Originally Posted by amirm
Dumped? Boy, you should get a job, running negative campaigns for politicians.
It is the election season
But you are right, dumped has some connotation that are not fair with the MP-20...but sadly it is a word that is frequently used in this context.
I am pretty sure Trinnov in this thread is the same. Dan, can you please confirm?
I was not aware of this. Dan, can Trinnov owners not purchase the mics?
That is true but a good system gets the job done the first time.
True, but as you know, many HT owners were past "audiophiles", and they still like to change speakers and the like every once in a while.
Since we set up our reference theater, we have felt no need to change it at all.
Valid point in your case, but I was considering the product in the context of the general consumer, as opposed to reference installations (which you are right, they often remain unchanged [in the context that matters, e.g. speakers] for a number of yrs).
You can have multiple settings programmed while the dealer/calibrator is there and then switch between them.
My point related more to future changes in speakers, subs, etc. which would be hard to predict even for the best installers.
Keep in mind that you can seriously damage your system using any of these tools. Just because you have a graph and you can pull things up and down doesn't mean you should. Even dealers have damaged speakers using these systems.
Very true, but that does not stop many tinkerers (dummies
) like myself from wanting that flexibility.
That said, let me mention that if you work with a competent dealer that Harman trusts, you can have much more flexibility than this. Specifically, if someone falls in the serious enthusiast category and likes to play indefinitely, work with your dealer and arrangements can be made to accommodate it. We have done this in one occasion and are able to do it again if needed.
Judging from your posts, your store tries to be very helpful to its customers and clients, and I have little doubt that you would try to accommodate them. The problem is that not all dealers are as accommodating as you are, and there is no guarantee that an accommodating dealer will always be there or always be so accommodating. That is the advantage of the consumer owning the calibrating gear (not to mention that he or she can always pull it out when he or she wants to fool around play with the gear, which some of us like to do at times).
Compare what changes? And why won't you do this while your dealer is present?
Lest say the consumer changed (or added) speakers or changed (or added subs), if they have the gear to calibrate (and the software can auto-calibrate), the consumer can have measurements and saved curves for before, do an auto-eq and take measurements to compare with before, look at what the prior curve looked like, try to emulate it or stick with the auto eq, go with a new curve they like. Granted, in the end the best solution should involve hiring a calibrator to recalibrate your system, but as I said, many consumers like to do the tinkering themselves (at least some of the time if not all), so their is value to giving consumers the opportunity to purchase the mic gear.
If the process is slow, it can be time consuming as Dan mentioned. You can't possibly tell me in one breath that you like to mess with the system but then in the next breath say you are perfectly OK with a non-real-time system
I think you misunderstood my point. After many measurements have been taken with the new gear, and different curves have been stored, the consumer can easily compare them (and the old curve(s)) in Dirac Live and Trinnov (and I'm guesing this is also true with ARCOS in the context of SDEC). In that context, comparisons are only as time consuming as the consumer makes them (i.e. after the new curves have been stored).
I finally got to hear Dirac again and this time it was a far better experience than what they did at CEDIA. This was at the Theta suite at CES so I can share my experience with that here...They had it nicely set up and switched back and forth for me so I could hear with or without correct (Datasat folks would not do that at CEDIA). The system worked very well. No comparison to what Datasat had done at CEDIA. Despite the system being very high end, the improvements were apparent and considerable. The graph showed massive low frequency aberrations prior to correction as expected and resolving that showed that the system is a very capable room EQ.
As I said in the previous thread where we discussed this, that was a poor decision by Datasat since it gave the consumer no baseline against which to compare (which was my criticism to you regarding your comments as well).
I also sat through the demo of the software. It was very simple to use. I shot a video of it that I will upload later to WBF.
Sadly, I am well behind my evaluation stage of this aspect of the product...maybe I can speak in a more informed manner by the summer