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Bass Down Low – Build 2.Owe

post #1 of 40
Thread Starter 
In 2007 I added an addition to my house. When I built this addition I decided to spend extra time and money to dig a basement for its foundation so that someday I could build a dedicated theater. Over the following years I bought all the gear I needed to have a pretty decent setup. Last year I decided to take it to the next level and finish the space. A couple weeks after calling it done (May this year) my sump pump failed allowing a couple inches of water in the space. I ripped the floor out and was able to save the walls. Since that time it has been usable, but I am again looking to make this space killer.
So here is what I’ve done so far.
Added basement to the house

Build from above:

Build from Projector Screen

Final Room from the initial construction; it remained unfinished until last year even though I setup the equipment and used it. Again, this picture is from where the projector screen is located.

Entrance to the basement:

Final from outside

Now for the build 1.0

Acquired the following equipment initially:
IN82 Infocus 1080p projector
106” 16 X 9 Da-Lite projection screen
Klipsch rf7 (mains), RC7 (Center), RS7 (Surrounds)
Polk 12” powered subwoofer (model?)
Polk Rear Surrounds (model? – actually older fronts just used as backs)
Tivo HD
Integra DTR5.9

The picture looked and sounded great. I went from sitting in a lawn chair in the basement to some initial home theater chairs I picked up on Craigslist.
I had plenty of leftover lumber from the original addition that I stored in my minibarn, but I knew I had to begin buying supplies to finish the basement. I found dri-core on clearance at Lowes and ended up cutting a deal with the manager for all of his remaining supplies. I purchased on Clearance from Lowes 10 boxes of Armstrong Knotty Pine laminate ceiling planks. I thought it would allow me to get a lodge feel in the room. So that is when I decided that the end theme would be a cabin/lodge look.

Specialty items I purchased for finishing:
.22 nail gun for shooting into the concrete
Rope light (blue) for soffit
LED Dimmer
Bread Knife
Kreg Tools and clamps
IR blaster
Pink Foam insulation
R19 for ceiling
Case of Green Glue
29 bags of sand
Pawn shop trips include: router, miter saw, sawzall
5 Boxes of CertaPro Commercial AcoustaBoard Black
Electrical outlets and other normal finishing products

I look forward to sharing more!
post #2 of 40
Thread Starter 
Build 1.0
Steps taken in the 1.0 build
1. Installed dri-core subfloor
2. Framed on top of the subfloor
3. Insulated the exterior walls
4. Installed R19 in the ceiling
5. Installed electrical and low voltage to the front. This included an IR blaster and LED rope light dimmer.
6. Dry wall – green glue – drywall
7. Installed stage using 2 X 10s (I think)
8. Curved step using hardy plank, not the right way to go in my mind. It broke in a couple places when I curved it.
9. Plastic sheathing installed in stage and then filled stage with playground sand
10. Built faux wall that included subwoofer enclosures on both ends. This allowed the subwoofers to go behind the front wall and the Front mains to be above the subwoofers.
11. Covered front wall with 2” Certainteed acoustical insulation – similar to what everyone uses here, I just found it on clearance locally and bought it all.
12. Built ceiling tray around entire room.
13. Dry walled side and rear walls including ceiling tray.
14. Hung black velvet fabric on front wall except in front of the speakers. Used speaker fabric for those areas. (Wish I would have painted the wood black prior to installing the fabric).
15. Painted
16. Built columns and stained
17. Installed trim
18. Carpeted
19. Built corner bass trap.
20. Moved in furniture
21. Watched NCAA tournament
22. Basement flooded
Here are some pictures. I want to be the first to go on record that I hate the colors. They’re not as bad in person, but it is pretty ugly. I will be correcting that in build 2.0 and look forward to getting everyone’s ideas on color.

Some additional pictures that are a little out of focus. They’re the best I’ve got though. I know everyone looks at a different detail so it can’t hurt to add them.

Post flood pictures:

post #3 of 40
Thread Starter 
Reserve again for future
post #4 of 40
Welcome! I am subscribing to this one...really looking forward to seeing how it turns out. Nice to have a brand new space!

post #5 of 40
Good luck with this, it's nice to begin with a blank canvas.
post #6 of 40
Thread Starter 
It was a blank canvass.
I finished round 1 and didn't like the color scheme, stage, or front fake wall. The sump pump broke causing about 3 inches of water to flood the entire basement. The carpet, subfloor and 29 bags of sand were removed. Actually the sand remained dry due to the plastic that I put inside the stage, so cleanup wasn't too bad.

I will post build 1.0 pictures soon to give everyone a reference point. 1.0 focused on function and I couldn't get the right look.
post #7 of 40
Originally Posted by longshorejl View Post

The sump pump broke causing about 3 inches of water to flood the entire basement.

Oh man, I did read that, obviously that really sucked. However, you do have the opportunity to tackle it again.

Keep us informed, and good luck.
post #8 of 40
reason 1 i need a better job
reason 2 i need to buy a house.
Good job so far! loving it
post #9 of 40
Thread Starter 
1.0 build photos added at the beginning of this thread.
post #10 of 40
Thread Starter 
Okay. I have 1.0 posted... time to move on to 2.0
Here is what I would like to do in no particular order.

Extend stage and replace front fake wall so that I can put my new pet monster (DTS-10) behind the wall. I'm sure I'll be asking you guys for ideas on placement of my new used sub. I would also like to add corner traps and hang a minimalist front wall. I plan to design this wall so that someday I can upgrade to 3D and Cinemascope. I don't need / want widescreen yet, I just want to be able to easily replace the screen when the time comes.
I would like to get a better "look" in this process as well. I may go the GOM route.

This weekend my main focus will be to get my new Behringer inuke 3000dsp wired correctly to the DTS-10. It was awesome last weekend when I gave the new Transformers blu-ray. However, I know there is a better way to wire these 2 up in bridge mode that might make it even better. The EQ recommendations on AVSForum worked like a champ! Oh quick question:

I have an Onkyo TX-NR709 with 7.2 hookup. So can I hook my existing power subwoofer to the LFE and the new amp/DTS-10 combo to the preout? Anybody do it this way?

post #11 of 40
Why do it like that? If it doesn't have dual LFE/sub outputs, then you split the one it does have. Perhaps I misunderstand.
post #12 of 40
Thread Starter 
I have a powered subwoofer that has an rca type connection wired through the walls. It is hooked up to the LFE. I purchased a passive subwoofer and a dedicated amp for it. I utilize the preout for the amp. Should I split the LFE or split the preout or leave the powered sub hooked to the LFE and the dedicated amp to the precut?
post #13 of 40
Thread Starter 
I had a chance to rewire and dial in the amp a little more this weekend. It is still not perfect and I need feedback on wiring and settings.
The amp is wired via male RCA to XLR 1' cable. The male RCA is plugged into the Onkyo TX-DS709 prepro subwoofer output. I have a powered subwoofer hooked directly to the LFE on the receiver. I did it this way so that when I'm not home the kids will still get bass, just not monster bass. (I turn the amp off in the equipment room)
I wired the DTS-10 and the Behringer NU3000DSP up in the following manner. Using a 4 conductor standard speakon cable I hooked up normal at the Subwoofer. I cut the other end back a foot to get access to the 4 conductors. I wired blue and red as normal to the +1 and -1 of a speakon connector. I wired up a second speakon connector to the black and white. I wired black and white to + and - 2. I hooked the first connector to channel A and the second connector to Channel B. I fired the amp up and entered the following settings through my laptop and the supplied usb(very easy).
Configuration: Bridge - This was the only change here. Note that I'm losing approx 10db from Input to Output (on the right). I would like to fix this!

Filter/Crossover: This is the one I played with the most. I am too much of a newbie to figure this out without more research. I think this is where I can close the Input output db gap. I had the high pass sets set to BW 20 hz at 48db (The amp wouldn't let me set it to 12 hz). I turned it off because I think the PEQ is doing this. Can anyone confirm my logic?

Parametric EQ:
I stole these settings directly off the AVS posts. This alone removed the rattle of the back wall.
Filter 1: -4.5db 29Hz
Filter 2: -8.5db 50Hz
Filter 3: -7.5db 84Hz
Filter 4: -14.5db 153.9Hz

Dynamic EQ: I changed nothing here. If I should, please let me know.

Setup: Saved settings as DTSEQd. DTS-10 settings are from last weekend when I ran as a bi-amp (incorrectly I think). This setting provided much more output than anything else.
post #14 of 40
Hey man. You need to adjust the "q" of your eq filters. This adjusts the bandwidth they affect. Yours are all set to 1 which is wide. The correct values should be listed. Q would be labeled as quality here.

After you set the eq make sure that you recalibrate the subwoofer channel level as you are doing a lot of cutting which will lower the overall volume.

We can probably fudge a 12hz highpass with the nuke. How many eq bands do you have available?
post #15 of 40
Thread Starter 
I'll do a search on the q to find proper settings.

By recalibrate the sub do you mean run audyssey in the Onkyo or just turning up the db gain in the Onkyo or something else.

I think I have 4 in the PEQ (3rd picture above). I have 2 DEQ (4th picture). I'm not using the filter/crossover (2nd picture).

Thanks for reviewing the setup!
post #16 of 40
Thread Starter 
Wierd... the software wouldn't let me change Q settings. Using the front panel of the inuke I dialed in the Q settings. An immediate upgrade in output. Incredibly better.

post #17 of 40
Thread Starter 
I had time to work on the theater this week, but a bad back kept me from making tons of progress.
I purchased a dremmel from a pawn shop. I used this to cut the old subfloor flush with the wall. This was a slow process, but it allowed me to get back in the groove.
Next I started to install the dri-core. This time I didn't use the levelers. My floor is pretty level and I noticed after the flood that water could get captured on top of the levelers. I didn't install all the way back just to behind the seating area. I'm trying to decide on riser...
I purchased an anamorphic lens this week. I've decided to go from a 54 x 96 screen to a 50 x 120 (or something close). I built a manual sled using 2 blocks of wood; 4 6 inch bolts; bunch of nuts and washers; and a heavy duty drawer track. I wrapped the entire assembly with black fabric and ceiling mounted in front of the projector. Picture looks immersive.
I purchased the wood necessary for the minimalist wall. I plan to build in front of my old wall before ripping it out.
I also am building a curved front screen and have the supplies less the actual screen for later this week.

I took a couple pictures, but trimming a wall down and installing dri-core is pretty straight forward. I'll share the manual sled picture later this week - I found this personally satisfying.

post #18 of 40
Thread Starter 
My next plan is to make a curved screen that is a 50 x 120 2.4 aspect ratio.

I plan to make it using a wood frame. The top and bottom will be affixed to a 1x6 that has the right curve cut into it. I plan to use a ton of pocket screws(kreg) to get it to hold the shape.

The big thing I'm worried about is how to stretch the screen. For noncurved it looks like everyone goes over the edges and staples to the top back of the frame. For a curved frame I think you would have to affix it to the back of the frame. For a noncurved the boards would be 2) 1x3 by 120 and 4) 1x3 by 45. The same boards for a curved would be 2) 1x3 by 122.5 and 4) 1x3 by 50. These would allow a stretched screen of 120 x 50 on the inside of the frame.

Can anyone confirm or offer suggested alternatives to this method? I have already bought the wood for the screen.
post #19 of 40
Thread Starter 
The curved frame looked great until I put it together. The method described above worked great for holding the curve. The problem I ran into is the frame had considerable mass to the point it broke apart at the corners. This happened after I practiced stapling a sheet to the frame. I called Chris at SeymourAV for some advice: He recommended that I add the additonal 2 boards for support and corner braces. I will try one more time, but if I run into the same problem I'm going to scrap it for a flat screen.

The big thing I'm trying to figure out now is... For a curved screen you need to staple to the back of the frame in order for the screen to maintain the stretch (I think). I'm not sure how to add support posts prior to mounting the screen. I think I just need to have the whole frame supported while I do the stapling and then add the support posts before moving.

I think I'll give the curved screen one more chance. Can anyone confirm that the frame should be 1 x 4? I was thinking of going 1 x 2 for the frame.
post #20 of 40
Thread Starter 
I think I just figured out my issue. I was using the 1 x 4s that were intended for the goal post and crossbar of the minimalist wall. I have 1 x 6s that need to be ripped. I will rip the 1 x 6 in half and rebuild the curved frame. I think I will order the screen material tomorrow.
post #21 of 40
Thread Starter 
Here are a couple quick pictures of the progress.
Dremmel used to cut the old dri-core flush with the drywall.

Installing the new Dri-core.

I installed the Dri-core back to where the riser will be built.

I'm currently laying out the riser for the back of the room. I'm attempting to build one big bass trap with this riser. I'm looking at 2 possible products for the riser top. The first is called Attic Dek, which is a product used in attics. The product would allow considerable air passage into the riser. The second is standard used aluminum grating. In the end it will come down to cost and I will pick the cheaper way.
post #22 of 40
Thread Starter 
I made progress and have some pictures to share…
First, I have a picture of the DTS-10 that I purchased from Ricci referenced above – Thanks!

I made a slide for the Panamorph lens and mounted it. This was followed be a week of using a sheet as the screen to get a feel for the screen size.
Lens in use:

Lens not in use:

I was able to add sand back under the stage (well, actually the kids helped with this one). I couldn't get all of it to fit because I was sealing from the front, but I think enough to deaden the sound. You can see I added the front board on the bottom right to contain the sand in this next picture. I also moved the DTS-10 and speakers into their ultimate position. I painted the DTS-10 the same black as everything else.

I built and painted the minimalist screen wall in the following pictures:

Then I built the screen… After hanging the sheet for several days I realized that curvature was only a minimal concern. I elected to go with a flat fixed screen made out of wood with the SeymourAV AT screen.
Here is the making of the screen (notice the sheet hanging on the goalposts in the background):

Supporting the corners:

I’ll upload a few finished screen shots later.
post #23 of 40
Thread Starter 
First, a quick screen shot...

I spent time making the frames and installing the linacoustic and poly b on the walls. I am going vertical full length from floor to ceiling tray. The below photo has the right wall that has one frame finished and 5 frames awaiting the fabric. The method that I ended up using is as follows:
1) Attached furring strips horizontally to the wall wall. The furring strips are ripped plywood.
2)Attached 1/2" linacoustic directly to the wall using super 77... same with poly on top.
3)Built frames they are approximately 20" X 83" tall. I used the dimension between columns usually around 62" and divided by 3 for 3 vertical frames.
4)Painted the frames black.
5)Drilled pilot hole through the frame into the furring strip.
6)Drilled hole in the back of the frame for the ball.
7)Drilled hole in the furring strip for the socket.
8)Attached framed using ball and socket.
9)Cut Linacoustic to fit the mounted frames.
10)Removed frame from wall and stapled GOM
11)Reattached the frame with Poly and 1/2" linacoustic within it.
This method is a little different than what others have done because I used two 1/2 inch linacoustic instead of 1 inch. Below are some pictures of the work in progress.

Wall with one finished frame and 5 painted frames. The 1/2 inch linacoustic is already attached to the wall.

Close-up of the completed frame.

Opposite wall... the front has linacoustic on the wall and the middle does not.

I love how that ugly yellow paint is slowly disappearing. I plan to paint the rest of the room and the columns the same color as the fabric.

The back wall will be 2" deep frames with kraft paper over 2" rigid insulation (covered with fabric). The rear side walls(between last column and back wall) may just be paint on both sides... If there isn't an acoustical purpose I probably wont add fabric to the walls, but...

Let me know what you guys think... I still have time to modify. I figure if there is too much absorption I can replace the1/2" linacoustic in the side frames with poly and just leave the 1/2" attached to the wall behind the frames.
post #24 of 40
Looks like you are making great progress. I'm not an expert in acoustics by any means, but based on what I have read here, covering all the walls with 1/2" linacoustic could damp the high frequencies too much while leaving lower frequencies untouched. It might be better to use thicker treatments more sparingly. You could always attach kraft over some of the 1/2 if you find you have too much damping at high frequencies

I do not see any bass trapping in your pictures so you may want to consider some thick traps up near the stage. Also boosting your rear and front to at least 4" will give a bit more performance at lower frequencies.
post #25 of 40
Thread Starter 
Let me clarify, the linacoustic goes up to about 60" in height on the left and right side walls. I have 1" total on these walls (2 times 1/2"). The current plan is to not place any additional linacoustic behind the front seats. So each side wall has 60"H by a total 120"L of 1" thick linacoustic. The side walls are approximately 200" long. So really 1/2 of each side wall will be covered.

The front wall is 2" thick rigid insulation on approximately 75% of the area. I plan to do the same on the back wall but adding Kraft paper to prevent overabsorbing the highs.

The brown thing in the corner is a Kraft paper wrapped bass trap. This weekend I plan to use all the leftover 2" rigid for super chunk bass traps floor to ceiling on the front. I wanted to make sure I had enough to do the front and back wall before I started cutting it at 45s. I also may do a super chunk across the top front behind the screen as well.

Thanks for the feedback...
post #26 of 40
Sounds like you have it covered. Looking forward to seeing how this turns out.
post #27 of 40
Thread Starter 
Two photos of recent progress. I continued making the fabric panels this weekend.

This picture has the egress window behind it. The fabric frames are not permanently mounted so in case of emergency the frames just pop off and you can climb through the window.
post #28 of 40
Thread Starter 
I can use some help! I am trying to figure out how to finish the back of the theater. I plan to do a riser in the back of the room. The layout will be a row of seats then a bar behind with some comfortable chairs. The issue I am wondering about is how large should the riser be. I would like to make it go all the way to the back wall and side wall, but I have a closet door in the back right. I keep my equipment in this closet(under the stairs). I also have the sump pump pit in there.

This picture shows the back of the room:

I think I would like to take the riser all the way to the back wall and the back right wall, but that door I think the only thing I could do is build an equipment rack that slides out of the way. Has anyone done something like this? I was also thinking about just doing the removable panels over the door and then just popping the panel when I want to go back there. However, I find that I currently access my equipment too much to make that acceptable.

I want the closet, but I want the floor space too. Anyone have an ideas?
post #29 of 40
Do you have enough room inside the closet to flip the door around?
post #30 of 40
Thread Starter 
It currently opens inwards. I would like the riser to go all the way to the door, which would make for a short door.
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