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Sony VPL-vw1000 - Page 246

post #7351 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I thought if you purchased the server and activated an account, the 10 preloads were yours to keep. Does anybody have a source that says you lose access after March 31?

I am not sure there is any legal difference in a management employee saying something to a reseller or putting it in an email. I doubt it would be legally binding. But let's assume that Mike's source was right and mine was mistaken. The worst case is the other way around. Hey hell freezed over this year in projector land when JVC adopted a dynamic iris as many of us for many years wished that they would. Optimism rules supreme.

Amazon sells the FPM-X1 for Sony and their page just says 10 free movies. Never seen anything about them expiring. Your post was the first I heard of this.

What's troubling is if Sony can remove stuff from the puck without your permission or say so. I would expect the owner to control the content. Purchased or the free movies would be yours and permanently unlocked. I would expect rentals to have a different key that last only 24 hours. When that period is up, it's not erased. You can then pay extra to purchase it or not, and then rent it later or delete it yourself to make room. I would think that you can offload content and the permanent key to an external USB3 drive (or USB2 which is much slower). This is all guesswork on my part, but how I would implement it.
post #7352 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by work permit View Post

I think there is a mistake in the file information posted. If indeed the total file size is 45GiB, and the movie is 3 hours and 20 minutes, then the total average bit rate for audio and video is 45,000,000,000 bytes*8 bits/Bytes / (3 hours*60*60+20*60) , or 30 Mbps. The file posted shows an average bit rate of 45 Mbps.

Yes it does say 45 and a max at 67. If it's only avg. 30 and a max of 35, then that's a big difference and makes it a lot closer to BD.

BTW, my LoA BD is an iso file, so the movie is actually smaller than 43.2GB.
post #7353 of 9633
Hope you guys don t mind going VW1000 on-topic again smile.gifbiggrin.gif:

When I put up a 100IRE pattern (completely white picture) I can clearly see that the colors are not uniform at all. Especially when going towards the left corners it gets yellow. Could this be the lamp or a fault in the unit?
post #7354 of 9633
Quote:

Are these track names yours or were they part of the original file? eg XXXXXXXXX_track2_NoAudioPoP
post #7355 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

Hope you guys don t mind going VW1000 on-topic again smile.gifbiggrin.gif:

When I put up a 100IRE pattern (completely white picture) I can clearly see that the colors are not uniform at all. Especially when going towards the left corners it gets yellow. Could this be the lamp or a fault in the unit?

Mine was very much was uniform with a new bulb and is very much not uniform after 150 hours... I suspect the bulb...
post #7356 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_H View Post

Mine was very much was uniform with a new bulb and is very much not uniform after 150 hours... I suspect the bulb...
So yours was uniform at start and now you also have problems with a white pattern in the corners? Also yellowish?
post #7357 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by elario View Post

Are these track names yours or were they part of the original file? eg XXXXXXXXX_track2_NoAudioPoP

I changed the names to XXXXX on the files
post #7358 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

When I put up a 100IRE pattern (completely white picture) I can clearly see that the colors are not uniform at all. Especially when going towards the left corners it gets yellow. Could this be the lamp or a fault in the unit?

I have yellowing, not in the corners, just in a certain section of the screen. I don't remember where because I never notice it. Don't know if it is the bulb or not, as my (2nd) calibration was done with hundreds of hours on the bulb. I don't think my first 2 units had this, but my 3rd does. I was told by my calibrator this is not unusual, I don't remember going into detail on the cause, but I think he blamed the chip.
post #7359 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by turls View Post

I have yellowing, not in the corners, just in a certain section of the screen. I don't remember where because I never notice it. Don't know if it is the bulb or not, as my (2nd) calibration was done with hundreds of hours on the bulb. I don't think my first 2 units had this, but my 3rd does. I was told by my calibrator this is not unusual, I don't remember going into detail on the cause, but I think he blamed the chip.
is it likely that the vw1100 upgrade will solve this for my unit?
post #7360 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by thestewman View Post

I changed the names to XXXXX on the files
But "NoAudioPop" was already there?
post #7361 of 9633
Its possible the panels are aging, that is likely what your calibrator was referring to.


Sander. If you get a new bulb with the upgrade it might help and then again it might not if the problem lies with something else. Every projector will have problems, just that many are unaware of them. The yellowing will probably not be noticeable when viewing by most. But we notice everything and then everything is a no gd POS.
post #7362 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Once activated you can use the server on any Sony 4K display other than a non upgraded 1000ES. Early 84 inch panels will need an upgrade. recent ones don't.

Mark, I understand context of your post was Sony consumer line up, but do you know if compatibility extends to the 515 or the new 510?

I thought I remember reading that one of your clients was getting a 515. Too expensive for me, but if the 510 streets cheap enough, I might be able to swing that.

I need to be careful with content, though, since I'm poor. Don't want to get locked into dcp's as my only source for 4k (or 2k 3D). Wife thinks we should get the 600 or 1100, but I don't think it will be bright enough.
post #7363 of 9633
These numbers refer to the commercial 4K projectors. They come with a bundled DCII server. I know they do have an HDMI input for things like playing Blurays but I do not think they are compatible with the FMP-x1 server but I don't really know.
post #7364 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

is it likely that the vw1100 upgrade will solve this for my unit?

Doubtful.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Its possible the panels are aging, that is likely what your calibrator was referring to.


Sander. If you get a new bulb with the upgrade it might help and then again it might not if the problem lies with something else. Every projector will have problems, just that many are unaware of them. The yellowing will probably not be noticeable when viewing by most. But we notice everything and then everything is a no gd POS.

I think the aging would be if I had the old defect, that supposedly newer SXRD chips aren't susceptible too. Mine is barely noticeable on a white background. Without seeing pictures it may not be the same as what Sander has. (my issue might not even show in pics).

But yes, I will try to watch it more closely to see if it gets worse, and will definitely note if it changes at bulb replacement, but that will be the same time as the upgrade.
post #7365 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by turls View Post

Doubtful.
I think the aging would be if I had the old defect, that supposedly newer SXRD chips aren't susceptible too. Mine is barely noticeable on a white background. Without seeing pictures it may not be the same as what Sander has. (my issue might not even show in pics).

But yes, I will try to watch it more closely to see if it gets worse, and will definitely note if it changes at bulb replacement, but that will be the same time as the upgrade.

While subtle with the 1000, I think three chip projectors are susceptible to some light contamination, where reflections inside the projector (and depending on zoom IIRC) might cause you to see slight greenish or reddish areas in a white field uniformity test. Not sure if this is what you're seeing.

Yes, my understanding is the old SXRD aging issue does not affect the last several years of panels...but who knows?...
post #7366 of 9633
I think it's a LCoS thing. One of the JVC guys explained the green/magenta corners a long time ago when it was very visible on JVC projectors even while displaying content. It had something to do with the liquid crystal, or substrate, or something. There was a grazing effect from the light originating slightly off center. At the time JVc was using xenon bulbs and gravity had an effect on the plasma arc, causing it to droop slightly, especially as the bulb aged. There were shading controls to try and compensate for it electronically, but it would vary somewhat bulb to bulb, especially if the new bulb wasn't oriented in the exact same way as the old bulb (and old shading calibration).

They went through a number of iterations with bright corners, non-uniform black (dark purple), and then green/magenta corners reemerged with Sony's initial SXRD take on LCoS. Not sure where they are with it now.
post #7367 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabident View Post

?..At the time JVc was using xenon bulbs and gravity had an effect on the plasma arc, causing it to droop slightly, especially as the bulb aged.

If your projector were mounted on the event horizon of a black hole, I could agree there might some visible gravitational effect...here on Earth? Hmmm.....
post #7368 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

If your projector were mounted on the event horizon of a black hole, I could agree there might some visible gravitational effect...here on Earth? Hmmm.....

Lol. I noticed my corners are all lighter than I expected them to be not too long ago with an extremely long fade to black scene. Throw 19' screen 13' wide scope.

My first pj was a JVC rs1x and read all the reviews before purchasing from avs and many complained about its light corners. I used a 110" 1.78 bw carada screen with it. I noticed them only during pitch black scenes but even on quick/short scenes were rather noticeable. The vw1000 is much better. I haven't noticed the color blemishes on white scenes and "won't" look for it as it would just bother me after noticing it lol.
post #7369 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenjw View Post

I just checked out my full rip of LoA. It's 43.2 GB. I watched some detailed scenes and those hit around 34Mbps, but others were generally in the 20 range. Your text indicates that this UHD version, while the same size, is in the 44 to 67 range. That's double the rate using the same space. That bodes well for eyeIO H.264. And your direct observation of the PQ confirms this. That's great and things can hopefully be improved. Maybe not with the FPM, we don't know, but hopefully with even better results from H.265 and future 4KBD.

Given the size of the file, I'm surprised that we don't already have some form of 4K on 50 GB BD already, similar to HD-DVD before BD won out.

EDIT: sounds like this is sadly not the case as the 44 to 67 info may not be correct.

I could be totally wrong here so apologize in advance if so but aren't we supposed to watch a 4k mastered disc is with the new sony 4k bd player because you need to use the proprietary algorithm that Sony uses to compress and upscale.....without that I'm guessing it would play back like any other Blu-ray Disc whether you have the proper video card in your HTCP or not?
post #7370 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

If your projector were mounted on the event horizon of a black hole, I could agree there might some visible gravitational effect...here on Earth? Hmmm.....





Man it's beyond dark in there, but sometimes the image gets a tad squirrelly when I watch stuff -the light just misses the screen for some strange reason....... biggrin.gif

Hard to keep the projector mounted too, pesky gravity keeps trying to rip it of the ceiling all the time lol...
Edited by OzHDHT - 12/10/13 at 5:28pm
post #7371 of 9633
Stevenjw I have 2 of Sony's 65 900a 4k sets with the FMP-x1 servers along with my 1000 projector that awaits the upgrade to use the FMP-x1 and on the 65 sets the movies at best look no better then BluRay versions of the films.

I Like the 4k Master Discs and think there better then the movies on the server on my 65 inch sets they look VERY good when played off my 790 Bluray player to the 4k set. I am more looking forward to see how they will look on the 1100 after our upgrade.

It seems the compression used on the 4k server is not that great.... The demo stuff can look good really good but most you have seen on the net. Things like the honey bee's and the puppy dogs taking a bath ect, ect.

Now again I heard from a Sony rep that there know the compression is not the best and will change it soon but who knows he was a rep.......

Again this is my opinion and it could be you will not agree and I'm wrong... But I think if your anything like me you will be disappointed with the 10 movies and the other few they have........

Tj8xp
post #7372 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenjw View Post

What's troubling is if Sony can remove stuff from the puck without your permission or say so.

Steve, you may want to read the Sony “Terms of Service” here. It is one of the major reasons that I will never invest very much into content that is not covered by the First Sale Doctrine. Also note that most all these licensed providers have this in their TOS: These terms may be changed any time, in whole or part, with or without prior notification. IOW, they are 100% in the drivers seat.
post #7373 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

Steve, you may want to read the Sony “Terms of Service” here. It is one of the major reasons that I will never invest very much into content that is not covered by the First Sale Doctrine. Also note that most all these licensed providers have this in their TOS: These terms may be changed any time, in whole or part, with or without prior notification. IOW, they are 100% in the drivers seat.

Sadly that sounds like the case, but as you pointed out every company is in the driver's seat. They can afford the lawyers. I can only control giving them my money. Ironically, some of that money goes to the lawyers. mad.gif And I think I already signed their SEN agreement using the PS3. I might have missed where they said the can remove content from my equipment. Reading that link, well just the starting to read it, gave me a headache. Still, Sony has never deleted anything off of my PS3 so hopefully won't touch my FPM either.

The way I see it, I'll get the FPM-X1 and movies with the upgrade. Buying any additional titles is going to take a good reason at $30 a pop. I need to see better PQ and the movie itself has to have eye-candy and re-watchable appeal. I've spent way too much on Laserdiscs, DVDs, HD-DVDs, and BDs to keep spending more without a damn good reason, especially for any titles that I already own on the other format. So, right away that eliminates any comedy, drama or character piece. I'll probably only spring for new titles that are a "must have" in 4K. My point has been that I don't want to go through the whole DVD -> HD-DVD -> mpeg2 BD process again. I'll let that all play out and rent BDs at RedBox until it gets sorted out. The FPM must be substantially better to make me want to own it on something other than a disc that apparently Sony can still screw with. I can wait for 4KBD too if I have too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tj8xp View Post

Stevenjw I have 2 of Sony's 65 900a 4k sets with the FMP-x1 servers along with my 1000 projector that awaits the upgrade to use the FMP-x1 and on the 65 sets the movies at best look no better then BluRay versions of the films. I Like the 4k Master Discs and think there better then the movies on the server on my 65 inch sets they look VERY good when played off my 790 Bluray player to the 4k set. I am more looking forward to see how they will look on the 1100 after our upgrade. It seems the compression used on the 4k server is not that great.... The demo stuff can look good really good but most you have seen on the net. Things like the honey bee's and the puppy dogs taking a bath ect, ect. Now again I heard from a Sony rep that there know the compression is not the best and will change it soon but who knows he was a rep....... Again this is my opinion and it could be you will not agree and I'm wrong... But I think if your anything like me you will be disappointed with the 10 movies and the other few they have........ Tj8xp

I've already said that I'm not happy buying the bundle, but must in order to get the upgrade and I don't want to sell the equipment at a loss, at least not immediately. I'm still trying to determine if the FREE content is worse, the same, slightly, or much better than BDs. I guess I'll need to see it for myself and I'll be able to do an A/B comparison with the Mastered in 4K BDs too. I'll know for sure at that point. However, even if I determine that is not NOTICEABLY better, I'll probably still need to keep it because it's the only game in town and may have the potential to improve with an upgrade. We can hope....
Quote:
Originally Posted by piratemonkey View Post

I could be totally wrong here so apologize in advance if so but aren't we supposed to watch a 4k mastered disc is with the new sony 4k bd player because you need to use the proprietary algorithm that Sony uses to compress and upscale.....without that I'm guessing it would play back like any other Blu-ray Disc whether you have the proper video card in your HTCP or not?

I'll apologize in advance too because I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say in response to my post about LoA bitrate. I don't expect to play any 4K movies back over the HTPC, just the clips that are available on the net or games in 4K. I bought the card in order for it to upscale my current collection of titles using the terrific JRiver/MadVR JINC+AR combo. My understanding is that even if I could move the content off the puck and play it back through the HTPC, I'd run into HDCP 2.2 issues. My guess is that you're also correct in that I'd need a software player that could playback content stored using eyeIO compression. My post wasn't looking for a way to play this content back over my HTPC, I was simply stating what I saw in terms of size and bitrates for my BD copy of LoA. Besides, why would I need to use my HTPC when I'd already own the FPM? Did I miss something?
Edited by stevenjw - 12/10/13 at 7:04pm
post #7374 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenjw View Post


I'll apologize in advance too because I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say in response to my post about LoA bitrate. I don't expect to play any 4K movies back over the HTPC, just the clips that are available on the net or games in 4K. I bought the card in order for it to upscale my current collection of titles using the terrific JRiver/MadVR JINC+AR combo. My understanding is that even if I could move the content off the puck and play it back through the HTPC, I'd run into HDCP 2.2 issues. My guess is that you're also correct in that I'd need a software player that could playback content stored using eyeIO compression. My post wasn't looking for a way to play this content back over my HTPC, I was simply stating what I saw in terms of size and bitrates for my BD copy of LoA. Besides, why would I need to use my HTPC when I'd already own the FPM? Did I miss something?

Sorry for the confusion
What I meant to ask is....am I correct in thinking the proper way to maximize the 4k quality is to play a mastered 4k disc on the new 4k sony bluray player?.....this way it upscales using sonys specific up scaling process??
If I try to play the same mastered 4k disc in my older sony bluray player, it would not be the same up scaling quality correct?
This leads to my next thought.....if I copy a mastered 4k disc on a server and play with a media player such as a Dune player it would look similar as any other Blu-ray Disc even though it's a mastered disc correct?
Final thought.....if using an HTCP even with the best 4k video card it still would not match playing the mastered 4k disc with the 4k sony player correct?......again because of the sony upscale process
post #7375 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by piratemonkey View Post

I could be totally wrong here so apologize in advance if so but aren't we supposed to watch a 4k mastered disc is with the new sony 4k bd player because you need to use the proprietary algorithm that Sony uses to compress and upscale.....without that I'm guessing it would play back like any other Blu-ray Disc whether you have the proper video card in your HTCP or not?

Mastered in 4k disks have three attributes that "elevate" them from standard blu ray disks:

Higher bitrates: Mi4k discs use almost all the available disk space for the movie. This allows the movie to be encoded at a higher bitrate. While most Blu-ray discs are are encoded at between 24Mbps to 30Mbps, Mi4K discs are encoded at 35Mbps to 38Mbps. Higher bit rate = lower compression = better quality picture. Improvement available through any BD payer.

Wider color gamut: MI4K supports xvYCC. From what I gather, requires Sony BD player and a compatible Sony monitor that supports wider gamut (ie TVs with Triluminos colour)

Sony 4K algorithms: Sony 4K televisions are able to identify a "mastered in 4K" disc and use an upscaling algorithm based on the same formula used at Sony Pictures to downscale the film from 4K to HD. Compatible with any bluray player.


In my personal opinion, most of the quality gain is from the higher bitrate.
Edited by work permit - 12/10/13 at 9:02pm
post #7376 of 9633
Well in the end it took a nervous few attempts with a 4K panel, but we have stage one lift off...fingers crossed more to come tonight hopefully next step over to the 1100:

post #7377 of 9633
Steve. I was thinking about the tablet and I think any tablet capable of down loading the Sony app could be used instead of the Sony tablet. Perhaps when you get the pacage and the upgrade you could try activation etc on some other device and then if it works just sell the tablet off new and unopened?
post #7378 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Steve. I was thinking about the tablet and I think any tablet capable of down loading the Sony app could be used instead of the Sony tablet. Perhaps when you get the pacage and the upgrade you could try activation etc on some other device and then if it works just sell the tablet off new and unopened?

Thanks Mark. I was wondering about that. It is only an Android tablet after all. I just didn't know if it came packaged with the FPM and preloaded specifically for this purpose. I image that you don't really need the Xpreria, just an app, but not really sure. It seems you can by the FPM-X1 on Amazon and it says nothing about requiring a tablet. I did ask if it came with a remote in this thread, but was told no. Where can one get the app?
post #7379 of 9633
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Steve. I was thinking about the tablet and I think any tablet capable of down loading the Sony app could be used instead of the Sony tablet. Perhaps when you get the pacage and the upgrade you could try activation etc on some other device and then if it works just sell the tablet off new and unopened?

The disclaimer in the Google Play apps store states the app will only work on Xperia tablets. I had issues initially with my non-US Xperia until I forced it to install via PC, also worked fine once I'd flashed the tablet with US firmware. I was very close to trying to cheap it out with a lesser cost android tablet.
Quote:
Important Notice:
This application is made exclusively for owners of Sony Xperia Tablets for use with Sony 4K Ultra HD TVs and Home Theater Projectors .
post #7380 of 9633
Thanks. I didn't know that.
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