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Official Sharp Elite PRO-70X5 and 60X5 Owners Thread - Page 439

post #13141 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by myoda View Post

Kdog:

Did you call any of the repair shops I listed for you? Thanks.

Yes, it turns out those were the same shops listed with Elite. The closest one was an hour away and would not return the call to Elite. Some of the others were over 3 hours away and it was apparent sharp wasn't going to ship someone in from that far. I started a ticket with Sharp Aquos customer service but they started locating the same shops Elite customer service did and were just duplicating their procedures. I drove a few blocks down the street and talked to a TV repair shop tech myself and he said he would fix it. Had Elite call them up to authorize the repair and the next day(today) it was done and over with in a few minutes.

I will definitely be purchasing the extended warranty now. Since Sharp is so anxious to issue a return authorization without attempting to fix a problem, I will just wait until my Elite dies and then go return it for a brand new 80" 16K OLED TV in a few years. smile.gif
Edited by kdog750 - 5/3/13 at 4:55pm
post #13142 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdog750 View Post

Yes, it turns out those were the same shops listed with Elite. The closest one was an hour away and would not return the call to Elite. Some of the others were over 3 hours away and it was apparent sharp wasn't going to ship someone in from that far. I started a ticket with Sharp Aquos customer service but they started locating the same shops Elite customer service did and were just duplicating their procedures. I drove a few blocks down the street and talked to a TV repair shop tech myself and he said he would fix it. Had Elite call them up to authorize the repair and the next day(today) it was done and over with in a few minutes.

I will definitely be purchasing the extended warranty now. Since Sharp is so anxious to issue a return authorization without attempting to fix a problem, I will just wait until my Elite dies and then go return it for a brand new 80" 16K OLED TV in a few years. smile.gif

The tech who replaced a couple of boards on my 847 was a jedi master Sharp tech. And drove from about an hour away. These LED panels will probably outlive the both of us..We're glad you are up and running. Now go watch some TV!

Back of lc70le847


post #13143 of 14509
hi, can anyone tell me if the 60in elite has the same picture quality as the 70in
post #13144 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by gweempose View Post

The fact that we're even still talking about the Kuros all these years later just goes to show how ahead of everybody else Pioneer was when they pulled the plug on their TV division. I can only imagine how amazing the Kuros would be now if they had continued to evolve all this time.

I think they would have been able to create a ZT60, F8500 hybrid. A plasma with the deepest blacks yet with the brightness of LED. Now it might have been inefficient and hot as hell, but If they managed to do this at a reasonable price, this would have given LED a better challenge in sales.

I'll say it here but I think Samsung is going in the right direction with their plasmas with competing with LED's.....extra brightness. Panasonic the wrong direction.....just better black levels. The better blacks appeal to many of us, but that's it. The average Joe is looking for bright, not black, levels and man when I see the Pannys in BB's I just feel bad cause I know they look better than the usual Standard (dim) mode they are in.

Th problem with many of us here are spoiled because we have been exposed to the great black levels of the Sharp Elites along with added brightness, and it makes it hard to view the typical plasmas again. Now if we could only have had better viewing angles..........
Edited by Mixdoctor - 5/4/13 at 1:48am
post #13145 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixdoctor View Post

The better blacks appeal to many of us, but that's it. The average Joe is looking for bright, not black, levels and man when I see the Pannys in BB's I just feel bad cause I know they look better than the usual Standard (dim) mode they are in.

Th problem with many of us here are spoiled because we have been exposed to the great black levels of the Sharp Elites along with added brightness, and it makes it hard to view the typical plasmas again. Now if we could only have had better viewing angles..........

While loving the blacks of the Elite, it is funny reviewers don't give same importance to whites (there therefore contrast, too) as they do blacks. And even with blacks they admit Elite is better, but still rate plasmas higher.

I really appreciate the greater whites in Harry Potter dream scene that David Katzmaier uses in his reviews. Love his reviews David Katzmaier, but he contradicts himself some when he says - while doing his reviews based on "side by side comparisons" - that the superior whites of the Elite vs all others including Kuro:

"In my experience however the light-output limitations of plasmas in such scenes are only visible in side-by-side comparisons, and don't detract at all from critical viewing in dim and dark rooms."

Does that mean all his reviews - which are side by side comparisons too - are to be equally discounted? LOL.

He also says the Elite has superior blacks levels vs all others including Kuro. So, Elite has much better whites, AND superior blacks - but the the whites don't count because it's only side by side comparison (jut like all other comparisons including blacks, which do count and the Elite wins but really plasma wins!), and therefore the Plasmas edge it out.

Haha!

That said, Elite does have minor DSE (mine does anyways), and motion handling is not as good as Plasma, definately. There is the cyan issue but I've never been able to make myself aware of it.

Yet - the pro reviews don't focus on these valid short coming (DSE, motion, cyan) when the rate Elite just shy of plasma - because it the Elite has BETTER whites and BETTER blacks - so seems to be plasma bias to some extent.

Anyways, I do see the short comings, and still LOVE my Elite. Great contrast, blacks, whites, low power usage. Can live with the minor DSE and motion handling short comings.
post #13146 of 14509
^^ I believe if the Elite was in the same price range as comparable sized plasmas it would rate much higher. The premium on the price tag likely sours a lot of reviewers when comparing it to the top plasmas.
post #13147 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdog750 View Post

^^ I believe if the Elite was in the same price range as comparable sized plasmas it would rate much higher. The premium on the price tag likely sours a lot of reviewers when comparing it to the top plasmas.

For the most part, plasmas offer a better bang for the buck than LCDs. This has been true for many years.
post #13148 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by gweempose View Post

For the most part, plasmas offer a better bang for the buck than LCDs. This has been true for many years.

Indeed. Full array local dimming is expensive when compared to a Plasma with similar picture quality
post #13149 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by gweempose View Post

For the most part, plasmas offer a better bang for the buck than LCDs. This has been true for many years.

I agree for the most part. The new Samsung f8500 would have probably been my choice if I hadn't solved my Elite sensor problem. But my Elite gets left on pause for many hours several times a week. I would probably have to be replacing the set within the first month lol.
post #13150 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdog750 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by gweempose View Post

For the most part, plasmas offer a better bang for the buck than LCDs. This has been true for many years.

I agree for the most part. The new Samsung f8500 would have probably been my choice if I hadn't solved my Elite sensor problem. But my Elite gets left on pause for many hours several times a week. I would probably have to be replacing the set within the first month lol.
The guy who likes to have ESPN on all day long every day is still my number one example of some one who should avoid plasma displays. You're probably some where a little below that point on the list, but outstanding none the less. Enjoy. biggrin.gif
post #13151 of 14509
For anyone that was following my woes about my BB Open Box unit and it not being able to be replaced. I have good news (at least for me it is).

Thanks to a very wonderful person within the AVS community, BB/Magnolia was actually able to replace my Elite with a brand new unit.

So here's to many happy years of Elite viewing. smile.gif
post #13152 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by malbo1 View Post

For anyone that was following my woes about my BB Open Box unit and it not being able to be replaced. I have good news (at least for me it is).

Thanks to a very wonderful person within the AVS community, BB/Magnolia was actually able to replace my Elite with a brand new unit.

So here's to many happy years of Elite viewing. smile.gif

Congrats and Enjoy!
post #13153 of 14509
hi, can anyone tell me if the 60in elite has the same picture quality as the 70in
post #13154 of 14509
Yes, the 70" has the same picture quality as the 60". The 90" is the one in the series that does not.
post #13155 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by malbo1 View Post

For anyone that was following my woes about my BB Open Box unit and it not being able to be replaced. I have good news (at least for me it is).

Thanks to a very wonderful person within the AVS community, BB/Magnolia was actually able to replace my Elite with a brand new unit.

So here's to many happy years of Elite viewing. smile.gif
Wow! I tried that as well but there are no new units anywhere on the west coast to replace it with frown.gif I had (and actually still have) the return authorization and went and looked at a bunch of TVs but they all had significantly more hours on them (display models vs open boxes). One store looked thru inventory all the way up to Washington and was unable to find any units.

I see that you are in CA. How did you manage to accomplish that???? Maybe I wasn't persistent enough frown.gif

Congrats for you though!
post #13156 of 14509
So yesterday GS came by to do a free cal. Yes, we all know the quality of GS cals, but it was free so I decided to give it a shot. Let's not start a flame war for trying GS. Please contain any flaming to the quality of the cal smile.gif There was always a chance I could get a good apple (but I don't think I did)

Prior to even fully setting the appointment, I asked some questions about him, namely equipment, experience, whether he'd ever done an Elite, and whether he'd be using the ISF day/night modes. Only the answer to the last question should have scared me - "If the TV is has that option then yes." He should have known that this TV has that option.

When he arrived (early due to a cancellation), I again asked about ISF day/night. He had to look up instructions on how to even activate the ISF modes (not a good sign). On the plus side, I now have the instructions on how to access the ISF modes biggrin.gif

As soon as he got in, he immediately "complained" that there were less settings available than on the standard mode and this probably wasn't a good idea (another sign). However, he said that since that was what I wanted, that's what he'd do. So he went on his way and started the calibration, but immediately said that the controls on the TV were having no effect. I quickly realized that he had no idea how to use the 10 point control (he was confused by that name). So, he was trying to calibrate the 100% position while still on position 1 of the 10 point. Once I showed him how it worked, he continued rolleyes.gif

Next roadblock was his inability to level out the colors for the greyscale. I watched as he played with the blue level. He pushed it all the way down (-50 I think) and the blue was still showing way too high. He was clearly getting flustered. He eventually got it to a point where he was "content", but not happy. He may have had to push the other colors up so that they were at least level. He then went on to ISF night and went thru the same pains. Throw in some accidental losses of settings by apparently not hitting the "Complete" menu item and the appointment was really starting to stretch on.

At this point we finally put in some real source material and it looked HORRIBLE. Even he admitted it. Every face looked like they were suffering from the worst case of rosacea you've ever seen (significant red push). He was befuddled since his readings were relatively good. At this point, he decided to use the regular modes where he felt he had more control rolleyes.gif He also just copied values between the two HDMI inputs I use instead of separate cals since "they should be the same (sign number...oh I've lost count)

So he used moive and standard (I told him to leave Movie THX alone since that is where I have Newbie's settings stored - It's also the "pre-calibration" numbers in the reports below). He claimed (and I admit I don't know if this is true) that all the settings are essentially the same and are just names for the factory defaults that are shipped.

So he proceeded to calibrate though two inputs - standard for daytime viewing and movie for night time viewing. He seemed to have a slightly easier time with the standard controls (i.e. non-ISF), but still had difficulty. When he was done, real source material was put in and faces did look like faces again. The colors do seem to have good pop, and when switching back to Movie THX, it now seems "muted" for lack of a better term. However, looking at the graphs, it seems that it is a much worse cal, so I'm confused. Maybe the experts can explain.

All in all, he spent over 4 hours here, which was surprising, but also annoying since it essentially killed my entire Saturday.

I'm attaching the cal reports (with personal info omitted). They are named appropriately (ISF Day, ISF Night, and Complete which is the non-ISF mode cal). There is also a spreadsheet with the values he set in the ISF day mode which seem totally out of whack - multiple setting pegged at or near the max scale.

My gut tells me his equipment was all messed up. The graphs that should equate to horrible picture (the regular cal) seem to actually have the best picture, and the ISF graphs, which look reasonable to me (although I am new at this) show s HUGE red push in actual source material.

Complete Report ISF DAY.pdf 251k .pdf file
Complete Report ISF NIGHT.pdf 251k .pdf file
Complete Report.pdf 252k .pdf file
Settings.xlsx 16k .xlsx file
post #13157 of 14509
Jason,

I have to admit, I was getting no where. A very kind individual from this forum saw my plight and said he might be able to help. As he worked for BB, I had nothing to lose. He was the one, who found a new TV and had it shipped to my local store. He did say that Magnolia inventory database in different than the normal BB database, so that may help. I have to say that once I got away from dealing with my local store, people seemed to be very helpful. All in all, it was 6 week of frustration on my efforts all if which I have not documented here, and about a week and a half with help.

I really hope you have better luck. If you can't get BB to ship the out-of-state Elite to your local store, maybe you could buy the one from out of state and return the broken one from here? Just a thought.

BTW, what is wrong with your set.
post #13158 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by malbo1 View Post

Jason,

I have to admit, I was getting no where. A very kind individual from this forum saw my plight and said he might be able to help. As he worked for BB, I had nothing to lose. He was the one, who found a new TV and had it shipped to my local store. He did say that Magnolia inventory database in different than the normal BB database, so that may help. I have to say that once I got away from dealing with my local store, people seemed to be very helpful. All in all, it was 6 week of frustration on my efforts all if which I have not documented here, and about a week and a half with help.

I really hope you have better luck. If you can't get BB to ship the out-of-state Elite to your local store, maybe you could buy the one from out of state and return the broken one from here? Just a thought.

BTW, what is wrong with your set.
I've got between 1 and 3 dead subpixels in seven different areas on the TV (60"). Sharp seems to think that is within spec, but it is clearly over the 3 dead pixel limit that the GS protection plan allows. They first tried for a panel replacement, but the part is no longer available, so they put in for a wholesale exchange instead (i.e. return/exchange authorization)
post #13159 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonvr View Post

So yesterday GS came by to do a free cal. Yes, we all know the quality of GS cals, but it was free so I decided to give it a shot. Let's not start a flame war for trying GS. Please contain any flaming to the quality of the cal smile.gif There was always a chance I could get a good apple (but I don't think I did)
....
You did the right thing to give it a chance, but from his comments and your story this guy was useless, even if you have something wrong with your TV. If you're getting a nice PQ from Newbie's settings there's probably nothing wrong with it, but I can see some really bad things in the settings, e.g. in the White Balance 10-level those are way off. The reason the blue is so far down is because the green is too. Bring the green up to 0 or thereabouts then do the red & blue to it and things will fall into place. Then in the CMS, the red & magenta saturation are totally over the top, and 30 for day & -30 for night???!!!

Well, at least it was free smile.gif.
post #13160 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonvr View Post

So yesterday GS came by to do a free cal.
Thanks for your detailed calibration report. I've added a link to it in the "special" Best Buy section (post number two) of the "customer reports" thread that's linked in signature area at the bottom of my post. The word "free" seems to do strange things to folks. wink.gif
post #13161 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by malbo1 View Post

I have to admit, I was getting no where. A very kind individual from this forum saw my plight and said he might be able to help. As he worked for BB, I had nothing to lose. He was the one, who found a new TV and had it shipped to my local store.
If it's the person that I know about, he is at BB's corporate level. That explains his ability to make something happen. Good for him, and good for you! biggrin.gif
post #13162 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnotherDude View Post

You did the right thing to give it a chance, but from his comments and your story this guy was useless, even if you have something wrong with your TV. If you're getting a nice PQ from Newbie's settings there's probably nothing wrong with it, but I can see some really bad things in the settings, e.g. in the White Balance 10-level those are way off. The reason the blue is so far down is because the green is too. Bring the green up to 0 or thereabouts then do the red & blue to it and things will fall into place. Then in the CMS, the red & magenta saturation are totally over the top, and 30 for day & -30 for night???!!!

Well, at least it was free smile.gif.

And "free" is about the nicest thing I can say about it biggrin.gif
post #13163 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonvr View Post


When he arrived (early due to a cancellation), I again asked about ISF day/night. He had to look up instructions on how to even activate the ISF modes (not a good sign). On the plus side, I now have the instructions on how to access the ISF modes biggrin.gif

Can you share that with the rest of us? smile.gif
post #13164 of 14509
For the Elite owners who use a HTPC with a media player that supports MadVR as a source device, I have created a workflow to utilize ArgyllCMS/DispcalGUI (free color management tools) to generate a 3DLUT file that can correct the color issues (ie. cyan tracking) and reproduce the REC709 target gamut almost perfectly.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1471169/madvr-argyllcms

See post #3 for before and after pics. My set has never looked better. wink.gif
post #13165 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrenK View Post

Can you share that with the rest of us? smile.gif

Anyone have an issue with it being posted? If not, then sure.
post #13166 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonvr View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrenK View Post

Can you share that with the rest of us? smile.gif

Anyone have an issue with it being posted? If not, then sure.
I may be mistaken, but I think these are the kind of instructions that can lead the unwary into serious display problems. When I see how much misunderstanding there is about D-Nice' calibration procedure, I shudder at the idea of people wandering into the service menu.
post #13167 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

I may be mistaken, but I think these are the kind of instructions that can lead the unwary into serious display problems. When I see how much misunderstanding there is about D-Nice' calibration procedure, I shudder at the idea of people wandering into the service menu.

WRT to service mode changes, I agree completely. However, in this case, it appears that ISF Day and Night modes are nothing more than additional viewing modes and have most of the same setting options as other modes (i.e. Movie, Movie THX, Standard, etc). In fact, I'm not even sure how the ISF modes differ at all from other modes except that they did seem to have some options grayed out (hence my "calibrators" assertion that there was less flexibility). But maybe I am misunderstanding something and someone can shed some light on the topic.
post #13168 of 14509
The ISF modes have greater granularity in the key calibration areas of 10-point white balance, RGBCMY CMS, gamma, contrast, backlight and brightness allowing more refined calibration settings. Any other settings are basically not needed for a proper calibration, or may tend to defeat the a calibration's intended purpose.

For example, in the regular modes gamma has five possible settings -2 to +2, whereas in the ISF modes the gamma can vary from -20 to +20, 41 settings.
post #13169 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonvr View Post

WRT to service mode changes, I agree completely. However, in this case, it appears that ISF Day and Night modes are nothing more than additional viewing modes and have most of the same setting options as other modes (i.e. Movie, Movie THX, Standard, etc).
Don't the ISF Modes start out locked and access to the Service menu is required to unlock them?

I assumed that's what your instructions were for.
post #13170 of 14509
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonvr View Post

WRT to service mode changes, I agree completely. However, in this case, it appears that ISF Day and Night modes are nothing more than additional viewing modes and have most of the same setting options as other modes (i.e. Movie, Movie THX, Standard, etc). In fact, I'm not even sure how the ISF modes differ at all from other modes except that they did seem to have some options grayed out (hence my "calibrators" assertion that there was less flexibility). But maybe I am misunderstanding something and someone can shed some light on the topic.

I am an adult, and understand the risks, and can make my own choices, regardless of other poster's fears. So please fell free to post the instruction smile.gif
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