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Integra DHC-80.3 - Page 94

post #2791 of 4252
I'm curious what everyone's opinion is on bi-wiring. I have a Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Series II 5-channel amp. Each of the front channels have two pairs of outputs, one labeled "Voltage Source", the other labeled "Current Source". The Current Source is meant to mimic the sound of a tube amp. Whether or not it does, I don't really have the experience to say.

The manual suggests bi-wiring the fronts if your speakers have dual binding posts, which my Axiom M60's do. The front Voltage Source outputs of the amp are connected to the woofer of each front speaker, while the front Current Source outputs are connected to the upper range of each speaker.

I am pleased with the sound, but I haven't really experimented with different configurations. Anyone have any thoughts on this set-up? Is it as much hocus-pocus as passive bi-amping?
post #2792 of 4252
Bi-wiring is even more hocus-pocus than passive bi-amping. The only way you'll hear a difference is if you use inappropriately thin wires on one of the legs, causing that signal to be distorted. Electrically, two wires in parallel are the same as using one thicker wire.
post #2793 of 4252
I know the consensus on bi-amping. Let me ask if my situation is a little different. I have Carver ALIII's as my main l/r speakers. They have 10" down firing woofers and 4' ribbons which are VERY inefficient. Im using a 150wpc B&K to drive the woofers and a 250wpc Mcintosh to drive the ribbons thinking that not using any of the mac power for the woofers would help with the situation. Am I at all right?
post #2794 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by leefarber View Post

I'm curious what everyone's opinion is on bi-wiring. I have a Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Series II 5-channel amp. Each of the front channels have two pairs of outputs, one labeled "Voltage Source", the other labeled "Current Source". The Current Source is meant to mimic the sound of a tube amp. Whether or not it does, I don't really have the experience to say.
The manual suggests bi-wiring the fronts if your speakers have dual binding posts, which my Axiom M60's do. The front Voltage Source outputs of the amp are connected to the woofer of each front speaker, while the front Current Source outputs are connected to the upper range of each speaker.
I am pleased with the sound, but I haven't really experimented with different configurations. Anyone have any thoughts on this set-up? Is it as much hocus-pocus as passive bi-amping?

I have owned several Sunfire MC amps over the years and on the occasions when I had dual binding posts on my main speakers, I fed the HF drivers the Current Source signal and the Voltage Source to the bass drivers per the Sunfire manual. Apparently (this is my non-technical understanding wink.gif) the only difference in the two signals is a 1ohm resistor on the Current Source output that created an additional 1 ohm impedance on that set of binding posts.

I had some fairly "high end" Revel Ultima Studio 2's for my main speakers and despite my wanting to hear a difference, I simply could not tell a difference between the Current and Voltage sources. That said, I have the extra speaker cables and happily used them as they certainly did no harm.
post #2795 of 4252
Could any of u guys PM me the price that u payed for the 80.3 and where it was bought from? Thanks. Wanted to make sure that my local installer is not charging me a premium for it. Thanks. smile.gif
post #2796 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by g_bartman View Post

I know the consensus on bi-amping. Let me ask if my situation is a little different. I have Carver ALIII's as my main l/r speakers. They have 10" down firing woofers and 4' ribbons which are VERY inefficient. Im using a 150wpc B&K to drive the woofers and a 250wpc Mcintosh to drive the ribbons thinking that not using any of the mac power for the woofers would help with the situation. Am I at all right?

You will just have to make sure the input sensitivity of both amps match so that they both play at the same levels. This is were bi-amping would make more sense or to use a tube amp for the high's and a solid state amp for the lows in some set-ups. I personally have never felt the need to do it but don't begrudge the thought of it.
post #2797 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by N8DOGG View Post

Wyred can state that it does this or that to the output stages but in reality I've had both and they sound identical. With the wryed, they're are more mainstream and you're paying for that. D-sonic is a smaller company but both D-sonic and Wyred come from the same parent company and both use ICE as well as other techs now. You're getting the same thing in a different case for cheaper with D-sonic.

Technically this is incorrect.... Dennis from D-Sonic started a company and worked along side as well as directly for Wyred4Sound, but then went off on his own....
I believe D-Sonic is now located in TX, Wyred4Sound is in California.... Separate companies that use the same B&O modules in their amps though....

I got my Wyred4Sound unit used for a steal of a price - and the D-Sonic new.... they are both fantastic units....

I would highly suggest either, and D-Sonic for the better price....


And thanks SpeedofFlight for the heads up on D-Sonics new website.... ahhh I must say that has been years overdue.... smile.gif
post #2798 of 4252
this was a quote from Wyred4sound on this thread : http://www.avsforum.com/t/855660/d-sonic-custom-audio-amps/120#post_13063444

: There are many differences between the units. Our unit has input buffers which raises the input impeadance to 60K ohms. Our input buffer consists of a dual FET design that makes the ICE modules have a sweeter tone. Also, the input buffer allows your source to easily drive the amplifier, especially for Tube sources. The ICE module alone will have low input impeadance in the 7K range which will cause the source signal to work harder to arrive at the amplifier in tact. The harder it is to drive, the more signal that you will loose in transmission, thus less detail.

We offer Dual 15A IEC's that allow more current, and the ability for cable upgrades if desired. 12V Trigger input and output come standard with complete off in stand-by mode via trigger, and front panel switch. Future upgrades are also made easy due to the modular design, and expandablity.

We also modify our modules with a couple of upgrades which we perform on our modifications to other units. All components on the boards with audio signal are competed with audiophile components, such as Dale resistors, MUSE and Wima caps. There are some upgrades to be done to our amplifier such as binding posts, and speaker connections. However, we make our units, for the most part, already modded with a couple of options for those who would like to take it further. With that said, I'm sure that you can assume that other amplifiers will take much more effort to sound similar to ours if at all possible depending on the design.

For your other question: We do manufacture the D-Sonic amplifiers. Modifications to any unit is possible, however, there will be much more to do to other products. We design our products to be better in stock form than others. You could say that our amplifier is more high-end than others. We put the best of the best together to fabricate our "stock" unit.

I hope that this answers your questions, and please let me know if there is anything else that I can either clarify on or help you with:


Now that may not be the case any more but it was then and could still be even though they are not in the same state. I loved my wyred amp and I love my D-sonic amp. Dennis was reason enough to go with D-sonic. I did have a bad module but I fixed it up quickly.
post #2799 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

You will just have to make sure the input sensitivity of both amps match so that they both play at the same levels. This is were bi-amping would make more sense or to use a tube amp for the high's and a solid state amp for the lows in some set-ups. I personally have never felt the need to do it but don't begrudge the thought of it.

Thanks for the reply. I put a line level volume control between the pre amp and the B&K because the lf was overpowering the ribbons. Not to start any controversy but to me the Mcintosh has a " tube like" sound that is a good match for the ribbons.
post #2800 of 4252
Purchased my DHC- 80.3 today. They had one in stock at HiFi House. I will be powering it with my Parasound Halo A51 250 watt per channel beast tongue.gif
Edited by YES90125 - 7/27/12 at 3:19am
post #2801 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by g_bartman View Post

I know the consensus on bi-amping. Let me ask if my situation is a little different. I have Carver ALIII's as my main l/r speakers. They have 10" down firing woofers and 4' ribbons which are VERY inefficient. Im using a 150wpc B&K to drive the woofers and a 250wpc Mcintosh to drive the ribbons thinking that not using any of the mac power for the woofers would help with the situation. Am I at all right?


Unless you have active external crossovers between the amp and preamp and have disabled the passive crossovers in the speakers, it's a waste of time and wire.

post #2802 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Bi-wiring is even more hocus-pocus than passive bi-amping. The only way you'll hear a difference is if you use inappropriately thin wires on one of the legs, causing that signal to be distorted. Electrically, two wires in parallel are the same as using one thicker wire.


+1. The sole benefit of biwiring is for people who sell wire.

post #2803 of 4252
what interconnect cables are you using from your amp to the 80.3?
post #2804 of 4252
Neutrik XLRs from Blue Jeans Cables
post #2805 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by N8DOGG View Post

Now that may not be the case any more but it was then and could still be even though they are not in the same state. I loved my wyred amp and I love my D-sonic amp. Dennis was reason enough to go with D-sonic. I did have a bad module but I fixed it up quickly.

Yeah that was way back in 2008, when dennis was first starting and since then that changed....

Either way, they are both great amps with basically the same guts. And owning both I can easily state they sound and perform pretty much identically....
Edited by Warpdrv - 7/27/12 at 8:57am
post #2806 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

what interconnect cables are you using from your amp to the 80.3?

I needed some 25' cables to run to the basement for my 6 pro amps for all my subs.
I bought GLS Audio cables off of ebay and they are dead quiet, shielded, locking and multicolored for ease of identification....


They came highly recommended by a audio mixer friend of mine who beats them up on a daily/weekly basis...

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=gls+xlr+cable&_sacat=0&_odkw=xlr+cable+25%27&_osacat=0

I also bought a short set for my secondary rig.... great flexible cable/wire that doesn't break the bank...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/6-6ft-XLR-Patch-Cables-Snake-Cord-Mic-GLS-AUDIO-P-6P6-/390301743317?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5adfcbf8d5

I don't see any reason to spend $30 on a single 6' cable, to me thats just silly, and I have 20 XLR cables in my couple of rigs with no issues....
Edited by Warpdrv - 7/27/12 at 9:07am
post #2807 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

what interconnect cables are you using from your amp to the 80.3?


Monoprice or Blue Jeans. Anything more 'exotic' is usually just a waste of money.

post #2808 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Yeah that was way back in 2008, when dennis was first starting and since then that changed....
Either way, they are both great amps with basically the same guts. And owning both I can easily state they sound and perform pretty much identically....

Well thats good to know. I've had both my D-sonic and wyred amps opened up and there is nothing too complicated about either, and I agree that they are VERY similar in almost every way. I like to support the smaller guys, which is the reason I sold my wyred and got the D-sonic. I do agree that they sound as the same to me also. I have the newer version od the D-sonic and love the looks of it. I was never a big fan of my wyred amps looks.
post #2809 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

what interconnect cables are you using from your amp to the 80.3?

I've got home made Neutrik XLR with mogami wire. I made 9 of them for under $100. I've used monoprice and bluejeans stuff also but like to make my own for fun when I can. I use monoprice HDMI's on everything in my house.
post #2810 of 4252
I have a 5.1 speaker system right now, On the Integra it has inputs for Surround Left/Right and Surround Back Left/Right. I assume Surround Back should only be used if you have 4 speakers set-up for rear surround with 2 surround Left/Right being for side rear walls speakers and 2 (surround back left/right being behind the listening position. Is this correct?
post #2811 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

I have a 5.1 speaker system right now, On the Integra it has inputs for Surround Left/Right and Surround Back Left/Right. I assume Surround Back should only be used if you have 4 speakers set-up for rear surround with 2 surround Left/Right being for side rear walls speakers and 2 (surround back left/right being behind the listening position. Is this correct?

You are correct, use Surrounds for 5.1. Backs if you have 4 surrounds.
post #2812 of 4252
Ok everything is hooked up. I am getting all video sources with HDMI, but absolutely no sound. My amp is on and connected to the controller using RBA jacks and nothing.mad.gif
post #2813 of 4252
Does your A51 have selector switches between balanced (XLR) and unbalanced (RCA)? Also, make sure you are using the pre outs and not the multi channel ins on the back of the 80.3. They look similar, especially when you can't look straight at them.
post #2814 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

Purchased my DHC- 80.3 today. They had one in stock at HiFi House. I will be powering it with my Parasound Halo A51 250 watt per channel beast tongue.gif

Congrats your going to love it !
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

what interconnect cables are you using from your amp to the 80.3?

Balanced XLR Audioquest Diamond backs, King Cobras and Transparent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

Ok everything is hooked up. I am getting all video sources with HDMI, but absolutely no sound. My amp is on and connected to the controller using RBA jacks and nothing.mad.gif

Jim has made some great suggestions, im sure its a setup/connection issue .
Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post

Does your A51 have selector switches between balanced (XLR) and unbalanced (RCA)? Also, make sure you are using the pre outs and not the multi channel ins on the back of the 80.3. They look similar, especially when you can't look straight at them.
post #2815 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post

Does your A51 have selector switches between balanced (XLR) and unbalanced (RCA)? Also, make sure you are using the pre outs and not the multi channel ins on the back of the 80.3. They look similar, especially when you can't look straight at them.

Ok , got it working. As it turns out I made two errors, which made the solution a bit more difficult to solve. First you were correct about the using the pre-outs on the controller, I had them hooked up to the same inputs, but to the left, instead of the pre-outs to the right. Second I used the PS3 for my Blueray player to set the whole thing up and had the sound settings incorrect (optical instead of HDMI. I had to use optical with my old Sony STR-DB930 receiver because it didn't have HDMI rolleyes.gif

Although I didn't do any speaker set up or Audyssey yet, I noticed that the volume control needs to be set at least 50 - 60 to get any decent volume of sound, is this normal? The Sony receiver that was hooked up to the Parasound and used to be much louder with only a quarter turn of the volume dial.
post #2816 of 4252
Sounds like you dont have the settings correct yet. Not sure what that might be but im sure someone will chime in.
post #2817 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFactor View Post

Congrats your going to love it !
Balanced XLR Audioquest Diamond backs, King Cobras and Transparent.
Jim has made some great suggestions, im sure its a setup/connection issue .


Nice connects there! I was thinking of getting the Audioquest Sub-1 for my subwoofer, not sure if I should get an XLR connect since my subwoofer has one. What connection do you have for your sub?
post #2818 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by YES90125 View Post

Nice connects there! I was thinking of getting the Audioquest Sub-1 for my subwoofer, not sure if I should get an XLR connect since my subwoofer has one. What cnnection do you have for your sub?
Thanks ! There great IC especialy the Transparent im running those for my fronts . As far as my subs I have the option for XLR's on my SVS Ultra PB 13 but not on my PB12 Plus although I choose not to run them just because I already had some nice Audioquest SUB-1 in rca's laying around and they sounded great . I dont think that unless your going to have long runs then XLR'S wont be necessary although I Iike them for my amp and pre/pro just because I can lol and it makes me feel good its kind of like running high octane premium gas in your ferrari insead of low grade regular smile.gif BTW nice amp you have there to that 51 is a monster and one of Parasounds finest !!
post #2819 of 4252
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFactor View Post

Thanks ! There great IC especialy the Transparent im running those for my fronts . As far as my subs I have the option for XLR's on my SVS Ultra PB 13 but not on my PB12 Plus although I choose not to run them just because I already had some nice Audioquest SUB-1 in rca's laying around and they sounded great . I dont think that unless your going to have long runs then XLR'S wont be necessary although I Iike them for my amp and pre/pro just because I can lol and it makes me feel good its kind of like running high octane premium gas in your ferrari insead of low grade regular smile.gif BTW nice amp you have there to that 51 is a monster and one of Parasounds finest !!

Who makes Transparent? I didn't see that name on Audioquest website. Is that speaker cable?
post #2820 of 4252
Transparent is the company. http://www.transparentcable.com/
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