Sony VPL-vw1000 - Page 27

Was that from the preproduction model or a newer one?

I fired mine up and have been examining it.. cant measure anything as my friend has my equipment.. getting that back tonight.

First blush is its bright.. but I have a dalite high power screen right now so that is to be well expected.

I dont think I like reality creation much, unless I can tweak it.. makes film grain unbearable...

The Cat level really wont make a difference. As long as it's a straight through cable, it should be fine.

Alright, I put new batteries in my CA813 (which by the way has never been calibrated and is a few years old) and took new measurements.

Since the light on the screen varies quite a bit from edge to edge I took the highest measurement I could find near the center. I wonder if any projectors have even light output from edge to edge?

The first measurement with my projector all the way back in my equipment room was near the same as before, a bit over 1000 lumens.

I then set up a table about half way in between(Much nearer the screen) and lugged the projector out. I had to pull out my 25' hdmi cable, luckily I have one.
Anyway with full near zoom I measured again. This time I got 1528 lumens. I also tried shifting the picture lower or higher but it didn't seem to make a lot of difference.

Uniformity doesn't seem to be a strong point but I haven't measured enough projectors to know if this is normal. My Marantz does better but it also has some uniformity issues. I took some measurements to show this and on all measurement I stayed 3 or 4 inches from the edges.

Center Screen 434 lux
Bottom Left 372 lux
Upper Left 304 lux
Upper Right 285 lux
lower Right 367 lux

We will be measuring it now Art. I couldn't find my meter. Its in my house somewhere. Tom brought his. I watched Avatar in 3D. The only time I watched Avatar in 3D before was at my local Imax. I guessed the Sony picture was 10 TIMES better. An AV Science Sales customer said I was wrong. It was 20 times better, Much brighter, much better colors, and lots of 3D depth. My wife is going to watch something on 3D on this thing and ask me when ours to keep is coming. Man this may not be enough to light up a Ed Sullivan size screen (really big) but man on man, this baby is good. Full review up by Tom tonight. Measurements for Art in a few.

I'm pretty sure that was a pre-production model.

I saw that too.

Just for the heck of it, I plugged the numbers that HT Magazine reported into the Stewart Filmscreen system calculator and it came up with 890 lumens.

I will be very interested to see how you review different things on your Dalite Hi-Power screen. Especially what kind of 3D picture it throws. BTW, what size is your Dalite HP screen and is it a 2.8 screen?

I thought 3D looked a bit dim but I had been watching a bright, punchy image in 2D.
I only watched parts of 2 disks in 3D. The picture looked good and I didn't see any crosstalk. The 3D image was 103" wide and 1.77.

I think I just don't really like 3D. It looks fake, I see layers with a flat background. The glasses worked well sitting in front of the projector with a clear line of sight to the projector. I need the other 500 lumens for 3D and I could go back to low lamp for 2D

I think I had the 2.8? But not really sure. I ordered it in June of 07 and dont remember there being a choice..

I had my rs20 set up perfectly hanging at long throw from the ceiling, but I dont have a mounting plate for the 1000, so its sitting on a table probably 5 feet closer than the rs20 was. But since I see my head in the picture now, I assume its in a pretty good spot for brightness . Its a 133" diagonal.

It is too bright of course, but not WAAAY too bright, which is what I expected it to be. I hope this 1500 lumen number that Randall is getting doesnt turn out to be right. This will be going back if so, as I need every bit of the 2000 lumens promised when I get my 160" enlightor screen.

I also dont seem to have one of these "perfect" convergence units since I do see some red fringing. But I will reserve judgement on that until i can mount it since I have seen that change sometimes from shelf to ceiling mount with other projectors.

So far the black level seems pretty high, after I calibrated with my AVS disc. To see the flashing 17 bar output from my OPPO, brightness was set at 52 or 53. Gamma was OFF though... seems much better with Gamma on 2.4 or 2.6. I will measure gamma tonight hopefully.

I do see the IRIS working pretty often. I think the IRIS is set on AUTO full... I havent changed many settings yet.

The first thing I noticed when displaying a movie is how many skin imperfections I see all of a sudden on the actors, but I think some of them go away once Reality creation is turned off. Like I said earlier, Reality Creation seemed to make film grain unbearable and pronounced. Like a sharpness control turned all the way up.

Oh and lamp in high mode sounds about the same as my RS20 in high mode did.

In low mode the fan is almost inaudible.

I have not seen this discussed here yet, but I just noticed Cine4home has another review up and is getting 1600 lumens calibrated.

http://translate.google.com/translat...00_Preview.htm

Wolfgang's numbers were also calibrated though, correct?

Me too, should be here beginning of March.


I guess I'm confused, what does this get you over the "Built-in 3D Transmitter" the spec sheet refers to. Why would you need the optional emitter to bounce off the screen, since if you have it you will run it to the front?

How do I measure lumens with my Colormunki or i1display and Calman? I am used to always measuring off the screen, and have never measured facing the projector. I just put it on the diffuser mode and point and measure ftL? I dont think Calman puts lumens out directly?

Depending on your installation you may need an external emitter. In my case my projector is in an equipment room with just the lense viewable from the back wall which is blocking the built in emitter. Not to mention from 20 ft away the emitter may be too far to bounce off the front wall. Seems to have a limited range.

So with my i1display pointing toward the screen at 133" full frame 100ire white field I get 61 ftL. With iris on full auto, d65 color, rec 709, calibration preset cinema film, and about 20% back from min throw.

I tried measuring with the diffusor on and pointing at the projector from about 2 feet away, at same settings, and got 7200ftL. so that was a worthless reading.

I am also seeing a pretty pronounced red shift along the bottom 10% of the screen all the way across. I will try to get a pic.

Well, that doesn't sound good.


Jim

If I see anything I will report it immediately.

I think it barely shows in the pic I tried...

Yes, I can see it. I think I've seen some of that in mine also. I'll check next time I turn it on.

I just checked my unit, none visible.


Jim

Randall, how does the 1K look with the AT screen? (How close can you get before the perf becomes visible?)


Jim

I posted this already but it may have been in a different thread. I checked using the VW1000 and a 100 IRE screen. I could begin to see subtle shading around 8 to 9 feet from the screen due to the perfs. Even at 8 feet I don't think I would see it if I didn't know. I started in close and moved back while focusing carefully on the perfs.

My apologies, I missed that post. (Thanks for repeating!)


Jim

You need to measure brightness with a light meter not your colorimeter.

Given that red you have at the bottom of the screen I would be sending it back for a new one. That is simply unacceptable for a projector of this caliber.

Yikes, this is terrible uniformity, center to upper right is 38% difference......for a $25K projector I expect much better. I am only 20% difference on my $5K projector. I am sure not liking these reports so far, lumens low, uniformity problems, convergence problems, red tinge.....

Also those are huge lux numbers, how are you calculating lumens?

Here is the calculation I know:

lumens = (lux / 10.76) * square feet of screen in FEET
now let's plug in your numbers:
First you said an 11' wide 2.35, I will assume you are using a lens meaning your screen and the projected image is 56*132 = 7392/144 = 51.3 square ft
calculation:
434/10.76 = 40.3 x 51.3 = 2067.39 lumens

if you are using the zoom method it is like 2800 lumens....something wrong with your measurements or I have your screen way off...

Tom and I spent 8 hours today testing the machine. Convergence was very good and a small amount of misconvergnce (a very tiny amount) was uniform accross the scren and easily correctable with a few clicks of pixel shift or whatever they call it for red and blue. One really had to get close to se any misconvegence.

The Reality Creation has been on other Sony products before. It has two controls when switched on. Resolution and Noise Filtering. I put it on but left both controls at zero. It is very hard to see whsat it does. I only used horizontal and vertical pixel patterns. Didn't have a diagonal pixel pattern and my screen is small. Already at close to close throw. Using the controls does affect the gray scale and we calibrated with it on butat the controls at 0.

There is some color shift with contrast at 100. Test pattern showed brightness should be set at 51 but in honor of Wolfgang we left it at 50. Technically there was some white clipping at 100 depending on how one defines clipping and at what bar. 97 was perfect but we calibrated at 90 to get best gray scale. But cranking it to 100 doesn't change things much. Tom is a color perfectionist so . . . .

The best preset was Reference.

Re the iris. The best setting according to the manual is Auto Limited for dark viewing environments. We used that and manual iris at various levels. Iris off is fully open. For 2D viewing we used low lamp and iris about 23 if I remember correctly.

I had an Oppo for about 2 hours when a customer came over with it with a 3D disc f Avatar. It was fantastic. I felt it was 10 times better in PQ than our local IMAX. He thought I was being too conservative and rated it 20 times better. It was realy bright and had tremendous depth and great colors.

My cheap Bluray player sucks. The FIOS box was much better in its PQ playing sports and other content.

Uniformity was fine and it takes good equipment and skill to measure it accurately. Uniformity can not be usered by spot reading in front of the area being measured. As I understand it, uniformity is measured from a given viewing position just like screen gain is measured. Eeven with a unity gain fabric such as Stewart Studeotec 100, there will be some non uniformity caused by the fabric. If you place the probe in front of the spot at an anglr of course, you will measure reduced gain and less bright unless you have a unity gain screen and even then the fabric itself won't be completely uniform in gain.. When I get my Studeotec 100, I will conduct a full reading sweep. I wouldn't worry about this much.

We didn't see any color banding but once again we did need to crank the contrast down a bit and some of the settings eg Reality Creation can cause some color problems. There are a lot of controls and it takes a while to understand them , see what they do, and whether tey have any bad side effects.

My brightness readings are in line with Randall's and not with Wolfgang's. Italked wth the Sony engineers today and they said to expect about 1400 lumens out, d65, BT709, contrast 100, iris full open (off), full illuminated 4096 x 2160 chip, high lamp at shortest throw.

Also remember this is a 1.888 chip machine. The zoom target is a full 1.888 target with interior markings for 1.85, 1,78, and 1.33 (all vertical of course) and a 2.35 horizontal marking. If one selects normal aspect ratio, the machine will light up the chip at 3840 x 2160. Switching to say 2.35 will light up 4096 x 2160. My screen is only 1.78 so while we did some measuring at 4096 x 2160 most of the time we used 3840 x 2160.

Man. Its late and I have a bunch of documents to draft tomorrow. Time to grab 2 hours of sleep.

All I can say so far is and !!!

Is it really that bad??