Purpose of flat response below 20Hz - Why does it matter? - Page 18

Originally Posted by sb1 

The "punch" everyone loves but also seems to contunually hunt in their own systems is a product of not only dynamics (or just plain volume), but also the ability to turn the entire system up, high frequencies and all. If your rig is hampered by mismatched high frequencies, reverb, and phase issues from hell in the higher khz regions, there's no way you can get the volume of that punchy area up high enough without the rest of the system seeming far too loud. Then people boost their sub and it sounds boomy and muddy. Then they blame their sub for being the weak link. Then they buy a new sub and wonder why it's no better.

Nothing so far mentioned by A55 is a realistic issue in the cinema or home theater environment.

Good grief the whole conspiratorial angle to why cinema theaters do not have low hitting subs.

Has more to do with economics more than anything else.

Fairly certain one big factor is that it requires a lot of power to sufficiently pressurize a cinema theater space with lower frequencies with authority, in addition to the sound bleed issue. Still happens a lot though even with '30hz' subs.

That sonic weapon methodology completely falls outside the scope of the usage of infrasonics in movie soundtracks.

Why A55 has not been banned for all this bunk is mind boggling

No one is doubting that infrasonics could be harmful if used AS A WEAPON. A subwoofer is not a weapon

Originally Posted by bfreedma 

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

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No subwoofers are not sonic weapons, that's not the issue. The issue is infrasound (below 20hz), can infrasounds be used as sonic weapons? I am convinced that the answer is yes. Here's another issue, can a subwoofer capable of producing infrasounds (like the ones popular around here), cause the same affects as a sonic weapon? The subject here is "infrasounds" played back loud enough to as to cause internal organs to shake, thereby resulting in nausea, dizziness and or a lost of equlibrium on the target? It really isn't about the means by which those infrasounds are delivered to the target. The target in the case of the commericial cinema would be the patrons, in the case of the home theater, the target would the HT enthusiast/consumer.

I have been tweaking my 15H this afternoon. I moved it slightly, reran Audyssey and have tried various port EQ and Q positions. Two ports open EQ2 Q of .3 sounds good to me, but I am actually flatter to 16hz using 1 port open, EQ2, q.3.
The other thing.. All the low freq test tones have me literarily feeling sick to my stomach...[/




Thank you for being honest about it.

Anyone else would like to share how they were affected by infrasounds?

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

Just like someone from Philly to try to make some jokes. You're probably mad because your none your sports teams can win.

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

What I have done is cited the Pseudoscience. You have right to comment and give your opinions on it.

Not a conspiracy at all. I don't know if they are famliar with any studies on infrasounds and how they affect human being. That is why I said that I would do some research. However, I'm not content to accept the company line like the sheeple tend to do.

And you know that how? I told you I spoke to Mr Syme at SMPTE and the reason he gave was that people don't hear sounds below 20hz anyway, so below 20hz content, according to him, is superflous.

You're "fairly" certain means you're not 100% certain.

You clearly missed the point. You're absolutely wrong, sonic weapons absolutely employ the use of infrasounds, they are said to effective because the target can't hear them. Infrasounds are used in psychological warfare to demoralize and disturb the enemy.

I should be banned for making arguments supported by "science"in the Audio Video Science Forum.

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

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No subwoofers are not sonic weapons, that's not the issue.

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

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The subject here is "infrasounds" played back loud enough to as to cause internal organs to shake, thereby resulting in nausea, dizziness and or a lost of....

Originally Posted by craig john 

On second thought.... it doesn't work:Oh well.
Craig

Originally Posted by Chu Gai 

WRT inrasounmds in movies, isn't their duration relatively short suggesting that any physiological effect is of comparatively short duration and may not mimic the effects experienced for sustained duration and level in the sundry scientific studies?

Originally Posted by SaviorMachine 

What's funny is that he found it exhilarating and wanted to share the experience with everybody else. Fancy that!

Originally Posted by ack_bk 

Exactly..
Auditor55, repeat after me, a subwoofer is not a weapon.... A subwoofer, is not a weapon.... A subwoofer is not a weapon...
You would have to go out of your way to great lengths (assuming you even have the right room and equipment) to hit 150db at the listening position for extended lengths of time.
Consider:
http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=systems&type=0
This is Max Burst! not a single badass sub Ricci measured could hit a max burst (let alone sustained burst) of 150db. Nothing is even close.

Originally Posted by jhan1000 

Here is a report released by the Health Protection Agency who performed an exhaustive literature search on the adverse effects of infrasound :
http://www.hpa.org.uk/webc/HPAwebFile/HPAweb_C/1265028759369
The Health Protection Agency is not some hack organization, but was set up by the UK government to protect its citizens from infectious and environmental hazards.
After careful review of the literature, including assessing the strength of each study, here is the first part of their summary as seen on page 142:
"Volunteer studies investigating the potential effects of infrasound are relatively limited. The quality of many of the early studies is questionable, and they often yield conflicting results. Very few studies appear to have been published in recent years. Overall, there is little evidence to suggest that acute exposure to infrasound at levels commonly experienced in the environment is capable of causing any consistent physiological or behavioral effect, although there is a general paucity of high quality research in this area. Nevertheless, there is some evidence that infrasound levels at levels above the hearing threshold may cause a decrease in wakefulness. Finally, aural pain and damage may result from very intense exposures above a threshold of about 140dB or more depending on the frequency."
I take this to mean that there is little evidence to suggest that infrasounds causes destruction to one's innards, with the exception of some ear pain and hearing loss. However, this can happen at any frequency.

Originally Posted by Auditor55 


They need to update their information. Here we have a poster in here admitting that he got sick from low frequency sweeps, which I doubt he cranked his system above 140 dbs.
He wrote:
"The other thing.. All the low freq test tones have me literarily feeling sick to my stomach..."
That is exactly my point, that is what all the science is attesting to, however you guys want to explain it away in order to justify your expenditures.
I'm mean really, how much more evidence do you need. Here this poster is attacking my arguments and at the same time in complete agreement with me. I wish more posters with infrasound capable systems would come forward and share their expirence.

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

They need to update their information. Here we have a poster in here admitting that he got sick from low frequency sweeps, which I doubt he cranked his system above 140 dbs.
He wrote:
"The other thing.. All the low freq test tones have me literarily feeling sick to my stomach..."
That is exactly my point, that is what all the science is attesting to, however you guys want to explain it away in order to justify your expenditures.
I'm mean really, how much more evidence do you need. Here this poster is attacking my arguments and at the same time in complete agreement with me. I wish more posters with infrasound capable systems would come forward and share their expirence.

Originally Posted by rnrgagne 

I think it's far more important to reduce bloat, or room modes, so the rest of the frequencies are not "muddied".

Originally Posted by sb1 

An excellent statement.

Originally Posted by Auditor55 

They need to update their information. Here we have a poster in here admitting that he got sick from low frequency sweeps, which I doubt he cranked his system above 140 dbs.
He wrote:
"The other thing.. All the low freq test tones have me literarily feeling sick to my stomach..."
That is exactly my point, that is what all the science is attesting to, however you guys want to explain it away in order to justify your expenditures.
I'm mean really, how much more evidence do you need. Here this poster is attacking my arguments and at the same time in complete agreement with me. I wish more posters with infrasound capable systems would come forward and share their expirence.

Originally Posted by Crabalocker 

Does a SubMersive count as a infrasound capable system? If it qualifies, it's given me a few awkward b*ners! Is it mental or a physical response? I don't care I love feeling the bottom end! Low Hz +db is sic, not sick.