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Sony VPL-vw1000 - Page 10

post #271 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

And JVC's e shifted would be 3960H x 2160V, or 8,553,600, which would be 293,760 pixels less. Just filling up space with time.

So I get 97% of the pixels on the JVC for 1/4 to 1/5 of the cost of the Sony? Anyone would be crazy to buy the latter!
post #272 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by HogPilot View Post

So I get 97% of the pixels on the JVC for 1/4 to 1/5 of the cost of the Sony? Anyone would be crazy to buy the latter!

Of course you should also add the 'lumen factor', ~ 2x, and the CR factor, probably also ~2x native CR, plus better motion handling factor, ?, quietness factor, ?, plus (for me) shorter min throw ratio factor, ?. One needs Solomon to weigh all the factors.
post #273 of 9623
From a pixel count only, that would be correct, but even not then because the Sony can display 4K native and the JVC only 1920 x 1080 or a scaled 3940 x 2160. This of course is relevent to those with 4K cameras now or in the future. The Sony does provide for 4K native if that should that come along in consumer source material. But the Sony has lot of other things going for it to justify the price. These have been peviously listed.

In my opinion, the JVC RS55 and RS65 are a hell of a value price/performance wise. So is the Sony given all you get there too, but it is simply beyond many's economic budget.


Many in the $20K forum have 2D only projectors that were considered by many to be the best and that streeted for north of $20K and now well well north of $20K and that the Sony, based on specifications and features including hardware quality, will likely best and significantly do so at a possible street of under $20K. This does not lessen the PQ quality of those projectors (and please DO NOT set forth brands and models), but the performance bar has likely been risen by Sony for a lower price. This is a tough tough market for any projector manufacturer at any price class level. There is a lot of competing good stuff and likely not any in a given price class that a critical review by an unbiased reviewer would conclude clearly bests the others. The Sony is in its own class performance wise at the current street and will present a signifcant challenge for many more expensive projectors. A/Bs will happen and owners will post comparisons. Intereting times and choices are here.

I would love to have one of those older and still curent projectors just as I would love to have the Sony 1000. Its the lack of funds things again.

This sport is usually based on what one can afford, often one going even a little beyond that. And then that decision get's defended as spending more (which one can't do) as being some other's waste of money, performance value wise. The Sony would appear to be a tremendous projector choice if one can spend the money. And the owners of the Sony will likely draw the hidden envy of owners of machines above and below it price wise.
post #274 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by HogPilot View Post

So I get 97% of the pixels on the JVC for 1/4 to 1/5 of the cost of the Sony? Anyone would be crazy to buy the latter!

More seriously, since most sources will be 1080i/p for some years, the most relevant issue PQ wise is how JVC's 4K-lite methodology compares to the 4K upscaler than Sony is able to come up with. Is there any significant advantage of one over the other at a close viewing distance, ~ 1 SW or less, where any kind of 4K will be relevant? Will be interesting to find out the answer to this question.
post #275 of 9623
Mark, I agree 100% - my "97% of the pixels" comment was only meant in jest.
post #276 of 9623
I know it was. I agree will Sony be able to match or exceed what Cine4home reports re the JVC scaling. And I suppose that no scaling will ever reach a point where it can't be improved. Sample, use better algs, sand have the computational horsepower necessary to use the algs. But the scaling is only one element of performace. Better lenses, more ANSI lumens, greater on/off, better ANSI, the list goes on and on. Its a question of the total holistics. CM. Where are you when we need you. I haven't had to reach for my dictionary since you have more or less stopped posting asnd I am running out of big words that I know.
post #277 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Many in the $20K forum have 2D only projectors that were considered by many to be the best and that streeted for north of $20K and now well well north of $20K and that the Sony, based on specifications and features including hardware quality, will likely best and significantly do so at a possible street of under $20K. This does not lessen the PQ quality of those projectors (and please DO NOT set forth brands and models), but the performance bar has likely been risen by Sony for a lower price.

I can't name names? You're no fun!!!

(j/k )

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

This sport is usually based on what one can afford, often one going even a little beyond that. And then that decision get's defended as spending more (which one can't do) as being some other's waste of money, performance value wise. The Sony would appear to be a tremendous projector choice if one can spend the money. And the owners of the Sony will likely draw the hidden envy of owners of machines above and below it price wise.

Agreed... And what makes the decision so interesting is the rapidly evolving nature of the technology! If, for example, one was weighing the choice between 2 cars- a cheaper less capable one, and a more expensive higher performance model, at least the buyer would know that there would not be a radical change coming the following year. The decision to pay up for quality is an easier one. In the case of projectors, it's quite possible that a $5K model in 2 years will outperform today's $20K model.

I have to say though- I "paid up" for Pioneer plasma 5 years ago, and I've never regretted it. I watch it most days, and it still amazes me! Today, I can buy a larger plasma for a fraction of the price, yet I've never wished i had waited....
post #278 of 9623
And I suspect that the Sony will be very future proof. The Qualia had some obvious future limitations. Nothing seems to be missing from the Sony. The specifications are pretty much unrivaled for the lumens class. A good question would be what dioesn't it have that one might need in say the next three year period. It even provides for inputting dual HD-SDI streams to handle say the transmission of 4K. One might say the lamp technology might age it but really, the lamp looks like it has a long life and replacement lamps are not high priced as they are in the xenon Qualia case.
post #279 of 9623
If the software can be easily updated, then the projector can go a long time. I am sure they will make improvements in chips in terms of performance and price, but that wouldnt take anything away from this projector
post #280 of 9623
The only future consideration is the lamp. I think within the next few years LED and perhaps even Laser light sources will start taking over. An LED doesn't dim with age, and requires far less frequent replacement. I for one would really welcome a non aging lamp. Month by month every projector I have ever had just gets dimmer and dimmer, and I never get more than 1000-1200 hours from any lamp before I feel it's too dim and needs replaced. I've owned a Qualia, a VW80, an RS15 and an RS40 and they've all had similar lamp aging characteristics.
post #281 of 9623
not to mention you do not need to do calibration that often....
post #282 of 9623
That is a good reason not to buy it. To many here endlessly calibrating has become an enjoyable ritual and now they will just have to watch instead of play. Same thing happened when switching from CRT FPs to digital. Got 10 hours of my life back per week and no more MOM. Dad is staring at dots again.
post #283 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

That is a good reason not to buy it. To many here endlessly calibrating has become an enjoyable ritual and now they will just have to watch instead of play. Samething happened when switching from CRT FPs to digital. Got 10 hours of my life back per week and no more MOM. Dad is staring at dots again.

Of course now with ChromaPure's autocal with a Lumagen, that takes all the 'fun' out of calibrating! (It takes only ~ 10 min, so you can run a calibration every evening when you turn it on!)
post #284 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

That is a good reason not to buy it. To many here endlessly calibrating has become an enjoyable ritual and now they will just have to watch instead of play. Samething happened when switching from CRT FPs to digital. Got 10 hours of my life back per week and no more MOM. Dad is staring at dots again.

that is so true.. Now, what do I do when my wife is having their girls night out?
However, I do now think I can justify spending $500 for a Professional one time calibration that will last a couple of years!!
post #285 of 9623
Yep. And with a motorized lift to lower the probe in place and automatically move it back to the ceiling when done. Then automsating it so the calibration starts say 5 minutes after turn on. Having a crestron would help here. When you get home and hit the garage door opener, the projector is switched on, the calibration starts a few minutes later, and everything is ready to go when you plank your posterior down. Working the bugs out of my robot to pour me a bourbon and cut and light a cigar is still a bitch. I hope Chromapure can help me here.
post #286 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Yep. And with a motorized lift to lower the probe in place and automatically move it back to the ceiling when done. Then automsating it so the calibration starts say 5 minutes after turn on. Having a crestron would help here. When you get home and hit the garage door opener, the projector is switched on, the calibration starts a few minutes later, and everything is ready to go when you plank your posterior down. Working the bugs out of my robot to pour me a bourbon and cut and light a cigar is still a bitch. I hope Chromapure can help me here.

Just make sure the cigar cutting happens as far from your lap as possible. Wouldn't want to fall asleep and accidentally initiate that macro.
post #287 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Of course now with ChromaPure's autocal with a Lumagen, that takes all the 'fun' out of calibrating! (It takes only ~ 10 min, so you can run a calibration every evening when you turn it on!)

Do you still need to have the Lumagen/or Duo for the projector after it is calibrated with CP autocal and Lumagen/or Duo ?
post #288 of 9623
I dont think we are as close to LED or laser as some people think. LED doesnt seem to moving very fast at this point and i would imagine that laser will be very pricey in the beginning. By the time laser and LED become common place, this Sony will probably been sold and replaced
post #289 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranger View Post

Do you still need to have the Lumagen/or Duo for the projector after it is calibrated with CP autocal and Lumagen/or Duo ?

Yes. The pj is set in some standard setting, and all the calibration is done in the VP and resides there. The autocal process doesn't change any of the settings in the pj itself.

PS One does need to set the Brightness and Constrast using the pj settings in the usual way, before beginning the autocal process (which sets whitepoint, gamma, and CMS).
post #290 of 9623
cine4home has reported that the RS65 (and presumably RS55) produces 900 to 1000 lumens at D65 calibration, and that its e-shifted 4K-lite methodology work quite well. Though the Sony1000 is spec'ed at 2000 lumens, it will be very critical to see how many survive at D65 calibration.
post #291 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

cine4home has reported that the RS65 (and presumably RS55) produces 900 to 1000 lumens at D65 calibration, and that its e-shifted 4K-lite methodology work quite well. Though the Sony1000 is spec'ed at 2000 lumens, it will be very critical to see how many survive at D65 calibration.

I will take the bet that the VW1000 is higher. I am expecting 1,200 low and 1,500 to 1,600 high lamp, calibrated lumens. No inside knowledge. Just my personal opinion.
post #292 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjg100 View Post

I will take the bet that the VW1000 is higher. I am expecting 1,200 low and 1,500 to 1,600 high lamp, calibrated lumens. No inside knowledge. Just my personal opinion.

A very reasonable surmise; hope it turns out.
post #293 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Hutnicki View Post

I dont think we are as close to LED or laser as some people think. LED doesnt seem to moving very fast at this point and i would imagine that laser will be very pricey in the beginning. By the time laser and LED become common place, this Sony will probably been sold and replaced

I don't know about laser, but two years ago, Sim2's LED projector was 800 lumens. The new version this year is 1000 lumens. That's a pretty good jump in technology. I'm going to be very interested to see what the calibrated brightness of the new Sim2 is, so we know how much true calibrated brightness we've gained.
post #294 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

cine4home has reported that the RS65 (and presumably RS55) produces 900 to 1000 lumens at D65 calibration, and that its e-shifted 4K-lite methodology work quite well. Though the Sony1000 is spec'ed at 2000 lumens, it will be very critical to see how many survive at D65 calibration.

Haven't early and pre-production units (or cherry picked units) brightness numbers for the most recent JVC model years been (much) higher than end-user experiences?
post #295 of 9623
i visited last week sony headquarter and the factory in kosai. here is the vw 1000 in the last final testings.

enjoy a short video from the factory

http://youtu.be/R64WZHYK73E

and here a some more pictures of the vw 1000

http://www.grobi-shop.tv/showpost.php?id=1336

best regards
post #296 of 9623
Quote:
Originally Posted by chappie View Post

i visited last week sony headquarter and the factory in kosai. here is the vw 1000 in the last final testings.

enjoy a short video from the factory

http://youtu.be/R64WZHYK73E

and here a some more pictures of the vw 1000

http://www.grobi-shop.tv/showpost.php?id=1336

best regards

Did anyone get anything useful out of any of this wrt the VW1000?
post #297 of 9623
Patrick. The Utube video I just watched does not mention the projector but I think had one quick shot of it. Talks about the factory and Sony, great stuff, sort of like a video about manufacturing and testing etc, but nothing about the product. What did you learn aboiut the projector? Are they still working on internal software etc, all you mention is final testing. Did you spend time watching it? What did you observe? Thanks.
post #298 of 9623
of course. it was not allowed to film in the factory. i will publicate a second video with more information about the vw 1000.

the units are in the final testing in point of software. hardware is ready for production. this will start end of november, so maybe the first units will arrived before new year.

best regards
post #299 of 9623
Thanks. That's pretty mutch what we were told at Cedia. Hardware done, still working on the software.
post #300 of 9623
http://youtu.be/s5eiNdCfelw

here is part of the presentation of the sony vpl vw 1000 es in tokyo.

enjoy.

best regards

patrick
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