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Official Pioneer Kuro Reddish Tint Problem Thread - Page 3

post #61 of 1117
9/23/11 at 12:06pm
Forget it! Dead end. This place did not even know that Pioneer is out of the display business!!! He said "Hey if we have to we'll just order a new panel". I said hey good luck with that. And this was an authorized repair center! Maybe Pioneer should send out memos.
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post #62 of 1117
9/23/11 at 12:08pm
Thread Starter 
Hahaha hey maybe that store has a secret stash of new panels still

Quote:
Originally Posted by THANKGOD4PLASMA View Post

Forget it! Dead end. This place did not even know that Pioneer is out of the display business!!! He said "Hey if we have to we'll just order a new panel". I said hey good luck with that. And this was an authorized repair center! Maybe Pioneer should send out memos.
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post #63 of 1117
9/23/11 at 12:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

No

At least you tried, my guy wouldn't even look at it.
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post #64 of 1117
9/23/11 at 12:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac13 View Post

mikey it sounds like you probably don't have the same issue since you were able to adjust it out. I used to have a 5020 that had a red push but I had it calibrated and it got rid of that. The color temperature was just too low on that set.

I guess not - sorry if I messed ya up!
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post #65 of 1117
9/23/11 at 2:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by THANKGOD4PLASMA View Post

Forget it! Dead end. This place did not even know that Pioneer is out of the display business!!! He said "Hey if we have to we'll just order a new panel". I said hey good luck with that. And this was an authorized repair center! Maybe Pioneer should send out memos.

Amazing! Somebody has to know what is going on with these sets!
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post #66 of 1117
9/23/11 at 2:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by s2mikey View Post

I guess not - sorry if I messed ya up!

We are discussing red tint on pure black..not red push on regular material. In spite of this flaw though it would be hard to find any set that's better today...I follow the forums and they all have some sort of irritating flaw that is common.
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post #67 of 1117
9/23/11 at 5:09pm
no tint, no DSE here. 600m.. still love it and wouldnt take any other set on the market over it.
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post #68 of 1117
9/23/11 at 5:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBuck View Post

We are discussing red tint on pure black..not red push on regular material. In spite of this flaw though it would be hard to find any set that's better today...I follow the forums and they all have some sort of irritating flaw that is common.

Gotchya, Alan. I skimmed the title and assumed it applied to some of the red push in general.

No doubt the KURO holds its ground against anything out there. My friends/neighbors all have different sets and other than the top-end Pannys, nothing even remotely impresses me at this point.
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post #69 of 1117
9/23/11 at 10:21pm
I have to check manufacture date on my KRP-600M but I don't have any reddish tint on my telly..I watched a few scenes of a demo pioneer Kuro br disc and didn't see a thing, in a completely dark room still nothing.

Edit, to add manufactured date NOV 08


Djoel
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post #70 of 1117
9/24/11 at 6:47am
KRP-500M with a February 2009 build date, in a dark room with either black bars or black screen I cannot tell where the bezel ends and the screen begins. Sorry that people have issues with their kuros.
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post #71 of 1117
9/24/11 at 8:18am
I doubt this will fix the problem (and I don't have the issue) but there are panel degradation adjustments in the Service Menu in Factory Mode, probably more appropriate for long-term uneven phosphor wear than this issue. And I would expect that any change to these settings would require complete readjustment of the white balance, and if the problem exists only at MLL, then the trade-off might be an awful gray scale above MLL :

RBL S00-7 BLUE setting for panel degradation correction : Level 0 to 7
RGL S00-7 GREEN setting for panel degradation correction : Level 0 to 7
RRL S00-7 RED setting for panel degradation correction : Level 0 to 7
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post #72 of 1117
9/24/11 at 8:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by switch42 View Post

KRP-500M with a February 2009 build date, in a dark room with either black bars or black screen I cannot tell where the bezel ends and the screen begins. Sorry that people have issues with their kuros.

No Kuro is so dark that you can't see at least a slight glow on a full black screen in a dark room. (unless it's off, or the panel shuts off due to no signal after a few seconds). Othewise it would the zero luminence model that Pioneer made as a prototype. I do agree that with some bright material on the screen the letterbox bars can appear as dark as the bezel. I think some people exaggerate the blackness of these sets. They are the darkest black plasmas made to date...but they ain't pitch black..lol Even D-Nice says they glow some.
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post #73 of 1117
9/24/11 at 8:57am
With my 111FD, the red tint does not seem to be consistent. Sometimes black screens seem to have more tint than at other times. My room has no windows, so watching conditions are usually fairly constant. On the other hand, if a light is turned on, I doubt if the tint would be seen.

At present is is most noticeable on the top and bottom of the screen and in dark screen letterbox images where the blacks in the picture look fine (a "blue" black) but the letterbox bars can have a distinct, but light red / crimson "glow" black. Before I noticed the tint, the letterbox bars in this situation would be seen as a light grey black. When there is any illumination in the active area, the bars and bezel disappear into the blackness.

If I try to adjust out the tint (still frame on movie) in the bars, say by increasing the blue cut control, you can get the bars more "neutral", but by that time, the picture is bright blue! A fullscreen pluge pattern does not seem to have any excessive tinting. If I bring up an unused input, the tint can be seen, but if you bring up the white balance controls, no amount of adjusting will change the tint in any amount on the unused input black screen. To me the tint appears to be a panel "problem" as opposed to a white balance adjustment "problem". Then again, I am most likely incorrect and would hope someone with real knowledge can come up with a cause.

Before I noticed the tint, I had not noticed the small bars on 1.85 movies, now on certain dark scenes you can see a distinct light reddish small letterbox bar. I have taken to turning on the panel and letting it settle down through it's three levels before turning on my 7000PAL and this seems to help (most likely fooling myself!). When the panel turns on, it shows a grey / black "solarized" blocky or blotchy pattern for a few seconds, then goes to a grey level, then I think darker grey, then to the black where you can see the tint. I also think the tint was less noticeable if I turned up the black level one click, but that makes the black level just a little bit too high.

At least my ticket was opened with Pioneer Canada when I had some time on my warranty (down to days!), so if we come up with a fix, I may be able to get it covered....I hope.... Still a great picture and I try to ignore the letterbox bars in dark scenes, but once you see it.....

P.E.Hannon
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post #74 of 1117
9/24/11 at 9:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by phannon View Post

With my 111FD, the red tint does not seem to be consistent. Sometimes black screens seem to have more tint than at other times. My room has no windows, so watching conditions are usually fairly constant. On the other hand, if a light is turned on, I doubt if the tint would be seen.

At present is is most noticeable on the top and bottom of the screen and in dark screen letterbox images where the blacks in the picture look fine (a "blue" black) but the letterbox bars can have a distinct, but light red / crimson "glow" black. Before I noticed the tint, the letterbox bars in this situation would be seen as a light grey black. When there is any illumination in the active area, the bars and bezel disappear into the blackness.

If I try to adjust out the tint (still frame on movie) in the bars, say by increasing the blue cut control, you can get the bars more "neutral", but by that time, the picture is bright blue! A fullscreen pluge pattern does not seem to have any excessive tinting. If I bring up an unused input, the tint can be seen, but if you bring up the white balance controls, no amount of adjusting will change the tint in any amount on the unused input black screen. To me the tint appears to be a panel "problem" as opposed to a white balance adjustment "problem". Then again, I am most likely incorrect and would hope someone with real knowledge can come up with a cause.

Before I noticed the tint, I had not noticed the small bars on 1.85 movies, now on certain dark scenes you can see a distinct light reddish small letterbox bar. I have taken to turning on the panel and letting it settle down through it's three levels before turning on my 7000PAL and this seems to help (most likely fooling myself!). When the panel turns on, it shows a grey / black "solarized" blocky or blotchy pattern for a few seconds, then goes to a grey level, then I think darker grey, then to the black where you can see the tint. I also think the tint was less noticeable if I turned up the black level one click, but that makes the black level just a little bit too high.

At least my ticket was opened with Pioneer Canada when I had some time on my warranty (down to days!), so if we come up with a fix, I may be able to get it covered....I hope.... Still a great picture and I try to ignore the letterbox bars in dark scenes, but once you see it.....

P.E.Hannon

Sad that Pioneer is stonewalling you on this. Someone in the company has to be aware of this and what the fix is. I suspect it might be the panel and they don't want to pay for that. Weird that my sets start up blotches are reddish purple, but after it settles down it's the same as everyone elses.
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post #75 of 1117
9/24/11 at 7:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBuck View Post

Sad that Pioneer is stonewalling you on this. Someone in the company has to be aware of this and what the fix is. I suspect it might be the panel and they don't want to pay for that. Weird that my sets start up blotches are reddish purple, but after it settles down it's the same as everyone elses.

I'm trying to be reasonable here.

There are no perfect displays. All of them have problems. We can't expect Pioneer or any other company to fix everything.

I do have a subtle reddish tint on my 500m, but unless I look for it, I don't see it. It's a subtle problem that I'm sure many people have but aren't aware of because you have to be in a completely dark room to see it well, and I doubt Pioneer will do anything drastic about it.
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post #76 of 1117
9/24/11 at 10:32pm
I have an April 2009 500M and don't notice the problem. If there's a lamp on in the room, sometimes I notice the purplish tint from the AR filter but that's normal.

For the people with the problem, how about posting how many hours are on the set?
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post #77 of 1117
9/24/11 at 11:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by trem0lo View Post

I have an April 2009 500M and don't notice the problem. If there's a lamp on in the room, sometimes I notice the purplish tint from the AR filter but that's normal.

For the people with the problem, how about posting how many hours are on the set?

I probably have about 4000 hours on mine, but I did notice it a long time ago at around 1000 hours. I don't think it has gotten any worse.

The problem is so subtle that I doubt anyone will be able to take a picture of it.

You really have to pause on a black screen on a video mode in a pitch dark room to see it. It'd help if you were watching regular content for 1-2 hours beforehand too.
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post #78 of 1117
9/25/11 at 4:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trem0lo View Post

I have an April 2009 500M and don't notice the problem. If there's a lamp on in the room, sometimes I notice the purplish tint from the AR filter but that's normal.

For the people with the problem, how about posting how many hours are on the set?

Bought my 6020 set used at 2000 hours and it was noticeable. Now at about 3000 hours and no change.
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post #79 of 1117
9/25/11 at 9:00am
Signature Elite PRO 101FD manufactured on april 2009 bought as showroom display. currently about 10,000 hours. bought it about 2 weeks ago and immediately noticed the red tint on the right side.
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post #80 of 1117
9/25/11 at 10:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBuck View Post


Mine always has irregular reddish blobs on the initial startup screen before it drops to the next lower black level. Does anyone else see this behavior on their sets?

Yes, my does this but it is completely black with content.
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post #81 of 1117
9/28/11 at 1:12pm
My experience again (I related a version of this on the 500m Owner's Thread pt 2 recently).

KRP-500M. Purchased Nov 2009. Build date Jan 2009.

I've owned this for apx two years. No ISF patch or professional calibration. I have never checked the hours, and do not know how. For apx 2 years, I never noticed a red tint on black fields or any other problems with the set, and I did not know about the reddish-blacks phenomenon on Pioneers. Recently (1 month ago), I accidentally fried my 500m by dropping one of its external speaker wires onto a surge protector (a loud pop... following this, the tv would come on for only a moment, then I would get error message "sd05" and the TV shut would itself off). I had a local repair shop pick up and repair the set. I don't know exactly what they repaired, but I talked to the tech briefly on the phone, and he said that he was going to replace several components, including some boards. I don't remember which ones, but the receipt lists these two parts: "AWW1385 Audio I/O PCB" and "AWW1384 Digi PCB". I don't know what either of those are, but I think that 1384 is the main board.

When I got the 500m back, I noticed the reddish tint the first day: A faint red tint on letterbox bars and blank screens. It's most noticeable on the lower right-hand side. It's important to note that I was consciously searching for flaws--something that I hadn't done since 2009--so it is possible that the red tint developed before the accident/repair, and that I'm just noticing it now. But I really don't remember it being there before. My memory is that, before the repair, the blacks were very, very dark grey, and that it was very hard to discern the distinction between the bezel and the letterbox bars unless there was no content on screen. Now, I can see the letterbox bars out of the corner of my eye on dimly-lit content, and they glow red. VERY subtle, and I can live with it (still so much better than my p50g10, which was pro calibrated!), but it is interesting.

So--is it possible that one of the parts listed above is responsible for my set's "rosy glow"?
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post #82 of 1117
9/28/11 at 1:25pm
Thread Starter 
Good information to know. Have you told the repair place about the reddish tint to the blacks? If not you should tell them and see if they have come across that before or have them swap out the boards again because it sounds like one of those is the problem. Anyone know what those two part numbers are?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blaken134 View Post

My experience again (I related a version of this on the 500m Owner's Thread pt 2 recently).

KRP-500M. Purchased Nov 2009. Build date Jan 2009.

I've owned this for apx two years. No ISF patch or professional calibration. I have never checked the hours, and do not know how. For apx 2 years, I never noticed a red tint on black fields or any other problems with the set, and I did not know about the reddish-blacks phenomenon on Pioneers. Recently (1 month ago), I accidentally fried my 500m by dropping one of its external speaker wires onto a surge protector (a loud pop... following this, the tv would come on for only a moment, then I would get error message "sd05" and the TV shut would itself off). I had a local repair shop pick up and repair the set. I don't know exactly what they repaired, but I talked to the tech briefly on the phone, and he said that he was going to replace several components, including some boards. I don't remember which ones, but the receipt lists these two parts: "AWW1385 Audio I/O PCB" and "AWW1384 Digi PCB". I don't know what either of those are, but I think that 1384 is the main board.

When I got the 500m back, I noticed the reddish tint the first day: A faint red tint on letterbox bars and blank screens. It's most noticeable on the lower right-hand side. It's important to note that I was consciously searching for flaws--something that I hadn't done since 2009--so it is possible that the red tint developed before the accident/repair, and that I'm just noticing it now. But I really don't remember it being there before. My memory is that, before the repair, the blacks were very, very dark grey, and that it was very hard to discern the distinction between the bezel and the letterbox bars unless there was no content on screen. Now, I can see the letterbox bars out of the corner of my eye on dimly-lit content, and they glow red. VERY subtle, and I can live with it (still so much better than my p50g10, which was pro calibrated!), but it is interesting.

So--is it possible that one of the parts listed above is responsible for my set's "rosy glow"?
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post #83 of 1117
9/28/11 at 2:50pm
So I checked my set again. There's a red tint to pre-initialized blank input screen, but nothing a pure black slide being fed to it (ie initialized signal) shows up as black and I see nothing with any actual content on.

Hopefully it stays where it is.
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post #84 of 1117
9/29/11 at 2:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac13 View Post

Anyone know what those two part numbers are?

AWW1385 - Is the I/O board which houses the speaker connections and serial port.

AWW1384 - Is the main PCB which houses the HDMI, DVI etc. connectors and the IC's

I can dig out some diagrams later if its going to help anyone.
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post #85 of 1117
10/3/11 at 10:17pm
So does the warranty cover the turn to red? Or are we SOL. I bought my 500m from VE with the extended warranty.
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post #86 of 1117
10/3/11 at 10:56pm
What a extended warranty will do. All depends Company who actually issues the policy, and no, VE was only the seller of the policy and is not the issuer, and also on the terms of the policy you bought. So it looks like the best thing for you to do to find out, is take out the copy of the info and terms of the policy you bought, and from that then find out who and what you would need to do to call/contact to set up a service appointment.
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post #87 of 1117
10/9/11 at 6:23am
I just had my 1150 re-calibrated. It still see some reddish tint in the black bars of a letterbox movie. The calibrator said that it calibrated reasonably well but not as well as it used to...it's grey scale tracking was harder to nail down.

Does the attached look troublesome? I'm not sure how visible this is.
LL
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post #88 of 1117
10/12/11 at 10:43am
Ive got a 508XD,not sure what the US equivalent would be.Its got around 13000 hours on it,not been used for gaming,contrast levels have always been low.

Have become aware over the last 6 months or so of the red blacks,especially when watching in darkness.Thankfully i have an extended 5 year warranty,so im going to persue the retailer initially,will keep you all posted.

Really dont want to have to change this set as its still up there,despite being 4 years old.........
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post #89 of 1117
10/12/11 at 12:29pm
I have the 5080HD with a VideoEQ to fix the color gamut. (yep, I can get the color errors below 1% except for blue which is 2%.) I also see the red tint on black. I can eliminate the red with the VideoEQ's grayscale controls. I use a 10% window pattern and slowly adjust the red down. If I reduce red too much the screen appears greenish. (Maybe I should have increased blue instead.)

Anyway, I decided to correct the color gamut and leave the grayscale as is with the red. I was frustrated with the grayscale readings using my meter at those low levels. With perfect colors, the redish black did not bother me.

I will try it again this weekend to see if I can eliminate the red without impacting the rest of the picture. I might try to eye ball it. I am not sure if it is too much red or too little blue that is causing this problem at 0-10%.
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post #90 of 1117
10/12/11 at 12:31pm
Had my first real noticeable brush with purple/red clouding the other night. Watching Deathly Hallows Part I on HBO with my 111, when the end credits started rolling the screen looked purplish around the edges instead of black. First time I've seen that.

With that being said, I haven't noticed it on BD's or on letterbox bars on broadcast movies. Maybe it's broadcast/signal-related?
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