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PlayStation Meeting 2013 (PS4 unveiling - conference replay in first post) - Page 11

post #301 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by confidenceman View Post

Console manufacturers understand that.

Game developers also can't make good looking, higher resolution games cheaply.
post #302 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbeefxy1 View Post

Game developers also can't make good looking, higher resolution games cheaply.

Hell, they can barely make a decent-looking, moderate resolution game cheaply. Production costs are unsustainably high across the board. So, yes, bumping everything up to a new display standard would be out of the question.

The industry's moving "horizontally" for the foreseeable future. I don't expect many "vertical" tech leaps for quite a while.
post #303 of 1994
Heck, some PS2 games look pretty good at 720 and 1080. RE4 surprised me as did Shadow of the Colossus. Not all games need to be super high detail to look fantastic.
post #304 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Heck, some PS2 games look pretty good at 720 and 1080. RE4 surprised me as did Shadow of the Colossus. Not all games need to be super high detail to look fantastic.

That's the "good enough market" I keep talking about.

It's whats driven people from PC to consoles, and also the market Nintendo was able to hijack (sort of).

GFX whores might be the majority of the PC market still, but on consoles it's not the driving market. They're still loud, but it's such a minority that it's really not worth worrying about.
post #305 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

GFX whores might be the majority of the PC market still, but on consoles it's not the driving market. They're still loud, but it's such a minority that it's really not worth worrying about.

And with the vast majority of PC development happening from the "think console release" approach, this is less and less the case. Toss in the booming indie scene on PC (which demands relatively little horsepower), and "graphics whores" are an increasing minority across all platforms.

It's all about storefronts, streaming content, media access, etc., regardless of whether it's a desktop PC, laptop, gaming console, smartphone, or tablet.
post #306 of 1994
After seeing the new Nvidia 680 gpu I am really hoping that Sony goes with a similar design for the PS4. Obviously it won't have that exact chip in the system, but it could have a custom chip that is similar to it. Throw in a custom CPU based off of intel's i7 mobile line and a decent amount of RAM (4gigs minimum since this has been a very big issue this gen) and you would have a beast of a machine. Cell compatability would be the only issue that they would have to work around...
post #307 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

After seeing the new Nvidia 680 gpu I am really hoping that Sony goes with a similar design for the PS4. Obviously it won't have that exact chip in the system, but it could have a custom chip that is similar to it. Throw in a custom CPU based off of intel's i7 mobile line and a decent amount of RAM (4gigs minimum since this has been a very big issue this gen) and you would have a beast of a machine. Cell compatability would be the only issue that they would have to work around...

And heat, and cost, and...
post #308 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgable View Post

And heat, and cost, and...

Power usage, and heat should follow, is actually amazing, but the current rumors suggest they'll be going with something in the 6870 range. I imagine cost is the biggest issue. If they can get something built with a 28nm process though, that would be great for heat, power, and cost.
post #309 of 1994
http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-p...re-the-details


... If true, then I am done with Sony after this generation.
post #310 of 1994
Thread Starter 
^^^^ PS4 rumor summary:

- Codename "Orbis"

- Holiday 2013 release (I doubt this)

- AMD x64 CPU

- AMD Southern Islands GPU

- GPU displays normal games at 4K resolution (which helps eliminate texture degradation when zooming in) or 3D games at 1080P

- No PS3 backwards compatibility (after the success of PS2 HD upgrade re-releases, I'm not surprised)

- Blu-ray format returns (hmmmm, perhaps with an upgrade to 100 GB discs?)

- Retail downloads over PSN

- All games will be tied to the PSN account (anti-piracy as well as anti-used market tactic no doubt)

...once again, these are all rumors. Nothing surprising here except the release date which seems early to me. Of course the main thing is to see what the new games look like.
post #311 of 1994
The main thing that bugs me is the always on internet requirement. That combined with the one activation to a psn account makes me very worried. (psn hacking would become a massive disaster instead of a large annoyance)

And what about the millions without hsi? I just cant believe this rumor, but it does line up with what publishers would love to see happen.
post #312 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

The main thing that bugs me is the always on internet requirement. That combined with the one activation to a psn account makes me very worried. (psn hacking would become a massive disaster instead of a large annoyance)

And what about the millions without hsi? I just cant believe this rumor, but it does line up with what publishers would love to see happen.

You could activate the game on a PC and use a thumb drive to activate it on the console. The question is who has no access to any kind of internet this day in age? By 2013 that audience should not buy the latest connected gadget, go buy a PS2/3.

An activation is a lot different than a 10GB game download.
post #313 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-p...re-the-details


... If true, then I am done with Sony after this generation.

And who are you going to go to...the WII U ?
post #314 of 1994
Thread Starter 
Online activation of a game does not mean it won't allow offline play. Once a game is tied to your account and is activated on the machine you are playing on, there's no reason to think at this point that you can't play it in full offline. The key step is the verification of a purchase, not 100% online monitoring. We'll see what the final setup looks like.
post #315 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgable View Post


You could activate the game on a PC and use a thumb drive to activate it on the console. The question is who has no access to any kind of internet this day in age? By 2013 that audience should not buy the latest connected gadget, go buy a PS2/3.

An activation is a lot different than a 10GB game download.

At one point I moved 2 miiles down the road and picked the wrong side of the highway. I was less than 100 feet from being able to get hsi, it would have cost me $5000+ to have them run the cables.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spinoza_43221 View Post


And who are you going to go to...the WII U ?

PC.
post #316 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

At one point I moved 2 miiles down the road and picked the wrong side of the highway. I was less than 100 feet from being able to get hsi, it would have cost me $5000+ to have them run the cables.



PC.

Steam requires broadband too. Without Steam, PC gaming is really gimp.
post #317 of 1994
Thread Starter 
...and it also allows offline play after online activation.

The introduction of the online pass was the writing on the wall, so no one should be surprised that they are going after the used market next gen.
post #318 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

...and it also allows offline play after online activation.

The introduction of the online pass was the writing on the wall, so no one should be surprised that they are going after the used market next gen.

The question is will Gamestop even carry their products? I dont think that they will unless they are allowed to include codes with used game purchases (that way publishers and devs get something from those sales and GS can still continue to sell used games)

Then you have gamefly, they would just be plain screwed.
post #319 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

At one point I moved 2 miiles down the road and picked the wrong side of the highway. I was less than 100 feet from being able to get hsi, it would have cost me $5000+ to have them run the cables.



PC.

I don't think you'd need hsi to activate a game. They'll still come on Blu-ray apparently. RTFA No deal-breakers here for me. I have a PS3 with BC, and I don't think I used it at all. The kids will go retro-gaming once in a while, but we'll still have the PS3. As long as launch titles are good, I'll be in. Looking forward to fast, HQ, 3D gaming. I wonder what the new media will be for 4K and if it will be out by then. Would any current BD tech be enough to hold a 4K movie, double-sided, double density, whatever they use for the 50GB ones?
post #320 of 1994
Last "launch time" had rumors of games being locked to a user, so here we go again.

The description of how DRM works here sounds disturbingly similar to the current rumor from the MS camp. Will they do it this time? I really hope not. No matter how much they describe it as a seamless process, DRM and always online requirements usually end up creating problems, and are generally a PITA.

No PS3 disc games was something I was expecting, and this is probably the most true part of this rumor. Digital items should be fine, but what about the digital PS3 games? That is the question, but I would play them all before moving on if I were you.

I'm not sure what to make of the hardware specs. Separate processor and gfx card might be better for performance, and that resolution number means it should look good on a 4K TV. At least the rumors are staying on the "more power" side of things.

The name? Doesn't really matter, I just think these names from Latin sound silly in English (maybe they sound cool in other languages). Could still be just a code name so my fingers are crossed!

It's gonna be a fun ride to E3 2013.
post #321 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounta1n View Post


I don't think you'd need hsi to activate a game. They'll still come on Blu-ray apparently. RTFA No deal-breakers here for me.

Re read the article. You need HSI to access PSN so yes, hsi is required to activate a game. Then you have the always on part of the rumor, that will be the death of the ps4 once hackers bring the whole service down on a daily basis just to prove a point. (just imagine if every PS3 was a brick during last years outage)
post #322 of 1994
If MSFT or Sony decides they want to get rid of Used Games or Rental (Gamefly) then I guess I WON'T be getting the Next Gen Consoles. I mainly use Gamefly as MOST games are NOT worth $60 just because Developers hype them up and say they are really good. I have about 12 friends that game heavily as well and they all have said they will not buy as well. I have All systems this Gen (including Handhelds) and I will just get a WiiU and play on my gaming Rig. To Hell with Sony and MSFT if they go this route.
post #323 of 1994
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

The question is will Gamestop even carry their products? I dont think that they will unless they are allowed to include codes with used game purchases (that way publishers and devs get something from those sales and GS can still continue to sell used games)

Then you have gamefly, they would just be plain screwed.

Codes won't be included in used game sales. A player (in theory) would get a gimped used game and pay for full access online.

And of course GameStop would carry the products even if used titles were completely locked out. I mean, if they refuse to sell games for next-gen systems, they'd eventually have pretty much nothing to sell at all and simply go out of business.
post #324 of 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

Codes won't be included in used game sales. A player (in theory) would get a gimped used game and pay for full access online.

And of course GameStop would carry the products even if used titles were completely locked out. I mean, if they refuse to sell games for next-gen systems, they'd eventually have pretty much nothing to sell at all and simply go out of business.

If gamestop refuses to carry a system then it will hurt sales considerably, especially with them constantly telling people that it is a waste of money and that they should buy something else instead.

If gamestop included the activation code in the price of the used game then they might support it but otherwise...

With just how popular gamefly and gamestop are, having a system that can't play games without a one use code effectively guarantees that they will not support that system.
post #325 of 1994
Thread Starter 
Console and game publishers have options to sell product if GameStop chooses to fold their arms and pout. Internet sites like Amazon, stores like Toys R Us and Walmart, plus the PSN digital store will likely have full games since the Vita offers that now, etc.

GameStop goes out of business if they stop selling games. It's that simple. GS wouldn't be that stupid.
post #326 of 1994
GameStop doesn't equal the world.
post #327 of 1994
post #328 of 1994
If Sony and MS set out to kill the used/rental market, they're signing their own death warrants

...unless they can bring game prices down considerably.

And I wouldn't count on publishers suddenly stopping things like DLC and Online Passes (which were nominally invented as ways of combating the evil used games market). Those have made them money and consumers have grown accustomed to them. Publishers won't suddenly leave that behind even if the new consoles aim their sights at the used market.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CNPalmer View Post

http://www.reghardware.com/2012/03/2..._2013_release/

Posted early this morning...

That's a half-assed repost of the Kotaku piece linked above.
post #329 of 1994
I'd like to at least see backward compatibility for ps3 games since they are hd and bluray. Since the next gen probably won't be as big a leap as the ps3 was, and they already have the hardware and software, how difficult/expensive could it really be?
post #330 of 1994
Thread Starter 
If they aren't going with the Cell (as rumored), emulation of the PS3 would be tricky indeed and adds to the hardware costs which they will try to keeep down.

Add the fact that they'd make extra money in software sales of "Super HD" re-releases (perhaps buffed with 3D and motion control support) and it would be surprising if this rumor were not true.
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