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PlayStation Meeting 2013 (PS4 unveiling - conference replay in first post) - Page 35

post #1021 of 1994
Both Microsoft and Sony are waiting for the other console to be announced first right ?

This kinda tells me both companies have "a couple options each."

If M$ release SSD, then sony will release SSD...
If Microsoft sells an internet-only system, Sony has one ready... and vice versa.

You can pretty much guess that the PS4 will come with a Move.
The ridiculous prices either mean the Move is dead.. or there's so many cameras in the supply for the Ps4, that the prices are dropping.

(I just saw a complete Harrry Potter wonderbook + move controller + move camera for $40)
post #1022 of 1994
In my case, I was implying $400 for a bare bones unit without backwards compatibility, only 4 gigs of GDDR5 RAM or anything extra. The more expensive unit could have other things thrown in for perhaps $500 and then for eighter version, you could probably get a PS3 box attachment for about $100. Now if it includes 8GB of GDDR5 Ram, then maybe $500 would do fine as long as it's released with key games.

Still, it's obviously true that Sony could try to do some type of a cell phone type deal to bring the cost down initially but they need to be very smart about it. All we know is that the PS Vita is a good example of something that was mismanaged. If I was part of Sony, I would have tried to see just how much profit the PS Vita and memory cards are making and if they really couldn't lower the prices soon than I would have suggested to throw in eighter Plus with the memory cards depending on the capacity or PSN cash. Even including PSN cash with the PS Vita like say $50 for example. Perhaps for the PS4, if they do sell the barebones for $450 or even up to $500, you'd be talking $100 worth of PSN cash and include a pack in game. Now that's if they really couldn't lower it even more. Back to the cell phone kind of deal, Sony does own Gaikai now and have a lot of ownership in games, music and movies so they have the ingredients to have extra tier services that people can buy for a 2 year contract so that people can have an even lower price initially but at the same time Sony will have to be careful to make sure some things stay free in relation to some 720 services.
OK, I'll stop before I start drifting a bit too much.
Edited by Paulo Teixeira - 2/4/13 at 8:18am
post #1023 of 1994
People need to also realize that theys till aren't losing money with most consumers- I don't know what they make off peripherals, but it's got to be alot.. that blu-ray remote? probably costs them 3 dollars. extra controllers? probably cost them $15. Do other game manufacturers pay Sony when they sell PS3 games? I think so.. What about Home and PS+? Even if you don't buy anything and just open up Home to see what it is- Boom- advertisements. They are making enough money off everything else, that they can afford to sell at somewhat of a loss. Even so, technology gets cheaper as time goes on. Especially when you buy millions of units. My point is, Sony is not hurting. To say they've lost X dollars per console since launch is not painting the whole picture, they're making money.
post #1024 of 1994
Sony lost a crap load of money on the PS3, it didn't really become profitable until the super slim launched. They were still taking a $50 loss in 2011 on the slim at $300. Sony is a shell of their former self and the PS3 ate away every penny that the PS1 and PS2 brought in and then some. Remember, stores also get bulk discounts and wholesale pricing. This cuts into Sony's profits as well. That $50 controller costs $15 to make, they sell to retailers at $25 and sell for $50 (yes retail markup often is this lopsided) The Wii U is sold to retailers at a $21 loss, but retailers have at least a $50 markup, probably closer to $70. (Nintendo is known for giving retailers more generous margins, so the Sony markup would be less on hardware)



I did the price breakdown myself based on consumer prices and the average wholesale prices of the parts in the 360 and PS3 at launch compared to the off the shelf equivelent. (adjusted for the fact that they were custom stripped down parts) It was actually a pretty fun project.

A 6670 would only cost Sony $30 at most for example, but they are profitable when sold at $70 with 1gb ddr5. Sony wouldn't need everything in that package, just the core gpu (RAM calculated seperately) which brings the wholesale cost down, add in bulk discounts and contracts and $30 suddenly seems a bit high.
post #1025 of 1994
Thread Starter 
- Sony's PlayStation division continues to be one of the strong bright spots of the corporation as a whole (unlike, say, the TV division), which is the complete opposite of the conclusion you just posted. Besides, as was mentioned the heavy, heavy losses from initial PS3 sales in 2006 (-$240 per unit) are unlikely to be replicated this time under Kaz, which again points against a super low launch price.

- OK, so no article has reported on specific cost breakdowns of the rumored components. Perhaps because not all is known, like issues related to customizing the parts. They are not strictly taking this stuff off the shelf and plugging it in you know.

I do agree with the general concept that money is saved by going with APU. It helps to consolidate all the parts together which saves money. Other savings, compared to the PS3's launch design, will come from not introducing a new media format (Blu Ray in 2006 cost a grip), not including hardware BC, and not going with an exotic CPU (Cell). Even XDR RAM and Rambus based graphics impacted the final all-around costs to make the PS3.

I would love for the PS4 to be as cheap as possible. I bought the pieces for my HTPC, my daughter's 3DS and my Vita all when I was able to get them at excellent prices. But I have to be realistic as well, so that's why I am pessamistic about a launch $400 PS4. Production realities don't suggest that based on rumors.

But speculating further a bit, how can they sell it for as cheap as possible based on current rumored spes? Maybe for $450 a unit, they can....

- Sell it without a hard drive by using , say, a 16GB flash drive instead. If you want bigger, buy your own SSD or HDD.

- All Move/PSEye tech is sold separately

- No pack-in games or PS+ vouchers. Only demos that you dload off the PSN

- Save money by using one of the new 4GB GDDDR5 chips going into production right now instead of the expected two of the existing 2GB GDDR5 chips.

- Any hardware that supports BC for PS3 titles is sold separately

Stuff like that helps them produce a "barebones" unit like what Paulo was referring to above. This can help any initial losses per unit sold be small enough to perhaps reduce the price.

I believe that the cost of PS4's production AND the consumer price will be lower than the PS3 release, which will be a bigger reduction than what some of you think once you adjust for inflation before making the comparison. But they can't go too crazy with lowering the final price either.
Edited by joeblow - 2/4/13 at 12:22pm
post #1026 of 1994
I'm sure there will be one basic and one premium bundle, but I just can't see them cutting out a HDD.

I could see something like $399 - 500GB HDD, $499-599 - 1TB HDD + 1 yr of plus + some cosmetic difference. Throw in some accessories like controllers, charging docks, headset etc.

The main difference between the PS3 and PS4 is that (if rumors are to be believed), they're just not building a bleeding edge box. They're giving us the console we would have had after 5 years in a traditional cycle, but the costs are going to be as if they're already 2 years into it.

If all the rumors are wrong and they really are making something super powerful, I agree, $399 is unlikely.
post #1027 of 1994
Their gaming division is a bright spot now, but just a few years ago it was bleeding a billion or more per year. The PS3 really hurt Sony and it will take many years of high profits to make back the losses they took from 2006 through 2010 on the PS3 hardware. From 2011 through mid 2012 the losses were minimized greatly. (maybe even to the point of being a minor profit on the hardware, the games are what offset the losses at this point)

Like I said, the hardware finally became profitable with the super slim, it took 6 years for Sony to finally make a PS3 that truly makes them money on every unit sold.


Sony will be looking at how they can build this system where costs will come down quickly. A system that is profitable from day one will be their target. Sony will want to keep their Playstation division profitable.


I don't see them shipping a HDD free model, they aren't that expensive to include. (cheaper than PS3 BC) and they will include a form of Plus with the system, that trial really hooks people into paying for a full year.


And considering I can build a PC with close to the estimated specs of the PS4 for under $400 myself at retail pricing, I still say that the PS4 can easily be profitable at $400. I used to say $300 until the ddr5 rumor hit, I adjusted my estimated price based on it.
post #1028 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthrsg View Post

I side here. PS4 will land in the living room unless they charge for Netflix like Xbox does, PS3 will move to the office and setup shop next to my PC.

Indeed, the cost of a 360 is well above and beyond a PS3. Sure the entry marketing price is lower.. But for those that game more than a couple of months online.. the 360 is ridiculously more expensive than a PS3.
post #1029 of 1994
Thread Starter 
I should have been clearer bd2003. They can still have a HDD port in a barebones PS3 for us to fill in our own SSD OR HDD; the 16GB flash memory allows barebones downloading from the PSN so that every system has storage just like the PS3.
post #1030 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

I should have been clearer bd2003. They can still have a HDD port in a barebones PS3 for us to fill in our own SSD OR HDD; the 16GB flash memory allows barebones downloading from the PSN so that every system has storage just like the PS3.

I just don't think an optical only console is viable this gen from a development standpoint. They'll need the HDD in there just as a buffer, I don't think any optical drive alone can keep up with the demands of filling 4-8GB of ram. Not without EPIC load times, and it constrains what's even possible. This has to be a fundamental part of the system.

They could certainly do that with flash, but it would have fast flash, not the cheap stuff, and couldn't be used for storage. The HDD gets them both that essential buffer and the storage space to purchase games as well, which will offset the costs.
post #1031 of 1994
Thread Starter 
I see. If that doesn't cut it, then a low capicity HDD that is still in mass production (i.e., no 20GB drives) could still lower cost over a 500 GB standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Their gaming division is a bright spot now, but just a few years ago it was bleeding a billion or more per year. The PS3 really hurt Sony and it will take many years of high profits to make back the losses they took from 2006 through 2010 on the PS3 hardware. From 2011 through mid 2012 the losses were minimized greatly. (maybe even to the point of being a minor profit on the hardware, the games are what offset the losses at this point)

Like I said, the hardware finally became profitable with the super slim, it took 6 years for Sony to finally make a PS3 that truly makes them money on every unit sold.


Sony will be looking at how they can build this system where costs will come down quickly. A system that is profitable from day one will be their target. Sony will want to keep their Playstation division profitable.


I don't see them shipping a HDD free model, they aren't that expensive to include. (cheaper than PS3 BC) and they will include a form of Plus with the system, that trial really hooks people into paying for a full year.


And considering I can build a PC with close to the estimated specs of the PS4 for under $400 myself at retail pricing, I still say that the PS4 can easily be profitable at $400. I used to say $300 until the ddr5 rumor hit, I adjusted my estimated price based on it.
There is far more bringing money into to the PlayStation division than just the flagship hardware. The first slim cut costs quite a bit, all while revenues continued to generate from every software and DLC sale (retail or PSN), peripherals (DS3 controllers still cost $55 MSRP),publishing fees, PS2 sales (hardware/software), PSP sales (hardware/software), etc.

As those last two have slowed down, the PS3 itself has improved in pure profitability. The net productivity of the division as a whole has not been in bad shape at all. Other divisions have been the primary source of losses for the corporation.

I agree on the PS+ point - it makes more sense to give trials. And if you agree that they want the PS4 to be profitable early, then that means savings from lowered production costs aren't all passed down to the consumer price. Remember, Sony usually adds free stuff to their hardware to add value before cutting the price outright.

Lastly, it doesn't work to do an apples to apples comparison with the PC version of components. There are a lot more issues involved that affect costs. The APU is guaranteed to be customized, meaning it gets its own production line.

Customizing it costs money, and producing it apart from established, mass market parts costs money. We won't even be able to do diect comparisons between the abilities of PC hardware part XYZ and console hardware part XYZ because these components work a lot more efficiently in a closed console environment when compared to how they may work in a PC.
Edited by joeblow - 2/4/13 at 2:06pm
post #1032 of 1994
I guess they could get away with 250GB drives (the smallest current PS3 drive), but I doubt that really saves them much from a manufacturing standpoint. By the time it launches 500 may be the new 250.

They could always put out a high margin version to subsidize the low margin/loss leader. If they can make $50 on a high end model, they can eat the cost of $25 on two low end models.
post #1033 of 1994
''Lastly, it doesn't work to do an apples to apples comparison with the PC version of components. There are a lot more issues involved that affect costs. The APU is guaranteed to be customized, meaning it gets its own production line.''

Using custom parts is always cheaper than off the shelf parts. The PS3 GPU was $129 at launch, but the closest retail equivalent was $300 and only minor tweaks were made to this chip for the PS3 version. They only need the chip itself, not the rest of the parts. The Cell never made retail, but it cost $89 wholesale, which puts it in the $250 range if it had.

The closest retail equivalent to the APU that will be custom built are under $200 retail. (6670/7670 plus A10 APU) This is a major price difference.

Building a console means that a lot of things that bring up the cost are never factored in. For example, AMD sells a 6670 gpu chip to asus, they add the memory and control boards, outputs and sell it to retailers, everyone makes money and it sells for $70 to the consumer. Sony buys direct from AMD.
Edited by PENDRAG0ON - 2/4/13 at 2:39pm
post #1034 of 1994
I'm guessing $499 with a 500gb hd. They might also do a subsidized version where you sign up for a couple of years of PS+ say: $299 + $15 per month for two years ($660 total).
post #1035 of 1994
Thread Starter 
^^^ Reasonable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

''Lastly, it doesn't work to do an apples to apples comparison with the PC version of components. There are a lot more issues involved that affect costs. The APU is guaranteed to be customized, meaning it gets its own production line.''

Using custom parts is always cheaper than off the shelf parts. The PS3 GPU was $129 at launch, but the closest retail equivalent was $300 and only minor tweaks were made to this chip for the PS3 version. They only need the chip itself, not the rest of the parts. The Cell never made retail, but it cost $89 wholesale, which puts it in the $250 range if it had.

The closest retail equivalent to the APU that will be custom built are under $200 retail. (6670/7670 plus A10 APU) This is a major price difference.

Building a console means that a lot of things that bring up the cost are never factored in. For example, AMD sells a 6670 gpu chip to asus, they add the memory and control boards, outputs and sell it to retailers, everyone makes money and it sells for $70 to the consumer. Sony buys direct from AMD.

For one thing, you might be focused on old rumor reports because based on the on the latest PS3 APU rumors of the last few weeks, it is somewhere around the 7850/70 in power as opposed to the lowly 7670. All of the specs under the current rumors blow past what you are referencing. It's even well past the 7770 comparison I see in some people's posts. As an example, the PS4 GPU is now rumored to sport 32 ROPs compared to the 16 ROPs in the 7770. That's one of many areas that puts it in the 7800 family.

Even if you do update your base comparison component (making the PS4 rumored APU a lot more expensive than a 7670 component in the process), I still say you can't make that kind of apples-to-apples price comparison because of customization. There is no blanket rule that says customized parts are less expensive. We won't know a realistic estimate of the costs until an iSuppli report.
post #1036 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by defdog99 View Post

Both Microsoft and Sony are waiting for the other console to be announced first right ?

This kinda tells me both companies have "a couple options each."

If M$ release SSD, then sony will release SSD...
If Microsoft sells an internet-only system, Sony has one ready... and vice versa.

You can pretty much guess that the PS4 will come with a Move.
The ridiculous prices either mean the Move is dead.. or there's so many cameras in the supply for the Ps4, that the prices are dropping.

(I just saw a complete Harrry Potter wonderbook + move controller + move camera for $40)

Nope. Simply because of logistics.

95% of the next gen consoles are locked in by now because of pre-existing agreements and contracts. There's the possibility something like say a HDD might change, but hardware wise no.
post #1037 of 1994
Actually, the latest rumors are that the systems will use mobile chips. (or was that the 8 core cpu one?) I have stuck with the APU rumors because they have been the most consistant over the last several months. These last two months the rumors have become wild, but the APU rumors were consistant for a long time, which is why I still go with them.
post #1038 of 1994
Thread Starter 
An 8-core Jaguar is what the CPU rumors state. Currently, no "insider" I've read about is disputing these supposedly leaked details of the PS4 that came out a week ago, which have been in part suggested by others for months:

Quote:
LIVERPOOL SOC

Custom implementation of AMD Fusion APU Arquitecture (Accelerated Processing Unit)
Provides good performance with low power consumtion
Integrated CPU and GPU
Considerably bigger and more powerful than AMD’s other APUs


CPU:

Orbis contains eight Jaguar cores at 1.6 Ghz, arranged as two “clusters”
Each cluster contains 4 cores and a shared 2MB L2 cache
256-bit SIMD operations, 128-bit SIMD ALU
SSE up to SSE4, as well as Advanced Vector Extensions (AVX)
One hardware thread per core
Decodes, executes and retires at up to two intructions/cycle
Out of order execution
Per-core dedicated L1-I and L1-D cache (32Kb each)
Two pipes per core yield 12,8 GFlops performance
102.4 GFlops for system


GPU:

GPU is based on AMD’s “R10XX” (Southern Islands) architecture
DirectX 11.1+ feature set
Liverpool is an enhanced version of the architecture
18 Compute Units (CUs)
Hardware balanced at 14 CUs
Shared 512 KB of read/write L2 cache
800 Mhz
1.843 Tflops, 922 GigaOps/s
Dual shader engines
18 texture units
8 Render backends


Memory:

4 GB unified system memory, 176 GB/s
3.5 available to games (estimate)


Storage:

- High speed Blu-ray drive

single layer (25 GB) or dual layer (50 GB) discs
Partial constant angular velocity (PCAV)
Outer half of disc 6x (27 MB/s)
Inner half varies, 3.3x to 6x

- Internal mass storage

One SKU at launch: 500 GB HDD
There may also be a Flash drive SKU in the future


Networking
:

1 Gb/s Ethernet, 802.11b/g/n WIFI, and Bluetooth


Peripherals:

Evolved Dualshock controller
Dual Camera
Move controller


Extra:

Audio Processor (ACP)
Video encode and decode (VCE/UVD) units
Display ScanOut Engine (DCE)
Zlib Decompression Hardware


UPDATE: some people is confused about the GPU, here you have more info about it:

Each CU contains dedicated:

- ALU (32 64-bit operations per cycle)

- Texture Unit

- L1 data cache

- Local data share (LDS)


About 14 + 4 balance:

- 4 additional CUs (410 Gflops) “extra” ALU as resource for compute

- Minor boost if used for rendering


Dual Shader Engines:

- 1.6 billion triangles/s, 1.6 billion vertices/s

18 Texture units

- 56 billion bilinear texture reads/s

- Can utilize full memory bandwith


8 Render backends:

- 32 color ops/cycle

- 128 depth ops/cycle

- Can utilize full memory bandwith



All this info is subject to change in the future by Sony.

Almost any tech discussion on the internet about the PS4 specs prior to its unveiling will use the info above as the basis for their comments.
Edited by joeblow - 2/4/13 at 6:52pm
post #1039 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Nope. Simply because of logistics.

95% of the next gen consoles are locked in by now because of pre-existing agreements and contracts. There's the possibility something like say a HDD might change, but hardware wise no.
But they will have flexibility with pricing and pack-ins.

We've also heard next to nothing about Sony's acquisition of Gaikai. It's possible that they add that to their future PS+ subscription plan at a slightly higher premium. Or hell, if they're really smart and capable, they'll also find a way to rope in Netflix, Amazon Prime, and Hulu+ along with it. So there's some pricing flexibility with all of these possible tiered, multi-year subscription contracts, as well.
post #1040 of 1994
A lot of people did dismiss that set of specs since it was almost a copy and paste of the 720 rumors floating around at the time. (with minor tweaks) If your industry insiders are from neogaf, they tend to back every single new rumor that pops up, no matter how different it is from the old one. It is part of the reason I stopped going there for info on spec rumors.

Heck, AMD had a press release that pretty much said that the next gen consoles were using 8000 series mobile GPUs, Neogaf backed these rumors just as they backed the previous rumors.

Based on those specs, the CPU side will cost Sony about $70, the GPU side will cost them about $100. $400 is still within reason for the base hardware but at a minor loss. I still doubt that Move will be included due to how it never caught on. Wonderbook was a flop as well. BC in the base model is out. Hopefully an add on will be available from day one.
Edited by PENDRAG0ON - 2/4/13 at 9:15pm
post #1041 of 1994
Thread Starter 
I have consistently labeled stuff throughout this thread as rumors because that's what they are. I claim nothing to be fact. I posted links to all the stuff I came across - maybe one link is from NeoGAF, and that's because it captured a iSuppi breakdown summary before the original link was taken down. The "insider" comments come from a variety of sites besides that one (Beyond 3D has some respected posters who do good analysis), but all I can post is what they claim, not vouch or back up what they say. Also, news blogs have posted similar articles lately regarding the PS3 specs. It is all tying together in the last week or so.

I wouldn't be surprised if some of the "leaks" were found to be wrong, and I purposely didn't read too deeply into reports from months ago since anything could change. However, since we are only a few weeks away from the unveiling, the latest links are all we have. It's fun discussing them whether true in the end or not.

Just not to be wishy washy, I believe most of the CPU, RAM, and GPU specs from that link are on the mark. They are reasonably specc'd for a new generation console, and there is an underlying logic to how smoothly everything flows together on paper. Still, I'm waiting for 2/20 like everyone else for the real machine.
Edited by joeblow - 2/4/13 at 9:34pm
post #1042 of 1994
The more I've read about the reveal the more I think there will be two big deals happening there.

I spent some time digging around some hardcore financial and tech blogs. The consensus seems to be that yes, the PS4 will be revealed. The other big deal will be what they intend to do with Gaikai. Sony spent 380 million to acquire them and we haven't heard a peep since. Lots of the pundits out there are wondering why, and think that Gaikai will be the big hook for PS4.

Like CD, DVD, and BD/HDMI before it, Gaikai and how it's implemented will be the difference maker for the Sony console over the others. I fully expect to see what Sony will be doing with its streaming service as it relates to their entire network. I also expect to see the PS4, and some of the things it will be doing when hooked into Gaikai. I guess I'll see how close I was in 15 days.
post #1043 of 1994
Thread Starter 
Minor deals like restricted Steam access on the PS3 (for Portal 2) is also something that has raised my eyebrow. I wouldn't be surprised if an announcement involving SteamBox support came about.
Edited by joeblow - 2/5/13 at 9:52am
post #1044 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

Minor deals like restricted Steam access on the PS3 (for Portal 2) is also something that has raised my eyebrow. I wouldn't be surprised if an announcement involving SteamBox support was announced.

Cross platform online play is one thing, but I'll be shocked if Sony gives us access to buy and play games directly from Steam.
post #1045 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasnmb View Post

Cross platform online play is one thing, but I'll be shocked if Sony gives us access to buy and play games directly from Steam.

I'm sure Sony would get a cut if you're accessing it through the PS4, and it would be one more feature and a reason for you to NOT buy a separate Steambox (which would essentially be like a console this next gen, since they'll be using APU's and such)
post #1046 of 1994
Thread Starter 
Heh, an even wilder thought is Sony allowing select PS3 1st party titles to be sold on Steam as well. It could boost software sales and give more of an incentive to participate in the whole Cross Play concept. I mean, DC Universe Online comes close to this idea (though they didn't go with the idea of cross platform shared servers)
post #1047 of 1994
$399 sounds good.

via the verge
Quote:
The PlayStation 4 will launch this year for over 40,000 yen (about $428), according to a report in major Japanese daily the Asahi Shimbun. That's the first clear indication we've gotten on how much the new system might cost, and suggests that while Sony isn't pricing the PS4 too aggressively next to the likes of the Wii U, it may have learned its lesson from the shaky PlayStation 3 launch.

For comparison, upon release in 2006 the PS3 cost around 60,000 yen in its more expensive configuration, and $599 in the US. Meanwhile, the cheapest PS3 now costs 24,980 yen in Japan versus $269 in the US. Were the PS4 to launch at 40,000 yen in Japan, we'd expect an American price point of around $400 or more.

"Has Sony learned its lesson from PS3?"

The Asahi Shimbun further corroborates things we've heard from other reports, such as a 2013 launch for the US and Japan — no mention was made of Europe, suggesting the release there may well slip into 2014. Elsewhere, the report says that the PS4 controller will feature a touch pad and be "roughly the same shape" as the current Dual Shock 3. Finally, the Asahi Shimbun states in no uncertain terms that February 20th is the date when we'll hear all this information confirmed for real.
post #1048 of 1994
Thread Starter 
New rumors!

A major Japanese news agency claims that the PS4 will sell for over $428 ("over 40,000 yen"). That points to a price point between $450 and $500.


Edit: Beaten by Monger with the rumor info, but the conclusion doesn't sync. It clearly says "over" $428. You and the editorial article mention $400, but that is under the quoted price even if you round it off.

Either way, this rumor suggests that they may not even try $500, which is great for all of us.
Edited by joeblow - 2/6/13 at 5:14pm
post #1049 of 1994
The price in Yen is never a direct conversion to a US price. The US price is almost always cheaper than the Yen conversion so $399 is the likely price based on this rumor.
post #1050 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

New rumors!

A major Japanese news agency claims that the PS4 will sell for over $428 ("over 40,000 yen"). That points to a price point between $450 and $500.


Edit: Beaten by Monger with the rumor info, but the conclusion doesn't sync. It clearly says "over" $428. You and the editorial article mention $400, but that is under the quoted price even if you round it off.

Either way, this rumor suggests that they may not even try $500, which is great for all of us.

It''s a guess. The vita was cheaper in the US and the Japanese price contains consumption tax.
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