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Advanced MPC-HC Setup Guide - Page 78

post #2311 of 2891
not sure if this is the appropriate tread to post this - I downloaded make MKV a week ago, never tried it, and I receive a popup that the trial period expired and I can't use it. Has anyone had this experience? I uninstalled and redownloaed and I get the same popup. thanks
post #2312 of 2891
Probably not the right thread, but here you go.
post #2313 of 2891
Hi Mindbomb

Thanks for your guidance and I apologize for the delay in providing you with an update. MPC-HC Nightly 1.7.0.7798x86 does provide the LAV Video Decoder options I was looking for in Play → Filters → LAV Video Decoder (internal). However, configuring MPC-HC is still posing a challenge. For example, when I change my options in the LAV video filters by choosing my graphics card instead of DXVA I still cannot see a difference in video quality. MadVR also seems buggy, because when I install it it doesn't work at all, then 10 minutes later it shows up in the Filters option and becomes accessible, but there is still no change in video quality regardless of how I configure it. For example, when I go through the following : MadVR → Edit Settings → Scaling Algorithms → Chroma Upscaling → Bicubic if I choose sharpness of 100 instead of 75, I don't see a 25% increase in sharpness like I should.

For now it seems the only discernible changes to video quality is via MPC-HC's View → Options → Miscellaneous → Color Controls for VMR-9 and EVR, and these controls work well on current playing video. When I convert video, the filters I mainly use to improve video quality are sharpness, deblocking, contrast (in colour correction) and sometimes de-interlace. The rest I barely use. I have observed that MPC-HC has most of these filters (or shaders) in Play → Shaders → Select Shaders or Edit Shaders, and I have tried all of them to no effect, even though in Edit Shaders I get a screen message saying “D3DX Compile Shader succeeded”. When I chose grayscale and there was no change in the video, I had to conclude that the shaders are not working. How can I make them work?

Many thanks for your help.
post #2314 of 2891
Thread Starter 
The dxva options also use the graphics card in general for decoding. The option "none" is for cpu use. Furthermore, it isn't really for quality reasons that you decode on the gpu, it is to lower cpu usage, allowing for better multitasking or battery life or possibly less heat output, etc.

The madvr scaling options only control the characteristics of the scaling. So using a chroma scaler that is sharper only affects the chroma scaling.

The MPC-HC's View → Options → Miscellaneous → Color Controls are also found in madvr>devices>color and gamma.

Note that deinterlacing generally is done automatically by the renderer, you don't have to use the shader for it.

I don't advise people to use the shaders since I'm a purist, but if you must, it's through play>shaders>select shaders. For example for sharpen complex 2, click the lower box, click add, and then click enable post resize shader.
post #2315 of 2891
Quote:
Originally Posted by MlNDBOMB View Post

The dxva options also use the graphics card in general for decoding. The option "none" is for cpu use. Furthermore, it isn't really for quality reasons that you decode on the gpu, it is to lower cpu usage, allowing for better multitasking or battery life or possibly less heat output, etc.

The madvr scaling options only control the characteristics of the scaling. So using a chroma scaler that is sharper only affects the chroma scaling.

The MPC-HC's View → Options → Miscellaneous → Color Controls are also found in madvr>devices>color and gamma.

Note that deinterlacing generally is done automatically by the renderer, you don't have to use the shader for it.

I don't advise people to use the shaders since I'm a purist, but if you must, it's through play>shaders>select shaders. For example for sharpen complex 2, click the lower box, click add, and then click enable post resize shader.

Hi , I'm currently have a decent hardware components : 2 GTX580 + I7 970@ 4.2ghz . And i would like to run the max performance of my hardware in order to produce the best picture . I have read the whole infos at the first page but not really understand . So can you give me some advices , or guide me choose the best setting for my hardware .

thank you for your all hard work
post #2316 of 2891
Thread Starter 
The only section that really differs depending on your hardware is the madvr scaling section. With a high end gpu, use jinc 3 and the antiringing filter for image and chroma upscaling, as I mention is popular with high end rigs.
Madvr's smooth motion is good to use on a 60hz computer monitor.
Generally, with a tv (that supports 23.976hz or 24hz) or a 120hz monitor, reclock works well.

If you have any specific questions about anything else, I'll try to answer them.
post #2317 of 2891
Quote:
Originally Posted by MlNDBOMB View Post

The only section that really differs depending on your hardware is the madvr scaling section. With a high end gpu, use jinc 3 and the antiringing filter for image and chroma upscaling, as I mention is popular with high end rigs.
Madvr's smooth motion is good to use on a 60hz computer monitor.
Generally, with a tv (that supports 23.976hz or 24hz) or a 120hz monitor, reclock works well.

If you have any specific questions about anything else, I'll try to answer them.

Thank you , I was doing what you advised me ,then now i'm using [jinc 3 and the antiringing filter for image and chroma upscaling]+[smooth motion] .And i have a few question.
1) how about the Image downscaling ? what should i adjust there ?
2) At the smooth motion . which option should i choose ? "only if... " , "....or if" , or "always" to give the best performance ?
3) what if I used above "Scaling setting" + "smooth motion" ,then Do i need to use "Reclock" ?

***I'm using 27 inch 2560x1440 monitor @ 60hz , and sometime ,When i watched movie ,I'm using HDMI connect from PC to TV ,and i switched to the HDTV 1080p @240hz by clicking Resolution -> duplicate these displays -> then my monitor switch back to 1080p resolution at the same as my TV ,but Both of them difference Refresh rate @60hz ,and @240hz . Do you have any idea about that ? Or any other options to watch movies better with the method i'm using ?

Thank you ,and sorry for long question ^^!
post #2318 of 2891
Thread Starter 
1. leave it at catmull rom. technically you can add antiringing and linear light if you want to make it slightly better. it's not a big deal though.
2. Choose the first option for smooth motion. only if judder.
3. reclock doesn't do much for 60hz, assuming you watch 23.976 fps videos.

If you are gonna use a tv, use the refresh rate changer in madvr (under the display modes section) so that the refresh rate matches the video framerate. Then you can use reclock.
post #2319 of 2891
im using the i5 4670k haswell, mpchc + madVR and when you turn up the upscaling to jinc 3tap the video goes to absolute ****. any thoughts? also, when i turn my refresh to 23hz for my epson pj, it also gets the jitters.
post #2320 of 2891
Thread Starter 
you probably already figured this out, but jinc scaling requires a pretty fast gpu in general.
the dxva scaling option works well for intel chips.

Not sure what would cause the stuttering at 23hz. make sure fullscreen exclusive mode is on?
Also, reclock may help, but you might not want to use it without that dtsdecoderdll.dll file.
Or a setting on the projector might help.
Another thing you might wanna consider is having 23hz be the default refresh rate.
and if you can't get it to work, you can leave it at 60hz and use smooth motion.
Edited by MlNDBOMB - 9/16/13 at 10:01am
post #2321 of 2891
meh, nothing but issues with madvr after trying all the different alogorithms. i uninstalled, rebooted, and reinstalled madvr but it still knows all the last settings. how can i get a fresh start at madvr? with bone stock madvr i was sitting at 1 dropped frame every 1.5hrs. now best i can manage is 1 extra frame every 40 seconds. i need to just start with a clean slate of madvr but it remembers my last settings. any help?
post #2322 of 2891
Run "restore default settings.bat".
post #2323 of 2891
Thread Starter 
you need to use reclock to get thing perfectly smooth.
also, other renderers will have the same problem, they just don't report them, so it isn't really anything specific to madvr that is causing it.
post #2324 of 2891
Hi Minbomb

Thanks for the valuable insights. I have made significant progress.

1. MadVR – I have discovered how to make it work properly simply by loading a second video, so no more waiting for 10 minutes. The colour adjustment options in devices also work, and also automatic de-interlacing. When you said
Quote:
the madVR scaling options only control the characteristics of the scaling

Is scaling about quality adjustment? I have tried the image upscaling and there some notable changes e.g. SoftCubic → Softness (100) to Lanczos → 8 taps. I could see that the video image becomes slightly sharper. However, overall the changes are subtle differences only, and not huge differences. I tried image downscaling, but nothing happened at all.


2. MPC-HC – I tried the shaders and they provide far bigger differences than madVR does. There is no deblocking in the options though, only denoise which doesn't seem to smooth out video very much. E.g. sharpen complex 2 and LCD angle correction seems to result in a sharper video image than the original i.e. lines such as table edges become more pronounced. Secondly, MPC-HC's shaders don't work without madVR. It's crash after crash after crash.


Is this correct for me to conclude, therefore, that this set-up is only for video that has an originally high quality source? This question is because madVR's changes were so very subtle. Is this set-up not for the digital enhancement of poor quality video, or are my configuration settings still wrong? I also just saw that you have mentioned a “fast gpu” as possibly important. My graphics card NVIDIA GeForce GT 610 has 2GB RAM and 48 CUDA cores, and I'm using it via DVI-D input on a 1080p 22inch pc screen. Does this meet the specs for what I'm trying to achieve?

Please let me know. Thanks for your help as I have learned so much in the past few days.
post #2325 of 2891
Thread Starter 
so scaling is about changing the resolution of the video. if you are watching a 720p video for example, and you have a 1080p display, the upscaling algorithm will convert the video to 1080p.

the set up is pretty good in general. I guess you can say it is not for the digital enhancement of poor quality video, but I'm not sure what that entails, or if that is part of a video player's job. On the other hand, videos from dvd's aren't high quality, but they benefit from the good scaling options and deinterlacing and other features in madvr.
post #2326 of 2891
Hi Mindbomb

Thanks for the clarification. I'm signing off for now.
post #2327 of 2891
Thread Starter 
mpc hc 1.7 is officially out now.
instructions have been updated. should be a bit easier to set up now.
post #2328 of 2891

First I'd like to say thanks for the guide, I've used it for a while and it's worked well :)

 

I recently acquired some new hardware and seeing how I'm somewhat clueless when it comes to technological stuff I'd like to ask a few questions:

 

1. I use USB headphones (Gamecom 780) so in the 'Bitstreaming' section does this mean I have neither SPDIF nor HDMI, and as such I should not check anything?

 

2. I am going to use Reclock, so does this mean that my first question is has no merit as I am to un-check everything anyway and use the dtsdecoderdll.dll?

 

3. In order to use Reclock with the dtsdecoderdll.dll all I need to do is move it into the mpc-hc/lav folder?

 

4. I use a TV (hooked up through HDMI) as my monitor. It has multiple refresh rates that it can display, a few of which have ", Interlaced" next to them, e.g. '25 Hertz, Interlaced'. In the MadVR display modes section, do I list all of them? and if so should it look like: 1080p23, 1080p24, 1080i25, 1080i29 etc? (1080i being used for the interlaced refresh rates?)

 

5. In display modes, should I also put down "720p" and "720i" seeing how I watch a lot of 720p videos? (does this matter?)

 

6. I watch a lot of anime so, in the processing>deinterlacing section, should I un-check the "only look at pixels in the frame center" ?

 

7. Is there a reason for using fullscreen exclusive mode, or can I disable it?

 

8. In rendering>general settings, I saw someone say that enabling "use a separate device for presentation" speeds up the rendering time (and it seems it does). Is it beneficial to check this?

 

9. Seeing how I'm making use of the display modes function, does this mean that "Smooth Motion" is unnecessary?

 

 

Sorry for the large list of questions, these are just some things which have been bothering me and I'd like to know about :)

 

Thank you


Edited by LiekZomg - 9/30/13 at 10:33am
post #2329 of 2891
Thread Starter 
1. In this case, don't check anything, as the gamecom 780 doesn't appear to have a dolby digital or dts decoder.
2. Yea, you can't bitstream with reclock anyway.
3. Yes, same place that lav audio is in. You can use the dtsdecoderdll.dll without reclock too.
4+5. Don't list interlaced options, and only list native resolutions (ie, 1080p ones). The reason is that madvr can't output interlaced frames, it will deinterlace them first anyway, and it can upscale to native res, which is better than non-native res. Also, you don't have to list multiples, such as both 1080p30 and 1080p60, just go with the higher one.
6. It only affects the film deinterlacing mode. I imagine most of the anime you watch has already been processed anyway, so it probably won't have any effect either way.
7. Fullscreen exclusive mode should perform better.
8. It may help, it may hurt, depends on the hardware I think. at any rate, in general, if something had an upside with no downside, it would be the default setting.
9. Smooth motion is generally for people who can't use display modes and are limited to 60hz. It may help if you are missing a refresh rate though. It only turns itself on when the refresh rate and video fps don't match well(using the "only if judder" option), so you don't have to worry about it being on unnecessarily.
Those were all great question.
Edited by MlNDBOMB - 9/30/13 at 11:51am
post #2330 of 2891
Hello and thank you MINDBOMB for the guide and tips. I tried the latest 1.5 version yesterday on some anime and the performance and quality is very good. I was intrigued by the built in shaders MPC has , so I started playing around with some of them, and have a few questions:

1)Which sharpen shader do you recommend for anime? "Sharpen complex x2"? "Edge sharpen"? Is sharpen edge better than sharpen complex x2 or vice versa?

2)Should I place the sharpness shader in the "Pre-resize pixel shaders" or "Post-resize pixel shaders" box...or both? What is the difference?

3)Is there a way to adjust the level of sharpness you wish to apply for each shader? Perhaps some sort of sharpness slider like in ffdshow?
post #2331 of 2891
Thread Starter 
i think sharpen complex 2 is the better one, but I don't use either.
post resize.
not really.
post #2332 of 2891
Hi AVS Forum!

First of all i would like to thanks AVS Forum and his skilled members for answering my question over the years...

That being said i have some news questions in my mind :


I play bluray with MPCHC (LavAudio/Video) DTS-HD & TrueHD audio tracks

(windows speakers are set to 24Bit/44000Hz) or should i set to 96Hz ?


My PC send sound to my sound card
http://us.store.creative.com/Creative-Sound-Blaster-XFi-HD-Sound/M/B004275EO4.htm

My sound car is setup with two RCA (Red/White) to my homecinema RCA RedWhite as well
http://www.lg.com/uk/home-cinema-systems/lg-BH6220C-home-cinema-system


So i know that DTSHD/TRUEHD and FLAC can only go throw HDMI
And that SPDIF/TOSLINK can only pass DTS

But what about RCA (Red/White) what is it ? DTS ? Or less (compare to SPDIF/TOSLINK)

What type of quality audio am i hearing ?



Thank you for your time
post #2333 of 2891
Thread Starter 
48khz for movies typically.
spdif can do stereo pcm (uncompressed), so it can do any format as long as you decode and downmix to stereo.

rca or spdif, it depends on the quality of the equipment. RCA would imply you think the creative is better than the LG, spdif would imply the opposite.
Also, for long cable runs, spdif is better.

In this case, I think the creative card is better than the LG, so I would say RCA.
post #2334 of 2891
Quote:
Originally Posted by MlNDBOMB View Post

48khz for movies typically.
spdif can do stereo pcm (uncompressed), so it can do any format as long as you decode and downmix to stereo.

rca or spdif, it depends on the quality of the equipment. RCA would imply you think the creative is better than the LG, spdif would imply the opposite.
Also, for long cable runs, spdif is better.

In this case, I think the creative card is better than the LG, so I would say RCA.


Thanks for your reply i will go for RCA

But did you know what type of audio go throw RCA ?
(From a DTSHD bluray track for exemple)
post #2335 of 2891
Thread Starter 
there are no limitations as long as you decode to pcm first.

Actually, one thing I didn't consider was that your subwoofer crossover might not work with rca. Might wanna test a song with a lot of bass on both connections and see if one is missing the sub.
post #2336 of 2891
Quote:
Originally Posted by MlNDBOMB View Post

there are no limitations as long as you decode to pcm first.

Actually, one thing I didn't consider was that your subwoofer crossover might not work with rca. Might wanna test a song with a lot of bass on both connections and see if one is missing the sub.

So RCA Red White & SPDIF Toslink are the same audio quality ?

Hum i dont see why my subwoofer will not work with RCA but i will check


Thanks
post #2337 of 2891
Thread Starter 
uh, it depends. with digital, the quality is largely determined by equipment coming after the connection.
with rca, the the quality is largely determined by equipment coming before the connection.
post #2338 of 2891
RCA (R&W) is analog, after the DAC conversion from digital (PCM or DTS).
As its quality depends by the quality of the DAC, it is a choice where to do the conversion - in the sound card (your case), or in the LG. As MINDBOMB pointed out, your soundcard's DAC is probably better, so this is why your setup will give you better sound.
post #2339 of 2891
Can someone suggest how I can get smooth playback of DVD (SD 720x480i) source?

My current setup:
Thinkpad x230 with Intel i5-3360M Intel HD 4000. The internal display is set at 1366x768 at 60pHz

I followed the guide with the exception of the reclock. I tried these settings and still cannot get smooth playback:

First Settings (madvr default)
Chroma: Bicubic-75
Upscaling: Lanczos 3
Downscaling: Camull-Rom

Second Settings:
Chroma: Bicubic-75 AR
Upscaling: DXVA2
Downscaling: DXVA2

Smooth motion on or off still does not produce a smooth playback compared to a settop DVD player.
post #2340 of 2891
Thread Starter 
performance should be fine, especially with the second settings. not really sure what the problem would be.
update intel gpu drivers maybe? or maybe even just a restart of the pc will do the trick.

also, if the video is telecined, force film mode in madvr>processing>deinterlacing
and smooth motion on should benefit you at 60hz.

press ctrl+j while the video is playing, and make sure all the queue values are almost full, and the times listed in your average stats are low.
Edited by MlNDBOMB - 10/4/13 at 6:55pm
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