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The Plains Theater - Page 33

post #961 of 1535
Thread Starter 
This is along the lines of what Tony is suggesting. That is, buy a 14' screen, and just mask it down if I need to. It's certainly an option I'm considering.
post #962 of 1535
Two weeks since a picture. How about some tape, mud, and prime? Were you contracting that out as well?
post #963 of 1535
Thread Starter 
I can always count on Fred to keep me honest smile.gif Progress has been slow. They did get the drywall finished, and I managed to get in there and sweep and mop most of the dust up. BTW, a box fan with an HVAC filter (or 2) taped to the front does a great job of getting a lot of the dust that gets stirred up. Make sure you keep the room sealed up until all the dust settles, though.

I started working on my threshold to the room since the flooring guys left me with a rough edge at the doorway, but I haven't got it finished yet. I'm hoping I'll have some time later this week. Between work, school, and chasing tricycle motors, it's been a crazy couple of weeks. I'm glad to have all the opportunities, though. I'd much rather be so busy it's hard to keep up than the alternative smile.gif Although, now that I think about it, the alternative would be working on my theater........ I better not think about it biggrin.gif
post #964 of 1535
Nice house. Looking forward to seeing the finished theater.
post #965 of 1535
Thread Starter 
Thanks smile.gif We are still extremely happy with our house. There's really very little we would change about it, which I think is probably the best way to judge something like that.

And yep, I'm looking forward to a finished theater, too smile.gif I like the journey and all, but this is a case where I'd really like to be at the destination biggrin.gif
post #966 of 1535
Thread Starter 
I got my threshold in, but now I'm having some second thoughts about it. It's 3/4" above the floor, which is the same height that the threshold for an exterior door is above the threshold, but this one is pretty wide to cover where the flooring guys were sloppy. Do you guys think this will be a trip hazard? I could probably put a 3/8" chamfer along the edge instead of the round over I have now. It's not nailed down, so I can still tweak it a bit. Obviously there will be a door casing on either side, so it should stick out past the door casing.





If a wide threshold like this turns out to be an issue, the only other solution I can think of is not one I cherish the idea of. That would be to take up a section of the flooring, and run it up to the door like it should have been the first time. This would require refinishing the entire landing....

I'm open to suggestions!

EDIT: Apparently I really need to clean the floor. I'm sure I'll get to that any day now smile.gif
post #967 of 1535
I have to say that I was under the impression that you would be making the threshold flush with the oak flooring in the first place and not placing it on top of the flooring.

I'd get a sharp pencil, draw a line on the finished floor from jamb to jamb and make your absolute best and straightest cut possible. You might even consider scrapping this piece of threshold, cutting one off square and then using an oscillating tool to cut out the bottom part of the door. That way you can hammer home the whole threshold completely flush underneath the door. Make sense?

EDIT - I guess if you recessed the threshold so it's flush with the finished flooring that would necessitate removing and remounting the door lower so your gap is the same as it is now and not 3/4" taller. A bit more work, but something to consider if you want to make it perfect from finished floor to threshold to theater carpet.....
post #968 of 1535
Can that threshold be ripped or planed thinner? I don't think I'd be terribly satisfied with it the way you've got it there, but I wouldn't pull up finished flooring to fix it.
post #969 of 1535
Thread Starter 
Here's a shot of the edge of the hardwood. It's just uneven enough to be a problem. I think it would stand out like a sore thumb if I just put a piece of wood across there. I thought about cutting it square, but I can't get a skill saw in there to do it. I suppose I could try with a jig saw, but then I'll have to deal with the gap around the door frame, and as you said TMcG, I'd probably need to pull the door out, and cut down the jamb to get the bottom of the door where it needs to be.



We actually have an exterior door that goes into our attic (all the doors going into our attic spaces are sealed like an exterior door), and the threshold on it is about 3/4" above the flooring. That's what I used for a reference when I hung this one. Hmmmm..... lots of options, but I'm afraid I don't like any of them (even the one I chose to start with smile.gif )

Assuming i can get a jig saw in there, and get a blade that will cut into the subfloor without pushing the saw around too much, I guess I could put in a piece flush, and then put a more traditional T-mold directly under the door to give the door something to seal against. It would only be a about 4" wide instead of the 7-1/2" I have now, and it would be centered under the door rather than like it is now. What do you guys think?

Here's a shot of the door going into our attic for reference.

post #970 of 1535
Yeah, it would have been ideal had you had a piece of 3/4" plywood or something to represent the threshold for the flooring guys to go tight against.

Exploring the cutting option a bit further.....the extra generous gap they left you on the return of that wood on both sides has really screwed you out of being able to just even up what's there, so what I was saying is that you would draw a line from the outside edge of the jamb to the outside edge of the jamb to get your reference mark. To make things easier on yourself I would actually blue tape that whole area after you clean up that dirty floor biggrin.gif so the line is easier to see and you can avoid marring the finish with tools in subsequent steps. I would then remove the door and jamb entirely to give you a bit of room to work. Now, pin nail or take an 18 gauge nailer to install a straight piece of plywood directly on top of your finished floor which you can then use as a guide to run your circular saw to make almost all of the cut. The blue tape will also protect the floor from chips and scratches from the circular saw (as you probably already know). I would then remove the straight piece of plywood, pull the nails and reposition it along the cut line itself so I could finish with my oscillating saw. Install the new square threshold and fill any small gaps with wood putty and stain to match. Reinstall the door and *POOF!* - within a few weeks of ball-busting and completely unsatisfying work you'll be done! tongue.gif Thoughts?
post #971 of 1535
This is how I would do it, which I think is the same thing you were pointing out on the attic door:



Although I don't think a jig saw will be your friend on this one. A Fein tool would be a godsend on this. However, you could do as much as you could with a circular saw (using a straight edge to keep the cut straight) and finish up with a japanese saw. Shouldn't be bad at all considering the saw can run past the outside of the door jamb.

Or you could just purchase an aluminum threshold from Zero. The even make one 6" deep with the sound gasketing.

Tim

Edit: Err yeah, what TMcG said smile.gif
Edited by Mr.Tim - 6/7/13 at 4:48pm
post #972 of 1535
Thread Starter 
Thanks guys! I think the only thing still missing is what the door will seal against. The door is designed to have a threshold that is about 3/4" above the floor. If I cut the door jambs down so that the door will seal against the floor, I think it will wear out my carpet. I was going for something like the aluminum thresholds that Mr. Tim linked to, just out of hardwood instead of aluminum. I think the big difference is the bevel at each end.

This may be what Mr. Tim is getting at, but let's say I put in the flat stock like TMcG and Mr. Tim are recommending so that my floor runs all the way from the outside edge of the door jamb to the inside edge of the door jamb. Any reason I can't make a beveled piece similar to the one on the attic door pictured above? That would give the door bottom something to seal against and keep the seals off of the carpet on the inside of the room. Something like this, except without the sweep.



BTW, I really appreciate the input!
post #973 of 1535
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

Any reason I can't make a beveled piece similar to the one on the attic door pictured above?
Why not just cut a bevel into the piece you've got and be done with it? I think I must've missed something here... The threshold you've got is functionally perfect, yes? If the concern is the abrupt edge (not the overall height) being a trip hazard, can you cut a bevel?
post #974 of 1535
Thread Starter 
Oh yeah, I can cut a bevel on it. I'm just second guessing the thing now. I can't imagine it being any more of a trip hazard than the Zero thresholds with the acoustic seals. Maybe even less so.
post #975 of 1535
There's a few ways you can address it. As long as you get the look and functionality you want, any way is acceptable. I like the flush look that I detailed (I would probably even but the zero threshold with seal on top of the stock I used to fit in the gap). But really the aesthetics are all you, man!

Tim
post #976 of 1535
Aren't you using the automatic door bottom seal from Zero International? http://www.zerointernational.com/content.aspx?p=77 If you aren't . . . then you should.

The door seal can either be surface-mounted to the theater side of the door and drop down tight on the Oak threshold (assuming you go the route of removing the door, cutting down the jambs and reinstalling) . . . OR . . . you can router out a recess in the bottom of the door so the automatic door bottom drops down when shut and lifts up into the door when it opens. This second way is the preferred method IMHO. You could add the Zero International Model 564 door threshold for a few extra STC of acoustic sealing power, but you'll already be 90%+ of the way there with the automatic door bottom alone.

The sweep lifts up the moment the door opens, so there is no concern with anything dragging against the carpet, and the jamb only needs to be to the depth of where you put the automatic door bottom -either directly under the door if you recess the unit or extending a bit more toward the theater if you surface-mount the unit. No bevel is needed!!! This is especially true since you can build your riser the exact height that is needed to leave 1/2" to 3/4" for the height of the carpet and pad to give you a 100% smooth transition from theater carpet to Oak threshold to Oak flooring with no difference in height, no bevel and full acoustic sealing with the door bottom.
post #977 of 1535
TMcG is describing what I'm planning. I'll mount the door bottom inside the theater instead of mortised because iirc the stc tests better that way.
post #978 of 1535
Thread Starter 
I had not planned to use those because I will have interlocking doors. It seemed overkill, particularly with how well the door seals now.
post #979 of 1535
Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post

TMcG is describing what I'm planning. I'll mount the door bottom inside the theater instead of mortised because iirc the stc tests better that way.

Fred,

Can you tell us how much better the STC rating is? I have the "best" seals and I was leaning towards mortising for aesthetics but I don't want to shoot myself in the foot just for looks.
post #980 of 1535
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

I had not planned to use those because I will have interlocking doors. It seemed overkill, particularly with how well the door seals now.

JPA,

By interlocking doors you mean a double door system? I am also doing double doors but still went with the seals. The impression I get from the experts is that the interior door is much more important. Once sound gets past the interior door it will also makes its way to flanking paths in every possible direction. But, the seals are extremely expensive and everyone has to decide how to best spend the money available. I definitely understand that.

Edit:
There is a post somewhere in Vik's thread describing some disappointment after firing up his Orbit Shifter bc there was quite a bit of sound getting out of the theater. They discovered a very small gap around the casing or somewhere around the door I don't remember exactly. Anyway, after sealing this very small gap he said it made a significant difference. Maybe I can find the post. I guess just do what you can to make the best seal possible is all I was offering up which is admittedly a "well duh" thing to say.
Edited by jedimastergrant - 6/8/13 at 8:40am
post #981 of 1535
Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post

TMcG is describing what I'm planning. I'll mount the door bottom inside the theater instead of mortised because iirc the stc tests better that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimastergrant View Post

Fred,

Can you tell us how much better the STC rating is? I have the "best" seals and I was leaning towards mortising for aesthetics but I don't want to shoot myself in the foot just for looks.

This difference is barely a few STC points: http://www.zerointernational.com/catalogpage.aspx?pageID=53 and http://www.zerointernational.com/catalogpage.aspx?pageID=54 The 119W will do more for you than any difference in mounting the bottom door gasket, fyi.

Personally, I will be recessing the automatic bottom and getting one of the aluminum thresholds with integrated gasketing from Zero, but as my signature says - If it's worth killing, it's worth overkilling!



JPA - are you planning for two sets of doors on the same jamb with alternating the lockset location?
Edited by TMcG - 6/8/13 at 9:42am
post #982 of 1535
Thread Starter 
There will be a short hallway between my doors. About 5'-6' I'd guess.
post #983 of 1535
Thread Starter 
If the Zero seal is surface mounted to the theater side of the door, what does it seal against on the floor? If the door is flush with the jamb, the a surface mount seal will be over the carpet.
post #984 of 1535
I was assuming my hardwoods would extend through the entire doorway, and the carpet would cut straight along at the edge of the wall. The door would, I assumed, recess far enough into the doorway that the seal would land on wood.

The thing that gets me is whether or not the door bottom reaches jamb to jamb. If it doesn't, there's an opening between the edge seal and the bottom seal. That's why it was surprising to me when I read that the mortised bottom was not superior.
post #985 of 1535
Thread Starter 
Take a look at one of the doors in your house that will swing the same way. My doors are flush with the jamb, and then there is a casing that extends another 1/4"-1/2" past the jamb. The carpet in our bedrooms runs even with the jamb (under the casing). So if I put a Zero seal on the face of that door, it will be over the carpet, unless I put it on the face outside the theater. Am I missing something?
post #986 of 1535
The Zero seal gets mounted on the push side of the door. It's the contact between the seal and the door jamb that handles the retracting.

Tim
post #987 of 1535
In terms of order of operation, is the door typically done after drywall? Won't they be a nuisance while building? Are you doing a soffit around the room for HVAC or lighting?
post #988 of 1535
Thread Starter 
I'd say most builds I've seen put the door in later. Ted and John recommend putting it in before drywall because it lets the drywall guys run the drywall all the way up to the jamb to keep the gap around the door as small as possible.

I am planning a soffit all the way around the room. I'm planning to run lights in it, and minimal ducting for my HVAC. I'm also toying with the idea of running a short coffered ceiling to house some lights for the seating, but I'm waiting to see how low the ceiling feels once the riser is in to make up my mind.
post #989 of 1535
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Tim View Post

The Zero seal gets mounted on the push side of the door. It's the contact between the seal and the door jamb that handles the retracting.

Tim

You are right, typically speaking. I was flying when I was typing. The disadvantage with this approach is having to cut the handle side at a slight bevel so it will swing clear of the door stop, thereby creating a weaker point in the soundproofing. It can be mounted from the pull side but the jamb has to be deeper. Most theater jambs are deeper on the pull side because of the additional drywall thickness / channel on the theater and use long-throw butt hinges. Perhaps this install is different for subsequent steps with the trim and panel work.
post #990 of 1535
Thread Starter 
I used a door on a custom jamb to handle the extra thickness of the DW, clips, and channel, so my door is flush with the interior jamb. At any rate, I'll probably order a Zero seal and put it on the push side.

I have managed to get my dead vent finished up. The pictures are horrible because it's such an small space to try to get into, but I know how you guys are. First a little framing:



Then some insulation, and the first bit of drywall:



And the finished product:



Since I had to have a removable panel for access to my junction box and fan, I used a layer of 5/8" ply, and put strips where my studs are to give me something to put screws through. If I expected to be in there more often I might have gone with something that would hold up to repeated installation and removals, but I think this will be good for what I need. I filled in the space between strips with 5/8" drywall since it's heavier. It's not pretty, but that part of my equipment closet is not likely to get finished......... ever! I'm planning a removable panel between the rack and the wall there to allow access to the back. With the cover on there, the fan is just barely audible, and is certainly quieter than the jet engine I have for a server.

The bad news, however, is there is quite a bit of wind noise at the opening into the theater. Now that my door seals (extremely) well, I can't hear my server in the theater anymore, but it makes it painfully obvious just how much wind noise I'm getting at the return opening. I'm hoping once I put my soffits up I can duct the vent around to the back of my theater, and give it a large opening to get the velocity down. If that doesn't work, I'll probably be looking for a new fan since this one can't be slowed down. frown.gif
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