Sony VPL-vw1000 - Page 3

Originally Posted by fight4yu

To make 4K content successful, they need to bring the price down anyway.

Originally Posted by d.j.

I dont see, why they shouldnt provide at LEST a 20K:1 native with it ( new and bigger panels = 0,74" ) , they allready did that with the 90ES ( and Im sure with the 95ES too ) and this is going to be their flagship ! ( so I cant really believe, its not going to beat the little brothers in allmost every aspect )

Originally Posted by mr stroke

I would love to see one of these in person.


To anyone here thats seen one in person is the difference between 1080p and 4k that big of a deal? As much of a jump as 480p to 1080p?

Originally Posted by Stephan

Do they? Remember the old laserdisc days, where we paid $50 for a movie, $100 to $150 for a nice special edition.

There is little 4k content, even for the cinema. But it would be nice to get all the content that is available. Get rid of the chroma subsampling on 4k Blu-Ray (or whatever the format will be called), and put a $50 to $60 price sticker on the 4k content. I'd happily pay that price if they won't constantly screw up mastering of the discs, as this is pretty common now with BD (and was for DVD). That way, they can release screwed up 2k content on regular discs for the mass market.

Originally Posted by mr stroke

To anyone here thats seen one in person is the difference between 1080p and 4k that big of a deal? As much of a jump as 480p to 1080p?

Originally Posted by fight4yu

I do not see how anyone can justify making a 4K version...

First, we saw a side-by-side comparison of digital still images projected through both the VW1000ES and a “competitor’s projector.” The idea here was to show the lack of screen door effect and the “obvious difference in uniformity of texture.” The problem is, the differences were not all that obvious. With serious scrutiny, the differentiation was visible, but we couldn’t help but think about how difficult it might have been to see them without extended viewing of still images and the presenter’s fancy “pointing finger” laser pen.

Next, the VW1000ES was put to work upscaling a clip from Resident Evil. We’re pretty sure the rest of the room saw what we saw, since we heard no murmurs of approval. To be frank, it was a pretty terrible demonstration. The film had a monochromatic look to it that lacked depth and the effects of the projector’s motion smoothing processor were both obvious and annoying.

The last clip we viewed was from Sony’s forthcoming film, The Amazing Spiderman. Since it was native 4K content, it was, as you might expect, pretty amazing. Colors were beautiful, skin tone was excellent, black level was top notch and the image had tremendous depth and texture.

So, when fed with elusive 4K content, the VW1000ES delivers the “real theater” experience in spades. But we still think the lack of 4K content makes the projector’s availability a little less exciting, considering its hefty price tag and lackluster 1080p upconversion. Keep your fingers crossed that Sony Pictures delivers on its promise of tapping its 4K library soon.

Originally Posted by Spizz

Apparently the VPL-VW1000 doesn't do to well with non 4k material-

Impressions from Digitrends-



Let's hope their VP for non 4k content (which would be what you would mostly use it for currently) improves by its December release.

Originally Posted by Spizz

Apparently the VPL-VW1000 doesn't do to well with non 4k material-

Impressions from Digitrends-



Let's hope their VP for non 4k content (which would be what you would mostly use it for currently) improves by its December release.

Originally Posted by Stephan

And you know that, because you've already done a comparison... right?

--Compare with what? It is already in the specs...Fake 4K and It will not be compatible with the native 4k source if/when they become available.
Please read this post again in two years after CEDIA 2013 after seeing the native 4K projectors under $5k.

Short lived? Laserdisc was around for 20 years and that's what you call short lived? How long does a format have to stick around for you, so it's not short lived? DVD was short lived as well and so will Blu-Ray be.

--I meant the consumer market. Laser disc short lived or never caught up with the mainstream consumer market since its introduction to market in 1978. At peak of the laser disc market only captured 2% of the US household (may be more in Japan) especially late 80s to mid 90s. I still have about 200 laser disc titles in my collection and 80% of them I paid $30-$40 each. Yes of course the DVDs have transformed into blu-ray and it will move on to something.

And how do you know the Sony won't deliver the same? I'm a big fan of DPI, the Sims can be good if one is lucky enough to get one without issues or convergence errors (had to go through several Lumis' before I found one to have acceptable convergence and the Mico 50 had crazy CA and something wasn't right with the lens, second one was ok tho). Let's wait and see how it performs, then come to a conclusion.

At yesterday's Sony press conference, the company didn't demonstrate the new VPL-VW1000ES 4K projector—that had to wait until this morning at Sony's booth on a Stewart Ultramatte 150 screen measuring 180 inches diagonally. As with most Sony presentations, this one was mostly talking and not much demo material, but that material was worth the wait—except for the first clip, which was from Resident Evil at 1080p upconverted to 4K. The clip exhibited severe banding and solarization, which I learned was due to sourcing and processing issues, not the projector. (The original file was 16-bit, which was truncated to 10-bit in the server and then 8-bit for HDMI to the projector.) Also, this clip was projected using Motionflow frame interpolation, which I don't mind, but Tom Norton objected to that more than the banding.

By contrast, the trailer for The Amazing Spider-Man due next year was in native 4K from the server, and it looked, well, amazing. Detail was stunning, and the blacks were better than yesterday's showing of the same clip from the Sony 4K digital-cinema projector. After the formal presentation, I confirmed that the VW1000ES can indeed accept a 4K signal over a single HDMI 1.4 connection. Of course, that won't help most consumers see native 4K content, which will be nonexistent for at least a couple of years to come.

Originally Posted by mhafner

Only if the brightness change leaves color temperature alone. Otherwise colours/gamma degrade and recalibration is needed again and again. I hate that.
If one calibration would last for 2000 hours and ends with 70% brightness starting at 2000 Lumen calibrated I could warm up to this projector.

Originally Posted by JustMike

Weird colors? On which projectors? Reviews I've read of the Sim2 have said that it can be calibrated to real excellence.

Originally Posted by rraman

My point is what their offering for $30k price point to the consumer market. I would have been the first customer if Sony could have released this projector for $10k with the following features instead;
2000 lumens, native 2.35 (switchable to 16:9), decent CR, AR lens memory.

Originally Posted by Spizz

Here some more impressions from HomeTheater.com. They say the poor performance of the non 4k material might of been due to the file used? Time will soon tell-

Originally Posted by millerwill

Another nice feature of the Sony 1000 is the very wide throw ratio, from a min of 1.27 (which is great for me) to 2.73.

Originally Posted by Stephan

Well, it is rated 2000 lumens. Native scope with 4k would be a niche product in a niche market. I wouldn't worry too much about it tho, Zooming in the high end market (Barco, DPI) works very well, better than when it's done in the <$10k range. The lenses are completely different beasts and usually don't have the drawbacks of the cheaper lenses.

What's decent CR for you? Given that the best we can buy right now in the consumer market when looking at around 2000 lumens is 10k:1 on/off, I wouldn't say the Sony is doing so bad (if it's true what they state). The cheapest to deliver that is the Sim2 Uno, which is over $20k as well. Are you sure it does not have AR lens memory? If not that would be unfortunate, but not a big deal for me. I'd personally handle it via a videoprocessor and rs232 control of the projector.





Could very well be the case. The lack of depth can't be explained by the upscaling, unless something goes really, really wrong there. One can always argue scaling quality, but I doubt what they describe is due to scaling only.





That could be a good or a bad thing. Wide throw ratio usually comes at a price of quality of the lens and resulting performance depending on the throw. Lens hope they did this right and the price of the lens itself is around $10k. If that's the case, I wouldn't worry too much. If however the lens is much cheaper, we'll have to wait and see how it performs.

Originally Posted by rraman

Currently my heart is set on DPI's 3 Chip DLP Highlite 260 HC with an A lens.

Originally Posted by damnsam77

Fellas,
I have set up my Paypal account to take your donations. Rest assured it will all go to a good cause when I get my VW1000 in 50 years

In all seriousness, if money was not an issue and I was sitting on a pile of it, I will be getting this baby installed in my theater. But it may be dumb to spend 10% of the value of your home on a projector. So I will first have to buy a 3 million dollar mansion, so keep your donations coming please.

Originally Posted by rraman

I am not sure about lens memory. But I didn't see it on the press release. As for CR rating, the reason I said I wanted the "decent" CR without specific ratio as it is a hot topic for the debate and I wanted to avoid it. Currently my heart is set on DPI's 3 Chip DLP Highlite 260 HC with an A lens. After watching CEDIA releases, I think I will be happy for HighLite for another 4-5 years (I have to convince myself). May be down the road I will settle for a low end Epson or Panasonic for 3D content to give bragging rights for my kids.
Meanwhile the 4 year good old RS1 in my old theater will run to until its demise.

Originally Posted by R Harkness

That new Sony looks lustworthy. But in real world terms (i.e. with 1080p content upscaled), at least these folks weren't too impressed:

Originally Posted by millerwill

PS Another nice feature of the 1000 (if I understood the presenter's description correctly), is that when one uses the zoom method to get 2.35, the 'black bars' that would be projected above/below the pic are electronically blacked out. So this is just like the side black bars on a 2.35 screen with a 16x9 pic: the black bars have nothing projected on them, not even the projector's 'black'.

Originally Posted by Stephan

Already been confirmed that this is due to the source used. They used a 2k clip in 16-bit which was then converted to 10-bit, then to 8-bit into the projector. They should have just used the Blu-Ray instead.

Originally Posted by rraman

There is something called rehearsal or dry run prior to any presentation especially when you are introducing a $30k projector to the world in a major event like CEDIA. Sony is either ignorant or employed incompetent technician(s) for the presentation.

Originally Posted by Chuck Anstey

If they could project nothing electronically, why wouldn't they use that when projecting black normally in the image? My guess is that "electronically" means there is a shutter system than can be electronically moved into place.

Originally Posted by d.j.

Do anybody know, if it can display 1920x1080 without scaling it to 4K ? ( and leave the rest pixels unused/ blacked out ) - 1:1 pixel ?

dj