Auto brightness limiters (abl) in plasma sets

Originally Posted by eagle_2

I see so many comments that say something like "if you don't like x problem with LCD screens then go with Plasma". Everybody seems to talk about how great Plasma is. Yet every time time I look at a plasma set one of the first things I notice is how every time a bright scene appears or the screen goes all white, the screen dims by over 50%, ruining the image. After doing some research into this, I have learned that this is called the "auto brightness limiter" which is on all new plasmas and has been cranked up higher and higher each year to the point where, in my opinion, it has totally ruined the quality of these sets.

So are people really just ignoring this fluctuating brightness issue on these new plasmas? It seems that people are real quick to bash LCD with all its flaws (and there certainly are many flaws) and speak of the virtue of plasma, but I never see anybody mention this deal-breaking design flaw with the new plasmas. People talk like if I really want quality I should get a plasma. But what good is a plasma if every time there's white on the screen the screen auto-dims? That would drive me nuts.

Originally Posted by eagle_2

I see so many comments that say something like "if you don't like x problem with LCD screens then go with Plasma". Everybody seems to talk about how great Plasma is. Yet every time time I look at a plasma set one of the first things I notice is how every time a bright scene appears or the screen goes all white, the screen dims by over 50%, ruining the image. After doing some research into this, I have learned that this is called the "auto brightness limiter" which is on all new plasmas and has been cranked up higher and higher each year to the point where, in my opinion, it has totally ruined the quality of these sets.

So are people really just ignoring this fluctuating brightness issue on these new plasmas? It seems that people are real quick to bash LCD with all its flaws (and there certainly are many flaws) and speak of the virtue of plasma, but I never see anybody mention this deal-breaking design flaw with the new plasmas. People talk like if I really want quality I should get a plasma. But what good is a plasma if every time there's white on the screen the screen auto-dims? That would drive me nuts.

Originally Posted by aydu

Plasma sets do give you "dirty whites".

Originally Posted by eagle_2

I appreciate the input. There's actually a lot to like about plasma. It was only recently that I was made aware of ABL because I was looking at some plasmas in some stores and I noticed whenever the screen got white (commercials for example) the screen got very noticeably darker. The whites indeed did turn gray. I have read that the ABL in these sets are being cranked up more each year and that some sets dim the screen by more than 50% now, which seems quite excessive to me.

I watch all kinds of programming and I'm sure that there will be many times that I come across a white scene and I would find that very annoying. While I'm not a huge follower of polar bear documentaries I do sometimes watch Discovery channel and I have indeed watched some docs with ice/snow/polar bears, etc. - and I like my white to look white. Right off the top of my head I'm thinking of "Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory" - the original one - and the long scene with an all-white room with the teleporting tv set. Or how about THX-1138? My point is I don't know if I could ever get used to the screen just suddenly dimming whenever a white screen appears. I admit LCD has many issues, and they can be very frustrating, but sadly I don't know if I could get past the ABL issue.


Michael2000, I know what you mean with Google though - blinding in fact.

Originally Posted by eagle_2

I appreciate the input. There's actually a lot to like about plasma. It was only recently that I was made aware of ABL because I was looking at some plasmas in some stores and I noticed whenever the screen got white (commercials for example) the screen got very noticeably darker. The whites indeed did turn gray. I have read that the ABL in these sets are being cranked up more each year and that some sets dim the screen by more than 50% now, which seems quite excessive to me.

I watch all kinds of programming and I'm sure that there will be many times that I come across a white scene and I would find that very annoying. While I'm not a huge follower of polar bear documentaries I do sometimes watch Discovery channel and I have indeed watched some docs with ice/snow/polar bears, etc. - and I like my white to look white. Right off the top of my head I'm thinking of "Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory" - the original one - and the long scene with an all-white room with the teleporting tv set. Or how about THX-1138? My point is I don't know if I could ever get used to the screen just suddenly dimming whenever a white screen appears. I admit LCD has many issues, and they can be very frustrating, but sadly I don't know if I could get past the ABL issue.


Michael2000, I know what you mean with Google though - blinding in fact.

Originally Posted by specuvestor

I think ABL has been around plasma longer than just "recently". Too bright a screen for too long a time will burn the plasma circuits due to the low power efficiency of plasma cells.

It will help if u lower the brightness or get it calibrated to reference 80-120cd/m2. But it's an inherent plasma issue until they can improve on the luminosity. LCDs are often tweaked too bright >120cd/m2 and IMHO may hurt your eyes (depending on your environment) if for eg the Google home page pops up.

Originally Posted by eagle_2

Actually I've said goodbye to that LCD forum for good!

I made the leap today with the Samsung PN51D7000F plasma and I can't wait for it to be delivered.

I've given these new LED lit LCDs many chances and I have been very unhappy with the uneven lighting/banding/poor viewing angles/light leaks, etc that plague LED lit LCD screens. I've been stressing myself for 2 weeks with LCD returns due to horrible lighting issues. After looking at some plasmas again today I decided that even though ABL might make itself known in some situations, the huge gains in other areas make it well worth the jump to plasma.

I was also impressed that both sales people I talked to today, from 2 different retail chains, both said they owned plasmas themselves for years and were extremely pleased. And one of these guys was from Best Buy even.

Originally Posted by surap

I wish I could turn this "feature" to "off". But I'll guess its built in?

Originally Posted by specuvestor

nope otherwise plasma failure rate would shoot through the roof

Originally Posted by 3reach


what a load of bull ****

Originally Posted by JSpectre88 

I hate to necro this bad boy, but it seems easier than creating a new thread. I realize this thread is well over a year old, but at the time TC was talking about how they are making this effect stronger and stronger in newer models. Most of the replies only discuss the impact on bright white backgrounds, but on my brand new P50U50 anything remotely bright becomes dim. What I mean is that anything bright that isn't a solid color comes in dim and appears faded. Examples include solid light backgrounds like blue or yellow, video games with bright environments (in-game) or even cartoons such as Family Guy. I could understand if this feature toned down only extreme brights, but this set is distorting the picture quality on anything even remotely "bright". Is this really normal or is there a chance I may have a defective set?
Thanks in advance if anyone takes the time to reply.

Originally Posted by MechanicalMan 

I don't have a U50 to judge the ABL myself, but FWIW, pro reviews have noted that the U50/UT50 plasmas have more aggressive ABL than some other plasmas, including the higher Panasonic models. David Mackenzie says this in his review of the UK UT50:
"The implementation of ABL on the Panasonic TX-P42UT50B appears to be a little more extreme than on other Panasonic plasma televisions, such as the ST50 series and up. In other words, images which wouldn’t trigger the dimming on the ST50 did appear slightly dimmed on the UT50, suggesting that the ABL kicks in sooner on this cheaper model."
And David Katzmaier says this in his review of the U50:
"Only when the screen turned mostly white... did the U50 get dimmer than the Samsung [PNE550]"
Both of them downplay the issue and give the TVs very favorable reviews, but when comparing the U-series directly to other plasmas, both reviewers witnessed that the U plasmas got dimmer in bright scenes than other plasmas -- although it's not totally clear how much of the problem was caused by ABL in Katzmaier's review, because the U50 may have been (by necessity) calibrated to a lower peak brightness than the Samsung.

Originally Posted by Steezus Christ 

I think you may have a defective model. I have the same panel, just the 60 inch size and the only time I notice ABL is in game mode with my PS 3 and that is only 1 game I see it with. I get pretty sensitive to monitors with problems. My last one had a pulsating problem (a known issue with the model that was discovered after my purchase) when the screen was dark. Most people never noticed it, but it always got under my skin. It really sucks to have to send it in for return and be without a monitor, but I definitely would if I was having problems like you are describing.