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Official Pioneer Kuro Reddish Tint Problem Thread - Page 24

post #691 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlplover View Post

KRP-500 is overall a touch better than 111 since it is 9.5G, where 111 is 9G panel. Slightly better black level, less DSE typically, etc.. etc.. but no tuner because it's considered a monitor where 111 is a tv.



From my experience, it's a rock solid display. Black levels on mine are perfectly neutral even w/lights off. Yes, they are not perfectly black in a totally dark room, but closest you can get. With a small amount of light in the room, perceived black drops to 0 though. I have not noticed the set get any brighter/darker over time or develop any kind of tint. Pretty much darkest you can get without sacrificing shadow detail.

I still have an extended warranty on mine (not through Pio), but I would check the set out in person and make sure there's nothing wrong with it. Even if it's under warranty from Pio direct, it sounds like there's a good chance they wouldn't cover red tint or similar defects that don't prevent the set from working. And my general impression is that people looking to sell probably are people who've got some defect that developed since it'd be kind of irrational to sell one unless you really wanted a 3D display badly, needed money, or similar considerations. For instance, I see one listed on fleabay right now, but it has an annoying hot pixel that the seller is likely downplaying (assuming it's the only thing slightly off).

If you do buy the one you found, make sure to check thoroughly for IR (kuros tend to be quite resistant, but again be careful so you don't get had) and also make sure they can provide a copy of the original receipt. Buying a stolen set is never a good idea (not to mention immoral) and I think there's a number of kuro owners who might take the effort to hunt down their set to reclaim so it's a good idea to make sure you're getting legit used rather than hot merchandise.

Thanks for the info, its in a warehouse with alot of other displays, customer return or over stock that wasnt sold, hours verified with pic and have seen it on through pics. 14 day return policy as well. Wouldnt think it was a display with that little hours on it unless it was reset, but you would have to know how to do that and they probally dont. If it doesnt look defective why would someone want to return one of these especially since there were selling for cheap in the 1st place. Who knows why its there but its there. I bought my pdp5010 that way sitting in a warehouse with 2 others like it all in original boxes over stock from a costco cenetr that had to sell as shrink when ordered online. Its been a great display that I have had no trouble with since I bought it spring of 2010 for 8 franklins. I may pull the trigger on it since these are hard to find with minimal hours.
post #692 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by baron2 View Post

Thanks for the info, its in a warehouse with alot of other displays, customer return or over stock that wasnt sold, hours verified with pic and have seen it on through pics. 14 day return policy as well. Wouldnt think it was a display with that little hours on it unless it was reset, but you would have to know how to do that and they probally dont. If it doesnt look defective why would someone want to return one of these especially since there were selling for cheap in the 1st place. Who knows why its there but its there. I bought my pdp5010 that way sitting in a warehouse with 2 others like it all in original boxes over stock from a costco cenetr that had to sell as shrink when ordered online. Its been a great display that I have had no trouble with since I bought it spring of 2010 for 8 franklins. I may pull the trigger on it since these are hard to find with minimal hours.

I was talking about buying from individuals. If you're buying overstock, then you're probably ok.
post #693 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlplover View Post

I was talking about buying from individuals. If you're buying overstock, then you're probably ok.

Sorry about that I wasnt clear in my message. I got the I want something bigger bug a month back but didnt want something made after 2009, not a fan of the ultra slim display, IMO slim displays ( not including pio monitors ) equals quality componet issues, could be an ignorant staement on my part though. I found a new samsung pn58b650 with the bezel stickers on it from same place as the 500m for 8 franklins and was ready to pull the trigger when he mentioned the 500m. Totally threw a wrench into my plans. Hard to think about looking at anything other than a Kuro after having them for awhile now, but the 58b650 had a nice price and great color but lacking the black level.
post #694 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by baron2 View Post


Do you have the KRP500A or KRP500M

Hi baron2

I have a hybrid European Kuro. I have got the LX5090H. It is a cross between the regular LX5090 but it has some of the KRP500A tech in it.

I believe performance wise it is the same as the LX5090 but has the same menu system, MPEG4 compatability and satellite receiver as seen in the KRP500A.
post #695 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by KuroMike View Post

Hi baron2

I have a hybrid European Kuro. I have got the LX5090H. It is a cross between the regular LX5090 but it has some of the KRP500A tech in it.

I believe performance wise it is the same as the LX5090 but has the samemenu system, MPEG4 compatability and satellite receiver as seen in the KRP500A.

Thanks KuroMike
post #696 of 2557
Quote:


Originally Posted by Majestyk
So are there two different red tint issues being discussed here? One that happens over time (phosphor age?) on a fair percentage of sets, and one that is a factory (software?) error on a very small percentage of sets?

Quote:


No.

So then you are stating that there is only one reason and that is calibration error, by the factory. In which case these people from Pioneer, who are stating "normal panel age", are mistaken or lying.
post #697 of 2557
I think that we need a better understanding of the following:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=455

This is what I think (and hope) I have been confusing for a genuine red tinted blacks issue. This is what I believe that the Pioneer rep was explaining on the phone when the engineer was at mine yesterday.

So potentially could have been indirectly discussing two different types of red issue. The genuine one, and one where people see what is normal for the TV?
post #698 of 2557
Just noticed that the link isn't working.

The link is originally on page 41
post #699 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by KuroMike View Post

Hi baron2

I have a hybrid European Kuro. I have got the LX5090H. It is a cross between the regular LX5090 but it has some of the KRP500A tech in it.

I believe performance wise it is the same as the LX5090 but has the same menu system, MPEG4 compatability and satellite receiver as seen in the KRP500A.

If my memory serves me correctly, only 500-M, and Elite 101 have the "9,5"-blacks.
post #700 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by surap View Post

If my memory serves me correctly, only 500-M, and Elite 101 have the "9,5"-blacks.

correct.
post #701 of 2557
Picked a used 111fd, no red tint.
post #702 of 2557
Has Pioneer made any official fix, or has they address the problem you guys are having? I sold my 600M, and having major regrets on doing so. I never had any red tint problem, and thinking of it could have had my Pio for at least 2 or 3 more years. Anyway hope you guys get a fix quick.

DJoel
post #703 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djoel View Post

Has Pioneer made any official fix, or has they address the problem you guys are having? I sold my 600M, and having major regrets on doing so. I never had any red tint problem, and thinking of it could have had my Pio for at least 2 or 3 more years. Anyway hope you guys get a fix quick.

DJoel

No they haven't and I doubt they will. My friend has it on his set and he backed out of a deal to sell it mainly because there is nothing better to purchase right now. He was thinking about an Elite LCD but couldn't justify it after already owning a Kuro (that's payed for), even with the red tint issue. Plus he would have had to shell out quite a bit of money on top of what he got for his used Kuro just to purchase the Elite.

It's annoying Pioneer won't acknowledge it as a fault but at least it isn't as obvious as clouding/flashlights on LCD's. I noticed the red tint on my friend's set a bit on the top and bottom (mainly on the right side of his screen) in a pitch black room on certain dark scenes in movies. If I go up to his screen and focus on the top right corner (a few inches away), I can see a red glow towards the bezel. I normally watch movies with a lamp on so if my set has it or eventually gets it (I haven't checked yet honestly), I know it wouldn't affect my viewing very much.

I will use mine for at least another year and a half (that's about when my warranty is up) and then move on. I doubt OLED will be affordable by then in a 60" or greater size so I may have to look at a 2nd/3rd gen Elite LCD. Then again those will be expensive regardless . I just wish LCD wasn't lagging so far behind in regards to uniformity on the screen, black level's, etc. The Elite LCD is the first LCD I have seen that gives plasma's a run for their money. I can't justify it either considering I already have a Kuro. It might be where I am heading though if OLED doesn't mature fast enough. I have some time before I have to make that decision though.
post #704 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by YOTR View Post

No they haven't and I doubt they will. My friend has it on his set and he backed out of a deal to sell it mainly because there is nothing better to purchase right now. He was thinking about an Elite LCD but couldn't justify it after already owning a Kuro (that's payed for), even with the red tint issue. Plus he would have had to shell out quite a bit of money on top of what he got for his used Kuro just to purchase the Elite.

It's annoying Pioneer won't acknowledge it as a fault but at least it isn't as obvious as clouding/flashlights on LCD's. I noticed the red tint on my friend's set a bit on the top and bottom (mainly on the right side of his screen) in a pitch black room on certain dark scenes in movies. If I go up to his screen and focus on the top right corner (a few inches away), I can see a red glow towards the bezel. I normally watch movies with a lamp on so if my set has it or eventually gets it (I haven't checked yet honestly), I know it wouldn't affect my viewing very much.

I will use mine for at least another year and a half (that's about when my warranty is up) and then move on. I doubt OLED will be affordable by then in a 60" or greater size so I may have to look at a 2nd/3rd gen Elite LCD. Then again those will be expensive regardless . I just wish LCD wasn't lagging so far behind in regards to uniformity on the screen, black level's, etc. The Elite LCD is the first LCD I have seen that gives plasma's a run for their money. I can't justify it either considering I already have a Kuro. It might be where I am heading though if OLED doesn't mature fast enough. I have some time before I have to make that decision though.



Well that plain out sucks big time, allot people purchase these Pdp in droves out of faith pretty much. I do hope they're still concidering finding a fix, though..This might bite them on their asses later down the road.

I was pretty much in your same situation, but decide on selling. Now I'm suppose to get Samsugn 64" 7000 series, hope I like as much as my last two Pio.
I thought of the Elite too, but wasn't too sure of having an LCD no matter how much hype it was getting. After selling my Pio I wasn't too far from the Elite 60" but thought of living conservative not just living big this time around.

Good luck and here's to Pioneer doing the right thing sooner rather than later.

DJoel
post #705 of 2557
Pioneer should just state that there is a problem. I would atleast want to know what caused this then to keep me in the dark by telling me this is normal. This is not good business on their part and it makes me think twice about buying any other product from them ever again.
post #706 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djoel View Post

Well that plain out sucks big time, allot people purchase these Pdp in droves out of faith pretty much. I do hope they're still concidering finding a fix, though..This might bite them on their asses later down the road.

I was pretty much in your same situation, but decide on selling. Now I'm suppose to get Samsugn 64" 7000 series, hope I like as much as my last two Pio.
I thought of the Elite too, but wasn't too sure of having an LCD no matter how much hype it was getting. After selling my Pio I wasn't too far from the Elite 60" but thought of living conservative not just living big this time around.

Good luck and here's to Pioneer doing the right thing sooner rather than later.

DJoel

I totally understand. I actually almost sold mine about a year ago. As I started looking though, I became frustrated because not one manufacturer came close to the Kuro's. If I could afford the Sharp Elite LCD, I would consider it. At the same time though, I am not a big fan of LCD's in general plus the price of the Elite scares me, lol. After selling my Kuro, I would still be a couple thousand away which is something I could never justify even if I was a hardcore videophile . I figure I will just keep my almost 2 year old Kuro (2 years in April) and see what the market holds in the future.

I am sure you will be happy with the Samsung but I became really spoiled by the lack of image retention in the Kuro's especially for games. It's nice not having to baby a plasma when it comes to viewing content. Samsung does a good job but it's not like the Kuro (at least in my opinion).
post #707 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingd View Post

Pioneer should just state that there is a problem. I would atleast want to know what caused this then to keep me in the dark by telling me this is normal. This is not good business on their part and it makes me think twice about buying any other product from them ever again.

I feel the same. I will think twice before I buy another product from them and yes that includes the Sharp Elite LCD line (pretty much the same engineers from what I have read so might as well be from Pioneer).

I do think they should acknowledge and fix it but I am not holding my breath. I honestly could tolerate it on my friends set but as I stated a few posts above I rarely watch movies in complete darkness and any type of light on in the room literally hides any sort of red tint your eyes might see. It wasn't even obvious to me in a completely dark room (except for scenes that were also completely dark). In fact if he had not pointed it out to me, I probably wouldn't have noticed it for quite awhile. It's there, it's just not overpowering. It still is defect/issue but I just don't see Pioneer stepping up to the plate to fix it.
post #708 of 2557
Pioneer is probably not going to fix it, but the problem is the reddish/purplish tint might just get worse over time. Its not faint on my set. I will probably get another set when something better comes around but others might not have that option to get another set. These panels wasn't cheap, if it was then most of us would just write it off as a lose and just move on. But since I consider this a defect, they should address it as such.
post #709 of 2557
Pioneer say that any subtle red tint that you can see in a room with no lights on when there is little bright content on screen is normal and is just how the technology works. I rang them again today (despite having an engineer round last Friday) and was told the same thing again. I guess I wasn't convinced after the visit and needed to hear it again.

We know that Kuro's cannot do perfect blacks in low light conditions as there will always be some residual glow, it seems that this glow has a hint of purple/red in it.

If you are experiencing the same as me, then you do not see the red hint when there is any sort proper light in the picture. It's only when things are gloomy. Even then, it is when your eyes adapt to that particular dark scene.

The more you look for it, the worse it seems. It's annoying when you do notice it so you gotta try not to look.
post #710 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by KuroMike View Post

Pioneer say that any subtle red tint that you can see in a room with no lights on when there is little bright content on screen is normal and is just how the technology works. I rang them again today (despite having an engineer round last Friday) and was told the same thing again. I guess I wasn't convinced after the visit and needed to hear it again.

We know that Kuro's cannot do perfect blacks in low light conditions as there will always be some residual glow, it seems that this glow has a hint of purple/red in it.

If you are experiencing the same as me, then you do not see the red hint when there is any sort proper light in the picture. It's only when things are gloomy. Even then, it is when your eyes adapt to that particular dark scene.

The more you look for it, the worse it seems. It's annoying when you do notice it so you gotta try not to look.



That's pretty much what my friend's looks like. If I get close to the screen and stare at the upper right area (near the bezel) or below on the bottom, I can see a subtle red glow. It honestly looks like it is coming from the frame/bezel (I can see more concentrated red tint right next to the bezel versus going towards the middle of the screen).
post #711 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by YOTR View Post

I totally understand. I actually almost sold mine about a year ago. As I started looking though, I became frustrated because not one manufacturer came close to the Kuro's. If I could afford the Sharp Elite LCD, I would consider it. At the same time though, I am not a big fan of LCD's in general plus the price of the Elite scares me, lol. After selling my Kuro, I would still be a couple thousand away which is something I could never justify even if I was a hardcore videophile . I figure I will just keep my almost 2 year old Kuro (2 years in April) and see what the market holds in the future.

I am sure you will be happy with the Samsung but I became really spoiled by the lack of image retention in the Kuro's especially for games. It's nice not having to baby a plasma when it comes to viewing content. Samsung does a good job but it's not like the Kuro (at least in my opinion).

Elite brand has some input from Pio, but it is different tech and it's owned by Sharp. I feel that if Pioneer were still in the plasma business they would probably fix people's sets who have this issue, but even discounting that their fail rate was 2% if I recall correctly, lower than any of their competitors. I would really push for them to fix it under warranty if you still are within range. Put in something with the better business bureau and see if it kick starts anything.
post #712 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlplover View Post

Elite brand has some input from Pio, but it is different tech and it's owned by Sharp. I feel that if Pioneer were still in the plasma business they would probably fix people's sets who have this issue, but even discounting that their fail rate was 2% if I recall correctly, lower than any of their competitors. I would really push for them to fix it under warranty if you still are within range. Put in something with the better business bureau and see if it kick starts anything.

Good point. My friend has already called a couple of times and had a tech out (like KuroMike). They stated it was normal for the plasma to exhibit this slight red tint and that it was not a defect. Now I think that's a load of bull but it's apparent that Pioneer is not going to do anything. It seems that once they left the tv business so did hope of good support (even though it shouldn't matter because people still have a warranty). I agree though that if they were still making displays, they would probably at least look into it the problem.

I will mention the BBB option to him. It's at least worth a shot. He is still happy with his set and turned down a really good offer for it last week. He simply couldn't find anything that matched what he had, even considering the red tint on his set.
post #713 of 2557
Got a guy from my local store un the UK to look at my LX5090, unfortunately they are taking it away tomorrow to be looked at. No engineer visit unfortunatly!!

I'm not liking the Idea to say the least!!

But we'll see where it leads, as I want my TV back regardless I'll send it with a Note telling them to do the panel reset procedure regardless, a new panel would be good .
post #714 of 2557
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnarok666 View Post

Got a guy from my local store un the UK to look at my LX5090, unfortunately they are taking it away tomorrow to be looked at. No engineer visit unfortunatly!!

I'm not liking the Idea to say the least!!

But we'll see where it leads, as I want my TV back regardless I'll send it with a Note telling them to do the panel reset procedure regardless, a new panel would be good .


Ya I think I would be a little nervous having them take the display.

Just an update on the tech coming out to my house to install the "software update" that mascior had talked about. The tech had scheduled a day to come out but said he had to get in touch with Pioneer to obtain the update for my TV. He called back and said that their site was down and he had to wait for it to come back up because he didn't see the update for the 500M on there. He called a few days later and said that there isn't actually an update for the 500M which means he won't be coming out to check out my TV unforunately. Oh well, I guess I will just have to live with the TV or get into the service menu myself and try some of the tweaks that others have done.
post #715 of 2557
I put on the Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince that the OP stated he sees it, I do not..I am using a PIO Elite 05 player..tv 111FD,is in Pure mode..dot by dot...05 is in professional mode..with resolution set to auto....I have to do another check with my OPPO player later too, so far so good

turned off all light in room and put my nose to the screen and changed to different scenes too


no problem using OPPO 83 either
post #716 of 2557
What was D-Nice gathering data for about how people with the red tint used their kuros? Is he going to do something with it?
post #717 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by gene9p View Post

I put on the Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince that the OP stated he sees it, I do not..I am using a PIO Elite 05 player..tv 111FD,is in Pure mode..dot by dot...05 is in professional mode..with resolution set to auto....I have to do another check with my OPPO player later too, so far so good

turned off all light in room and put my nose to the screen and changed to different scenes too


no problem using OPPO 83 either

By any chance do you have Deathly Hallows 1? At the end credits, I noticed quite a bit of red/purple clouding while watching on Fios cable. I don't have the BD to check, but it was a surprisingly front and center for me. Every now and then I'll notice a bit of purple tinge but I think that's normal, but nothing like this.
post #718 of 2557
my practice, when watching a show or movie and then pausing, is to turn my set off if i am going to be away for more than 10-15 minutes to avoid burn in.

could this be worsening the reddish blacks issues? i notice some reddish discoloration issues in the center of the screen on start up which disappears once the set comes back on. haven't noticed reddish blacks on the edges of a dark scene, but haven't really looked for it.

any correlation between frequency of on/off cycles and worsening of the reddish blacks?
post #719 of 2557
Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

What was D-Nice gathering data for about how people with the red tint used their kuros? Is he going to do something with it?

+1
Why was he asking, that was more than six weeks ago.
post #720 of 2557
Well Richer sounds chosen repair company in my area ( Les Preston) did nothing at all. all i got was my Tv taken away for 2 weeks.

Edit, Richer sound still seem to care and are chatting to some more engineers on my behalf not just my local one.
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