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Just for fun, brochure on the Sony 4K projector for theaters

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 
Sony SRX-R320P 4K Digital Cinema Projector

It's actually kind of fun to read how this all works
post #2 of 21
Cool, thanks!
post #3 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by kucharsk View Post

Sony SRX-R320P 4K Digital Cinema Projector

It's actually kind of fun to read how this all works…

Quit fooling around be a real man, if you really cared about your fellow HT enthusiast and AVS forum friends you'd put yourself on the line & purchase one of these to give us the scoop to ether take out a second mortgage (giving the wife and kids a heart attack) telling us to buy one asap or give it a thumbs down saving us from a Dump truck size catastrophe
post #4 of 21
No HDMI input?
How can I make this work in my bedroom then. wink.gif
Edited by OzzieP - 5/19/13 at 10:23pm
post #5 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzieP View Post

No HDMI input?
How can I make this work in my bedroom then. wink.gif

It's has DVI wink.gif
post #6 of 21
There is another device called a Gefen (at least for my chain) that works as a HDMI input that connects to our sound rack and DVI out to the projector (Christie)
post #7 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by invadergir View Post

There is another device called a Gefen (at least for my chain) that works as a HDMI input that connects to our sound rack and DVI out to the projector (Christie)

Single link DVI and HDMI are the same. They each have the same 19 pin configuration but each has it's own layout and shape. You can use a simple HDMI to DVI cable without the need for an intermediary component to change the connection type. I've always found that keeping the amount of components in the chain to a minimum makes it less likely for something to to go wrong or get changed for the worse.
post #8 of 21
2000:1 is 'high contrast'?
post #9 of 21
Bill,
For cinema pjs it is. Those are real men's pjs not the toy you have.wink.gifsmile.gif

I saw one on Sat night for Star Trek. It looked pretty good from my vantage point.
post #10 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

Bill,
For cinema pjs it is. Those are real men's pjs not the toy you have.wink.gifsmile.gif

I saw one on Sat night for Star Trek. It looked pretty good from my vantage point.

I understand that this CR works for a commercial theater, but I doubt that we would find it very impressive in our 'toy' HT's, and few of us really need 5000-6000 lumens.

However, at some point I hope we see the truly high CR of the best JVC's, together with ~2000 true lumens at full calibration. The Sony 1000ES is as close as we've gotten so far; I like it very much, but do sometimes miss the higher CR of the best JVC's. And after 500-1000 hrs on the lamp, it's lumen output is below 1000.
post #11 of 21
The interpixel spacing would stay the same if the JVC was not improved. Shove more light through the chip and more light will leak through lowering the on off drastically. Its all a game of trade offs forcing JVC to lower the lumens to increase the on off on its most expensive models. I am curious, on the Sony's the chip is closed when no current or voltage is applied, when black is projected. This was done rather than going the other way to electrically drive the pixels to dull closure. This was done on the Sony's do avoid the failure of LCDs to fully close the farther they are away from the driver. I wonder if the JVCs also operate by having black no driven to avoid this surface effect. It is simply not possible to have HT level on offs on high lumens machines. if it were, commercial theater machines would have much better on offs. The problem could be solved by having chips stacked in front of the existing chips but alignment would be horrendous and expensive. You can chose your trade off but both can't be had. modifications of commercial machines do exist that significantly improve on off but there all involver insertion of specially shaped apertures which reduce the lumens.
post #12 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

The interpixel spacing would stay the same if the JVC was not improved. Shove more light through the chip and more light will leak through lowering the on off drastically. Its all a game of trade offs forcing JVC to lower the lumens to increase the on off on its most expensive models. I am curious, on the Sony's the chip is closed when no current or voltage is applied, when black is projected. This was done rather than going the other way to electrically drive the pixels to dull closure. This was done on the Sony's do avoid the failure of LCDs to fully close the farther they are away from the driver. I wonder if the JVCs also operate by having black no driven to avoid this surface effect. It is simply not possible to have HT level on offs on high lumens machines. if it were, commercial theater machines would have much better on offs. The problem could be solved by having chips stacked in front of the existing chips but alignment would be horrendous and expensive. You can chose your trade off but both can't be had. modifications of commercial machines do exist that significantly improve on off but there all involver insertion of specially shaped apertures which reduce the lumens.

Well you certainly understand all this better than I, Mark. But why is it that JVC is able to get so much better native o/f CR than Sony, since both are lcos-based pj's? If the Sony had JVC's native cr, then with its excellent DI it would be so much the better.
post #13 of 21
And if JVC weren't so damn egotistical and offered a well executed DI as a switchable option for those who wished to use. Now as to the chip difference give me a minute and it involves certain patents on the chip design that JVC owns. In general, the thinner the chip meaning how close the pixels are to the driver, the interpixel spacing, whether the chip is on or off for its all black position and the lumens being shot onto the chip as well as the quality of the polarizers are what controls light leakage and light scatter. Next post is what JVC does differently in its chip design and build to achieve a super native chip on off if you will.
post #14 of 21
Its probably better if you go to the JVC site and read about its chips but the main advantage is in the vertical alignment and the smoothness of the outer chip boundary which reduces light scatter. They also claim their method of driving the pixels allows for closer pixel spacing. Off hand I don't remember the claimed inyerpixel spacing for the JVC chip and the Sony chip. JVC improved on off this year by improving the quality of its polarizers. Further gains could be had if more expensive polarizers were used. They exist but in my estimation would raise the MSRP by over $1000.
post #15 of 21
OK, I'm happy to put the onus on JVC, to implement a good DI--and also to utilize a 330 watt lamp, or something, to increase the lumen output from ~ 800 (calibrated) lumens. And don't tell me that this would ruin their superlative o/f CR; yes, it would raise the black level, but should ..not increase the o/f CR. And it seems pretty clear that JVC will come out with a true 4K pj, if not at this CEDIA, then surely by the next. (I'm willing to keep my Sony1000 for a couple of more yrs, at least--should I live so long!)
post #16 of 21
First, I will say that the JVC commercial 4k is supposed to be around 10k to 1 on /off. You guys tell me your opinion. At least the one at Cedia doesn't look that high.

Second, good luck with getting JVC to put a DI on their pj. Darin has been telling them for years at Cedia and he still gets the same response - "We have the highest native on/off cr, so we don't need a DI." I might add that not everyone in the industry likes a DI (which could be a factor). I don't know if it was with you Mark or Darin at the Epson demo in '11, when Greg from THX said he always turns a DI off because he doesn't like it.

Finally, Bill I don't want to hear anymore of this crazy talk about keeping the 1000 for a couple more years. You better go to Cedia this year and look for your next upgrade.tongue.gif I am planning on attending this year after missing last year.cool.gif
post #17 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

.....

Finally, Bill I don't want to hear anymore of this crazy talk about keeping the 1000 for a couple more years. You better go to Cedia this year and look for your next upgrade.tongue.gif I am planning on attending this year after missing last year.cool.gif

Just as you, I'm definitely planning to go to CEDIA this Sept (nice that it's closer, being in Denver!), also having passed it up last year. I don't think it likely, though, that I will see anything that will cause me to want to replace the 1000--but it's always fun to see what's coming.

But just for fun, what features or performance to you see as possible that would make you want to replace it? (for ~ $15K or less). Besides, I've still got one more lamp due me on my Mack Warranty!
post #18 of 21
I'm seriously considering booking a trip to Denver this September for CEDIA. I think it would be a lot of fun to see first hand what JVC and Sony (and others) have to offer on the UHD/4K consumer side of things.
post #19 of 21
If you go, drive west to the mountains if you like that sort of thing, cool drive near there. Though I've been there so many times, nothing new here. Especially neat is the Mt. Evans drive to the top at $14,000+ feet overlooking the city. Denver also has fairly cheap hotel rooms. I would say the cheapest hotel rooms in the whole US are probably in Dallas though, or maybe Tennessee.
post #20 of 21
My gut feeling is while the USA JVC folks give feedback to JVC Japan, they really have not a lot to do with JVC technological developments. Its the USA guys will always be inferior to the great Japanese engineering minds. Its that way with a lot of Japanese manufacturers with offices here primarily manned or womaned by Americans.

Once again everything in projector land is a trade off. Many projection experts do not use a DI when there is a switchable option to use one or not use one. To the untrained eye the primary fault of early DIs was visible pumping on various scenes or the slowness or lag in operation. Over the years these artifacts were negated so that in some manufacturer's unit (Sony being a great example) so that they are not often seen. What is visible is better blacks. But this does not mean using a DI has no adverse consequences. The dynamic gammas (lowering the gamma) used to increase the brightness of bright objects dimmed by the reduced iris opening to darken the blacks does cause white clipping and will affect the gray scale. Put up the scene from 2001 where the computer disconnectss the tether from the astronaut and watch the color of the NASA suit lit by the sun. Switch the DI off and on. I rest my case. Banding might also be an issue on the 1000ES caused by use of its DI. But the blacks are better and one probably won't notice or care about the color change or even the banding which will be there but they won't see. Yes Charlotte because they are untrained observers and that is not necessarily bad. I know in 2001 to shut the DI off if I want to see the NASA orange or turn it on to see better blacks in the star field but I can't have both. But I like the idea and provision for turning it off and on and of varying DI intensity or aggressiveness options.
Edited by mark haflich - 5/20/13 at 11:15pm
post #21 of 21
Clipped whites are my biggest complaint with DI systems. There are a bunch of scenes I know of off the top of my head that look totally unnatural because of how much whites are boosted to accent the DI being pushed to hard. If a projector can get decent contrast and black levels with a manual iris and still have adequate brightness for my screen size I'd like that instead of a DI. Image stability is a huge plus with the manual iris.
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