or Connect
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Sony VPL-vw1000 - Page 158

post #4711 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

I agree. You are going to sue them for what? You can't say the projector does not accept 4K 24P. It has been proven that the projector does this just fine. The problem is an incompatibility issue with their server. An issue that Sony plans to resolve. We just do not know how Sony is going to resolve the issue. Sometime between now and CEDIA, we should find this information out. Probably work out about the time that there should be some content available. If it happens like this, then it does not look like anybody is missing out on much of anything.

Actually there is a very strong case. If anyone were to take it up. Of course since you sell Sony you are going to say it is a stretch. biggrin.gif

I won't spell out the strong case here since I have no intentions but it is not hard to piece it together. wink.gif
post #4712 of 9742
Joerod. I am an engineer and a lawyer. If the issue was the projector can not accept 4K etc and Sony said tough ****, there would be a case but there is no case at present. Mike is right here and I am not a dealer.
post #4713 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Joerod. I am an engineer and a lawyer. If the issue was the projector can not accept 4K etc and Sony said tough ****, there would be a case but there is no case at present. Mike is right here and I am not a dealer.

Finally I know more than you! Lol

I just had a interesting phone call (though I can't tell you what was said) that says quite the opposite. And from who you would not believe.
post #4714 of 9742
I am urging others for a peaceful protest however. I will have a "Guestbook" on top of my page where you can sign in and post your opinion. All entries will be sent to Sony. There is strength in numbers and we will be heard. We will not have to resolve to legal action of any kind. I am confident they will expedite a fix for the 1000ES owners sooner than later. More to come...
post #4715 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Actually there is a very strong case. If anyone were to take it up. Of course since you sell Sony you are going to say it is a stretch. biggrin.gif

I won't spell out the strong case here since I have no intentions but it is not hard to piece it together. wink.gif

Does not have anything to do with being a Sony dealer. Of course some lawyer (not grouping all lawyers) would love a class action lawsuit. They do not have to be right or wrong. They just have to be enough of an annoyance, to get a settlement. Public perception would probably go to the 1000ES owners. Only real winner in this would be the lawyers. 1000ES buyers knew going in that there was no current 4K content. Sony did not give a date for providing 4K content. Sony has not said they are not going to provide 4K content. Sony has not said it would cost extra to owners to get the server compatible with the 1000ES. They have also not said that it will be free either. They just have not made a statement. The projector is capable of displaying 4K 24P as advertised. You can build or buy your own server and shoot or buy some 4K footage and watch it on your projector. I just don't see the breach of contract, nor the breach of implied contract. Of course you can sue, because here in the US anybody can sue anybody. Once the 4K service is up and running and if at that time Sony does not have an acceptable solution, then I can see 1000ES owners getting upset. I guess we can agree to disagree. smile.gif

Added
Does anybody here think that Sony has not been working to resolve this issue?
Reply
Reply
post #4716 of 9742
They are working now to resolve it. wink.gif
post #4717 of 9742
And to think we are going through so much to see That's My Boy in 4K!!! eek.gifsmile.gif
post #4718 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

And to think we are going through so much to see That's My Boy in 4K!!! eek.gifsmile.gif

I will have to admit I have watched some movies that I really did not have a lot of interest in, just because the video quality was really good. smile.gif
Reply
Reply
post #4719 of 9742

Thanks for the link. An excellent article!

It would be ideal if Sony could obtain the right to load the 4K version of "Samsara" on the servers/players. Having been recently shot on 65mm film, it's an ideal example of 4K can really do. (I saw the 4K DCP on a 4K Sony projector in the theater and the BD version at home.)
post #4720 of 9742
Finished. At the top of my site there is the "Guest Book" which is self explanatory. Also there is a web poll for anyone to participate in. Just search my name (like it is in my signature) to find my site. Fair 4K!

smile.gif

PM if you have any questions or email me.
post #4721 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Does not have anything to do with being a Sony dealer. Of course some lawyer (not grouping all lawyers) would love a class action lawsuit. They do not have to be right or wrong. They just have to be enough of an annoyance, to get a settlement. Public perception would probably go to the 1000ES owners. Only real winner in this would be the lawyers. 1000ES buyers knew going in that there was no current 4K content. Sony did not give a date for providing 4K content. Sony has not said they are not going to provide 4K content. Sony has not said it would cost extra to owners to get the server compatible with the 1000ES. They have also not said that it will be free either. They just have not made a statement. The projector is capable of displaying 4K 24P as advertised. You can build or buy your own server and shoot or buy some 4K footage and watch it on your projector. I just don't see the breach of contract, nor the breach of implied contract. Of course you can sue, because here in the US anybody can sue anybody. Once the 4K service is up and running and if at that time Sony does not have an acceptable solution, then I can see 1000ES owners getting upset. I guess we can agree to disagree. smile.gif

Added
Does anybody here think that Sony has not been working to resolve this issue?

I think they better not charge for it or that would put them on shaky ground....
post #4722 of 9742
I noticed the FMP-X1 is in stock almost everywhere. Hope these places prepare themselves for a lot of returns. In other news nanotech's Nuvola NP-1 4K device is right around the corner. And at 299 it is definitely worth a go. They are 100% guaranteed to work with all 4K TVs and the 1000ES. Love the logic!!!!
post #4723 of 9742
Question will be about the quality of streaming 4K-UHD. AFAIK, Nanotech is using their own developed codec.

The streaming content will alo be available on a new Roku platform, which is where Naotech has operated before.
Nanotech is a nice name that gives one a feeling of confidence, but till now they have mostly been streaming games on mobile platforms.

Will they be in the forefront of UHD hype with no real quality? Will streaming UHD be the "new HD"?

Nice deal if they don't "compress the sh*t out of 4K".

Going to be a lot of "boxes" one needs to own to tap into all available 4K content.
Quote:

LX Rudis, NanoTech’s Media Group, Senior VP of Development, said, “4K Ultra HD Televisions are just now starting to arrive in homes and are sure to bring an enhanced viewing experience of 4K to a whole new audience. With 4K TVs able to deliver a vibrant and natural picture that is four-times clearer than high definition, users need a low cost solution for content delivery. Unlike other 4K players, our unit will work with any brand of Television and a variety of content delivery services.

The availability of the Nuvola NP-1 will be followed in fall by our streaming 4K video distribution service that will demonstrate how NanoTech continues to lead the market in bringing the 4K entertainment experience to consumers.”

Come this summer, owners of the 4K UHD TVs are able to pick up the Nuvola 4K Media Player that will come bundled with 10 videos in true 4K resolution, in addition to 10 video games and 5 multimedia applications, all for just $299 a pop, while this fall,they will gain access access to a fee-based streaming video distribution service known as NanoFlix UHD that will offer a library of 4K titles. Good entertaining times seem to be ahead, don’t you think so?:

http://www.ubergizmo.com/2013/05/nanotech-announces-4k-media-player-nuvola-np-1-4k-streaming-video-service/

10 videos in true 4K resolution. Wonder where they get those from and if they are mostly up-converts.

-
post #4724 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Finally I know more than you! Lol

I just had a interesting phone call (though I can't tell you what was said) that says quite the opposite. And from who you would not believe.


Joe. Exactly what do you believe Sony has done that is actionable at this time. In order to sue and not be subject to motion dismissal one must state a cause of action that if proved would be subject to the award of damages which then the amount of damages must be determinable. Of course there are certain statutes which provide for more than the award of actual damages and attorney fees such as antitrust actions and treble damages etc.

At this point Sony has sold a server that evidently doesn't work with anything. So it either takes it back and refunds all costs or it makes it work by either modifying it or the display.. A more interesting point is whether Sony has done something wrong by making its server only work with Sony products and then restricting Sony 4K content to 4k Sony products. .Anyhow, it certainly looks like the server will be operational with respect to 1000ESs with a very short time period, say three months at worst and assuming something could be pieced together to attempt a suit for the delay, exactly what would be the damages.
post #4725 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Joe. Exactly what do you believe Sony has done that is actionable at this time. In order to sue and not be subject to motion dismissal one must state a cause of action that if proved would be subject to the award of damages which then the amount of damages must be determinable. Of course there are certain statutes which provide for more than the award of actual damages and attorney fees such as antitrust actions and treble damages etc.

At this point Sony has sold a server that evidently doesn't work with anything. So it either takes it back and refunds all costs or it makes it work by either modifying it or the display.. A more interesting point is whether Sony has done something wrong by making its server only work with Sony products and then restricting Sony 4K content to 4k Sony products. .Anyhow, it certainly looks like the server will be operational with respect to 1000ESs with a very short time period, say three months at worst and assuming something could be pieced together to attempt a suit for the delay, exactly what would be the damages.

I agree Mark, it is extraordinarily preliminary to talk in that direction. I would reiterate that if they enforce a fee for a functionality otherwise marketed and implied as part and parcel of the projector, there probably would be some grounds.
post #4726 of 9742
I promised not to discuss the info shared with me (from Sony) but there is cause for alarm is all I will say. And I do agree it is to early to consider action at this point. It would be a knee jerk motion.
post #4727 of 9742
Ooh my neck! My back! My neck and my back!

I want a hundred and fifty THOUSAND!
But I'll settle out of court right now for 20 bucks...

Seriously , Sony... Give me a call. I am ready to talk settlement.
Edited by hifiaudio2 - 7/4/13 at 8:05am
post #4728 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I promised not to discuss the info shared with me (from Sony) but there is cause for alarm is all I will say. And I do agree it is to early to consider action at this point. It would be a knee jerk motion.

Sounds like it aint' no-cost...
post #4729 of 9742
My guess is that for a projector it would have to go to Texas. And RT shipping costs would be the issue. Plus you have to mount/demount the projector and pack it up.
post #4730 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

Ow my neck! My neck and my back!

But I'll settle out of court right now for $20....

Seriously , Sony... Give me a call. I am ready to talk settlement.

Let me get this straight, if you bought a $25,000 Sony 4k projector that becomes nothing more than a permanent 4k upscaler you would be perfectly content? I am NOT saying that will happen here, but stranger things have happened in the world of AV. Sony will very likely fix the problem, but to mock those concerned seems inappropriate.

NO ONE is saying let's go sue Sony. Not me, not Joerod, not anybody on this board. The relevance of any legal discussion shows that when a company may incurr possible liability then there is a much stronger likelihood that the company will fix a problem. In this situation, liability or not I think Sony will take care of us with a fix. To discuss the topic does not mean we are condemning Sony. Most of us here are huge Sony fans. I know I am.
post #4731 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

My guess is that for a projector it would have to go to Texas. And RT shipping costs would be the issue. Plus you have to mount/demount the projector and pack it up.

I think the RT shipping needs to be Sony's dime without hesitation - they cooked this stew, now eat it.

The cost and labor to dismount and remount is going to be more complicated - this is why I am saying Sony really screwed up here.

It's not going to help their case they are sending technicians out freely in the field to upgrade their panels, but would not do so for much more expensive projectors...

It would behoove them to figure out how to do these upgrades in the field, perhaps training their resellers, and compensating them for their time - would be far cheaper to them.
post #4732 of 9742
A
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

I think the RT shipping needs to be Sony's dime without hesitation - they cooked this stew, now eat it.

The cost and labor to dismount and remount is going to be more complicated - this is why I am saying Sony really screwed up here.

It's not going to help their case they are sending technicians out freely in the field to upgrade their panels, but would not do so for much more expensive projectors...

It would behoove them to figure out how to do these upgrades in the field, perhaps training their resellers, and compensating them for their time - would be far cheaper to them.

An in-home fix would be ideal. I really hope Sony takes this path.
post #4733 of 9742
If it's just a matter of shipping costs, although not ideal, I can live with that. I just want to know their is a solution in the works. I'm guessing they will have a solution for us.
post #4734 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by adidino View Post

If it's just a matter of shipping costs, although not ideal, I can live with that. I just want to know their is a solution in the works. I'm guessing they will have a solution for us.

It's not cheap to ship and insure this projector, so I wouldn't be so quick to be comfortable with that. Plus, there is always the chance of some issue being introduced during transit - panel or lens alignment, or board or cable coming loose...

Most packaging is meant for one or two time use...the carton and packing material loose their impact protection qualities after repeated stress...not a big deal for a 5 pound, $500 item, but very different for this....
post #4735 of 9742
I
Quote:
Originally Posted by adidino View Post

If it's just a matter of shipping costs, although not ideal, I can live with that. I just want to know their is a solution in the works. I'm guessing they will have a solution for us.

I hope the fix is as simple as a firmware or hardware mod to the streamer, though I know with an updated hdcp/protocol this may not be feasible.
post #4736 of 9742
Happy 4K of July! whoops, my fault. Sorry couldn't resist biggrin.gif
post #4737 of 9742
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Rex View Post

I
I hope the fix is as simple as a firmware or hardware mod to the streamer, though I know with an updated hdcp/protocol this may not be feasible.

It is a mod to the 1000 at this point...
post #4738 of 9742
U
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

It is a mod to the 1000 at this point...

Unfortunately it looks that way. If there is a mod needed to accept a 4k 24p streaming source now, then a second mod needed for the new hdmi 2.0 4k 60p spec, then wouldn't you think Sony would delay the fix and do both mods at the same time? I know to avoid the risk of shipping damage my projector will only be shipped once to Texas (if needed), but not twice in one year.
post #4739 of 9742
if it does require sending the unit it, I would considering waiting until someone else does it to give a review of the first 10 or so movie offerings to see if it's worth the risk of shipping.

Has Sony announced an upcoming schedule with dates of new releases? Is only going to be content from Sony Studios?
post #4740 of 9742
You guys are acting crazy.

There was never any promise that the projector would not require a modification to work with the server. If Sony provides the upgrade for free including shipping (which i suspect they will) then what "legal" case or complaint do you really have?

You bought a projector that is capable of displaying 4K if provided in a format that it will accept. Sony has modified if's server format for whatever reasons and will likely provide the "fix" to existing customers.

You have only yourselves to blame for expecting something that was never promised.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home