RX-V571 or RX-A700

Between those two, it should be an easy decision. The A700 is a much better AVR that the 567. The power difference should be noticeable as the 700 has discrete amps whereas IIRC the 567 does not.

I don't think you should try to compare power output. It's explained many times here, but some quick points...

* The power spec is not absolute; for example, a mfg. could measure at a different THD and get a different power figure, or use 1khz vs 20hz-20khz
* A resonable position to take, is that it takes twice the power for a significant gain (but that's not the whole story due to the way multi-channel amps work, but it's a good idea anyway)
* The real world performance is unclear; depending on how the limiter circuits work, and what happens in loud scenes in movies when all the channels are drawing a high amount of current

What I do, is to look at cabinet size. If it's a larger cabinet, that often means a bigger transformer in the power supply. You can then look at weight. You can also download manuals and look at it's power draw in the specs. By looking at these things, and understanding how Yamaha goes about things (something I used to understand better, having studied service manuals and product lines,) I come to some basic conclusions about how I think one model compares to another. The one thing I look at least...is what Yamaha claims the power output to be

That's an odd way to say that? Whether it's discrete amps or hybrid (chip) amps, wouldn't the power depend on the power supply and limiter circuits and such, and not the amps?

Admittedly, the chip amps may have built in limiter circuitry, I don't recall.

I know there's mixed feelings about chip amps. Some people think they can be very good (such as gainclone fans,) and some people think the mass market stuff is junk. I have never compared them directly, so I can't say.

I agree with you in spirit...the 500 series has usually been a cut down product compared to the 600 series, with weaker power supply, etc.

Using your thoughts on the amps or power supply the wt. difference between these two is 6 lbs. Below is two reviews from Home Theater along with specs. Which would you choose from each of the spec sheets?


http://hometheatergears.com/yamaha/y...v571bl-review/


http://hometheatergears.com/yamaha/y...x-a700-review/

Mind you they are just reviews and not full test but also remember that the Aventage line does have a 3 year warranty, full pre-outs, and other things that are missing from the 571. Even more than the 671 which lost its pre-outs this year.

I am not disgreeing based on which one I would choose.

Just saying that I don't think the that discrete amps vs not discrete amps determine how much power it has. Maybe I misunderstood you.

No sir you did not misunderstand me. I just feel that the discrete amps are better. Don't they need a better power supply? Don't know for a fact but from things I've read the chip amps are not in some of the best equipment are they? Am I wrong about this? If I am please correct me as I am always willing to learn something.

I don't think discrete amps need a better power supply. The only difference between chip amps and discrete amp circuits is the chip. The quality of the amp would of course be dependent on the design.

I could conceive of both pros and cons to a chip amp. Having the circuitry more closely coupled could make it easier to deal with thermal changes in the amp maybe. But then you also have a smaller area in which to dissapate heat.

One thing is for sure, though. Yamaha's prime motivation for using chip amps in their cheaper receivers is cost. If they thought they could get the same quality for less money, I could see them using chip amps more often. So in that sense, I suspect the discrete amp circuits sound better and/or measure better. But I am not sure we should codemn the receiver because it uses chip amps...we should perhaps rather realize it's a cheaper receiver and Yamaha has "cut more corners."

I sure seem to prefer my Z7 to my 867, for whatever reason

Well look at the power supplies on the two receivers. The 571 has a 270W power supply while the A700 has a 400W power supply. I'm sure that makes a signficant difference too.

Not debating that at all

But doesn't the 867 have discrete amps also. Then the big difference would be the power supplies.

I agree, that's the big difference. There's probably a bit more sophistication to the amp design (both would use similar designs, but the Z7 "may" use more elaborate circuits...there's a lot of ways to implement stuff like the input stage.) But I find it hard to believe it makes any real difference in sound.

I would like to take time to hook up both receivers to my living room system, and use them as full range amps with a good music source, and try to compare them.

i know this is old, but since I'm deciding between the same two, i'd like to point out he wasn't asking about the 567, he was asking about the 571.

The 571 still has the same small power supply like the 567 and only weighs 18.3 lbs. I would go for the A700.

The only reason to get the 571 is for the USB port. It just isn't the same quality receiver as the Aventage 700.