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"Official" Onkyo TX-NR809 Thread - Page 147

post #4381 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post

Wow. I am trying to find some documentation/specification from DTS to that effect...
This is no big deal, but IMHO they (DTS or Onkyo or Denon) are corrupting the original sound track..

I spoke to a DTS engineer who indicated the "remapping" (or copying) of the side surrounds to rear surrounds of DTS 5.1 audio has been a spec for quite some time. For some reason Onkyo and Denon only chose to first implement it beginning with last years' models. confused.gif
post #4382 of 5253
Hey all. My receiver is putting a vertical line on my screen. Any idea what is causing this? When I bypass the Onkyo all together it goes away.

http://chattypics.com/files/dumbline_6jmqdmuric.jpg
post #4383 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

I spoke to a DTS engineer who indicated the "remapping" (or copying) of the side surrounds to rear surrounds of DTS 5.1 audio has been a spec for quite some time. For some reason Onkyo and Denon only chose to first implement it beginning with last years' models. confused.gif

Thank you very much for this info.

The question still remains, why did they do it..confused.gif
post #4384 of 5253
Likely because the vast majority of folks who have a 7.1 setup, want audio from all 7 speakers when watching a movie.
post #4385 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Likely because the vast majority of folks who have a 7.1 setup, want audio from all 7 speakers when watching a movie.

Agreed, but shouldn't that be optional from a purist point of view? I honestly did not like it enforced ...
post #4386 of 5253
Is there a backlit remote for the NR809? I read somewhere that a remote of a higher model may work w/ the 809 but I no longer can find the source nor where to get one. Anyone know, care to share the source/link? Thanks.
post #4387 of 5253
It looks like there is a new firmware download available on Onkyo's site dated 7/5/2012. It is version 1131-1277-0211-3107

According to Onkyo the update

The 7/5/12 update addresses the following:
1. Improves the operation when HDMI Through is set to on
2. Stabilizes the operation of Network Control
3. Corrects the video output when the Picture Mode is set to Through
Edited by FrankVP - 7/6/12 at 4:02am
post #4388 of 5253
Does anyone have this happen to them...............

Onkyo 809 receiver: When watching tv, through a cable box, the tv a JVC DLP (my dads) when the channels are switched there is a display of the input on the tv saying "digital 1 in" almost every time he switches channels

.Is this the onkyo?
the tv or the cable box???
post #4389 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonic debauchery View Post

Does anyone have this happen to them...............
Onkyo 809 receiver: When watching tv, through a cable box, the tv a JVC DLP (my dads) when the channels are switched there is a display of the input on the tv saying "digital 1 in" almost every time he switches channels
.Is this the onkyo?
the tv or the cable box???

My guess it's TV....
Because I have not seen this with NR809. (where there is a possibility of input being connected)
The only last device where input will get connected is TV.
post #4390 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slaine View Post

Folks - sorry if this has been answered definitively in the thread previously, but did Onkyo (or someone on this board) ever figure out the issue with the 'Through' video mode? Specifically, why it's mangling the picture settings rather than just upscaling it? I tried it before and blacks seemed to be crushed to oblivion, so I've been running in 'Direct' mode ever since.
I now want to get around to watching some old HD-DVD titles however, and my players only output 1080i, so I was hoping to take advantage of the players scaling capabilities to bump the picture back up to 1080p. Failing a direct fix to the 'Through' mode, I'd be curious if someone has put together a set of tweaks for the 'Custom' picture mode option that gets the picture back where it needs to be. No sense repeating someone else's fine work, if it's already been done. biggrin.gif

Onkyo just released a FIRMWARE update today and according to the release notes, they have fixed the 'Through' issue.
post #4391 of 5253
Has Onkyo fixed the "pass through" mode in such a way that we can use our cable box with the receiver off and HDMI CEC/RI is on ?
post #4392 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post

My guess it's TV....
Because I have not seen this with NR809. (where there is a possibility of input being connected)
The only last device where input will get connected is TV.

Thanks for your input
post #4393 of 5253
I performed the July 5, 2012 firmware update via USB. It only took between five and ten minutes to complete. I have not done a lot of testing yet but "Through" doesn't seem to be as dark as it was previously. Can someone remind me what the difference is between the Through and Direct settings, now that Through is fixed?
Edited by Viventis - 7/6/12 at 4:58am
post #4394 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viventis View Post

I performed the July 5, 2012 firmware update via USB. It only took between 5 and ten minutes to complete. I have not done a lot of testing yet but "Through" doesn't seem to be as dark as it was previously. Can someone remind me what the difference is between the Through and Direct settings, now that Through is fixed?

Direct = Direct (As is. No change)
Through = Upscale (no other change)
post #4395 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by patran View Post

Has Onkyo fixed the "pass through" mode in such a way that we can use our cable box with the receiver off and HDMI CEC/RI is on ?

Was that a common problem? I don't think so..
post #4396 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post

Was that a common problem? I don't think so..

Yes it was at least with 709 and I am not sure about 809. The "through" mode has grayscale problem and colors were completely tinted.
post #4397 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherpa25 View Post

Is there a backlit remote for the NR809? I read somewhere that a remote of a higher model may work w/ the 809 but I no longer can find the source nor where to get one. Anyone know, care to share the source/link? Thanks.

The 809 remote has some transparent type buttons, which light up when pressed to show the Source input, or Zone 2/3 ON, etc.

But you know this. I looked at the 5009, it looks identical, so other than an Harmony RC, I don't know of any.
post #4398 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by atlind01 View Post

Yes it was at least with 709 and I am not sure about 809. The "through" mode has grayscale problem and colors were completely tinted.

Now your are confusing "pass through" (which means pass the video signal even if the receiver is off)
with "Through" of the category "Direct" "Through", "Custom" etc.

I have not heard of problem with "pass through" for 809 (and may be 709).
I do know there was a problem using "Through" (where receiver upscales the video), which apparently seem to be fixed with latest FW.
post #4399 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by wl1 View Post

The 809 remote has some transparent type buttons, which light up when pressed to show the Source input, or Zone 2/3 ON, etc.
But you know this. I looked at the 5009, it looks identical, so other than an Harmony RC, I don't know of any.

Thanks wl1. Yes, some buttons in the 809 remote light up, although very few. And these few buttons light up only after pressing the button (w/c you may not see when dark), w/c is why I'm looking for a backlit one so I see the buttons before making a selection. I checked that of the 3009 too and it looks similar, though I'm not yet sure it would work w/ the 809.

Been looking at the oRemote too for some time but I find using my iPad too bulky as a remote. I'd prefer single handed use when I just want to press a few buttons. Tried the Onkyo remote on my Android too but didn't connect at times. OTOH, @wl1 and @rworne, does oRemote work w/ the ipod Touch, and if so, won't the screen be too small for it? Is there a demo/trial license (maybe for a few hours or a day) just to see how it works w/ it?

Thanks.
Edited by sherpa25 - 7/6/12 at 6:27pm
post #4400 of 5253
alriite, so my nr809 stopped working last night!! help!!! the unit turns on but not video or sound. Everything was perfect for a few months that ive had it. I swithed HDMI cables, I reseted the unit by holding vcr and power botton. i know the its the receiver because even when I do level callibration for each speakers, theres no white noise. and for Video, nothing is displayed on the tv at all. HELP!
post #4401 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3ng03 View Post

alriite, so my nr809 stopped working last night!! help!!! the unit turns on but not video or sound. Everything was perfect for a few months that ive had it. I swithed HDMI cables, I reseted the unit by holding vcr and power botton. i know the its the receiver because even when I do level callibration for each speakers, theres no white noise. and for Video, nothing is displayed on the tv at all. HELP!

OMG. And this is your first post! Sorry Bro.

A call to Onkyo is what is needed...

May be give it a shot posting it here.

http://onkyoproductsupport.forumotion.com/f1-welcome-to-the-onkyo-forum
post #4402 of 5253
Programmed the 809 's 'My Music' macro (since it's the easiest button to reach when it's relatively dark) to turn on my Samsung TV and the 809 but can't get the 'All OFF' button to turn off the TV. Has anyone made this work?

And while at it, does oRemote also have the functions of the macros from the original 809 remote?
Edited by sherpa25 - 7/6/12 at 6:53pm
post #4403 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherpa25 View Post

Programmed the 809 's 'My Music' macro (since it's the easiest button to reach when it's relatively dark) to turn on my Samsung TV and the 809 but can't get the 'All OFF' button to turn off the TV. Has anyone made this work?

And while at it, does oRemote also have the functions of the macros from the original 809 remote?

I use an Harmony One, and it's been a long time since I played with the RC from the Onkyo. But I would have thought that My Music would not involve a Display, so the macro would not activate that device. Try the My TV next to it......

ORemote is not a direct copy of the RC, it is different in concept. So does not have macros, as it does not control other devices (unlike RC IR).
post #4404 of 5253
Firmware updated today - 10 mins. Via USB.

Some pics for the record.
Original firmware number
545c3218-a760-26b9.jpg


First step - Arm Writing
545c3218-a782-fa3f.jpg

Second step - MMPU writing
545c3218-a7a9-d78b.jpg

Completed!
545c3218-a7cb-adff.jpg

Turn it Off, and the 809 reboots itself.
545c3218-a7d9-9942.jpg


My settings seem intact, but not checked in depth. I wanted to see the changes.

Latest firmware number:-
545c3218-aaf1-27e3.jpg
Edited by wl1 - 7/7/12 at 4:43am
post #4405 of 5253
Saw this on 709 forum:-

========================================
There seems to be new facilities which did not exist before (at least I was not aware):

Press and hold:

* BD/DVD and press Power - Some sort of HDMI menu

* CBL/SAT " " " - Deep Colour ON/OFF

* NET " " " - Forced firmware upgrade (Net)

* USB " " " - Forced firmware upgrade (USB).

========================================

The first seems to be an option of "use" or "ignore" for the HDMI board.

Deep Colour did not seem to do anything when given a 24 bit YCbCr signal.

If anybody can shed more light, let us all know......
post #4406 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by wl1 View Post

Saw this on 709 forum:-
========================================
There seems to be new facilities which did not exist before (at least I was not aware):
Press and hold:
* BD/DVD and press Power - Some sort of HDMI menu
* CBL/SAT " " " - Deep Colour ON/OFF
* NET " " " - Forced firmware upgrade (Net)
* USB " " " - Forced firmware upgrade (USB).
========================================
The first seems to be an option of "use" or "ignore" for the HDMI board.
Deep Colour did not seem to do anything when given a 24 bit YCbCr signal.
If anybody can shed more light, let us all know......

Deep color on/off was there before. (See page 84 of the manual)
IMHO Unless both source and display can produce the (12 bit?) picture, you can not notice anything.
post #4407 of 5253
It looks like the latest firmware has fixed a few of the issues with the 4.5 Picture Adjust > Picture Mode setting.


Summary

4.5 Picture Mode “Through” now works correctly – ie, it no longer changes the greyscale position NOR change the Contrast/Brightness setting. So for those people requiring “by Source input “ control of upscaling, it is possible to make use of the onboard video processing WITHOUT affecting all the colours.
Streaming is also fixed in the same way.

So Custom, ISF Day, ISF Night, Direct, Through and Streaming are available without worrying about calibration issues.

The BAD NEWS – Do NOT use Game or Cinema – as these are both still affecting the greyscale.

Game – very BLUE and cold pre-set. Obviously, if you like it for Games, fine.
Cinema – Warm/yellow tint – in general, many would look to use Cinema as a “calibrated” start point. For this 809, it is very misleading. If you like it, fine, but it is totally inaccurate. In fact if you have a calibrated video chain, and then use either of these two presets, you will have wasted your time and money.

For those interested in the detail:-

The Direct Picture Mode is my calibrated BR Player to Display video chain, and the reference here.

I have included some background info for those not familiar with “Calibration Guide for Dummies”. (If not, why not? smile.gif)
Graphs:

The RGB graph:
“Top Part” shows the greyscale response of my display from black (left) to white (right). The correct combination of RGB will produce the correct grey (no colour) for all the intensities of light output. Ruler flat RGB at 100% is ideal.
The “Bottom Part” shows the Delta Error – which is a measure of the accuracy to the REC709 HD standard. Below 10 is good, but below 4 is excellent (your eyes cannot resolve the colour changes with a Delta E of less than 4).
The Direct RGB Graph shows accurate colour response for greyscale from black to white .

314

The CIE Graph
The Black triangle shows the REC709 standard, and the white triangle is the Display response. Colours mixed with varying amounts of R,G and B can produce ALL the colours within the triangle. As you can see, grey is in the middle. If this is accurate, and the primaries and secondary’s are accurate, then it falls into line the other colours will be accurate too. In the middle are two blue ovals – these show the Target grey value, D65. The larger circle is 10 Delta E, with the small oval being the ideal 4 Delta E.

You should be aware of the Z axis – coming out of the CIE graph. This is the intensity of the light output. So D65 black to white D65 goes through all the grey points D65 out of the screen. So all colours, and all intensities contained within the white triangle are able to be produced.

315

Brightness/Contrast:-
The highest value of White was measure to 102cd/m2 (30ftL) – good for Direct Display panels.

Conclusion:-
The Direct picture mode shows a good calibration – unaffected by the 809.


Picture Mode “Through” BEFORE Firmware change 5th July 2012.

The RGB graph:
This clearly shows a change in relationship between RGB - Red and blue separating from Green from Black to White (left to right). The Delta E is ~20.

316

The CIE Graph
This clearly shows the cluster of white measurements moving away from the blue oval, and towards yellow.

315

Brightness/Contrast
The highest value of White was measure to 91cd/m2 (26ftL) – a reduction in light output compared to Direct.

Conclusion : -
The image would be reduced in light output, affecting Brightness/Contrast and Dynamic range. And last 6 months’ worth of advice was NOT to use Through.


Picture Mode “Through” AFTER Firmware change 5th July 2012.

The RGB graph:
Within the limits of my measurement system, the results are identical to Direct mode.

316

The CIE Graph
Within the limits of my measurement system, the results are identical to Direct mode.

316

Brightness/Contrast
Within the limits of my measurement system, the results are identical to Direct mode.

Conclusion : -
The manual says that Through and Direct differ just by being able to set the resolution for Through. This is now the case. Yippee….


For completeness – the other pre-set picture modes.

Game AFTER Firmware change 5th July 2012

The RGB graph:
This clearly shows a change in relationship between RGB - Red and blue separating from Green from Black to White (left to right). The Delta E is >10.

316

The CIE Graph
This clearly shows the cluster of white measurements moving away from the blue ovals, and towards Blue.

316

Brightness/Contrast
The highest value of White was measure to 80cd/m2 (23ftL) – a large reduction in light output compared to Direct.

Conclusion : -
The image would be severly reduced in light output, affecting Brightness/Contrast and Dynamic range. It leaves the image very blue/cold.


Cinema AFTER Firmware change 5th July 2012

The RGB graph:
This clearly shows a change in relationship between RGB - Red and blue separating from Green from Black to White (left to right). The Delta E is ~20.

315

The CIE Graph
This clearly shows the cluster of white measurements moving away from the blue ovals, and towards Yellow.

315

Brightness/Contrast
The highest value of White was measure to 75cd/m2 (22ftL) – a large reduction in light output compared to Direct.

Conclusion : -
The image would be severely reduced in light output, affecting Brightness/Contrast and Dynamic range. It leaves the image with a yellow tinge and warm. Very inaccurate.


Streaming AFTER Firmware change 5th July 2012

The RGB graph:
This clearly shows a change in relationship between RGB - Red and blue separating from Green from Black to White (left to right). The Delta E is ~20.

315

The CIE Graph
This clearly shows the cluster of white measurements moving away from the blue ovals, and towards Yellow.

316

Brightness/Contrast
The highest value of White was measure to 101cd/m2 (29ftL) – within the accuracy of my measurements, identical to Direct

Conclusion : -
I am not sure of an application for this pre-set – but at least it is neutral to the image.
Edited by wl1 - 7/7/12 at 1:20pm
post #4408 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherpa25 View Post

Been looking at the oRemote too for some time but I find using my iPad too bulky as a remote. I'd prefer single handed use when I just want to press a few buttons. Tried the Onkyo remote on my Android too but didn't connect at times. OTOH, @wl1 and @rworne, does oRemote work w/ the ipod Touch, and if so, won't the screen be too small for it? Is there a demo/trial license (maybe for a few hours or a day) just to see how it works w/ it?
Thanks.

There's no trial for iOS apps, and if I released a time-limited demo Apple would pull it since you really aren't allowed to do such things - limited demos work for games and such, where they are full featured but only include a few levels.

The iPhone/iPad screens are admittedly a bit cramped - oRemote tends to take the "everything but the kitchen sink" approach to managing the AVR. That and the "display" takes up approx. 40% of the available screen space. So there is a toolbar with submenus, but everything is organized on tabs (main, zone, a/v, settings) and each tab has a toolbar dividing up functions in common groups - source, listening mode, audio controls, video controls, etc.

1.4.0 (due "soon") will have significant improvements in the UI, one of which is getting rid of nearly all the commands that require multiple taps to cycle between all the options - like the dimmer or HDMI out. These controls will now display a list of commands specific for each AVR model to allow directly setting the command instead of cycling through all the options. This helps out the iPhone/iPod a lot.
post #4409 of 5253
Quote:
Originally Posted by wl1 View Post

Firmware updated today - 10 mins. Via USB.

I really liked the entry:

"Stabilizes the operation of Network Control"

in the release notes.

I'm hoping that they are finally looking into fixing a few bugs I have been reporting for over a year now...

I also now have to stop working on the next release to see what they changed... if it's just a stability fix or did they secretly add stuff again.
post #4410 of 5253
Thanks @rworne.

Hope to get feedback too on the new firmware once you've tested it further.
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