The "Official" Pioneer Elite SC-55/SC-57 Owners Thread - Page 128

You have described what I did accurately, with the exception that I first had the two voice coils wired in parallel, which would have reduced the impedance to 2 ohms, I believe. I turned the sub amp on, there was a short, low hum which stopped when I turned the sub amp from on to off. The hum stopped, but when I turned it back on again, there was no hum anymore. I suspect I fried the coils at that point. You mentioned having read the sub amp manual. Do you know where I could get or download the manual for the Jamo MPA-100? I will replace the speaker, but want to correctly connect everything. Regardless, I will start by only connecting a single RCA from the SC-55 to the sub amp. Thanks for you comments.

To be honest I never did find the correct manual. But while I was surfing around looking I discovered that Jamo manuals and devices tend to have many similarities. The only current sub amp listed is the MPA-201. It may have enough in common with your amp to be of some help. That said you may have already looked at this manual, but if you haven't you can find it here.

You also may want to consider contacting Parts Express for a new driver. They are very helpful and would likely have just what you need.
Edited by Terrya - 2/15/13 at 7:08am

Thank you again. Looking at the manual, in the section on passive subwoofer, the hookup appears to be for a double voice coil speaker, with the amp set to stereo and the speaker level conductors coming out on both right and left channel. If I had hooked mine up that way, I think I would have been fine. However, I had read somewhere that sending a right and left signal to a double voice coil sub speaker would result in the voice coils working against each other and poor sound quality, so I went through the gyrations that fried my speaker.

I have already ordered a single voice coil speaker. Looking again at the passive subwoofer diagram, it looks like I can keep the right and left (even though they are a split from a single source) input RCA's, but then set the switch to bridge (my amp has a switch to set to Bridge or Stereo) and then connect the speaker wire positive to the left channel positive and the speaker wire negative to the right channel negative. That is what the diagram appears to show for "Bridged Mono". What do you think? I know you suggest just using one RCA, but then wouldn't one channel of the amp be unused, with 50 percent reduction of power to the speaker?

Either configuration will work, and I doubt you'll notice the difference in sound quality. The switch from Bridged Mono to Stereo should simply be describing the input configuration to the sub amp and should not influence the output level of the amplifier.

The thing about audio that I've learned is that sound improvements are incremental and can be very subtle, but they can add up. Critical auditioning can reveal differences but it's not always that easy to discern. These configuration options you're facing are easy to adjust but while A/B testing might prove to be tricky, and may reveal no audible differences, it may be worth doing if you have time. Pick something you're familiar with and play it with each configuration and decided for yourself what sounds best. Having someone audition with you can to eliminate the possible placebo effect.

Here's an anecdotal example: For years I've read that there is no audible difference between a FLAC file and an uncompressed file. More recently I've been reading that this may not be true. I set up an experiment and played two identical high resolution files purchased from HD Tracks, one in FLAC format, the other in AIFF (Apple's uncompressed format) I quickly switched back and forth and thought I could hear a difference. One version had the notes lingering longer, in a long slow decay to oblivion. That's what I thought I heard anyway, but I knew what I was listening to. I asked my wife to listen, figuring she'd have no time for it or get impatient, noticing no difference whatsoever. That's not what happened however. After two or three quick auditions she said "That one! That one has the notes lingering longer. It sounds richer and smoother." She'd heard exactly what I'd heard without any prompting. A little time invested in creating new versions for my server and I have improved sound..........for free! That's not a bad deal.

The point is, when we're not sure which configuration is best, do a test if possible and find out.

Sorry if my question if off topic (yes I'm a SC-57 owner) but how come I can't find any discussion/threads on AVS about Pioneers recent announcement of spinning off their home entertainment business and how it will affect future receivers and blu-ray players.

Thanks

So which one did you like better? Inquiring minds want to know :-)

I have to be careful, don't I? There are some who will not believe that we could hear a difference. Thankfully my wife proved to me that I wasn't just hearing what I expected to hear. The AIFF files sounded better.

Here come the flying tomatoes........

FYI the source material for the AIFF files was the same FLAC file converted to AIFF in XLD.

Further info, in case inquiring minds want to know. I'm using an iMac as a music server, running Decibel (as my music player) output through USB to a Musical Fidelity V-Link, output through digital coax to my Peachtree Nova's built in 24/96 Sabre DAC. I had to use a boosted USB cable, and the conversion to coax is because the Nova DAC can't do 24/96 through USB. It all started as an experiment with a demo version of Decibel and the expense of a boosted cable that I figured I'd toss if I didn't like the results. (I think it cost around $30) I should be using the shortest audiophile USB cable possible, right? Nevertheless I heard a sonic improvement over iTunes using this setup, regardless of (or in spite of) the extreme signal path.
Edited by Terrya - 2/15/13 at 10:18am

The point that seems to escaped the discussion is that sighted evaluations like the one above tend to provide the evidence that is either random or serves the listener's biases. There is only one sure way to do an experiment like this without personal biases affecting the results and that involves reducing or eliminating personal bias as surely as is possible. IOW, the dreaded Double Blind Test.

If you have a Windows PC there is a freebie program called Foobar2000 that has an ABX plug in for the most reliable possible results:

http://www.foobar2000.org/download

http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_abx

Step-by-step

http://www.homebrewedmusic.com/2009/04/22/abx-testing-and-a-new-audio-interface/

Instructional video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jt7GyFW4hOI

That's cool but, I'm not in 100% agreement. This simple test was done by the people who will be doing the listening and took less than 5 minutes. No further testing is required to convince us. And it's not my intention to convince others, I'm simply reporting my experience, and encouraging others to do their own testing. And they may want to try the method you describe, thank you for posting it. But I don't need to.
Edited by Terrya - 2/15/13 at 10:31am

i think what you are testing is the ability of your player to output FLAC versus AIFF.

Precisely my intention. I'm working within the parameters of my own gear. The test resulted in a better listening experience without investing a dime.

That's pretty cool! It really doesn't matter how it tests technically if it sounds better to you. I'll have to perform the same thing with my gear. Thanks for reporting on your experience.

From the press release it sounds like the disc business is losing money and the av business saw significant decline in Japan

Supposedly the new company will stand on its own with the idea it will become profitable again and be quicker to react

The example given had to do with outsourcing versus in house

An optimistic view might be pioneer makes money again and releases new innovative products faster

On the other hand, they could be building more cheap stuff and this could be s prelude to the end of pioneer as an av and disc player company

I'm not holding my breath on pioneer changing, a.though it is nice they updated hmg

What I don't understand is why pioneer doesn't build value in their products by continuing to support them, especially the elite line

As it is, retailers practically give the products away at the end of the model year

Imagine though if pioneer had a policy of adding substantial updates to the firmware that would build some brand loyalty

You might suppose that would hurt sales, but I contend it wouldn't and would help maintain the average selling price

Besides, all pio would have to do is add some real cool hardware feature

Yes, but everybody has to play along . I have directv , and it doesn't ( Xbox doesn't neither ) so I have to run component to tv and hdmi to sc55. The oppo blue ray does so if desired I can leave sc55 off and still use oppo

Is there a trick to getting Pandora to work on the SC-55? I have my SC-55 connected through the Pioneer wireless adapter (sold separately, as they say). I am connected to the internet because I can get internet radio loud and clear. However, when I try to log into my existing Pandora account, I get a message something like "communication Error". I think I have carpal tunnel in my thumb from trying to input my account username and password - in several ways at least 25 times. If you haven't tried it, it is a very frustrating exercise. The manual gives no step by step instruction on this. (Memo to Pioneer - give the instructions as though the new user is just that - a new user). On my Vizio smart TV, on the other hand, it was a snap to log in to Pandora. I am curious to see if there is a noticeable sound quality difference between the Pioneer and the Vizio TV. There is a wide variation on the internet radio channels. Also, does the SC-55 support or is it able to access YouTube? Thanks.
Terry

I lost track but I think the latest firmware addressed this issue
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/ephox/StaticFiles/PUSA/Files/SC-55_57/Ver1_203_086_703_093/Change_History_SC55_57_Ver1-203-086-703-093.txt

Thank you. That did resolve the Pandora issue. I got right in on the first try. Regarding the firmware updates, does the latest one issued include the all of the previous revisions, or do I have to worry that by updating this latest by USB, any revisions I had made previously by internet are wiped out? For example, I see that one of the earlier revisions was regarding connectivity. I noticed now that the internet radio cuts out and is buffering now, whereas it wasn't doing that before. The DA was using her laptop, so that could have diluted the information transfer over my LAN, I suppose. That leads me to my next question. Will I have a significantly better connection to these internet based functions by hard-wiring by ethernet cable than by the Pioneer wireless LAN adapter? Thanks again.

As far as I know the latest has all fixes

Always better to be hardwired

I agree. Usually all previous firmware updates are included in the latest, and yep, hard wired is generally better but not always easily done or as convenient as wifi.

So, I installed a single voice coil 250 watt in-wall sub speaker to replace the one I burned up. To be cautious, I connected from sub 1 out of the SC-55 to the left channel input only of MPA-100 sub amp. I connected the speaker to the left channel speaker output of the sub amp. With the sub amp off, I slowly plugged it into a power strip. There was a loud hum that did not sound good to me. I immediately unplugged it. I tried it again and the hum came on again and I unplugged it. It seems to me that the amp is putting out very high current even when switched off. That seems very wrong. Is this sub amp hosed? Is the RCA sub out from the SC-55 a low level output or a speaker level output? I haven't been able to find this subject in the SC-55 manual.
Edited by Dobes49 - 2/21/13 at 8:13am

The sub out from the SC-55 is line level not speaker level.

You might try plugging in the sub amp without any input via RCA. if the hum is present the issue is the amp or the speaker wires. If the hum is gone the issue may be the rca cable. If this is the case I'd try using the other half of the cable.

I'm not sure if it will pass thru or not (I would think it would), but what I do is plug the cable box via HDMI directly into the TV. If you have HDMI Control turned on (and assuming your TV supports both HDMI Control and the HDMI Audio Return Channel), the TV will automatically turn on the receiver and set it to TV. It picks up the audio via the HDMI Audio Return Channel so no extra cable is necessary. If I don't want to listen via the receiver, I simply shut the receiver off and the sound returns to the TV. I also do this because I don't want the receiver to do any video processing. Via HDMI control, if I switch the receiver to Blu-ray, the TV will automatically change inputs to the HDMI input from the receiver.

The only thing that doesn't work (and I think it used to, so some setting might have changed somewhere) is that if I shut off the TV, the receiver doesn't shut off automatically. Sometimes that's bad (like when I've finished watching media for the night) and sometimes it's good (like when I want to listen to the radio or Pandora or a CD after I've watched TV or a movie).

I can get theoretically get Pandora from the SC55, from my Blu-ray player and from my TV and by far, the absolute worst Pandora interface is from the SC55, so I never use it from there. In fact, since Pioneer also "lied" and doesn't provide updates via the network, the Apple Express network unit I got for the Pioneer was a complete waste of money, since I don't do any web stuff from the SC55. Pioneer should have been completely embarrassed by their UI. It looks completely like it was designed by coders who have no idea what good UI is. In their world, if it sort of works, they've accomplished the job. Usability has nothing to do with it because they have no problem wading through levels and levels of menus.

While HMG is not very good at all,

I can't even begin to list all of the issues with it

Network connectivity is a very handy feature

AirPlay, or connecting to a Dlna server is very nice (and you don't need to use the hmg ui)

As is being able to remote control through the network

Just ordered an SC-55, purchased a SC-61 a few weeks ago but found a good deal on a 55 so I am going to swap and save a couple hundred. They appear to be very similar however I like that rhapsody is built into the 55 apparently which must have been dropped in the 61. I am also hoping that the 55 doesn't have the plastic feel of the 61, can anyone comment on the front fascia of the 55? Is it all metal? Hope so!

I bought an used SC-57 with warranty a month ago (Euro model LX85)
I found out the hard way that it will not perform HDMI handshake - the HDMI indicator on the receiver display does not come on
My cables are good quality and that's what I have been using for years (everything works perfectly with Onkyo 818)
Here's what strange: I took it to a local store where I know the manager
They turned it on/off several times and everything worked fine
It still worked when I came home and turned it on, but that same evening I simply could not get a handshake
What can this be?
The dealer (not the local store) says that I have to pay for everything if they can't reproduce the error
Jakob

Hello again!

Yesterday it turned out, that the problem with DTS HD High Resolution (DTS HD HR) was caused by the HDMI cable (a no-name 1.3 HDMI cable). It is strange, because this cable connected to my old Yamaha RX-V1067 receiver (also equipped with HDMI 1.4 ports), has been working for two years without single problem. I can remember, that in some review of the Pioneer Elite SC-67, there was info, that this AVR has low quality (sensitive to interference) HDMI ports and therefore higher quality HDMI cables are required. I have bought high quality HDMI 1.4 cable and since yesterday I have no problem with DTS HD HR sound. In my opinion the HDMI ports in Pioneer Elite SC-67 are a weak point of this receiver.

Best Regards!
Robert

Hi Jakob,

I had the same problems until I turned off "Network Standby", if that feature is on, turn it off, if it's already off, I'm not sure what is causing it, sorry! And yes I did take it back to the dealer and same thing, was fine for them, I think they thought I was crazy! So annoying!! lol Anyway give that a go and hopefully it settles down for you!

Malcolm.

Hi guys I have a SC-55 in my Family room and a SC-57 in my living room (my main listening room). They are awesome and way better then the Denon I had before. I bought them both for great deals as open box, left overs at BB and got a great price. The 57 actually worked out to be a couple hundred cheaper than the 55.. which was cool. I have a kind of technical question that maybe is an easy answer for you guys but I need help because I don't know the best way to go about it and was hoping you could help. Any opinions or feedback would be greatly appreciated. I want to hook up and external 2-channel preamp (Tube) and then in turn a 2-channel external amp for 2-channel music listening. I have a set of Martinlogan ESL Xstat speakers that I am told sound amazing with certain preamp and stereo amp combo's but I love my SC-57 and want to still use it for everything else TV, Blu-ray, Home Theater and 5.1 sound but I just want the option of a 2 channel listening with a external and preamp and amp. Please I really would appreciate your imput. Also does the SC-57/55 preamp sound good with an external amp? Are any of you using the pre's with external amps? Thanks