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Cheapest videocard for MadVR? - Page 3

post #61 of 111
8/19/12 at 10:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMGNYC View Post

If one is using software decoding, what is the minimum CPU recommended? I have problems with a few movies where CPU is getting up into the 90's during certain passages (e.g. Avatar) and am getting dropped frames galore. I've only an E4500 and an ATI 5570.

Sorry to bump this, but I'm thinking of a new build and really don't understand fully how the CPU and video card really affect madVR/LAV and how.
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post #62 of 111
8/19/12 at 3:55pm
What's your build list?

You can run MadVR if you want with an iGPU/CPU not using a discrete graphics card.
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post #63 of 111
8/19/12 at 4:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

NVidia cards have one big advantage: Custom resolutions. Other than that there's no disadvantage using ATI cards with madVR. Actually, playback in fullscreen exclusive mode is currently less problematic on ATI and Intel compared to NVidia, due to a nasty NVidia driver bug which has been there for ages. All those stupid tweak options in madVR are only there because NVidia makes smooth playback in fullscreen exclusive mode very difficult, unlike ATI. With NVidia you may have to tweak fullscreen exclusive settings a lot to get perfect results. With ATI, results are often perfect with default settings. However, I plan to report this problem to NVidia and hope to have it fixed sooner or later. Then NVidia will have the advantage again, thanks to custom resolutions. Don't really know why ATI doesn't offer something similar.
For what it’s worth, this has not been a problem for me since the 300 series of WHQL drivers from Nvidia with my GTX 570. The first time I tried playing back a video on a fresh install of Windows recently I was seeing presentation glitches, but after a few minutes that settled (I assume it was ReClock re-learning the system clock or something) and it has never had problems since.

That doesn’t necessarily mean that whatever the driver bug is, isn’t still there though, just that it has not been impacting me.


If you plan on building a system for more than just video playback (games) I would highly recommend Nvidia over AMD. Better performance per watt now too, I think?
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post #64 of 111
8/19/12 at 4:32pm
Why the ability of using custom resolutions is a plus? I don't use them today on my GT430, am I missing anything?

Also, what would be the MadVR recommended settings to achieve optimal playback in fullscreen exclusive mode (using NVidia GT430)?
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post #65 of 111
8/19/12 at 5:22pm
There isn't a benefit if you don't have a 24Hz or multiple thereof HDTV.
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post #66 of 111
8/19/12 at 6:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

What's your build list?
You can run MadVR if you want with an iGPU/CPU not using a discrete graphics card.

I haven't settled on either a CPU or GPU yet. I tend to think I want to stick with ATI despite their problems. Because of that I'm using Software Decoding in LAV Video and my CPU just doesn't seem up to it on certain passages in certain movies. So I guess my question is , using software decoding, what is the suggested minimum CPU/GPU combination?
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post #67 of 111
8/19/12 at 9:32pm
I have an e8400 clocked at 4gHz with a hd 6870 Radeon and using the suggested madvr settings from the advanced mpc hc set up guide my system is on the brink of cpu usage using either software or copy back.

1080i sources are unplayable unless I switch to just hardware decoding(eg mad vr turned off) 720p sources upscaled to 1080 are playable just with copy back or software.

The limiting factor is my cpu, so if I were you I'd forget about just a new graphics card and just go with one of the new cpus.
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post #68 of 111
8/19/12 at 9:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodgexander View Post

I have an e8400 clocked at 4gHz with a hd 6870 Radeon and using the suggested madvr settings from the advanced mpc hc set up guide my system is on the brink of cpu usage using either software or copy back.
1080i sources are unplayable unless I switch to just hardware decoding(eg mad vr turned off) 720p sources upscaled to 1080 are playable just with copy back or software.
The limiting factor is my cpu, so if I were you I'd forget about just a new graphics card and just go with one of the new cpus.
I’m surprised to hear that you are having decoding problems with that CPU—I had no problem with an E5200 clocked at 3.5GHz years ago.

That said, install LAV Filters and use DXVA decoding if your CPU can’t keep up. Your 6870 should be capable of handling that and madVR scaling.
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post #69 of 111
8/19/12 at 11:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

For what it’s worth, this has not been a problem for me since the 300 series of WHQL drivers from Nvidia with my GTX 570. The first time I tried playing back a video on a fresh install of Windows recently I was seeing presentation glitches, but after a few minutes that settled (I assume it was ReClock re-learning the system clock or something) and it has never had problems since.
That doesn’t necessarily mean that whatever the driver bug is, isn’t still there though, just that it has not been impacting me.
If you plan on building a system for more than just video playback (games) I would highly recommend Nvidia over AMD. Better performance per watt now too, I think?
I think the problem mainly (but not only) appears if display refresh rate is higher than movie frame rate. E.g. here in Europe 24fps/25fps on 50Hz is a very common setup for movie playback on TV. If you have a 1:1 match of refresh rate to frame rate, the problem occurs less often. But it still does occur for some people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by danbez View Post

Why the ability of using custom resolutions is a plus?
It just gives you flexibility. E.g. if with the standard 1080p24 mode you have a few frame drops in every movie, because the 1080p24 timing is slightly off, you can correct it by using custom resolutions. Custom resolutions can do custom timings, too.
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post #70 of 111
8/20/12 at 4:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMGNYC View Post

I haven't settled on either a CPU or GPU yet. I tend to think I want to stick with ATI despite their problems. Because of that I'm using Software Decoding in LAV Video and my CPU just doesn't seem up to it on certain passages in certain movies. So I guess my question is , using software decoding, what is the suggested minimum CPU/GPU combination?

I'm having trouble understanding this. First you say you haven't decided but then you say your CPU is under powered without stating what CPU it is. An i3-2100 or A6-3500 can handle MadVR for most sources. From what I've read the A6 actually does better.

This thread is full of GPU suggestions as that is what it is about. As far as CPU's you could get a G 620 if you're going to have a dedicated GPU,
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post #71 of 111
8/20/12 at 4:59am
Even a poor,old g210 can do the trick if what you play is 1080p@24 but the drivers face some problems with tv sets that don't support rgb full/limited video levels.On the other hand I tested a AMD 5770 and it couldn't perform without dropping a few frames.
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post #72 of 111
8/20/12 at 6:39am
You don't even need that if your not playing 29/30 fps content. I ran my i3-550 iGPU with MadVR for a while before adding a GT430 which, AFAIK, is the minimum card to handle this content with MadVR. The gt210 won't do it I believe. And as madishi already stated a fture version of MadVR he's working on will require even more processing power.
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post #73 of 111
8/20/12 at 6:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodgexander View Post

I have an e8400 clocked at 4gHz with a hd 6870 Radeon and using the suggested madvr settings from the advanced mpc hc set up guide my system is on the brink of cpu usage using either software or copy back.
1080i sources are unplayable unless I switch to just hardware decoding(eg mad vr turned off) 720p sources upscaled to 1080 are playable just with copy back or software.
The limiting factor is my cpu, so if I were you I'd forget about just a new graphics card and just go with one of the new cpus.
I’m surprised to hear that you are having decoding problems with that CPU—I had no problem with an E5200 clocked at 3.5GHz years ago.

That said, install LAV Filters and use DXVA decoding if your CPU can’t keep up. Your 6870 should be capable of handling that and madVR scaling.

The dxva option for AMD cards doesn't use madvr scaling asfaik from the stickied thread. only copy back and that struggles with 1080I. Everything else runs fine. With just dxva the gpu handles everything fine. Since 1080I is the native resolution then it doesn't really matter, but it's annoying having to switch between dxva and copy back just for one source resolution.
Sent from my Blade S using Tapatalk 2
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post #74 of 111
8/20/12 at 6:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

I'm having trouble understanding this. First you say you haven't decided but then you say your CPU is under powered without stating what CPU it is. An i3-2100 or A6-3500 can handle MadVR for most sources. From what I've read the A6 actually does better.
This thread is full of GPU suggestions as that is what it is about. As far as CPU's you could get a G 620 if you're going to have a dedicated GPU,

Sorry about not being clear. In my original post I stated I have an E4500 @2.2Ghz and an ATI 5570. I like ATI generally despite their problems but think DXVA/DXVA Copyback is somewhat lacking and prefer software decoding. However my E4500 is falling short in some instances and my decode queue drops causing a period of a couple hundred frame drops in a 5-10 second period.

So, I want to upgrade to a new build. Since I want to stick with ATI I will probably continue to use software decoding as DXVA/DXVA Copyback is likely to continue not being ideal. So, is an i3-2100 enough of a bump to future proof my new build for a while or should I up it to an i5 or i7? Even with software decoding the GPU is used of course. I would take the recomendations from Madshi on that and go with a 7750 or 7850. It's the CPU that I'm still unsure about.
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post #75 of 111
8/20/12 at 7:03am
The i3 is fine for almost all content using MadVR. As I said, I have read but do not have personal knowledge, that the A6 does an even better job with MadVR.. both w/o a discrete GPU. Go that route and upgrade to a dicrete GPU later if you find you need it.
Edited by Sammy2 - 8/20/12 at 7:21am
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post #76 of 111
8/20/12 at 7:14am
I took a look at the Nvidia 660Ti and saw that it is a PCI Express 3.0 card. My motherboard is a 2009 Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P with PCI Express slots conforming to the 2.0 standard. I do not know enough about PCI Express 3.0 to understand if there is a performance penalty when putting it in a motherboard expansion slot the manual says support the 2.0 standard.

I am currently using a Nvidia 440 1GB GDDR5 to a 1080p/60 plasma and I think the picture I'm getting is better than any I have gotten previously.

Would I get my money's worth to go to the 660Ti for home theater use with no gaming?
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post #77 of 111
8/20/12 at 7:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postmoderndesign View Post

I took a look at the Nvidia 660Ti and saw that it is a PCI Express 3.0 card. My motherboard is a 2009 Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P with PCI Express slots conforming to the 2.0 standard. I do not know enough about PCI Express 3.0 to understand if there is a performance penalty when putting it in a motherboard expansion slot the manual says support the 2.0 standard.
I am currently using a Nvidia 440 1GB GDDR5 to a 1080p/60 plasma and I think the picture I'm getting is better than any I have gotten previously.
Would I get my money's worth to go to the 660Ti for home theater use with no gaming?

That was my impression with the GT 430 too. Better color space and deeper blacks.
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post #78 of 111
8/20/12 at 8:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

The i3 is fine for almost all content using MadVR. As I said, I have read but do not have personal knowledge, that the A6 does an even better job with MadVR.. both w/o a discrete GPU. Go that route and upgrade to a dicrete GPU later if you find you need it.

Are you using the i3 with Quicksync in LAV or software decoding?
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post #79 of 111
8/20/12 at 8:38am
I have a first generation i3. Quicksync doesn't work with it AFAIK. Plus by the time Quicksinc came out (or I became even aware if it most likely), I was already using a GT 430 because I have 720p29/30 content that the i3 could not handle with MadVR although it can handle it within WMC or even MB and/or MPC-HC without MadVR.
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post #80 of 111
8/20/12 at 8:58am
Further research seems to indicate that there will not be a noticable penalty for using a PCI Express 3.0 card in a motherboard supporting the 2.0 standard.

I don't think my Core Duo processor makes a difference since I am using madVR, LAV and cuvid and having the graphics card do the processing.

This leaves me with a question for Madshi which is: Is it worth replacing the 440 1GB GDDR5 with the 660Ti for home theater at 1080p/60?
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post #81 of 111
8/20/12 at 9:17am
Can the iGPU 6530D ( and A6-3500) run 3d with MadVR well? Do I need to buy another Video card for madVr+LaV decoder setings ( no hardware accerleration) ?
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post #82 of 111
8/20/12 at 10:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodgexander View Post

The dxva option for AMD cards doesn't use madvr scaling asfaik from the stickied thread. only copy back and that struggles with 1080I. Everything else runs fine. With just dxva the gpu handles everything fine. Since 1080I is the native resolution then it doesn't really matter, but it's annoying having to switch between dxva and copy back just for one source resolution.
That looks to be old information. I have an Nvidia card, but DXVA (native) was introduced after that guide was written, and works perfectly with madVR here. (though I use CUVID, as it gives you more control)

Copyback is more CPU intensive than DXVA Native.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postmoderndesign View Post

Further research seems to indicate that there will not be a noticable penalty for using a PCI Express 3.0 card in a motherboard supporting the 2.0 standard.
I don't think my Core Duo processor makes a difference since I am using madVR, LAV and cuvid and having the graphics card do the processing.
This leaves me with a question for Madshi which is: Is it worth replacing the 440 1GB GDDR5 with the 660Ti for home theater at 1080p/60?
PCI-E 3.0 is really only a benefit for people running multiple GPUs in the same system with very demanding tasks.

A 660Ti will likely handle anything you can throw at it as far as video playback is concerned.
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post #83 of 111
8/20/12 at 2:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

That looks to be old information. I have an Nvidia card, but DXVA (native) was introduced after that guide was written, and works perfectly with madVR here. (though I use CUVID, as it gives you more control)
A 660Ti will likely handle anything you can throw at it as far as video playback is concerned.

A 660Ti is a GTX670 with 25% less memory bandwith. It is a massive overkill for a non-gaming HTPC.
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post #84 of 111
8/21/12 at 4:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kesawi View Post

A 660Ti is a GTX670 with 25% less memory bandwith. It is a massive overkill for a non-gaming HTPC.
There's a big gap in the Kepler lineup at the moment between the GDDR3 GT640 and the gaming cards. The sweetspot will be the next GDDR5 card up from the GT640. Several rumours about a release next month. Sadly didn't appear in August.
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post #85 of 111
8/21/12 at 8:49am
But if you select dxva native in madvr it doesn't use mad vr scaling, just the scaling set in AMD ccc. You need copyback to use the madvr scaling.

I guess a nvidia cuvid compatible video card would the best bet. If you don't want to a new cpu.

Sent from my Blade S using Tapatalk 2
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post #86 of 111
8/21/12 at 9:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodgexander View Post

But if you select dxva native in madvr it doesn't use mad vr scaling, just the scaling set in AMD ccc. You need copyback to use the madvr scaling.
If you are using LAV Video, that is not accurate.

It should be really easy to see whether this is the case, simply by playing a low resolution video fullscreen and changing the madVR luma scaling between nearest neighbour and softcubic 100.
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post #87 of 111
8/21/12 at 12:16pm
Is there a link somewhere for newer test builds of madvr? I want to see what the anti-ringing algorithm does.

Thanks
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post #88 of 111
8/28/12 at 9:02pm
This is a really interesting thread so I'm going to send it TTT with this question:

What effect does memory bandwidth have on madvr rendering? i.e. All else being equal, will a GDDR5 GT 640 have any performance benefits over the GDDR3 version?
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post #89 of 111
8/28/12 at 9:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postmoderndesign View Post

Further research seems to indicate that there will not be a noticable penalty for using a PCI Express 3.0 card in a motherboard supporting the 2.0 standard.
I don't think my Core Duo processor makes a difference since I am using madVR, LAV and cuvid and having the graphics card do the processing.
This leaves me with a question for Madshi which is: Is it worth replacing the 440 1GB GDDR5 with the 660Ti for home theater at 1080p/60?

Are you having any performance problems with the 440, do you game? If not, then no. If buying new today I would get at least a 640, and a 660 if gaming.
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post #90 of 111
9/14/12 at 4:58am
Just to let you guys know: It seems that NVidia has finally fixed the presentation glitch problem in their latest WHQL drivers:

http://www.geforce.com/drivers/results/48847#

It seems madVR with default settings now runs fine without any presentation glitches (except at the very start of the video) with these new NVidia drivers. Thanks a bunch to NVidia for fixing this!!!
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