Official Sharp Elite PRO-70X5 and 60X5 Owners Thread - Page 221

Just finished reading the new issue of Sound & Vision and, not surprisingly, another reviewer described the Elite as having 'excellent color accuracy' and 'pitch perfect skin tones'. Not a single mention of the cyan color error. Just another indication of how unnoticeable this is in the scheme of things.

It just reenforces my notion that if nobody was aware of it from reading these pages, it would go unnoticed by almost everyone, including the professional reviewers who do this for a living.

I usually don't like to quote D-*ICE that much but in this case it bears repeating as it keeps getting conveniently ignored...

in regards to the cyan issue not being mentioned in pro reviews:

"Why has it not been covered in other reviews? Well, how many reviewers actually measure the six color points at different stimuli levels? ZERO. Sad truth but I guarantee this will change in the future as it seems what should be an automatic will now have to be checked. Thomas J. Norton of HT Magazine did mention the cyan issue, but misdiagnosed what he saw. Read up on when he discusses green in darker area on his 141FD vs the Sharp Elite on a piece of content that was mastered to have Hollywood's stylized Orange/Teal picture cast. Not getting cyan correct over 60% of the stimuli level strips the stylized look from the picutre being viewed on the Sharp Elite"

It's obvious Sharp thought there is a market for the high end viewer by producing the Elite. Anyone know how sales are going since its introduction? Hopefully it is doing well and will have a longer life than the Kuro.

The bottom line IMO Titus, is that like what reviewers so often mention, test instrument results often don't translate into visible or, in the case of audio equipment, audible errors. I think that's the real reason most pro reviewers as well as owners miss it.

I read somewhere that sales were exceeding Sharp's expectations. But who knows how reliable those comments are?

If so, price will hold.

so if the test results don't support your argument then it's the instruments that don't translate well to real world material?...but if the measurements say that color accuracy and skin tones are spot on then the instruments are perfectly valid?...no need to respond to this as it's a rhetorical question

So you are saying that people are better off waiting for something that doesn't exist yet because the next version will be better? Insightful

sort of...I'm all about facts...I'm basing it on the info that came from CES that a new Elite would be released in late Summer/Early Fall...also basing it on D-*ICE's comments earlier in this thread that the new Elite's would have "perfect color tracking and MUCH more"

so I'm willing to wait 8 months and pay the $4400 or whatever the current Elite costs and get a much better value and not have to worry about second guessing myself

all these semantics being thrown around that the issue is not noticable, how every reviewer in the world has called it the best display ever, anybody who criticizes any aspect of it is jealous etc is all white noise...in everything you have to look at the good AND the bad...certain people are only focused on the good...me personally whenever I buy a premium item I purposely try and find some bad reviews just to gain some perspective...nothing in life can be as great as some reviews paint them out to be...it's all about choosing what you can live with...if you can buy the Elite, be perfectly happy and not ever second guess yourself then go for it and enjoy

if you read through all my posts you can clearly see that I think the Elite is one of the Top 3 sets ever made...the way certain people are reacting is as if I've called the set terrible or something...me personally I don't think it's a good value based on the issues it currently has (however major or minor you might think it is)...I'm allowed to have that opinion same way anyone else is allowed to love the set...don't use me as your template on whether or not you are going to buy the set

hard to argue that...nothing but facts there

Out of curiosity, how many Elite owners watch "a lot" 3D content on the tv? I've only watched a little of Legend of the Guardians and the effect and picture was very impressive, but I think I still prefer my content and viewing in 2D. Maybe a better question is given a 2D version and 3D version, which mode would you normally watch?

Certainly, the wait and see approach is a valid one. I myself am waiting to see what the next Elite brings, though, truth be told, it's an easy call for me, because I'm not in a position where I have to buy something now.

There are plenty of us who would rather wait, mostly because of the set's issues which have been discussed to death already. To be clear, I'm not making a statement on the magnitude of those issues; I just happen to be of the camp that prefers they not exist on my very-pricy television. There are those who have the Elite and profess not to notice those problems, or else to not care. That's a valid position as well.

I'll tell you this: Everyone seemed comfortable with bringing new Elites to market in 2012 at CES. But it's clear the volumes are small, a tiny fraction of the equivalent volumes of non-Elite sets. That's why the 80" Elite is currently a maybe only. 80s sell in small amounts (tens of thousands is the total sales expected in 2012 for example) and so an Elite that sold 10% of that would be a very, very low production set.

My sense is that Sharp will have a tough time continuing to make this model work unless they can unequivocally claim the mantle of "best TV on the market". And so they have to perfect the customer experience and eliminate these nagging bugs.... I believe they get this, so hopefully we'll see that happen in the coming months.

I have to say, when I first bought this set I bought it not intending to watch much 3D content, but after watching Avatar, Despicable Me, and a few others, (mainly the comic book based 3D movies) it has officially turned me into a big 3D fan! I have an articulating wall mount that I only use for 3D movies but the 3ft closer it brings the tv is mind blowing! It didn't ruin the 3D picture instead it got better and I definitely felt the sensation of "being there". I had never experienced that, not even in a THX 3D movie theater, not even close. So to finally answer the question, It all depends on the content and the director who did the 3D as it is definitely an art, but anything that is QUALITY 3D will not let you down on this set.

Actually it's simple logic. The vast majority of people and professional reviewers don't see the issue and never did. The instruments show the error is there. Obviously then these results don't translate to real world material in most cases. Does that mean you'll never see it? Of course not, I never said that (recall who first brought this entire issue up?). But it's obviously a very rare occurrence or real world observations from many people would not be what they are.

It's hard to believe you've never seen reviews on video and audio equipment where that exact thing occurs and the reviewer specifically mentions it. It's far from a rare occurrence, it's actually quite common. Lab measurements often do not translate to actual 'real world' results with actual video and audio equipment.

When in doubt, I care less about instruments than what my eyes and ears tell me. So when a pro reviewer says the skin tones are spot on, I'll put more weight in that observation.

Of course, as you're implying, there are no guarantees that the next gen will be better, worse or the same. It's impossible to guarantee the next unit, whenever it's released, will have perfect color tracking or not. That's just simple logic. When Sharp is still working on a fix for the current model, doesn't even have the details of the next model nailed down and doesn't even know if they'll use a 4K panel or not, how could there possibly be a guarantee of perfect color tracking or perfect anything else.

That just makes no sense at all.

I watched a few things at the beginning, and the effect was very impressive. I'm not a fan of 3D, but I was curious to see how it compared with the 3D of the Sony I traded in. It was much better, with much better brightness, much less cross-talk and none of the color shift that occurred with the Sony when you tilted your head.

As good as it is, it's still of little interest to me. Maybe it's just the wearing of the glasses or maybe it's just the 'gimmicky' feel I get watching 3D, but it just doesn't do it for me.

Ken, can you or any other owners comment on the earlier post about purples appearing more blue than purple? D'nice made the same comment at the shootout. Any other Lakers or Vikings fans notice this? I haven't ordered my set yet and this would seem to be potentially more noticeable than cyan.

Actually, the cyan error was mentioned in the article. I don't have it in front of me, but I believe it was in the lower left corner on the third page of the article. (I'm thinking it was in a red box that contained some side notes, but I'm not sure).

Regardless, this set is at the top of my short list to replace my aging Samsung DLP. Has 80" been confirmed for 2012 models? I sit 15'+ from my set ATM and a 70" just won't look that big.

i noticed it when i was watching a vikings game. you could tell it was off, but it wasn't a huge issue for me.ymmv it had a more darker purple look, i suppose that could be the blue in it.

So, let's think about this.

In the Shootout, everyone, I mean EVERYONE wrote off the LG plasma within the first couple of seconds of seeing the high MLL compared to the other TVs.

Why? Because to most people there that MLL was unacceptable.

Let's fast forward to where the cyan problem reared it's ugly head on the Elite.

When some people saw that, compared to the other TVs, they also wrote off the elite as best TV.

So tell me, why where those that wrote off the LG ok to do so, but those doing the exact same thing to the Elite not right?

If low MLL is important to you, you won't like the LG. If color accuracy is important to you, the very glaring issue on the elite will make IT a TV you won't think about buying.

Why you continue to minimize other people's opinions about the severity of this issue, makes no sense.

So you actually can pull the tv closer to you when you want to view 3D to enhance the experience even more? That is a sweet idea. Tell me you have that all automated with the touch of a single button and I'm booking my next vacation to your place

none of these codes are working for me for the Sharp Elite 70. I just have Power Power. No discreet power. Tried the attachment in prev. posts but that worked only on our old Pioneer Elite, not the new Sharp 70". Any thoughts? Is URC just slow on this stuff?

So the opinion of one calibrator - an opinion not very highly regarded in this thread judging by history - has higher value than the opinions of multiple professional reviewers on videophile sites, blogs, and in videophile magazines? Please.

I suppose it all depends upon your definition of "purple" or "blue". I look at a color and say "blue" while the person next to me says "purple". It happens all the time. When I finally see a color that I can call purple, someone else says it's violet. On and on...

Similarly, your continuing to call this a "very glaring issue" is doing the exact same thing you accuse others of doing.

I first noticed it looking at the glass blocks on the Today Show. They should be purplish, but they leaned toward the blue. Beyond that I can honestly say I haven't see one other instance where I 'knew' it was wrong. Could there have been and I didn't realize it? Sure, anything is possible.

As to the Vikings uniforms, I do remember one poster saying the uniforms looked spot on, yet Airgas said he saw a deviation. So I guess calibration can play a role in how these colors appear to you.

But I think it's apparent from all the feedback we have in both the press & from owners, it's a relatively minor issue. Unlike one prospective owner's comment, I never ever had a feeling of 'settling'. I'd buy this again in a nanosecond.

No guarantees what will happen with the 2nd gen. Once you have the 2nd gen, the 3rd gen may be better. It never ends. At some point you either sh*t or get off the pot.

Go to a paint store, they have 10 shades of purple.

Right after I got my 60" Elite I bought Legend of the Guardians and Resident Evil Afterlife specifically to try out the 3D, based on reviews saying these were two of the best examples of 3D. Although the 3D effects on both movies are impressive and entertaining, I find the whole thing distracting and not additive to the movie experience. I don't plan to buy any more 3D BluRays.

Given the 2D vs. 3D choice, I would choose to watch a movie in 2D. The 3D just seems "gimmicky" to me at this point.

You are correct, I didn't read the 'Test Bench' box. So, to put things in perspective as I've said in the past, the Test Bench actually reenforces what I've been saying all along. I quote:

"Primary color points measured very close to the HD standard before calibration, although cyan and magenta secondary colors were somewhat off-target. The set's extensive CMS (color-management system) adjustments helped somewhat to correct this cyan/magenta error during calibration, however."

My personal translation: "No big deal". Otherwise it would have been mentioned in the body of the article, conclusion or overall rating. It wasn't.

I might also add that Kevin Miller told me that he has found his ISF calibration has done wonders for this problem. I guess that means 'not perfect', but much better. So, if before ISF I've got an issue that is extremely difficult to see with the overwhelming majority of material and with an ISF calibration this error will be further minimized, I'd say that sounds pretty good to me.