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The "Bacon Race" Theater / Patio / Bar Project - Page 21

post #601 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post

Maybe the column fits so tightly to the wall that the panel has to be flush against the wall to slide into position?

Pretty much for two of the three black panels not for the most of the reds.
post #602 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post

What is the kraft paper for in the absorption panels?

It is only on the rear wall, You'll have to ask the acoustical designers but from personal experience it reflects high frequencies and when used on the rear wall makes the surround sound, sound surrounding.
post #603 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post


It is only on the rear wall, You'll have to ask the acoustical designers but from personal experience it reflects high frequencies and when used on the rear wall makes the surround sound, sound surrounding.

Surround sounding, surround side! Most excellent!
post #604 of 2303
Is the kraft paper on the entire back wall and back wall only?
post #605 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbraden32 View Post

Is the kraft paper on the entire back wall and back wall only?

Yes, the treatment plan was given by BPape (user name here on the forums). He called for a 4 inch treatment with facing or scrim paper against the front side of the OC703 material. He also gave an option saying that 2" thick OC703 with a 2" air gap behind it is about 80some% as effective as a solid 4" thick piece. So he said double the cost for a small performance increase, up to me what I wanted. I went with the air gap... but yes, we used kraft paper, and it is only on the rear wall 4" treatments. The side walls are 1" cotton. (though they are only treated up to 5' up from the floor on the sides where the riser is to allow some reflection)
post #606 of 2303
Pardon the noob question but if the 2" stuff is OC703, what is the 1" cotton used on the side walls?
post #607 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanice View Post

Pardon the noob question but if the 2" stuff is OC703, what is the 1" cotton used on the side walls?

Two different materials with 2 different acoustical properties. The front wall is 2" 3lb dense cotton. The side walls to the riser are floor to ceiling 1" 3lb dense cotton. On the side walls between riser and rear wall is 5' high of 1" 3lb dense cotton (this is 5' up front foundation, not the riser). Rear wall was a 4" treatment, using OC703.

If you want specific details on why one or the other, I can't give them. Bryan Pape just said that is the material in his plan. Cotton performs better but is also more expensive. It is also harder to cut, but it is more dense and definitely has different physical properties that I'm sure have something to do with it. Softer, spongier, heavier.

The scrim paper is used for high frequency waves.
post #608 of 2303
This is a busy thread. How do you and Big get anything done on the theater AND answer all of our questions? It's like magic or something!

Regards,

RTROSE
post #609 of 2303
I assume that you purchase the cotton material at the same place you would find OC703 sold?
post #610 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Here is a post I found by BPape on another forum back in 2007. He has a link to a chart of materials and their performance by frequency. Since it is brand specific, there might be some differences between where you get your product, but at least it is all the info and why I just trust people like him instead of reading huge charts like that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BPape View Post

Check out Bob Golds' site - www.bobgolds.com and look under the coefficients link.

If all else is equal (thickness, mounting, and density), the cotton will have a slight edge in the lower frequencies if we're speaking of 1 and 2" 3lb density materials. As you get thicker, the different materials tend to be more readily avialable in different densities so it's harder to compare. The best solution depends on the application and what specifically you're trying to accomplish.

For instance, 6" of OC703 is pretty effective and even across the board assuming an A mounting flat on the wall. 5.5" of 1.5lb acoustical cotton will do just as well over most of the band but has a hump in absorbtion around 250hz.

Read more: Rock wool vs. Acoustic cotton vs. OC703 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

Bryan
post #611 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanice View Post

I assume that you purchase the cotton material at the same place you would find OC703 sold?

Sometimes. OC703 is actually much more common and is found in a lot of building supply chains that carry normal insulation. Cotton sheets are not very common at all. They are mostly used for acoustics only so are more of a specialty. Working with people like BPape allow me to get much better prices and worry about supplies than searching myself.

Here are some google results of places I found that actually sell it if you wanted some more information.
http://www.soundaway.com/Acoustic_Co...anels_s/91.htm
http://www.acousticalsurfaces.com/ec...wall_panel.htm

Quote:
Originally Posted by RTROSE View Post

This is a busy thread. How do you and Big get anything done on the theater AND answer all of our questions? It's like magic or something!

Well, BIG is retired and is very active on the forums during the week. I sit in front of a computer for a living, and have them all over my house at home so I have a lot of availability. I'd go insane without the internet at work.
post #612 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by damelon View Post

I like the idea of magnets myself. Though the counter-sinking would be a pain with the panels we have made already. You could even put magnets in the strips of wood trim and then the entire wall could be adjusted as we see fit.

EDIT: Looking at places like K&J magnetics, countersunk 1/8" magnets look pretty intriguing.... especially some with a LOT of pull force. I DO wonder if that would work. A LOT less messy and future adjustable.

I think the glue is going to be even more of pain. To be honest the first few "quick nail it" tests we ran didn't even go through the frame... no idea what happened to the nail. I liked the original "Industrial Velcro" thought Sandman had, but that gives 0 wiggle room. Once the velcro touches you can't really adjust, and we WILL need to adjust. All of the other methods allow adjustment (Glue, Magnets, etc). With the baseboard and the trim nailed firmly in place though, I dont think it will take much at all to get them right. Every fabric panel will have a piece of nailed trim below it to support the vertical force.

As far as the carpet goes, here are a few more dark ones I saw today:

East Village - Tuxedo

Greenhurst - Ebony

So is the trim going to be flush with with the panels or r u building the trim out with furring strips?
post #613 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

I see no problem in installing the panels perfectly the first time with a room wide laser level. The real issue is whether you want to be able to remove the panels with minimum drywall damage in the future.

Velcro is pretty much out of the question as with this design we need to slide panels under the column ribbing to position

Ball and socket is out also

Magnets are a legitimate option the only issue is that once the trim molding is secured all the panels with the exception of the bottom of the two black panels (there are two horizontal panels below the red) are pretty much trapped in place. So one way or another if the panels need to come off there will be surface drywall damage.

I think u just answered my question. The trim is going to overlap onto the panels so the furring strips will come out even with the finished panel?
post #614 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimim View Post

I think u just answered my question. The trim is going to overlap onto the panels so the furring strips will come out even with the finished panel?

The trim is 3/4" thick. The panels are 1" thick with a bevel. So the bevel will angle toward the trim. It is not the same depth from its highest point
post #615 of 2303
I was just re-reading the soffit build part of this thread and it looks like originally you planned on using GOM over the MDF face of the soffit but instead just filled the holes, sanded, and painted it flat black like the ceiling? Is that correct? No drywall on top of the MDF face either, right?
post #616 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by damelon View Post


The trim is 3/4" thick. The panels are 1" thick with a bevel. So the bevel will angle toward the trim. It is not the same depth from its highest point

Thanks d.

Jimi
post #617 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unacceptable View Post

I was just re-reading the soffit build part of this thread and it looks like originally you planned on using GOM over the MDF face of the soffit but instead just filled the holes, sanded, and painted it flat black like the ceiling? Is that correct? No drywall on top of the MDF face either, right?

Correct on almost all counts. The soffit face did get painted black, but we didnt fill the holes near the ceiling, we just covered it with a piece of flat trim. The actual light tray (Red) was never planned to be fabric GOM, though now that I'm changing the paint....again... it might have been an interesting idea!

First new coat of paint around the room is done. I just have to deal with how poorly dark red paint cover whats under them until it dries and I can put coat #2 up there.

BIG has dropped off all of the trim pieces for the room which I still have to paint. He has been here today doing door work. Filling the gaps with foam and caulk, and then doing the entryway (Almost identical to his planned picture).
post #618 of 2303
New to this thread and I have been reading this thread for last few days. Great work and making of an impressive home theater. Newbie Question on soffit; what is width of soffit? I belive the height is 10" as mentioned previously, could not find the width.
LL
post #619 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinoco View Post

New to this thread and I have been reading this thread for last few days. Great work and making of an impressive home theater. Newbie Question on soffit; what is width of soffit? I belive the height is 10" as mentioned previously, could not find the width.

Great timing. I was just in my basement eyeballing my ceiling trying to figure this out myself. I'm pretty sure the ladder/inner part is 16" wide so you don't have to cut batting to stuff in there.

Somewhere earlier today while I was reading this thread, I came across the light tray width but can't remember off the top of my head... something like 6" or just under that.

I'm going to guess 22 inches total, not counting the additional width of the front of the soffit face for all but the front wall. It's that green line that I'm trying to figure out right now.
post #620 of 2303
the soffit started with a 10 inch piece of MDF hanging from 2x2s that were 16 inches from the wall so the soffit started as 10x 16 3/4.

the light tray is made of a 5 1/2 bottom and a 6 inch tall piece fastened to the edge

that was fastened with 1 1/2 overlapping the bottom of the soffit so the total width of every thing is

16 3/4 +4 +3/4 = 21 1/2

of course then their was the decorative molding which added another inch.
post #621 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

the soffit started with a 10 inch piece of MDF hanging from 2x2s that were 16 inches from the wall so the soffit started as 10x 16 3/4.

the light tray is made of a 5 1/2 bottom and a 6 inch tall piece fastened to the edge

that was fastened with 1 1/2 overlapping the bottom of the soffit so the total width of every thing is

16 3/4 +4 +3/4 = 21 1/2

of course then their was the decorative molding which added another inch.

As per your exact picture of the soffit, (the green line) the front part of the room's soffit is larger. The screen wall is 2'4" out from the front wall and the ladder area is lowered for the entire area.
post #622 of 2303
THE ENTRANCE

You may recall that I had an idea for a little bit of bling outside the theater instead of builders basic case molding. Something that says to visitors in the rec room that the theater is over here.



I got the green light so today it got done.

First the keystone which is 1 3/4 inches thick.



then 6 inch wide strips of 1/2 inch MDF with the inside edge rounded over glued and nailed to the wall





Then a 4 inch wide layer followed by a 2 inch. The 2 inch had both edges rounded over. Both were attached with wood glue and nails.





The two inch is a little darker in the picture because it got sealed. I think an additional benefit is that all the additional molding creates the impression of a much larger door. We ended up using a pretty small 28 inches wide door to line up with the interior panels.

Can't wait to see it painted.
post #623 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Looks as beautiful as planned. I even saw me in the background there performing the devil's work... (painting) and then you go mention painting for the door too.. hehe.
post #624 of 2303
Yup, I definitely had the easy assignment today. Except all the time I spent laying on the floor installing the thresholds and door bottom seals.
post #625 of 2303
Man the trim looks great, what a neat idea. Especially to hide the fact that it is a smaller door, very slick. Have you considered making the keystone a different color from the rest of the trim? Just a thought to help set that particular feature off.

Regards,

RTROSE
post #626 of 2303
Wow. Did not know a 28" door was an option. I have a 36" opening that I was planning to take down to 32" but 28" would be perfect.

Stupid question time... I assume you can you fit the chairs in that small of an opening? I'm 6'4" 195lbs... is that an unnaturally tight doorway width?
post #627 of 2303
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unacceptable View Post

Wow. Did not know a 28" door was an option. I have a 36" opening that I was planning to take down to 32" but 28" would be perfect.

Stupid question time... I assume you can you fit the chairs in that small of an opening? I'm 6'4" 195lbs... is that an unnaturally tight doorway width?

Most indoor doors are 30". A lot of bathroom/powder room doors are 28".

Usually entryway doors are larger, and some closet or pantry doors get down to 24". The door going into my equipment room is 24".

As for the chairs, they come without the backs on. You can easily fit them in sideways without a problem. If I had to move a full sofa in there it would be a royal pain!

(I still hate painting!)
post #628 of 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by damelon View Post

(I still hate painting!)

It looks like someone needs a new toy.
post #629 of 2303
Big -

So, uh, how did you draw those nice, straight lines around the door without your architectural ruler?



Just askin'.
post #630 of 2303
Thread Starter 
BIG is great at what he does, he doesn't need no stinking architect's ruler to draw a puny line!
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