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Panasonic PT-AR100 MSRP$ 1,999 - 4000U replacement... kind of - Page 15

post #421 of 1007
Jimbo85281, Yep you are correct. I meant to say horizontal waves, and they do curve up at the center of the screen. This weekend though I managed to get up to 31 hours on the lamp and I now only see the screen door effect at any size I put the lens at. It does sound like you are having a different problem than me.
post #422 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShoShinobi View Post

My AR100U currently has about 25 hours on it and it has what I call vertical waves in the image. The best way that I can describe the waves is a rainbow of red, blue, green about a half inch wide and about an inch apart from the top to the bottom of the screen. (Throw of 18 feet and a screen size of 119" diagonal or a little under 9 foot across) The waves will go away if you take the image just slightly out of focus. Another way to get rid of the waves is to enlarge the image to about 12 foot across. With the image at about 12 foot across I then see the "screen door" effect. The problem also shows itself in the "Test Pattern Menu" which proves it is not any kind of signal or input issue. The best I can figure from everything I have tried is that it has something to do with the focus ?

I'm no expert, but I've torn apart my old AX200U several times, right down to the prism. A couple of thoughts crossed my mind...
1) Bad electrical connection / grounding of one of the LCDs
2) Chemical pattern on either the prism or one of the LCDs (from cleaner?)
...just my over-tired brain meandering.

I'm going to bed. Discuss amongst yourselves. Good luck!
post #423 of 1007
Can anyone tell me or show me in a photo how much "screen door effect" (the picture is made up of lots of little squares) you see in your image. The easiest way to see it is to go into the menu and bring up the test pattern on the screen. I can see squares of red, blue, and green all over the screen. Normally you should only see very faint squares all over the screen. Hold a white sheet of paper up in front of the screen if you have a silver screen. I believe it as simple as a misalignment which is why they warn me that if the find nothing I'll pay $130. I believe they think I am being overly sensative to it. "I can see it at 14 feet away" Thanks for any help.
post #424 of 1007
I see no SDE from 11 feet on a 92 diagonal screen.
post #425 of 1007
I agree with lolmaster you really have to get in close to see the pixel structure.

I took a few pictures of my AR100 on my 120" white screen 1.1 gain. Excuse the quality since the Kodak digital camera I used is pretty old and the pictures have a blue cast that is not on the screen. The shots are taken off the Disney WOW Blu-ray. I used the white pluge for the pixel shots, first at about 8 feet, then 4 feet and finally right up next to the screen - within a foot. The camera was angled up a little to keep me out of the shot. I haven't calibrated my projector since I'm waiting for more hours on the bulb before I do. Hope the pictures help.
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post #426 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShoShinobi View Post

Panasonic has an interesting concept of customer service. For those of you thinking of this Panasonic projector or another model pay attention. I am almost 40 years old, I have a dedicated home theater, I am not using a hallway. The distance from the projector to the screen is 18 feet and I set at about 14 feet (this info is for later) I bought this projector for price, to get me by for now. I had it overnighted from projector people ($95). I went over the time limit on the lamp for their return policy before I realized I had a lemon.

The Online Chat Service - First I start with the online chat several weeks ago about seeing this wave pattern in the image. As Jimbo8528 said you mostly see it in "sky" scenes. The online chat said to send Panasonic
photographs, so I did. It can clearly be seen in the photographs. As I would periodically go to the online chat they first told me they didn't receive the photos. I sent them again while I was online chatting and verified they had them. Then they said they emailed me more questions (that I had already answered) to an email address that wasn't mine. Then they said they are getting an email error when they try to email me to the email address I verified with them. FISHY ?

The Phone Call - He politely starts talking about the failed email attempts. I didn't care. At this point the wave issue which Jimbo85281 and I are describing has turned into just the "Screen Door Effect" at no matter what size I have it at. I crossed the 31 hour mark this weekend. I told him this in an over 20 minute phone conversation. "How far away are you setting ?" "And you can see it at 14 feet away ?" Does this freaking matter ? I still have an old ae900u which doesn't have the "Screen Door Effect". He said that he thought it could be a lens alignment issue since I could blur it and make it go away.

The Solution - As Jimbo85281 said, they asked me to send it in. You pay to send it to them. No problem I knew that before I bought it. He says (pay attention here) "IF THEY DON'T FIND ANYTHING WRONG WITH IT THEY WILL CHARGE YOU $130" Now at my age do I believe that they will fix it send it back and say nothing was wrong with it and ask for $130 ? I did not set it up to be fixed yet. I am going to watch it to see if it gets better or worse. Then maybe get it fixed and if I have problems get the Better Business Bureau involved. Epson anyone ?



What are we looking for in the blue/green closeup again? I see the waves in your other photos, and I would be pissed about that, but the blue/green image just looks like a super close up shot showing normal pixel structure. Sorry if I'm missing something.
post #427 of 1007
Thanks everyone for the replies and photos. I took 2 more photos (as best I could about a foot from the screen) the first photo of the AR100U and the second of my old AE900U.
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post #428 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShoShinobi View Post

Thanks everyone for the replies and photos. I took 2 more photos (as best I could about a foot from the screen) the first photo of the AR100U and the second of my old AE900U.

I think the reason the AE900 and AR100 look so different form up close is because the 900 had "smooth screen" technology which somehow (electronically or just tight pixel structure) eliminated space between pixels to compensate for it's low resolution (720P) Your pixel structure looks normal on the 100U. If you had an LCoS or DLP projector, it would look much more like your 900U in that they have less space between pixels. I have a 133" screen and I'm 13" away. I cannot make out pixel structure from that distance and I have 20/15 vision. If you have eyes like an eagle then maybe you could see them from a reasonable distance.
post #429 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo85281 View Post

I think the reason the AE900 and AR100 look so different form up close is because the 900 had "smooth screen" technology which somehow (electronically or just tight pixel structure) eliminated space between pixels to compensate for it's low resolution (720P) Your pixel structure looks normal on the 100U. If you had an LCoS or DLP projector, it would look much more like your 900U in that they have less space between pixels. I have a 133" screen and I'm 13" away. I cannot make out pixel structure from that distance and I have 20/15 vision. If you have eyes like an eagle then maybe you could see them from a reasonable distance.

Jimbo, I think after having the "wave" issue and I noticed how the pixels weren't as tight as the 900 it is just making me paranoid that something else is wrong. That is what I am trying to figure out ?
post #430 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo85281 View Post

I think the reason the AE900 and AR100 look so different form up close is because the 900 had "smooth screen" technology which somehow (electronically or just tight pixel structure) eliminated space between pixels to compensate for it's low resolution (720P) Your pixel structure looks normal on the 100U. If you had an LCoS or DLP projector, it would look much more like your 900U in that they have less space between pixels. I have a 133" screen and I'm 13" away. I cannot make out pixel structure from that distance and I have 20/15 vision. If you have eyes like an eagle then maybe you could see them from a reasonable distance.

Funny how when I first got my AE900 projector I wanted to find a way to turn off the Smooth Screen technology since I was so accustomed to the pixel structure evident in my previous Panasonic PT-L720U projector. The 720U was considered a multimedia projector with a 1024x768 native resolution and a 4:3 aspect ratio. But it was a brighter projector with a 220W bulb and 2200 lumens so in a way I have come around full circle although the AR100U is still a much brighter projector with colors clearly superior to either of my earlier projectors and I've paid considerably less. I didn't think the move from 720p to 1080p was going to be as noticeable as it turned out to be. My usual sitting position is about 15 feet from the screen so I don't notice ANY pixel structure until I get as close as my previous photos show. I wear corrective glasses when I watch movies on this setup.
post #431 of 1007
Hand-held shot with Lumix LX-5. Criterion 88" Classic Cinema White screen (1.0 gain). 15' away (approx). Eco mode.
LL
post #432 of 1007
After reading the last several posts and viewing the pictures I'm still not sure I clearly see exacly what the problems are or that they are that similar. The only constructive suggestion I have is recheck every "basic" possiblity prior to returning the PJ. I had problems with my AR projecting a funky HDTV signal right out of the box and spent over twelve hours on the phone between the cable company, Projector People tech support and Panasonic tech support not having a clue as to how to resolve the problem until I methodically and systematically "stumbled" across the soulution myself. Long story short is that it took me way too much time and effort to solve an issue that the PJ techs were blaming on the cable company and they should have been able to recognize and solve the within 2 minutes as far as I'm concerned.

That being said, eliminate every possiblity you can. Is your screen tight and perfectly flat or even defective? Is there a reflection or light source hitting the screen where and when you notice the problem? Many horizontal issues can be power/electical issues. Is your power outlet grounded properly? Is there power interference from another electical or magnetic source in your home or near your PJ?

Reset EVERY setting back to "zero" or factory setting. Check to see if your problem is visable with all or only some aspects. Some aspects and combinations of V and or other edge enhancement/screen adjustments can really effect "center screen" picture quality on many PJs. Check your PJ position relative to your screen. Has the position of your PJ "violated" throw distance, angle (vertical or horizontal) in relation to your screen? Is the PJ too high or too low? Is the PJ as level as possible? Exaggerated lens/screen adjustments can cause alot of the described picture issues.

Hope this helps. ....Jon
post #433 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trogdor2010 View Post

Oh yeah, do the Projectors have V-Stretch (picture stretcher for 2.35:1 movies)? I want to pair this with an Anamorphic lens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lespurgeon View Post

Almost 100% positive no.

Is this confirmed yet? I haven't found anything on this. I would be surprised if it didn't have the v-stretch mode since the PT-AX100U (720P) I currently own has it. I don't really need the lumens but then again the AX100U is bright as well but in best modes doesn't seem to be overwhelming in my generally completely dark room.
post #434 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShoShinobi View Post

Thanks everyone for the replies and photos. I took 2 more photos (as best I could about a foot from the screen) the first photo of the AR100U and the second of my old AE900U.

It appears you are seeing Moire affect. This is typically caused by the pixel structure aligning with something in the screen itself. What kind of screen are you using? This would typically be caused by an AT woven or perf screen, but other screens can cause it too.

Try zooming out to make the image larger, but still focused to see if it goes away. If it does then it is moire caused by your screen.
post #435 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang5o View Post

Is this confirmed yet? I haven't found anything on this. I would be surprised if it didn't have the v-stretch mode since the PT-AX100U (720P) I currently own has it. I don't really need the lumens but then again the AX100U is bright as well but in best modes doesn't seem to be overwhelming in my generally completely dark room.

I'm not sure I know what you mean. The AR100 has the ability to fill the entire 16:9 screen with a 2.35:1 signal. I replaced an AX200 with the AR100 and it seems to have all the adjustments, plus some, that the 200 had.
post #436 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang5o View Post

Is this confirmed yet? I haven't found anything on this. I would be surprised if it didn't have the v-stretch mode since the PT-AX100U (720P) I currently own has it. I don't really need the lumens but then again the AX100U is bright as well but in best modes doesn't seem to be overwhelming in my generally completely dark room.

I don't have a Scope screen so I haven't played with the screen size settings but you may want to download the owners manual (.pdf) and look at page 61.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/pdf/...anual_6499.pdf
post #437 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.G View Post

I don't have a Scope screen so I haven't played with the screen size settings but you may want to download the owners manual (.pdf) and look at page 61.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/pdf/...anual_6499.pdf

Just checked, and it sounds like it has pretty comprehesive features. You can even adjust the stretch method (on P.57). That sounds very good for the price of the projector.
post #438 of 1007
i am a newcomer to the pj forums and i want to know why there aren't anymore postings to this thread? i'm interested in this pj but,there is no activity in discussion.
post #439 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgwilliert66 View Post

i am a newcomer to the pj forums and i want to know why there aren't anymore postings to this thread? i'm interested in this pj but,there is no activity in discussion.

I have been a Panasonic owner for about 4 years now. AX200 and now the AR100. I suspect the reason is that there seems to be very little wrong with this PJ. Yes, there have been some issues but not like some of the other PJs (including the AX200) Also, it is not aimed at the purist. Meaning it is definitely a compromise. It probably is not as good as some of the other PJs in it's price range in a completely light controlled room. Although I am totally happy with my picture in a dark room. The one thing this thing does very well is throw a great picture with the lights on. It opens up a totally different usage profile that allows you to watch sports, etc. with people over with normal illumination. No bumping into things trying to get to the dip. Other than a couple of issues mentioned in this thread, I have not heard of any broad range problems with this PJ. Bulbs exploding, flickering etc. Problems tend to generate discussion. A quiet forum is generally a content forum.
post #440 of 1007
thanks iolmaster, i feel better about pj since reading your thread.i think i will be making this my first pj as soon as we get through with buying a home.so maybe in a month or so. i want to be able to watch in daytime as well as at night and i will not have a very dark room always.
post #441 of 1007
If this is your first PJ, you will be astounded at the picture. When I got the AX200 I couldn't believe how good the image was and so big. If you will be feeding the AR100 Blu-ray you will be amazed at how good a PJ can look. (not just this one) The only down side to this PJ that my wife and I have found is we are using it more than the AX200. This thing is so good with the lights on that we are watching more content on the PJ rather than the TV. Bulbs are expensive!! Oh well, no one said this a cheap hobby. Since this is your first foray into PJs you should know that virtually and new PJ is going to have a great picture. Many on this forum discuss minute details that the vast majority of the population would not consider significant. Remember, most people on this type of forum are hobbyists and they tend to be far more picky about things than most people are.
post #442 of 1007
Compared to an 80" inch TV, this projector and multiple bulbs is still quite affordable
post #443 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpotoka View Post

Compared to an 80" inch TV, this projector and multiple bulbs is still quite affordable

No question about it. That was just my attempt at being humorous.
post #444 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by iolmaster View Post

Remember, most people on this type of forum are hobbyists and they tend to be far more picky about things than most people are.

Quote:


Problems tend to generate discussion. A quiet forum is generally a content forum.

Amen to both of these comments.
post #445 of 1007

It was late last night and I was tired but since the projector was warmed up I decided to run a quick test of the lumen output of my AR100U, partially because I know there are people interested in this projector and for my own curiosity. Rather than doing a comprehensive test using the required 9 point readings I opted for coderguy's method of 3 point measurements - center, lower left and upper right corners of the screen. I used an inexpensive digital illuminance meter I purchased several months ago. The AR100U has 7 picture modes which significantly change the light output.

As listed in the owner's manual:

[NORMAL] - For a general image.
[DYNAMIC] - For viewing at high brightness.
[GAME] - For use with games.
[SPORTS] - For sports program.
[REC709] - For HDTV standard (ITU-R BT.709) color temperature 6500K at the default setting.
[CINEMA 1] - Tuned by top Hollywood colorists for watching a movie with smooth image quality.
[VIVID CINEMA] - For use with a high luminance, clear picture mode.

The readings were taken using the LUX scale and converted to lumens and ft-L.
Screen size 119" - aspect ratio 16:9. The screen area is 41 square feet.
The distance from projector to screen 13 feet 7 inches.
This projector has NOT been calibrated. The bulb has 80 hours of use.

Below are the converted readings in order of brightness (ECO mode):

[DYNAMIC] - 1974 lumens (52.9 ft-L)
[SPORTS] - 1836 lumens (49.3 ft-L)
[NORMAL] - 1642 lumens (44.1 ft-L)
[GAME] - 1578 lumens (42.3 ft-L)
[VIVID CINEMA] - 1417 lumens (38.0 ft-L)
[CINEMA 1] - 804 lumens (21.6 ft-L)
[REC709] - 777 lumens (20.8 ft-L)

Since my measurement method was less than ideal just take these numbers as a gauge of what this projector is capable of.

 

EDIT: I recently discovered that what I had thought was a 120" screen was in fact 119". Because screen size has a significant bearing on lumen and foot lambert calculations I have corrected the numbers here.


Edited by Mr.G - 7/26/12 at 12:23pm
post #446 of 1007
...since I've posted here, but always amazing to know there is this invaluable resource whenever one needs it. Anyways after neglecting the living for too long (the bedroom projector gets all the love and upgrading) I finally just ordered the AR100 from projectorpeople.com - the pricing was too good to pass up and the 8350 just happens to be out of stock on Amazon in Prime so...AR100 it is. I will be using it on a 98" Stewart Greyhawk (how's that for a blast from the past!) and am very excited as this seems to be a great solution for my needs of entertaining with the lights on.

I have a question and would like your opinions and help for mounting my new AR100. As you can see with the attached picture I had a peculiar mounting situation as I can not drill into the concrete ceiling, and the windows provide no room to mount anything. So I had a friend whip up this mount for me which has been awesome on my ancient Panny AE900U. He makes various things for my racecar but I figured why not this so...after a quick sketch he whipped this up.

Anyways as you can see the mount plate for the existing AE900U is a metalplate with drilled holes. Taking the entire arm off the wall for him to remake another plate as it isn't an option, the wall stud mounts would come loose and remounting would be a huge pain. a

Any suggestions on the easiest way to adapt this plate to the new mount points on the AR100. I guess if they are the same it would be a miracle but I haven't seen the actual mounting points on the AR100 to know. I was thinking...a simple wooden adapter plate with dropped bolts attached to the metal plate, and then drop more bolts onto the new projector? Or...maybe metal wire harnesses attached to some hardware? Is there anything like this that is premade? I couldn't find anything online with an adjustable plate on both sides of the mount as...who would ever need such a thing? lol. Your ideas and help are greatly appreciated. Can't wait to get the thing up and test it on my screen.
LL
post #447 of 1007
I can't speak to the AE900U, but the holes were identical from the AX200 to the AR100. It was too easy.
post #448 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazkioken View Post

...since I've posted here, but always amazing to know there is this invaluable resource whenever one needs it. Anyways after neglecting the living for too long (the bedroom projector gets all the love and upgrading) I finally just ordered the AR100 from projectorpeople.com - the pricing was too good to pass up and the 8350 just happens to be out of stock on Amazon in Prime so...AR100 it is. I will be using it on a 98" Stewart Greyhawk (how's that for a blast from the past!) and am very excited as this seems to be a great solution for my needs of entertaining with the lights on.

I have a question and would like your opinions and help for mounting my new AR100. As you can see with the attached picture I had a peculiar mounting situation as I can not drill into the concrete ceiling, and the windows provide no room to mount anything. So I had a friend whip up this mount for me which has been awesome on my ancient Panny AE900U. He makes various things for my racecar but I figured why not this so...after a quick sketch he whipped this up.

Anyways as you can see the mount plate for the existing AE900U is a metalplate with drilled holes. Taking the entire arm off the wall for him to remake another plate as it isn't an option, the wall stud mounts would come loose and remounting would be a huge pain. a

Any suggestions on the easiest way to adapt this plate to the new mount points on the AR100. I guess if they are the same it would be a miracle but I haven't seen the actual mounting points on the AR100 to know. I was thinking...a simple wooden adapter plate with dropped bolts attached to the metal plate, and then drop more bolts onto the new projector? Or...maybe metal wire harnesses attached to some hardware? Is there anything like this that is premade? I couldn't find anything online with an adjustable plate on both sides of the mount as...who would ever need such a thing? lol. Your ideas and help are greatly appreciated. Can't wait to get the thing up and test it on my screen.

Drilling into a concrete ceiling isn't very difficult.. unless your strata prohibits it or something. I'd just get a regular mount, and attach it to the ceiling. Almost all new cordless drills have a hammer function, and they are good enough to put some quarter inch anchors into concrete. just ask the hardware guy at home depot for attaching into concrete, it's easier than you may think.
post #449 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazkioken View Post

Anyways as you can see the mount plate for the existing AE900U is a metalplate with drilled holes. Taking the entire arm off the wall for him to remake another plate as it isn't an option, the wall stud mounts would come loose and remounting would be a huge pain.

I've attached the drawing from page 81 of the owner's manual showing the mounting hole configuration. I upgraded from the AE900U and the holes are different. I purchased the Peerless PRG-UNV (which I highly recommend) to mount my AR100U, which is roughly twice as big and heavier (19 pounds versus 8 pounds) than the AE900U. BTW your existing mount is one of the most unique I've ever seen. Maybe you should wait for the projector to arrive before deciding on how to mount it. You never know, you may get just enough of the holes to match up with your current mounting plate.

Projector dimensions: Width = 18 1/2" Depth = 14 31/32" Height = 5 15/16".

http://www.projectorcentral.com/pdf/...anual_6499.pdf

EDIT: I just remembered that the Panasonic website has a CAD drawing of the projector mounting holes.

ftp://ftp.panasonic.com/pub/Panasoni...-AR100_CAD.pdf
LL
post #450 of 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickygreen View Post

Drilling into a concrete ceiling isn't very difficult.. unless your strata prohibits it or something. I'd just get a regular mount, and attach it to the ceiling. Almost all new cordless drills have a hammer function, and they are good enough to put some quarter inch anchors into concrete. just ask the hardware guy at home depot for attaching into concrete, it's easier than you may think.

I would love to do this but I live in an apartment building and this is strictly prohibited - they actually check! Wonder though if it doesn't go in that far...
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