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The "Official" Pioneer Elite SC-55/SC-57 Owners Thread - Page 117

post #3481 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by oztech View Post

Just a thought do you have the encryption set to WPA2 Apple products as well as all new tech plays nicer.

Yes I have my security settings on my router set to WPA2.
post #3482 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtkun View Post

Yes I have my security settings on my router set to WPA2.

OK, this is weird. I just got the Pioneer wireless adapter in the mail. Once I got it setup and hooked up, Airplay now works (guess you need to a wireless adapter for this to work???). I even got my ipad to turn on the SC-57 using Network standby (really cool).

If anyone has more suggestions for how to get Airplay to work via a LAN please let me know. Thanks.
post #3483 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtkun View Post

Yes, my ipad can connect to the internet via the wireless router and I can connect to my SC-57 via the AV2 app.
My router is the Actiontec MI424WR (supplied for Verizon Fios) and my SC-57 is connected directly to the router via LAN
I have tried turning on network standby and still cannot see the Airplay icon on the ipad.

i have the same router with Fios and have no issues with my ipad and airplay

you should not have to have the wireless adapter plugged directly in the SC55

how about itunes on laptops or other computers? can they see the SC-55 with airplay over wireless? Do you have the latest firmware for the sc55? There was an update a couple of months ago.

can your ipad access your itunes computers?
post #3484 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtkun View Post

OK, this is weird. I just got the Pioneer wireless adapter in the mail. Once I got it setup and hooked up, Airplay now works (guess you need to a wireless adapter for this to work???). I even got my ipad to turn on the SC-57 using Network standby (really cool).
If anyone has more suggestions for how to get Airplay to work via a LAN please let me know. Thanks.

you do NOT need the wireless adapter to make this work

i bet it is a router configuration issue, checkout this thread

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3897274?start=0&tstart=0
Edited by purdyd - 8/31/12 at 9:02pm
post #3485 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

i bet it is a router configuration issue, checkout this thread
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3897274?start=0&tstart=0

I had a dickens of a time getting the icontrolav app to link with the SC-68. whatever I did the iphone would flat not connect to the 68. I removed the MAC access control filter, the encryption - nothing worked.

I don't know if it was in the thread you linked to or not, but somewhere I found a reference (maybe Pioneer Japan's icontrol FAQ or troubleshooting tips?) and I'm not sure of the exact sequence, but I think it suggested removing the router's DHCP IP address entry and reboot it. It will re-assign IP address. I did that, re-applied encryption, re-tried the iphone, let it re-discover the IP address, and have no idea why but this time it hooked up OK, "saw" the SC-68 and has been working ever since. A little frustrating considering how simple apple devices are supposed to be but it may be the app - who knows, all I know is it works now.

Rebooting the router never hurts...mine is a older Netgear.
post #3486 of 3982
Changing my setting to "Broadband" and disabling the IGMP Proxy setting worked! This saved me $115 for the wireless adapter! Thanks everyone for the advice!
post #3487 of 3982
^^
congrats! enjoy biggrin.gif
post #3488 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtkun View Post

Changing my setting to "Broadband" and disabling the IGMP Proxy setting worked! This saved me $115 for the wireless adapter! Thanks everyone for the advice!

Awesome!

For what it is worth I just got FIOS and like I said, everything worked AirPlay out of the box but I checked the settings and they agreed with that link I posted

So verizon may have figured it out
post #3489 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

I had a dickens of a time getting the icontrolav app to link with the SC-68. whatever I did the iphone would flat not connect to the 68. I removed the MAC access control filter, the encryption - nothing worked.
I don't know if it was in the thread you linked to or not, but somewhere I found a reference (maybe Pioneer Japan's icontrol FAQ or troubleshooting tips?) and I'm not sure of the exact sequence, but I think it suggested removing the router's DHCP IP address entry and reboot it. It will re-assign IP address. I did that, re-applied encryption, re-tried the iphone, let it re-discover the IP address, and have no idea why but this time it hooked up OK, "saw" the SC-68 and has been working ever since. A little frustrating considering how simple apple devices are supposed to be but it may be the app - who knows, all I know is it works now.
Rebooting the router never hurts...mine is a older Netgear.

Yeah icontrolav can be fussy, more so than AirPlay

Part. Of the issue is discovery of the receiver, fixed ip address can help this

Sometimes it just locks up, pulling the power cord fixes that

Most of these pains happened In The first couple of months

However, for whatever reason, once I got everything really dialed in and with the latest firmware everything seems pretty solid and I am back to using dhcp

Go figure
post #3490 of 3982
I just got this & am having trouble getting sound from my HTPC. My video card's an older model with no audio over HDMI so I'm running from the coax out to the AVR. Per the manual, I connected the HDMI to input 5, DVD, & the coax to coax input 1. I get picture but no sound.
The HTPC worked with my old receiver, a Harmon Kardon AVR-325 so I don't think it's the computer, but I'll check.
Edit: If I go into the input setup menu & turn the HDMI input off, I get sound. How do I set that input to use the coax input & ignore the HDMI for audio?
Edit 2: Okay, I figured that out. Now it only plays everything, even my HD satellite PVR over HDMI in stereo.
Edited by Topher - 9/1/12 at 9:34am
post #3491 of 3982
^^
it's in the manual, pg 9 & 45.

for that particular input, use the Signal Sel button on the remote to change the audio input signal from Auto (default) or HDMI to Digital. You should get video from the HDMI input & audio from coax digital. But you'll have to make sure you assigned the digital coax to the same input as the HDMI & that'll be in the setup menu.
post #3492 of 3982
Thanks. I thought that it would automatically select the coax in if there was no audio over the HDMI. I finally got that working & the HD satellite PVR comes is DD like it should, now I just have to figure out why my HTPC comes through in stereo. I'll try reinstalling the audio drivers, but it was working before with no changes.
post #3493 of 3982
Issue with AV2 remote in HMG not scrolling beyond a single page for audio tracks, internet radio?? (not connectivity related)

High all. I've had my SC-57 for a few months and thought I had everything "dialed-in" but am hitting a brick wall with the AV2 software. Recently it has just stopped being able to scroll beyond 7-9 items in a list. For example: If I select "Internet Radio" and then "countries" -- I cannot scroll down to North America. The list stops at Middle East. I can then select Middle East, press the back icon, and North America through the remaining items.

The same happens with the songs served by Media Monkey -- which is an epic pain. I can't even get to "Rock" on the first pass. (blues, folk, jazz, jazz vocal, r&b, FAIL)

Note: This is happening with the App on an IPad3 and two Samsung Galaxy II phones. I'd thought it was my computer serving the music files, but it seems to happen with any list in AV2.

Is anyone else having this issue? the app was always a little "laggy" but good enough. Now it is becoming kind of useless except as a remote power button and volume control. Pioneer doesn't seem to update the app at all (disappointing -- seriously, what gives) so... any suggestions?

Alternately -- Does anyone know of a good work-around or alternate. I have an Oppo-95 (also, no remote App... bummer) and I'd kind of like to avoid a 3rd music "server" simply to get app access. Any suggestions?

Note -- the computer is only connected via Cat 6 to the receiver, it is not an HTPC. I could rebuild that route, but that is a bigger project and I'm hoping the SC-57 + some "app" can solve the problem in the near term. Flipside -- if anyone know of a fully functional way to remote (app) control the Oppo-95 and be able to scroll through my music that would be the preference as the DAC's are better smile.gif

Thanks for any help.


Final tip: For those of you having connectivity drops with the AV2. I set the IP assignment on the router to a fixed address for the SC-57, then entered that on the AV2. It solved most of the problems. It's gotten less stable with ICS (Android 4.x) but was very solid on previous releases and on the iPad it is pretty unshakable. If you have any questions, just let me know.
post #3494 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeleriumTremens View Post

Issue with AV2 remote in HMG not scrolling beyond a single page for audio tracks, internet radio?? (not connectivity related)
High all. I've had my SC-57 for a few months and thought I had everything "dialed-in" but am hitting a brick wall with the AV2 software. Recently it has just stopped being able to scroll beyond 7-9 items in a list. For example: If I select "Internet Radio" and then "countries" -- I cannot scroll down to North America. The list stops at Middle East. I can then select Middle East, press the back icon, and North America through the remaining items.
The same happens with the songs served by Media Monkey -- which is an epic pain. I can't even get to "Rock" on the first pass. (blues, folk, jazz, jazz vocal, r&b, FAIL)
Note: This is happening with the App on an IPad3 and two Samsung Galaxy II phones. I'd thought it was my computer serving the music files, but it seems to happen with any list in AV2.
Is anyone else having this issue? the app was always a little "laggy" but good enough. Now it is becoming kind of useless except as a remote power button and volume control. Pioneer doesn't seem to update the app at all (disappointing -- seriously, what gives) so... any suggestions?
Alternately -- Does anyone know of a good work-around or alternate. I have an Oppo-95 (also, no remote App... bummer) and I'd kind of like to avoid a 3rd music "server" simply to get app access. Any suggestions?
Note -- the computer is only connected via Cat 6 to the receiver, it is not an HTPC. I could rebuild that route, but that is a bigger project and I'm hoping the SC-57 + some "app" can solve the problem in the near term. Flipside -- if anyone know of a fully functional way to remote (app) control the Oppo-95 and be able to scroll through my music that would be the preference as the DAC's are better smile.gif
Thanks for any help.
Final tip: For those of you having connectivity drops with the AV2. I set the IP assignment on the router to a fixed address for the SC-57, then entered that on the AV2. It solved most of the problems. It's gotten less stable with ICS (Android 4.x) but was very solid on previous releases and on the iPad it is pretty unshakable. If you have any questions, just let me know.

ok, first small rant, I DONT KNOW WHY PIONEER DOESN"T UPDATE THE AV2 App. The official word from Chris Walker is it is too difficult to add features. Baloney. Amazing how other companies can do it. end of rant

ok, when you scroll on the ipad, does it scroll on the TV screen and the display on the receiver?

try running a telnet session to your receiver while AVS2 app is running. AVS uses a different port to send and receive commands but the status will be echoed out port 23 (telnet) .

when you scroll with your remote, doe the displays updates, and you should see stuff echoed out on the telnet port and to the AV2 app

I can say right now, i do NOT need a fixed IP assignment for AV2 to work. I did use it for awhile.

Do you have the latest SC5X firmware? There was an update quietly released last winter with performance enhancements, whatever those are....

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/AV-Receivers/Elite+Receivers/SC-55

ok, second small rant, why oh why would someone who buys a new receiver every month start this thread and not maintain the front page?
post #3495 of 3982
WTF is the B27102 error I am getting on my SC-57?

Randomly my AVR won't see my PC or Phone, but it will play Pandora?

Man, so annoying...
post #3496 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

WTF is the B27102 error I am getting on my SC-57?
Randomly my AVR won't see my PC or Phone, but it will play Pandora?
Man, so annoying...

Figures my question would kill the thread...
post #3497 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

Figures my question would kill the thread...

maybe 'cause no one else has seen this particular issue? wink.gif

I suggest you call Pioneer & find out then you can educate us smile.gif Because I certainly don't know your problem & it could be something specific in your setup or network or the AVR itself.

Your post didn't kill anything...if no one still active here has seen this error message themselves, what can they say, other than ramblings like my own redface.gif

I think all your talk of wishing for audyssey has hurt your 57's feelings & it's turning on you wink.gifbiggrin.gif

but at least we're trying to keep the thread off life support wink.gif the SC-09 one hasn't seen posts in so long, it's buried way back thar'...

seriously, I would call Pioneer & ask for tech support, not cust svc & see if they can get an engr to look up what that error code means. I have a service manual of the SC-09 but none of the other models. I'll look in it & if I find something, I'll post. I wouldn't get my hopes up because the 57 has so much more network capabilities than the 09 which came out before Pioneer had put in iphone support.
Edited by ss9001 - 9/7/12 at 3:09am
post #3498 of 3982
nothing in the SC-09 service manual, sorry...
post #3499 of 3982
Also no mention about that error in the SC-57 service manual...
You should ask tech-support from Pioneer for this frown.gif
post #3500 of 3982
Purdyd: on the telnet session, tried. Does not carry the commands -- it seems to send a second request each time asking for the next set

On why Pioneer isn't updating the AV2 App: My guess is that if that is the reason that Chris Walker gave he is not being entirely forthcoming. As far as I can tell, Pioneer contracted the development of the app out to a 3rd party shop --- a fairly small mobile app group based in japan. In all likelihood they simply didn't contract further revs or couldn't agree on the contract or made a bigger goof and didn't secure the IP rights.

Either way -- it is remarkably disappointing that they have just written it off. This was my first Pioneer AV purchase. I owned their Elite CD and then universal DVD players previously which were both very good.

However, I can't say that I would ever buy a product from them (with a lot of confidence/at a premium) again if they can't maintain performance on the app side. While they aren't the only vendor to be behind the curve when it comes to mobile apps, they are one of the few with the resources to easily correct the situation. This is just a case of shoddy development that they don't feel accountable for maintaining because it isn't traditionally within their definition of the "product" and they already got the marketplace bounce from the initial reviews. The challenge is that the "Apps" are now a huge part of how the consumer experiences the technology within the receiver. It isn't always fair -- but if you were to give my wife the choice of using the Pioneer or simply turning on a portable player: the player is going to win every time at a 25% of the cost because the user experience is consistent, not buggy or laggy, and delivers.

frickin' awful Pioneer. boo. hiss.

boo. get it together. Chris Walker -- if you are still paying attention to this thread, please take the feedback up. Don't become Sony.
post #3501 of 3982
^^

are you sure you & purdy are on the same page? the issue is not the AV2 app not getting updated. It WAS updated, from icontrolAV to icontrolAV2.

purdy's complaint is the the new AV2 app is not backwards compatible to last year's models, incl the SC-57. It is for this year's models. And he was told that last year's models can't just be firmware updated to be compliant with AV2, supposedly different hardware as well as FW.

If you're going to criticize Pioneer, criticize them for the correct issue wink.gif

because it ain't the app that's not getting updated. If I'm reading your post right, you have unfairly criticized them. They have updated the app I believe at least twice, since the orig icontrol.

now if you want to make an issue of why can't the older receivers be modified or the app's code modified to work with 1 & 2 yr old receivers, be my guest smile.gif
post #3502 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeleriumTremens View Post

Issue with AV2 remote in HMG not scrolling beyond a single page for audio tracks, internet radio?? (not connectivity related)
High all. I've had my SC-57 for a few months and thought I had everything "dialed-in" but am hitting a brick wall with the AV2 software. Recently it has just stopped being able to scroll beyond 7-9 items in a list. For example: If I select "Internet Radio" and then "countries" -- I cannot scroll down to North America. The list stops at Middle East. I can then select Middle East, press the back icon, and North America through the remaining items.
The same happens with the songs served by Media Monkey -- which is an epic pain. I can't even get to "Rock" on the first pass. (blues, folk, jazz, jazz vocal, r&b, FAIL)
Note: This is happening with the App on an IPad3 and two Samsung Galaxy II phones. I'd thought it was my computer serving the music files, but it seems to happen with any list in AV2.
Is anyone else having this issue? the app was always a little "laggy" but good enough. Now it is becoming kind of useless except as a remote power button and volume control. Pioneer doesn't seem to update the app at all (disappointing -- seriously, what gives) so... any suggestions?
Alternately -- Does anyone know of a good work-around or alternate. I have an Oppo-95 (also, no remote App... bummer) and I'd kind of like to avoid a 3rd music "server" simply to get app access. Any suggestions?
Note -- the computer is only connected via Cat 6 to the receiver, it is not an HTPC. I could rebuild that route, but that is a bigger project and I'm hoping the SC-57 + some "app" can solve the problem in the near term. Flipside -- if anyone know of a fully functional way to remote (app) control the Oppo-95 and be able to scroll through my music that would be the preference as the DAC's are better smile.gif
Thanks for any help.
Final tip: For those of you having connectivity drops with the AV2. I set the IP assignment on the router to a fixed address for the SC-57, then entered that on the AV2. It solved most of the problems. It's gotten less stable with ICS (Android 4.x) but was very solid on previous releases and on the iPad it is pretty unshakable. If you have any questions, just let me know.


I had this same issue and I am trying to remember how I fixed it. I even called up Pioneer to issue a complaint about this issue. They had no answer for me, but I did end up calling them back and note the solution afterwards. If you reference my name(Joel Johnson), maybe they actually wrote it down in the notes like I asked. It was a setting somewhere...man this sucks getting old...
post #3503 of 3982
ss9001 -- You raise a fair point, but not the one I was speaking to smile.gif --- I actually am referring to AV2.

My objection is that Pioneer essentially release a 1.1 version of the app for each model range -- and then leave the development of the app by the wayside. It is sloppy dev -- and my guess is that they are doing it that way because they outsourced it and don't really care. If you look at the EULA/Notice/About, the AV2 app was actually developed by satoshi Konno of Cyber Garage http://www.cybergarage.org/twiki/bin/view/

Pioneer has elected to not update the app to keep it current with OS releases, etc and continue to improve functionality, but instead to do a new build for the new release of receivers. Again -- I've no idea the actual reasoning behind it, but I would guess that it has to do with:

1) not owning the development of the applications in-house and not seeing them as part of the product, but rather an "add-on"
2) looking at the app as a marketing/branding element vs. long-term functionality

if they owned the development, my guess is that they would look to align the development so that it was a unified product across their models and invest in it as much as they do the other feature/functions. My frustration is as much with the lack of functionality as with myself for not doing enough due diligence and buying a product from a vendor that is still a little behind the curve in some areas I care about -- like ease of use.

With iOS6 dropping shortly and then Jelly Bean on Andriod I'll be curious to see if it maintains basic functionality rolling forward. i hope so.

P.S. this is in no way a criticism of Satoshi Konno. Cyber Garage has clearly made some cool contributions to the space and the initial rev of AV2 is really cool. My issue is with Pioneer for not thinking about the effort as something more than contract work. If you build the product -- and charge a premium -- maintain and improve it or open up the API and the Open Source it so that other can do the work you don't have an interest in. Don't hold it hostage and leave us with rapidly obsolescing SW.

whew.... rant done.


and Joe! thanks. I will call them and ask. (I may also post an ask to Konno's message board and will let you know what I get back)
post #3504 of 3982
ss9001 -- You raise a fair point, but not the one I was speaking to smile.gif --- I actually am referring to AV2.

My objection is that Pioneer essentially release a 1.1 version of the app for each model range -- and then leave the development of the app by the wayside. It is sloppy dev -- and my guess is that they are doing it that way because they outsourced it and don't really care. If you look at the EULA/Notice/About, the AV2 app was actually developed by satoshi Konno of Cyber Garage http://www.cybergarage.org/twiki/bin/view/

Pioneer has elected to not update the app to keep it current with OS releases, etc and continue to improve functionality, but instead to do a new build for the new release of receivers. Again -- I've no idea the actual reasoning behind it, but I would guess that it has to do with:

1) not owning the development of the applications in-house and not seeing them as part of the product, but rather an "add-on"
2) looking at the app as a marketing/branding element vs. long-term functionality

if they owned the development, my guess is that they would look to align the development so that it was a unified product across their models and invest in it as much as they do the other feature/functions. My frustration is as much with the lack of functionality as with myself for not doing enough due diligence and buying a product from a vendor that is still a little behind the curve in some areas I care about -- like ease of use.

With iOS6 dropping shortly and then Jelly Bean on Andriod I'll be curious to see if it maintains basic functionality rolling forward. i hope so.

P.S. this is in no way a criticism of Satoshi Konno. Cyber Garage has clearly made some cool contributions to the space and the initial rev of AV2 is really cool. My issue is with Pioneer for not thinking about the effort as something more than contract work. If you build the product -- and charge a premium -- maintain and improve it or open up the API and the Open Source it so that other can do the work you don't have an interest in. Don't hold it hostage and leave us with rapidly obsolescing SW.

whew.... rant done.


and Joe! thanks. I will call them and ask. (I may also post an ask to Konno's message board and will let you know what I get back)
post #3505 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeleriumTremens View Post

Purdyd: on the telnet session, tried. Does not carry the commands -- it seems to send a second request each time asking for the next set
.

I don't jknow what you mean by that

You didnt answer the questions,

1) does it scroll properly when you use the remote and a tv screen as a display?
2) does if scroll properly on the tv screen when you use icontrol av2?
3) with a telnet session from a computer connected directly via an Ethernet cable, when you use the remote to scroll, do you see it output the text to your telnet session?

My issue with pioneer and icontrol apps is they have actually gone out of there way to make things incompatible

For instance, I can use the original icontrolav program to control my sc55 because the ip commands have not changed

However with icontrol2012, there is code that says, sorry, doesn't work with the sc55

If you look at all of the commands implemented in icontrol2012, I think there is only one or two unique to the new 2012 rcvrs

Of course Denon and yami have just one app, for all of their receivers for all of the years

They must have brilliantl programmers, sarcasm
post #3506 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeleriumTremens View Post

ss9001 -- You raise a fair point, but not the one I was speaking to smile.gif --- I actually am referring to AV2.
My objection is that Pioneer essentially release a 1.1 version of the app for each model range -- and then leave the development of the app by the wayside. It is sloppy dev -- and my guess is that they are doing it that way because they outsourced it and don't really care. If you look at the EULA/Notice/About, the AV2 app was actually developed by satoshi Konno of Cyber Garage http://www.cybergarage.org/twiki/bin/view/
Pioneer has elected to not update the app to keep it current with OS releases, etc and continue to improve functionality, but instead to do a new build for the new release of receivers. k)

And yes, when 2013 rolls around, you can bet icontrol2013 will not work with your sc68

And the problem is they haven't finished the app, it should work on all of the features, including the setup menu

I am guessiing that will trickle out in 3 or 4 years

I am serious, I will not buy another pioneer product
post #3507 of 3982
When you made your receiver a static ip, did you also make your server a static ip? I think that is what fixed mine. I think I made the server just dhcp. I hope this helps.
post #3508 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeleriumTremens View Post

Purdyd: on the telnet session, tried. Does not carry the commands -- it seems to send a second request each time asking for the next set
.

I don't jknow what you mean by that

You didnt answer the questions,

1) does it scroll properly when you use the remote and a tv screen as a display?
2) does if scroll properly on the tv screen when you use icontrol av2?
3) with a telnet session from a computer connected directly via an Ethernet cable, when you use the remote to scroll, do you see it output the text to your telnet session?

My issue with pioneer and icontrol apps is they have actually gone out of there way to make things incompatible

For instance, I can use the original icontrolav program to control my sc55 because the ip commands have not changed

However with icontrol2012, there is code that says, sorry, doesn't work with the sc55

If you look at all of the commands implemented in icontrol2012, I think there is only one or two unique to the new 2012 rcvrs

Of course Denon and yami have just one app, for all of their receivers for all of the years

They must have brilliantl programmers, sarcasm

before holding up the denon app as a shining example, you should understand that it is very limited, and cannot in any way be compared to the pio app in question...

and you know i'm a denon fanboy... tongue.gif but their app is a joke compared to the pio app... many of us coughed up the cabbage to buy a 3rd party app...
post #3509 of 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

before holding up the denon app as a shining example, you should understand that it is very limited, and cannot in any way be compared to the pio app in question...
and you know i'm a denon fanboy... tongue.gif but their app is a joke compared to the pio app... many of us coughed up the cabbage to buy a 3rd party app...

Denon app at least works with all receivers

I just had a gander at the ip commands for the 2012 receivers

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Support/Home-Entertainment-Custom-Install/RS-232+&+IP+Codes/A+V+Receivers

When you look at what icontrol2012 does, not sure what the big deal is about supporting the 2011 receivers

I don't know why pioneer would renumber the commands for controlling the inputs

Of course the obvious solution would have bee to smartly define the ip commands to begin with so it would work ipwith future models

Or heaven forbid, update the previous years firmware in the receiver

Anyway,it is what it is
post #3510 of 3982
I agree, the lack of a functional app is somewhat disheartening, especially with the level of publicity that Pioneer made for their app--that's why they claimed more limited remote functionality and a few other things--, but it was an excellent app, when it worked. I've been a loyal Pioneer customer for years, and they've slowly eroded my consumer confidence and respect for their products, in reliability and build quality.
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