement to p/u your set; Panasonic wants to evaluate the unit ( we can offer you a loaner tv; while yours is being address)."

6/28/2011 - After confirming information in the email from Advisory TV with Panasonic, I scheduled the pickup for this Friday, July 1st. I had to confirm since this was the complete opposite of what Panasonic telephone support (and Advisory TV) told me only a few days prior.

6/29/2011 - Today, I received another email from Advisory TV stating the following:

"Just received a call from our Panasonic field rep:

Technical engineering at Panasonic had re-reviewed your pictures that I had forwarded to them and it has been determined that the TV is within factory specs.

Due to this decision we are not going to be picking up your unit for further evaluation.

If you have any questions you must call Panasonic directly 800-211-7262"

Basically, this means they aren't going to fix my TV at all because it has been 're-re-reviewed' - I say this because this is the third 'review' by my count.

I did speak with Panasonic after receiving this email and they are investigating what is going on. According to their records, the TV is still flagged as an off-site repair. Supposedly, I'll be hearing back from them today. If I do (or do not) hear from them, I'll post here.

I have to say this has been one of the most distasteful experiences I've ever had with a product and it really makes me reevaluate my opinion that Panasonic is a reliable, trustworthy brand.

Hi Kidhorn,

Actually, I can see the noise from across the room. I had my PS3 last night and noticed a huge amount of noise in the default menu - which looks sort of like washes of color, with whitish, wave ares - see below for an example of the menu, not the noise:



In those white areas, I could see the color noise 'dancing' throughout. So, it is very apparent and excessive. I took closeups because you wouldn't be able to see it otherwise with my iPhone camera.

In the second part of your message, I assume you're referring to the image retention. I cannot see any IR when the TV is off, so I think what you have is different from mine. I can say that when I was watching my 2001 Blu-Ray that I could see the IR very, very clearly in the end scenes - which really ruins the movie. The noise also was very distracting.



In short, the TV is defective. I'm going to take RandyWalters assessment over yours considering that he has 10000+ posts and more experience. No offense though, I do appreciate your input.

Best Regards

Hello,

To reiterate, there are two issues with the television:

1. Image Retention
2. Excessive noise in the picture

Replacing the A-BOARD was supposed to address the excessive noise in the picture.

While the tech from Advisory TV was evaluating the television, he mentioned that it also had something to do with 'clearing' the image when changing channels or updating images. In effect, if it was defective, it would have a direct impact on the image retention. Whether replacing it would fix the damage if it was already done is another question entirely.

Best Regards

Hello,

I wouldn't be as concerned about the image retention if it appeared after many hours of game playing - not 3 to 5 hours or if it eventually slightly disappeared with the use of white static noise and the white bar sweeps.

I'm going to want to play a video game again and this will continue to happen - damaging the picture and become more and more distracting.


There sure is too much noise and Panasonic would have agreed with you twice in their first two reviews - too bad the third 'review' deemed it within spec. I'm supposed to hear back from them today, but my hopes are low.

Also, I noticed something else odd - when watching movies the screen's contrast fades and then comes back. Its usually only a second long. Who knows what the hell that is.

To help show you the IR, here is an image of it with the levels boosted by 20%. This better represents what I'm seeing on the screen:



Again, this is after 3 to 5 hours (max) of playing one video game. The bigger issue is that this will continue to happen and the white sweep and tv static has NO EFFECT on it. This looks just as bad as it did a month ago. I ran sweeps and static for weeks and weeks. Simply: it will get worse.

The noise is pretty evident, so I'm not sure how you're not seeing it. I do appreciate you playing devil's advocate though.

I'll update later today once I hear from Panasonic.

Gray is used a lot in television and movies. Again, this is after 3-5 hours of gameplay and it doesn't disappear at all. That isn't a good sign and its an indication that the TV is defective. My friend has the 42" model and plays games all afternoon sometimes - much longer than 5 hours. There is zero image retention in his case. His TV also doesn't show excessive noise.


Yes, I read about that after the fact. I haven't played any games before or since this happened though. I've been working on trying (in vain) to fix it with wipes/tv static noise and full-screen content.


Yes, as stated in my post yesterday, I noticed it very clearly when watching 2001 on Blu-Ray and at various times during other films/TV shows.

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UPDATE FROM PANASONIC:

They are going to pickup the TV to review it. The way it was explained to me was that they had the model number's confused - the last tech that reviewed my case thought I had a Panasonic Viera TC-P50S2. I find that confusing considering that I sent the sales receipt and multiple emails with the model number clearly referenced. I also registered the TV, which is the only reason I'm getting any support - it is under warranty.

It was further explained to me that the noise would be acceptable on an S2, but not a GT25. Again, that confuses me.

We'll see how it goes and I'll be sure to update as things progress.

That remains to be seen. I'll believe it when the TV is completely fixed and sitting in my living room.


I'm not sure what you're talking about here.


I guess so. That seems really odd to me. I thought lesser models had less features - like 3D - not poorer picture quality.

I guess I don't know what you mean by intolerance.

Advisory TV is scheduled to pick it up tomorrow to evaluate and fix the problems, whatever they may be.

The problem is that this is a twofold issue: excessive noise and image retention. I believe the image retention to be a result of the TV operating out of spec. However, Panasonic doesn't warranty image retention and I'm not sure if they would even if it was due to a faulty component.

Maybe they will shock me and fix the whole thing. So far though, despite the representative's I've dealt with at Panasonic being very nice, the company itself hasn't followed through on anything. i.e. - saying "we will take responsibility for and fix both of the issues you are having with your TV in timely fashion" So far its just been saying one thing, then doing another or just changing their mind entirely.

Hi Ian,

Thank you for your post. I agree with most of what your saying, but I JUST bought this set in late February - which is why I'm really fighting this. If this had happened two years down the road, that would be another story.

I have no problem with temporary image retention (the kind that disappears over time), however, this is very, very permanent - again, one of the reasons I'm pushing Panasonic for answers and for them to own up and fix the problem. I still can't believe that it hasn't faded at all. I ran that static and wipes for days on end.

What are the C2's you're referring to?

Best Regards,
Phil